2021 Comprehensive Draft Thread

[actorguy1]

Tommy Tremble may have promise, but we are still talking about a TE with 11 catches and 0 TD's last season.

[KDawg]

1 minute ago, actorguy1 said:

Tommy Tremble may have promise, but we are still talking about a TE with 11 catches and 0 TD's last season.

Which is why he’s be a great TE2, HB1, FB1

[mhd24]

I don't think there is anyway Dallas takes a LB at 10.  If they would have cut Jaylon Smith, I could have seen it, but they kept him and LVE.  First rounders have to start.  Dallas (IMO) either trades back or takes Surtain/Horn.  

[Anselmheifer]

Is there a 40 time for JOK?

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Anselmheifer]

Jamin Davis. Those are crazy numbers. Is there a height/weight/arm length? 
 

I’ll also note that JOK had very good arm length and wingspan.

[clskinsfan]

Those numbers are crazy for Davis. But go watch his tape. Especially concentrate on his reaction times and pursuit angles. He is clearly a superior athlete. And maybe that is what a DC is looking forward to molding. But he also clearly struggled with misdirection. And I am not positive that is something that can be coached out of him. 

 

Edit: One other thing to note is Davis was never a full time LB at KY. He was used in a rotation. That alone is a big tell to me of what his defensive coaches thought of him. 

[Skinsinparadise]

PFF run stopping grades for the name LBS (I ignored Parsons)

                            

                          Run Stopping Score          Missed Tackle %

1. Jamin Davis      87.5                                  7%

2. Nick Bolton       79                                     12%

3. Monty Rice       77.9                                  5.7%

4. J. Koramoah.   75.5                                 15.2%

5. C. McGrone.    74                                      NA

6. B. Browning.   69.6                                   9.4%

7. E. Jones         69.3                                    8%

8.  Z. Collins      66.3                                   13.3%

9. P. Werner      57.6                                  14.1%

10. J. Cox        55.0                                   13.3%

11. D. Moses.   51.9                                   9.4%

12. C. Surratt.  35.2                                   11.3%

 

That doesn't mean that's how they rate who are the best linebackers but its purely their grades against the run.  most of the good run stoppers are poor against the pass with Jamin Davis being one of the exceptions on that front.  

 

 

 

I like his motto on his twitter handle

 

 

[Anselmheifer]

I wonder if the presence of Davis, Collins and JOK could push Micah Parsons down the board. 

[Skinsinparadise]

12 minutes ago, Anselmheifer said:

Jamin Davis. Those are crazy numbers. Is there a height/weight/arm length? 
 

I’ll also note that JOK had very good arm length and wingspan.

 

I haven't found one.  But watching him he looked to have great range and a huge wingspan.  the range is confirmed with those crazy measurables.   I'd bet his wingspan will as well. 

1 minute ago, Anselmheifer said:

I wonder if the presence of Davis, Collins and JOK could push Micah Parsons down the board. 

 

Yeah i'd bet it will.  Odds might be good he's there at 19. 

[KDawg]

Linebackers grades don’t mean much all in all, but the often correlate with the best players. For instance: Cole Holcomb. Dude grades out pretty decent, but I don’t believe it accounts for slow reads and tackles beyond the LoS that could have been made in the backfield or at the line for no gain. 
 

Davis’ pro day is going to make him real tempting for Dallas. And while I like him... I prefer Zaven and hope Dallas gets enamored with numbers.

[Skinsinparadise]

Just now, KDawg said:

Linebackers grades don’t mean much all in all, but the often correlate with the best players. For instance: Cole Holcomb. Dude grades out pretty decent, but I don’t believe it accounts for slow reads and tackles beyond the LoS that could have been made in the backfield or at the line for no gain. 
 

Davis’ pro day is going to make him real tempting for Dallas. And while I like him... I prefer Zaven and hope Dallas gets enamored with numbers.

 

I am not rooting for Dallas to end up with Jamin Davis.  too many painful memories for me over the years with them having thumpers at MLB who can shut down our running game.  We finally got a reprieve with their current injury prone group.

[KDawg]

2 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I am not rooting for Dallas to end up with Jamin Davis.  too many painful memories for me over the years with them having thumpers at MLB who can shut down our running game.  We finally got a reprieve with their current injury prone group.

Agree. I don't want it either. But if they're going to take one I like Zaven more right now.

 

I'm kind of hoping they take Spencer Brown or something at 10

[mhd24]

6 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I am not rooting for Dallas to end up with Jamin Davis.  too many painful memories for me over the years with them having thumpers at MLB who can shut down our running game.  We finally got a reprieve with their current injury prone group.

 

I think they take Surtain or Horn personally.  Unless they cut Jaylon Smith or LVE, where would Davis play?  They signed Neal to be a LB.  CB is a major need for them.  Heck, I could see them take Slater (who could play anywhere on that line) as Smith is injury prone.

[illone]

Decent 22 review of Jamin

 

 

[clskinsfan]

Watch Davis's game tape here against NC state. He is fast. He is a good player. But far from a dominate first round LB IMO. He gets manhandled by the TE more often than not. He is very slow to react.  I am not saying Davis cant become a good NFL linebacker. Because he has the athleticism to do just that. But he isnt one right now. Not even close:

 

 

 

[Ball Security]

35 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Our torsos look similar.

[Skinsinparadise]

18 minutes ago, KDawg said:

Agree. I don't want it either. But if they're going to take one I like Zaven more right now.

 

I'm kind of hoping they take Spencer Brown or something at 10

 

Zaven was one of my first reviews during the college season.  I think I mentioned him here before anyone.  So I go relatively way back on Zaven.  the problem though is it also means its been a long time since I've watched him.  I got to do it again.

