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Trump Border Wall Post-Shutdown Discussion (Wall-Fight)

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28 minutes ago, visionary said:
 

Pres now calling the Democrats "radicalized." "I think they've become a very dangerous party to this country," he said, fuming over cancellation of his State of the Union Address. Says @SenSchumer is "dominated" by Pelosi. "He's a puppet for Nancy Pelosi," said the pres.

 

Well if there is one thing Trump knows all about, it's being a puppet. 

Edited by NoCalMike
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46 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

Goddamn it, PB, you that pissed off you think i don't know the difference between impeachment and the the 25th amendement? Those are two legal options, I asked you to step back from the ledge, if you can't, maybe I'll just leave an let you believe whatever you want to believe, try this again another day.

 

I can assure you that I am not pissed off, I just don't have any idea of what you mean by stepping back from a ledge.  

 

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I'm looking for ways to get him out, we know he needs to go and like many in Congress has said if Muller has something that can be used to get him out without compromising the investigation, f'n do it.  Trump has a gun to our head and we're waiting for the cops to show up, I have every right to be frustrated and concerned at minimum. We all do.

 

I am as frustrated and concerned as the next person.  And I think Congress can start impeachment hearings whenever they want.  I just don't think rushing the Mueller investigation is smart.  Congress can do its own investigations and, obviously, there is already plenty of evidence in the public domain for reasonable people to vote for Trump's impeachment.  There are not, however, enough votes in the Senate to actually get him out.  Will Mueller's report change that?  That's not at all clear, no matter what is in it.  

 

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With respect to how investigations work, so be it. But holy ****, man, i don't want to hear it if they are still investigating him after he's re-elected.  If they have charges that doesn't need additional investigstion, i want to know.  The world is shifting toward authorianism, this investigation has a lot more at stake then just us.

 

Reelection is almost two years down the road.  I'm confident there will be something from Mueller by then.  Frankly, given that I'm not convinced that the report, no matter how bad, will lead to his ouster, I kind of want it to not be released until the summer of 2020, right at the start of the general, for maximum impact.  

 

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This isn't about politics anymore we talking survival of the free world keeping this guy from getting reelected.

 

:ols: And you are the one telling people to step back from the ledge. ;)

 

I'm also confident enough that he won't be reelected that i have four figures worth of bets on it with Trump supporters.  

 

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My point exactly, we can stop right here and go no further. Should i have lead with that? I thought we were all in the same page about this going in.

 

I'm definitely with you here.  This is also one of the reasons I don't think Mueller's report will be enough to get Trump out.  The entire ****ing intelligence community has told us that the guy is basically a Russian asset, and it hasn't really moved the needle.  :wtf:

 

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I'd like to hear his definition of Trump base then

 

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=12118280

 

I just posted the article.  You should read it, it's good.  He said Trump's base is 28-35% of all voters.  That means it's 60-70% of GOP voters, since none of the 28-35% are Dems or seriously independents.  The reason Trump has been able to completely capture the Republican party is because more than half of GOP voters love Trump more than any other politician.  

 

 

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Agree and refer back to previous link.  Most of my Trump friends like he says what's on his mind so they know what he's thinking, even if it's terrible.  Not a fan of this logic, but they have lines in what he's done and what he's being accused of.  The "no matter what" crowd is NOT 60% to 70% of the GOP.

 

Trump has *publicly taken the side of a group of Nazis that murdered a white women in the streets ON CAMERA* and you think there is some other line that can be crossed for those people?  I don't.

 

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I wish it was someone truly weak minded like that, but I whole-heartedly believe it will be someone who learns from Trumps mistakes and comes out like a new version of Ultron.  Why I'm stressing the plugging if loopholes, that dude is probably already in office somewhere.

 

I'm more optimistic man.  I think Trump's election was the death rattle of a generation with a lot of terrible people.  I definitely agree that many of our "norms" that Trump has taken a hatchet to need to be enshrined as "laws" so that, in future, someone way more savvy than Trump (which is most people) can't come along and exploit them more systematically.  

Edited by PleaseBlitz
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57 minutes ago, BenningRoadSkin said:

 

 

But, but, but, he would have surrendered to the Democrat's demand that he give up something that he didn't have in the first place, and didn't have the votes to get!  

 

 

Edited by Larry
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15 minutes ago, visionary said:

 

 

 

I actually agree with Lindsey Graham.  

 

I need to shower now.  

 

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7 minutes ago, PleaseBlitz said:

 

I can assure you that I am not pissed off, I just don't have any idea of what you mean by stepping back from a ledge.  

 

I seriously thought you forgot who was talking to when you tried to tell me what the 25th amendment was when we've talked about that before :ols:

 

7 minutes ago, PleaseBlitz said:

 

I am as frustrated and concerned as the next person.  And I think Congress can start impeachment hearings whenever they want.  I just don't think rushing the Mueller investigation is smart.  Congress can do its own investigations and, obviously, there is already plenty of evidence in the public domain for reasonable people to vote for Trump's impeachment.  There are not, however, enough votes in the Senate to actually get him out.  Will Mueller's report change that?  That's not at all clear, no matter what is in it.  

