Est.1974 Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 Haskins does appear to take constructive criticism, or in fact any form of criticism, poorly. It’s been a rough start after what appeared a promising offseason. Think it’s still worth keeping an open mind at this stage. Big month coming up prior to the bye week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWJ Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 36 minutes ago, Malapropismic Depository said: Another sad thing is this exchange with Davis was revealed to him back in TC, and still appears nothing has been done about it Yep, says a lot to me as him as a team player and not taking advise from a team player. Don't like this at all and those that think it's ok I think need to examine themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCalSkins Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 We don’t need to see much more to know it’s not going to get better... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HTTRDynasty Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said: OK, but do you really think he's just making it up about Haskins to placate fans? If so i'd have much less respect for Rivera. Throwing Haskins under the bus to pander to fans. It would seem absuredly out of character for Rivera and actually quite bizzare IMO. What do you mean? I didn’t say he’s making up anything about Haskins. Just that he’s not being honest regarding his primary reason for not using the timeouts (i.e. the injury excuse). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDawg Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 4 minutes ago, HTTRDynasty said: What do you mean? I didn’t say he’s making up anything about Haskins. Just that he’s not being honest regarding his primary reason for not using the timeouts (i.e. the injury excuse). No matter how transparent, you can’t come out and say, “oh, yeah, so I don’t believe in the guy playing QB but the owner picked him so I’m giving him so rope to prove he’s not the guy and improving our draft placement in the process.” Though I do believe that he truly wants to give Haskins a real chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PartyPosse Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 1 minute ago, KDawg said: No matter how transparent, you can’t come out and say, “oh, yeah, so I don’t believe in the guy playing QB but the owner picked him so I’m giving him so rope to prove he’s not the guy and improving our draft placement in the process.” Though I do believe that he truly wants to give Haskins a real chance. I also don't honestly believe he thinks Kyle Allen is any better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCalSkins Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 Just now, PartyPosse said: I also don't honestly believe he thinks Kyle Allen is any better But if he was not handcuffed by Dan there would be another viable option on the roster today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 2 hours ago, HTTRDynasty said: But outside of the turnovers, I actually think Haskins showed more flashes yesterday than he showed in the previous two games combined. I think benching him this season would be a mistake, and I truly believe Rivera knows that and is just giving lip service to the fans and reporters... because, as I alluded to earlier, his actions don't match his words here. I was referring to what's in bold there. You are referring here to Haskins here (not the time outs) and that Rivera knows better than to bench Haskins so he's just giving lip service to the fans and reporters. It comes off like you saying that Rivera doesn't truly believe what he said about Haskins. But if i am minsunderstanding your point, sorry, then please clarify because that's what I was responding to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xameil Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 4 minutes ago, SoCalSkins said: But if he was not handcuffed by Dan there would be another viable option on the roster today. That is really a HUGE speculation. I honestly don't think Rivera comes here if that were the case. He had options I'm sure. Its not like he was some scrub coach fighting for a job or some OC looking for his shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PartyPosse Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 9 minutes ago, SoCalSkins said: But if he was not handcuffed by Dan there would be another viable option on the roster today. Not with Alex Smith on the books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 1 hour ago, volsmet said: I speculate that Rivera says that to the media to gauge DHs response. I think you're probably right. It came off to me like he's trying to hammer home to Dwayne to slow down and go through his progressions at the right pace and order. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDawg Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 I think you guys are right that he said it to the media to help motivate Haskins/see his reaction. But I also think he said it because he just plain meant it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 1 minute ago, Xameil said: That is really a HUGE speculation. I honestly don't think Rivera comes here if that were the case. He had options I'm sure. Its not like he was some scrub coach fighting for a job or some OC looking for his shot. Being handcuffed doesn't necessarily mean that Dan made Dwayne's development a stipulation on his hiring. But Ron is definitely saddled with Dwayne, given the team had just used a 1st round pick on him (per direction from Dan, per numerous sources). Seems a bit wild to come here and dump last years first rounder off the break. Perhaps if Cincy took Young vs. Burrow, that might have happened. But the way things happened, it makes sense that Ron would see what he has in Dwayne, given the team's investment in him. I venture a guess if Dwayne's trajectory isn't way up from where it is now by the time he makes his last start this season, Ron will be getting 'his guy'. I don't see him as the type of guy to just keep trotting out a guy he doesn't think has it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 