 

Both Zaven and Jamin to me are raw on some fronts for different reasons but with a ton of athletic potential.  For that reason, I got to see Zaven's measurables.  His pro day is this Friday.  In both cases I think you are buying into their upside.  Jamin's measurables back his upside.  What I love about him is his sideline to sideline run stopping ability -- and I am sucker for players who play with enthusiasm.  He comes off to me similar to Chase on that front -- he comes off like he plays with a lot of fire.

 

 

[Anselmheifer]

4 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Zaven was one of my first reviews during the college season.  I think I mentioned him here before anyone.  So I go relatively way back on Zaven.  the problem though is it also means its been a long time since I've watched him.  I got to do it again.

 

Both Zaven and Jamin to me are raw on some fronts for different reasons but with a ton of athletic potential.  For that reason, I got to see Zaven's measurables.  His pro day is this Friday.  In both cases I think you are buying into their upside.  Jamin's measurables back his upside.  What I love about him is his sideline to sideline run stopping ability -- and I am sucker for players who play with enthusiasm.  He comes off to me similar to Chase on that front -- he comes off like he plays with a lot of fire.

We definitely need a sideline to sideline run stopping thumper/tone setter. I’m tired of seeing teams run the ball on our vaunted defense. 
 

 

 

 

[clskinsfan]

LOL! Just this on NFLN

 

 

[Berggy9598]

26 minutes ago, clskinsfan said:

Watch Davis's game tape here against NC state. He is fast. He is a good player. But far from a dominate first round LB IMO. He gets manhandled by the TE more often than not. He is very slow to react.  I am not saying Davis cant become a good NFL linebacker. Because he has the athleticism to do just that. But he isnt one right now. Not even close:

 

 

 

How do you know he's slow to react or if he's being fooled by misdirection without being privy to the defensive calls i.e which gap or players he's been assigned on a specific play?

[RWJ]

6 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I am with you on Darrisaw.  I'd hate Trask in the 2nd.  I'd tolerate it in the third but wouldn't love it. 

 

The QB comparisons by name that mock drafter mean nothing to me.  I think its just take random pocket passer who played in the NFL who was successful when it comes to Trask.    I can just as easily compare him to Christian Ponder with less mobility.  My two cents is ignore the comps.  Remember Haskins comp to Big Ben?  Drew Lock had some comps to Mahomes.  It's just a habit to take a successful QB with a style that matches said prospect and compare.   It means nothing as to whether they are successful in the NFL. 

 

While I disagree with those here who say pro days are worthless.  Jeremiah said it well yesterday teams don't send their guys to pro days for kicks to waste their time for a worthless exercise.    I do think the value of them you don't see on TV which is how the ball comes out of the Qbs hands live, how they interact with their teammates, their measurables, etc.    But where I agree with the cyncisim is just about every QB by the meda types will get praised as if they killed it.  That I take with a grain of salt.  So I expect Trask to have his day today with the mock draft media.  They will hype is accuracy and say he is a steal after the first round.    But IMO they will be wrong.

 

Pro days from a media stand point is about basking in the hype.  This thread as an example -- the people who liked Fields in advance before yesterday liked the hype and basked some in it.  Those who didn't like him much previously were cynical about it.  To me he confirmed he was a freak.  You aren't going to see Trask today look like freak.  But those who don't care for Fields suggest he plays well in shorts but not well with live pressure.  Will see.   But Trask will have his day in the sun today. 

 

My take on Trask is he ends up a backup. 

Always respect and agree with most of your assessments.  Today is Trask day.  Let's see if who from RR and Co. are there   A lot of WR/TE talent.  Who knows maybe RR gets the urge to spend future draft picks/player and move up to nab one of the fab 4; maybe not.  It sure would be nice for it to be draft weekend coming up but that takes away from the excitement and build up of the draft, right?    

[clskinsfan]

1 minute ago, Berggy9598 said:

How do you know he's slow to react or if he's being fooled by misdirection without being privy to the defensive calls i.e which gap or players he's been assigned on a specific play?

Watch his first step. Or lack of first step more accurately. I dont hate the player. But I cant stand him in the first round. 

[RWJ]

18 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Zaven was one of my first reviews during the college season.  I think I mentioned him here before anyone.  So I go relatively way back on Zaven.  the problem though is it also means its been a long time since I've watched him.  I got to do it again.

 

Both Zaven and Jamin to me are raw on some fronts for different reasons but with a ton of athletic potential.  For that reason, I got to see Zaven's measurables.  His pro day is this Friday.  In both cases I think you are buying into their upside.  Jamin's measurables back his upside.  What I love about him is his sideline to sideline run stopping ability -- and I am sucker for players who play with enthusiasm.  He comes off to me similar to Chase on that front -- he comes off like he plays with a lot of fire.

 

 

Kyle Trask is not special.   He will need all the weapons he can get to be a starter in the NFL.  Who knows though.  He may surprise.  When I says surprise I always go back to Brady.  Who would have though.  One never knows.

[Skinsinparadise]

17 minutes ago, Anselmheifer said:

We definitely need a sideline to sideline run stopping thumper/tone setter. I’m tired of seeing teams run the ball on our vaunted defense. 

 

 

 

He's a modern LB who plays well in space both as for the run game and the passing game.  He hasn't been starting for long so he has a learning curve as for diagnosing plays but he finds himself as part of the action frequently.    I think his potential is enormous.   From the games I watched they didn't use him much as a pass rusher but when they did you can see his burst and he could get to the QB or pressure him.  With his type of wingspan and his speed, I think the dude can be a weapon with double A gap blitzes, etc. 

 

As I said though the kicker for me is the oomph/enthusiasm he plays with really jumps at me when I watch him.  I like to have some dudes who play linebacker who bring energy to the field -- its contagious.