 

This is what kills me because it's part what the senate doesn't know, doesn't want to admit they know, or their constitutes dont know yet.  We don't have the 60 now, but that because the report isn't out.  That may change if the shut down continues and pressure grows in that chamber.

 

7 minutes ago, PleaseBlitz said:

 

Reelection is almost two years down the road.  I'm confident there will be something from Mueller by then.  Frankly, given that I'm not convinced that the report, no matter how bad, will lead to his ouster, I kind of want it to not be released until the summer of 2020, right at the start of the general, for maximum impact.  

 

I have no choice but to respect your opinion even if that timetable drives me bat**** while appearing to sit stoically. 

 

7 minutes ago, PleaseBlitz said:

 

:ols: And you are the one telling people to step back from the ledge. ;)

 

Reread our exchanges tou had more fun then I did : )

 

7 minutes ago, PleaseBlitz said:

I'm also confident enough that he won't be reelected that i have four figures worth of bets on it with Trump supporters.  

 

My sister and I have a dollar each sitting on a table.  Did you make that bet on idea that if it makes it all the way to summer or next year, what's a couple more to make it after November? 

 

7 minutes ago, PleaseBlitz said:

 

I'm definitely with you here.  This is also one of the reasons I don't think Mueller's report will be enough to get Trump out.  The entire ****ing intelligence community has told us that the guy is basically a Russian asset, and it hasn't really moved the needle.  :wtf:

 

Omg, no words. That's because intelligence community wasn't allowed to drop off folder worth of docs proving it at the lobby of the Washington Post.  Instead...they gave it to Mueller.

 

7 minutes ago, PleaseBlitz said:

 

I just posted the article.  You should read it, it's good.  He said Trump's base is 28-35% of all voters.  That means it's 60-70% of GOP voters, since none of the 28-35% are Dems or seriously independents.  The reason Trump has been able to completely capture the Republican party is because more than half of GOP voters love Trump more than any other politician.  

 

 

I didn't see it, still catching up from the vacation, was this what you were talking about?  

 

https://www.cookpolitical.com/analysis/national/national-politics/sizing-trumps-base

 

Did you see mine and why I asked that "no matter what he does question"?

 

7 minutes ago, PleaseBlitz said:

 

Trump has *publicly taken the side of a group of Nazis that murdered a white women in the streets ON CAMERA* and you think there is some other line that can be crossed for those people?  I don't.

 

They may be racist, but they're American.  If it comes out he's working directly with an Russia to hurt America instead of making it great again, yes, that's different.  Racism is as American as apple pie, treason is not.

 

7 minutes ago, PleaseBlitz said:

 

I'm more optimistic man.  I think Trump's election was the death rattle of a generation with a lot of terrible people.  I definitely agree that many of our "norms" that Trump has taken a hatchet to need to be enshrined as "laws" so that, in future, someone way more savvy than Trump (which is most people) can't come along and exploit them more systematically.  

 

Pretty much.  I believe our country will recover from this.  But as I brought up in the NATO thread, the next president is going to be walking into a much different world then Trump inherited. 

 

And with a victory like this, I don't see Russia stopping this method of trying to kill democracies from within, we have our work cut out for us, there's no promise we will be successful at it now that people are willingly voting for authorianism with more regularity now.

 

Will next president be leader of free world or what's left of it?

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Somewhere in a board room full of evil henchmen, Grover Norquist is giddy seeing his "starve the beast" wet dream scenario come true. 

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60% plus 36% plus 31% is a hell of a lot of blame to distribute

 

it's all the blame plus bonus blame

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27 minutes ago, Jumbo said:

60% plus 36% plus 31% is a hell of a lot of blame to distribute

 

it's all the blame plus bonus blame

 

The illegals voted, too.  

 

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After those polls don't expect anything but more of the same from the Ds. It's working in the court of public opinion. From Don, it'll be both fake news and somehow the Rs fault for not supporting him enough. 

 

Edited by @SkinsGoldPants

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Just pull the lever already and declare the freakin national emergency for the wall.  Dems aren't caving.  Better yet.  Declare a national emergency and reopen the government.  How about that?

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2 hours ago, spjunkies said:

Please, Lindsay can stuff his tradition until I get my damn paycheck!

We also have a tradition that our president is not a Russian agent. Let's see Graham do something about that.

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Lindsay Graham is worried about tradition?  Has a State of the Union address been given by a president during a shutdown?  Millions of people impacted and these bozos want to let Trump give a speech about how great he’s doing while they all stand and applaud him after every 10 words he says?  

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26 minutes ago, Cooked Crack said:

 

 

Great idea, Don.  

 

Reopen the government, and then issue an executive order ordering the government to spend money on something that Congress hasn't approved.  

 

I'm sure it will work.  

 

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Actually, Don, I've got an idea.  

 

Sell a bunch of weapons to Iran, and then pretend that the revenue from that sale isn't government money, and therefore you can spend it on things that Congress has forbidden you to spend money on. 

 

Lindsey Graham will approve.  He's big on tradition.  

 

(A little sarcastic reminder for those people thinking that the whole thing about trying to spend money without Congress' approval is a new low for the GOP, that only Trump would contemplate.)  

 

 

Edited by Larry
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