1 hour ago, volsmet said: I’m the only person in the world who wouldn’t have drafted DH at all, I don’t know if anyone else pointed out his issues vs zones ... but I pointed out exactly what he’d struggle with there, and I cited his mechanical issues more than anyone and I was relatively alone in pointing out his accuracy issues. You were a Haskins skeptic before it became cool to do so. After you basically egged me on to take a closer look at him and not to be fooled by his stats/highlights. I echoed it in detail one Saturday morning where i spent about 5 hours watching Haskins in back to back multiple games and posted on the draft thread in detail what I thought Haskins was good at and what he wasn't good at. I said after that, I didn't want to draft him. I recall you saying you hope the Giants draft him. I echoed that point and both you and I on the draft thread actively rooted for another team to take Haskins before our pick came up. You made the case that Haskins receivers have much to do with his inflated stats at Ohio State -- mesh routes, short digs up the middle, and Parris Campbell and company would break free for a big run. To me Haskins best attribute are those 5-7 yard quick in routes where he is good at hitting a reciever in stride and then YAC, YAC, YAC. Still the same IMO in the pros. I thought the biggest misperception about Haskins was that he threw a good deep ball. Big arm so he must be great at that, etc. But he didn't IMO. They were often underthrown with little arc on them. His balls would sail on the intermdiate stuff. He wasn't hot at throwing on the move or at the numbers or beyond. He'd have exceptions to all of this. But by and large he was very inconsistent. When I watched him in camp he put on a clinic where he showed all the same concerns that were discussed on the draft thread. 1 hour ago, volsmet said: DH is improving, he had a long way to go when drafted and he’s made progress. The negatives were there when most here loved him... the only changes are positives, he’s processing things more quickly & he has changed his body over the most chaotic offseason imaginable. I got to watch the games over with coaches tape, i'll get to it eventually. Crazy time for me at work. No doubt he did a nice job improving his body. And according to many he wasn't a hard worker last year but this year he's done a 180 and has worked really hard. I love that. For those reasons i actually started positive about Haskins before the season. But his accuracy issues to me seem so same old same old. And i never loved him talent wise in the first place. I do think he has a really good arm. But I think some take that point too far -- he's not to me Mahomes or Josh Allen or name that elite arm strength dude. I mentioned Arians' book a lot on the draft thread. And lol it doesn''t make me an expert on Qbs (far from it) but for a layman its the best i have right now. Arians mentioned footwork as the be all and end all. So does Peyton when he done various QB specials. They both say isn't not easy to develop consistent mechanics but the ones who do tend to be special. Haskins to me is still struggiling with that. i am more than willing to give him the season to see if he improves. And if he gradually makes strides as you suggest then we should see Haskins' game elevate as the season goes on. And I am open to that possibility. And I hope it happens. But if it doesn't and they have an opportunity to upgrade that spot, I am doing it in a heartbeat. Scouts say all the time, judging young QBs is the hardest job in sports. So don't get me wrong, I am not 100% confident in my opinion about any young QB. But that goes both ways. Just because someone here tells me Haskins has it doesn't make me a believer either. i think by and large the ones who know best are the ones who see the QBs everyday and can evaluate him. Mike Shahahan has said before more or less, that he knows a lot about QBs and offenses yet even he has a hard time judging a Qb's potential based on tape. He said he knows quickly once he has that QB in the building. But he's far from fully confident in his evaluations before that QB is in his building where he can see how that player rolls and progresses or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PartyPosse Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 3 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said: Being handcuffed doesn't necessarily mean that Dan made Dwayne's development a stipulation on his hiring. But Ron is definitely saddled with Dwayne, given the team had just used a 1st round pick on him (per direction from Dan, per numerous sources). Seems a bit wild to come here and dump last years first rounder off the break. Perhaps if Cincy took Young vs. Burrow, that might have happened. But the way things happened, it makes sense that Ron would see what he has in Dwayne, given the team's investment in him. I venture a guess if Dwayne's trajectory isn't way up from where it is now by the time he makes his last start this season, Ron will be getting 'his guy'. I don't see him as the type of guy to just keep trotting out a guy he doesn't think has it. Here's something to think about. If say Dwayne was not drafted, say we had no QB, and were still picking at 2. Would you have taken Tua over Chase? At this point, I'd still rather have Dwayne and Chase than Tua, who may not thrive in the NFL either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xameil Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 1 minute ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said: Being handcuffed doesn't necessarily mean that Dan made Dwayne's development a stipulation on his hiring. But Ron is definitely saddled with Dwayne, given the team had just used a 1st round pick on him (per direction from Dan, per numerous sources). Seems a bit wild to come here and dump last years first rounder off the break. Perhaps if Cincy took Young vs. Burrow, that might have happened. But the way things happened, it makes sense that Ron would see what he has in Dwayne, given the team's investment in him. I venture a guess if Dwayne's trajectory isn't way up from where it is now by the time he makes his last start this season, Ron will be getting 'his guy'. I don't see him as the type of guy to just keep trotting out a guy he doesn't think has it. Speculation....speculation...speculation... I don't think Dan had any hand on if Haskins started or not this year. Ron could have brought Cam in ( money obviously would have been tough) or just started his other QB from Carolina. Obviously Ron and his crew see something. I don't know what it is...but that's why I'm here typing on a phone and not coaching a pro football team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HTTRDynasty Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 16 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said: I was referring to what's in bold there. You are referring here to Haskins here (not the time outs) and that Rivera knows better than to bench Haskins so he's just giving lip service to the fans and reporters. It comes off like you saying that Rivera doesn't truly believe what he said about Haskins. But if i am minsunderstanding your point, sorry, then please clarify because that's what I was responding to. You are definitely misunderstanding here. I was referring to him giving lip service to the fans and reporters as it relates to timeouts. He can't outright say he's willing to tank for a high draft pick, so he's giving lip service by saying the reason for not calling the timeouts is mainly due to a host of other factors. And those other factors may even be true, but it's clear to me what the primary reason is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PartyPosse Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 Just now, HTTRDynasty said: You are definitely misunderstanding here. I was referring to him giving lip service to the fans and reporters as it relates to timeouts. He can't outright say he's willing to tank for a high draft pick, so he's giving lip service by saying the reason for not calling the timeouts is mainly due to a host of other factors. And those other factors may even be true, but it's clear to me what the primary reason is. So you legitimately think Ron is purposely trying to lose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOATFrerotte Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 That's really the big issue is simply the draft position. He's being treated like a first rounder when really he should be treated like a 2nd or 3rd. Someone that gets an opportunity, but if he doesn't run with it, he gets a seat on the bench until the next opportunity arises. He's not good enough to get the franchise qb treatment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HTTRDynasty Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 25 minutes ago, KDawg said: No matter how transparent, you can’t come out and say, “oh, yeah, so I don’t believe in the guy playing QB but the owner picked him so I’m giving him so rope to prove he’s not the guy and improving our draft placement in the process.” Though I do believe that he truly wants to give Haskins a real chance. I agree you can't come out and say that. I just despair for any fan who doesn't believe that's the real reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 1 minute ago, Xameil said: I don't think Dan had any hand on if Haskins started or not this year. To be fair, you cape for Dan Snyder a lot - so I'm not surprised. That said, I don't necessarily think Dan forced him to start Haskins either. It makes sense to start Haskins in order to see if he has it or not. I think you start Haskins the entire year or until you lose the locker room. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HTTRDynasty Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 Just now, PartyPosse said: So you legitimately think Ron is purposely trying to lose. When he has the veil of an excuse that the game is already out of hand - yes. It's pretty obvious. Occam's razor, folks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said: I heard the whole press conference. A reporter tried to egg Rivera on after Rivera said he starred by saying Haskins is saying he wasn't starring so what does he think of that. So Rivera adeptly avoided looking like he disagreed with Haskins on it so he goes Haskins might see it that way because he might think he looked it off but the look off was too quick, so he did stare. That wasn't a dodge by Ron. To me, that was Ron clarifying Dwayne's statement by pointing out there was a contradiction in terms between him and the reporter. It's a sort of semantic confusion that has led people to jump to the erroneous conclusion that Dwayne is being uncoachable. Ron explained that Dwayne interpreted the statement that he's staring receiver down to mean he was just getting stuck on his first read. Dwayne says, no that's not true, I went through the progressions. For the reporter, staring down means he's just looking at one of the progressions in the sequence too long, whether or not it's the first progression, which is where the confusion is coming from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xameil Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 Just now, BatteredFanSyndrome said: To be fair, you cape for Dan Snyder a lot - so I'm not surprised. That said, I don't necessarily think Dan forced him to start Haskins either. It makes sense to start Haskins in order to see if he has it or not. I think you start Haskins the entire year or until you lose the locker room. Lol again how wrong you are with that first part...but I expect no less from you. In reality..I wanted Bezos to buy the team. I just make it a policy to not rail against someone until I have facts...yup the F word. As for Haskins.....I agree with you...but I also was screaming to get him the hell out of there in the 3rd quarter... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PartyPosse Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 2 minutes ago, HTTRDynasty said: When he has the veil of an excuse that the game is already out of hand - yes. It's pretty obvious. Occam's razor, folks. That's not what i'm asking. Do you think going into each week he would rather lose than win? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.