Spaceman Spiff Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 33 minutes ago, DJHJR86 said: At this point, of Heinicke's ceiling is a hot/cold type of quarterback, there is zero reason to play Fitzpatrick...because Heinicke is essentially a younger, more mobile Fitzpatrick. And you would play Kyle Allen to see if he is better than that. I'm pretty sure Kyle Allen isn't significantly better. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 58 minutes ago, DJHJR86 said: At this point, of Heinicke's ceiling is a hot/cold type of quarterback, there is zero reason to play Fitzpatrick...because Heinicke is essentially a younger, more mobile Fitzpatrick. And you would play Kyle Allen to see if he is better than that. They went out and got Fitz for a reason. I doubt they'd just decide to forget the whole thing and that Kyle Allen is the guy they want playing (assuming both Fitz and Allen are healthy). I don't think there's much chance that Heinicke will be replaced before the bye week (outside of some sort of truly horrendous play or an injury). I'm guessing they'll see how he plays for these next 2 games and then see how Fitz is and make a decision on what to do after the bye. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvernon Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 Fitzpatrick is better than this of course there is a reason to play him when he's healthy. Unless they're tanking, I don't see why you stick with a back-up QB when Fitz has been an average/below-average starter. Like I said before, I think the thicker the book on TH the worse this'll get. Particularly with some cold weather games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 2 hours ago, Spaceman Spiff said: What I don't understand is the rabid calls for his benching when Kyle Allen, a quarterback with his own limitations, is next in line. Or looking forward to a guy like Fitzy who's old and is equally capable of great games and unmitigated disasters. I’m not sure it’s so much that anyone is looking forward to who is behind him, as much as it is the offense is stagnant and a tough watch. Getting a look at someone else at least adds some interest, even if you are pretty certain that the next guy isn’t very good either. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PartyPosse Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 2 hours ago, mistertim said: Honestly, this is one of the things that some posters liked to claim Heinicke had going for him...fast processing and going through his reads quickly. I didn't want to harp on it or get into some big debate here, but I was always a bit dubious as to whether this was the case or not because I remember, after his first couple of starts, seeing videos and pictures pointing out wide open guys that he missed. And it seems to still be the case. His plus was he’d go through his first two reads and then take off. Now he’s not scrambling and he panics if his first two reads aren’t open. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berggy9598 Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 (edited) 9 hours ago, KDawg said: Cousins is a much better overall quarterback but not worth what he is paid and isn't a gamer. He will be fairly consistent and lead you to a place where you have a chance to be competitive every week, every season and in the postseason Heinicke is a gamer but doesn't have the same physical tools and processing coverages that Cousins has and is much cheaper. He will be inconsistent and will give you a chance in any single game, maybe put together a small run, but he can't consistently carry a team for the course of a season due to physical limitations. I don’t know that Cousins isn’t a gamer. Look what he’s done the last couple of weeks including yesterday. We’d be a completely different team with him at QB now. In our game yesterday the defense forced 3 turnovers Heinicke could do absolutely nothing with, and in the end we couldn’t get the ball back because Mahomes converted third down after third down. There’s an immense gap in quality between Heinicke and Cousins Edited October 18, 2021 by Berggy9598 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmandoug1 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 5 hours ago, mistertim said: They went out and got Fitz for a reason. I doubt they'd just decide to forget the whole thing and that Kyle Allen is the guy they want playing (assuming both Fitz and Allen are healthy). I don't think there's much chance that Heinicke will be replaced before the bye week (outside of some sort of truly horrendous play or an injury). I'm guessing they'll see how he plays for these next 2 games and then see how Fitz is and make a decision on what to do after the bye. They didn't go out and get Fitz for a reason.....he was the only one left that would come here....stop it! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zCommander Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 2 hours ago, Berggy9598 said: I don’t know that Cousins isn’t a gamer. Look what he’s done the last couple of weeks including yesterday. We’d be a completely different team with him at QB now. In our game yesterday the defense forced 3 turnovers Heinicke could do absolutely nothing with, and in the end we couldn’t get the ball back because Mahomes converted third down after third down. There’s an immense gap in quality between Heinicke and Cousins We had Kirk here and when our D was bad he never could carry the team on his back to win games either. Kirk is only tad bit better because of his arm and his price tag is expensive. IF you have a D that can stop the other team from scoring you can win lot of games even with a QB who is a game manager or even at TH level. By the way, it is not a forced INT when the ball bounces off the hand of a WR and the DB happen to be there to catch it. We only had 1 forced INT yesterday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 15 minutes ago, tmandoug1 said: They didn't go out and get Fitz for a reason.....he was the only one left that would come here....stop it! Stop what? Listening to what the coaches, FO, and Fitz himself said? Ron and the FO said they tried to get Stafford but that Fitz was their main target if that didn't work. They said he was the guy they wanted. Fitz also apparently had other offers. There were other FA QBs available or some for trade. So do you believe Ron was lying? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berggy9598 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, zskins said: We had Kirk here and when our D was bad he never could carry the team on his back to win games either. Kirk is only tad bit better because of his arm and his price tag is expensive. IF you have a D that can stop the other team from scoring you can win lot of games even with a QB who is a game manager or even at TH level. By the way, it is not a forced INT when the ball bounces off the hand of a WR and the DB happen to be there to catch it. We only had 1 forced INT yesterday. Most of this is factually incorrect and what the offense did after the ball turned over has nothing to do with the circumstances of the turnover. If those Cousins teams with Jay Gruden and Bruce Allen had merely an average defense they would have went to the playoffs three straight years, while in today’s an NFL you need an all time great defense to make the playoffs with a QB like Heinicke. This whole game manager QB and play defense is antiquated and the idea that it could work in 2021 is complete nonsense. Edited October 19, 2021 by Berggy9598 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zCommander Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 1 minute ago, Berggy9598 said: Most of this is factually incorrect and what the offense did after the ball turned over has nothing to do with the circumstances of the turnover. You clearly said the D forced 3 turnovers. I was correcting you on that. As for what the O did afterwards I clearly said Kirk has been in the same position before when he was here and did the same as well. Those are the facts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berggy9598 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 2 minutes ago, zskins said: You clearly said the D forced 3 turnovers. I was correcting you on that. As for what the O did afterwards I clearly said Kirk has been in the same position before when he was here and did the same as well. Those are the facts. No those are fantasies. The offense under Cousins back in those years had streaks of dominance and a plethora of games given away by the defense. Cousins and Heinicke has a good 3-4 tiers between them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zCommander Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 5 minutes ago, Berggy9598 said: No those are fantasies. The offense under Cousins back in those years had streaks of dominance and a plethora of games given away by the defense. Cousins and Heinicke has a good 3-4 tiers between them. Oh our D is not giving away games this year? lol Kirk had flashes of being great. But saying dominance is a little bit much though. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 Kirktober is upon us. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickyJ Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 (edited) 8 hours ago, mistertim said: They went out and got Fitz for a reason. I doubt they'd just decide to forget the whole thing and that Kyle Allen is the guy they want playing (assuming both Fitz and Allen are healthy). I don't think there's much chance that Heinicke will be replaced before the bye week (outside of some sort of truly horrendous play or an injury). I'm guessing they'll see how he plays for these next 2 games and then see how Fitz is and make a decision on what to do after the bye. They went out and got Fitz for a reason, but that reason was because our QB room was Heinicke and a QB whose rehab would continue through the summer. It doesn't matter now whether Fitz is marginally better than Heinicke or Allen. Unless it's night and day, Fitz's ship has sailed down the water park slide. Do I think that Allen could save the season? Of course not. Do I think that he can prove that he's come back from his injury and can be the more valuable backup who knows the system next year? Quite possibly. Fitzpatrick being our starter or our backup next year would be a disaster. So I'm up for Allen getting his last audition. Edited October 19, 2021 by NickyJ 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CjSuAvE22 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 2 hours ago, zskins said: Kirk is only tad bit better Cmon man, Henicke was in math class last year at this time, Kirk might not be great but hes a good qb and a perennial starter in the league, had the vikings not paid him there would be at least 3/4 other teams ready to sign him to start...heinicke wouldnt sniff a starting role on other teams. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zCommander Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 6 minutes ago, CjSuAvE22 said: Cmon man, Henicke was in math class last year at this time, Kirk might not be great but hes a good qb and a perennial starter in the league, had the vikings not paid him there would be at least 3/4 other teams ready to sign him to start...heinicke wouldnt sniff a starting role on other teams. The arm strength makes him a tad bit better to say he is perennial is laughable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CjSuAvE22 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 3 minutes ago, zskins said: To say he is perennial is laughable. Sir, how long has cousins been in this league as a starting QB? Ae you trolling me? Hows that laughable....now lets compare that to how long heinicke has been in the league as a starter...the comparison is laughable if you ask me. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berggy9598 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 4 minutes ago, zskins said: The arm strength makes him a tad bit better to say he is perennial is laughable. He hasn't missed a start since 2015. How much perennial can it get Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zCommander Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 5 minutes ago, CjSuAvE22 said: Sir, how long has cousins been in this league as a starting QB? Ae you trolling me? Hows that laughable....now lets compare that to how long heinicke has been in the league as a starter...the comparison is laughable if you ask me. 5 minutes ago, Berggy9598 said: He hasn't missed a start since 2015. How much perennial can it get Let's talk about this when he gets a ring for his perennial performance for being in the league for so long. Okay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berggy9598 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 Just now, zskins said: Let's talk about this when he gets a ring for his perennial performance for being in the league for so long. Okay. You balked at the post that called him a perennial starter. IDK find a dictionary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zCommander Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Berggy9598 said: You balked at the post that called him a perennial starter. IDK find a dictionary. Typing too fast switched words. You get the point though. Let's just move on. There is a post in ATN Forum on Kirk if you like to discuss further. Edited October 19, 2021 by zskins 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJHJR86 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 (edited) 15 hours ago, mistertim said: They went out and got Fitz for a reason. I doubt they'd just decide to forget the whole thing and that Kyle Allen is the guy they want playing (assuming both Fitz and Allen are healthy). I don't think there's much chance that Heinicke will be replaced before the bye week (outside of some sort of truly horrendous play or an injury). I'm guessing they'll see how he plays for these next 2 games and then see how Fitz is and make a decision on what to do after the bye. If the season is over by the bye week, and that is a very real possibility, there is absolutely no reason to not play Kyle Allen at that point. They got Fitzpatrick, which IMO was nothing to get excited over, because they needed another quarterback on the roster. Heinicke's injury history and lack of experience were factors in that decision. Not to mention that Kyle Allen, the guy that was the starter before he got hurt, was still rehabbing his injury. Edited October 19, 2021 by DJHJR86 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koolblue13 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 Comparing Kurt Cousins to Taylor Heinicke is ultimate fan babble drunk of the Kool aid 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 (edited) Listening to Rivera this morning. He's doubled down that he'd like to see Taylor run more. It's been said in other interviews there is no leash on him on that front. He thought he was too quick with the dump offs, came off of his reads too quick. Talked about some throws that were off to Terry that could have ended up big plays. Like I said maybe Taylor thinks the leash is implied by him knowing he can't get hurt but IMO he needs to take his chances, regardless. Rivera per usual was nice and polite but you can tell he didn't think he played well and is hoping he learns from it. I suspect on Sunday we are going to see the Taylor let it all fly approach, will see how it pans out. IMO that's his best chance to show he's more than a backup in this league. the Packers are a middle of the pack defense in terms of giving up points. Edited October 19, 2021 by Skinsinparadise 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts