PleaseBlitz Posted September 20, 2018 Author Share Posted September 20, 2018 17 minutes ago, Renegade7 said: Hmm...they team was losing but his stats looked decent that year. I don't follow college enough to say how much a blame could be put on him for that last year, but didn't he take them to the fiesta bowl the year prior? His stats look remarkable similar to 2010 Alabama QB Greg McElroy (roughly 3000 yards passing, roughly a 150 QB rating). Of course, McElroy was facing SEC defenses and Kizer was playing Army and Navy and Duke and Syracuse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted September 20, 2018 Share Posted September 20, 2018 2 minutes ago, PleaseBlitz said: His stats look remarkable similar to 2010 Alabama QB Greg McElroy (roughly 3000 yards passing, roughly a 150 QB rating). Of course, McElroy was facing SEC defenses and Kizer was playing Army and Navy and Duke and Syracuse. More then fair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilmer17 Posted September 20, 2018 Share Posted September 20, 2018 I think Alabama's best team could have beaten the Redskins in December of 2013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PleaseBlitz Posted September 20, 2018 Author Share Posted September 20, 2018 1 minute ago, Renegade7 said: More then fair. Although, McElroy had much better talent around him than Kizer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dont Taze Me Bro Posted September 20, 2018 Share Posted September 20, 2018 1 hour ago, PleaseBlitz said: @Dont Taze Me Bro Mind doing the depth chart for the 2010 Alabama team, noting class year and whether they are a future pro bowler (or potential HOF candidate)? You can note the pro bowlers for the Browns too. No.......I got in trouble at work because I was looking up those stats and forgot to do something Let's assume that in any given season, that Bama will have 48 total players that will eventually be drafted in the NFL. And that assumption is based on them having 12 drafted last year. Out of those 48, lets say on average 5 of them per draft class are future pro-bowlers and starting from day 1, so 20 total. Keep in mind that while 48 players are going to make the NFL, only 12 of them are going the next year, so that leaves 36 underclassmen every year, which includes redshirt freshmen, sophomores, juniors not declaring early for the draft. So at any given point, during the season, real time, only 5 of those players would be ready to start/play in the NFL versus 22 players that already start in the NFL and already have pro experience, coaching, etc. Maybe......just maybe......one or two of those juniors that would not declare eligible for the draft might be starting caliber on some NFL teams. So 7 vs 22. Julio Jones as a sophomore versus starting NFL CBs........I'm going to say that he might beat his man here and there, but I seriously doubt the QB even gets off a pass before that happens, I just don't see four college linemen that are not fully developed blocking any NFL tackle/end/LB with any success, much less being able to create a pocket with a window large enough for the receivers to get open (in the case of So. Julio Jones vs. pro CBs). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PleaseBlitz Posted September 20, 2018 Author Share Posted September 20, 2018 1 minute ago, Kilmer17 said: I think Alabama's best team could have beaten the Redskins in December of 2013 I think they could have beaten the 2009 team in October when they made Zorn give up playcalling to the bingo caller. Scratch that, they'd probably have a better chance when Zorn was calling plays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justice98 Posted September 20, 2018 Share Posted September 20, 2018 1 minute ago, PleaseBlitz said: I think they could have beaten the 2009 team in October when they made Zorn give up playcalling to the bingo caller. Scratch that, they'd probably have a better chance when Zorn was calling plays. I think that offense in the first year of Spurrier, when he was out there running his college offense with his old Florida guys like Danny Wuerrfel and Chris Doering mighta had some issues against Bama's defense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PleaseBlitz Posted September 20, 2018 Author Share Posted September 20, 2018 19 minutes ago, Dont Taze Me Bro said: So at any given point, during the season, real time, only 5 of those players would be ready to start/play in the NFL versus 22 players that already start in the NFL and already have pro experience, coaching, etc. Maybe......just maybe......one or two of those juniors that would not declare eligible for the draft might be starting caliber on some NFL teams. So 7 vs 22. I don't think it's fair to say that only the pro-bowl caliber players are capable of starting/playing for some NFL team while they are seniors in college. In other words, I think a senior in college that never ends up making the Pro Bowl could still be better than a replacement-level NFL player (aka "just a guy"). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
88Comrade2000 Posted September 20, 2018 Share Posted September 20, 2018 Maybe not the best college team but a team of the best college players at each position, could possibly beat the worst NFL team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCSaints_fan Posted September 20, 2018 Share Posted September 20, 2018 2 hours ago, justice98 said: College all stars have beaten pros in MLB and the NBA. I dont see why the same couldnt happen in a one game scenario in the NFL. I think the college all-stars would have a chance, scratch that, I think they would almost definitely beat the worst NFL team. That's basically forming your team out of an entire draft class, or maybe even 1.5 draft classes because the best players don't always declare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCSaints_fan Posted September 20, 2018 Share Posted September 20, 2018 3 hours ago, Major Harris said: I don't know what to say, you're right, I can't name names, it doesn't make your stance any less absurd. Could the best middle school team beat the worst high school team? Could the best high school team beat the worst college team? Depending on the parameters of "worst college team". An D1 FBS or FCS school, probably no. But there are some insane high schools in Texas who I can see definitely beating Div III schools. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dont Taze Me Bro Posted September 20, 2018 Share Posted September 20, 2018 1 hour ago, PleaseBlitz said: I don't think it's fair to say that only the pro-bowl caliber players are capable of starting/playing for some NFL team while they are seniors in college. In other words, I think a senior in college that never ends up making the Pro Bowl could still be better than a replacement-level NFL player (aka "just a guy"). You have look at the criteria I set up for Bama, which is all speculation and only based on last years draft class and setting a static number of players that will go on to become pro-bowlers, starters in the NFL, back-ups, never drafted/signed. Of course in reality, each year, until they are drafted and play, there is no way to know if those first round picks are the real deal or bust, or if a 7th round pick becomes a starting pro-bowl player, etc. My criteria: at any given point in time starting with the 2018 team and future teams, they will have 12 players that are drafted by the NFL, every draft going forward. Each draft, out of those twelve players drafted, five of them will become starters in the NFL and future pro-bowlers, while the rest are 2nd-3rd stringers. So, we put the current 2018 Tide team against the 2017 Browns team, right now with the same rosters both teams had/have. Even if those future five studs are NFL ready today (which I seriously doubt all five would be), it still becomes a 5 versus 22 situation. I understand your point about certain Browns starters might not start for other teams. I guess the bigger question is, how many of the Browns starters would not be good enough to start on the other 31 NFL teams and would only be 2nd/3rd string quality? Even if it's half (11 starters), I still don't see that making a big enough difference in the overall outcome. Those 22 have played on the highest level against the best talent in the world and produced points, held their own and stayed competitive, regardless of what the W/L column reflects. There is no way, imo, a college offensive line with one stud would stop their front seven. The Browns would be living in the Tides backfield all game. And I don't think the Tides front seven would get enough pressure on even the ****tiest Browns QB. I'll even go out on a limb and say that the Browns QB would have a field day on the Tides defense. Again, these are grown ass men, professionally trained at the pro level going against young men, which in most cases, have not fully developed and have not hit their full potential mixed in with starters that have and will never even play on the practice squad in the NFL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted September 20, 2018 Share Posted September 20, 2018 1 hour ago, Rdskns2000 said: Maybe not the best college team but a team of the best college players at each position, could possibly beat the worst NFL team. Ya, but that would be an all-rookie team, not a college team, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PleaseBlitz Posted September 20, 2018 Author Share Posted September 20, 2018 1 hour ago, Dont Taze Me Bro said: You have look at the criteria I set up for Bama, which is all speculation and only based on last years draft class and setting a static number of players that will go on to become pro-bowlers, starters in the NFL, back-ups, never drafted/signed. Of course in reality, each year, until they are drafted and play, there is no way to know if those first round picks are the real deal or bust, or if a 7th round pick becomes a starting pro-bowl player, etc. Gonna have to pick this up tomorrow. Went to happy hour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
China Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 A few things: 1) in 2011 Julio Jones wasn't on the Alabama team: http://www.cfbstats.com/2011/team/8/roster.html ; he was a rookie for ATL https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/J/JoneJu02.htm 2) It is sometimes difficult to make direct comparisons. For example, Mark Barron is listed as a DB on the 2011 Alabama team, but he plays LB in the NFL (perhaps he was too slow to play safety.) Jabril Peppers was the safety for the 2017 Browns, and his 40 time was 4.46 compared to Barron's 4.54. 3) Speed of some players (I don't have time to look them all up): DE Myles Garrett (Browns) 4.64, Quinton Dial (Alabama), 5.29 RB Isaiah Crowell (Browns) 4.57, Eddie Lacy (Alabama), 4.55 LB Joe Schobert (Browns) 4.76, Donta Hightower (Alabama) 4.62 WR, Corey Coleman (Browns) 4.42, Brandon Gibson (Alabama) 4.5.9, Darius Hanks (Alabama) 4.52 (Note: he washed out here in DC and didn't make the league) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead36 Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 This argument is tired every year. Even the worst NFL team is mostly guys who were great college players, and they're now fully grown men for the most part. They would demolish the best college team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 If you want a specific breakdown, you'd need to identify who the "worst" NFL team is. Everyone is saying the Browns because they were 0-16 but, as mentioned, they were in plenty of games. But, once you name whatever NFL team you want, I think it would be pretty simple to line up the 11v11 and make the case that, almost across the board, the NFL team would dismantle the college team in each individual match up. I think something that might be a bit closer would be the best college team against a 33rd NFL team which is made up the way 1970s expansion teams were (basically the next best 45 players who didn't make it elsewhere in the NFL). Think the 77 Bucs, not the expansion draft 95 Panthers. In THAT scenario, I think the college team would do well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Harris Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 On 9/20/2018 at 1:34 PM, PleaseBlitz said: By my reasoning, a redshirt college freshman (who eventually becomes a pro-bowler like CJ Mosley, Haha Clinton Dix, Amari Cooper and Landon Collins) is probably good enough to make the league as a redshirt freshman, yes. On absolutely. But we aren't comparing 2011 Julio with 2013 Julio. We are comparing 2011 Julio with any-year Ricardo Louis. Again, I'll take 2011 Julio. It's enough to play one game. actually, by rule, you have to have 5 lineman. maybe julio could do that better than joe thomas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hersh Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 21 hours ago, DCSaints_fan said: I think the college all-stars would have a chance, scratch that, I think they would almost definitely beat the worst NFL team. That's basically forming your team out of an entire draft class, or maybe even 1.5 draft classes because the best players don't always declare. Being a college all-star in any sport is a lot different from being a good pro player. People are big time under estimating how good professional athletes are compared to college players. There is a reason almost all rookie QB’s struggle even when surrounded by elite talent, let alone surround by rookies. Then you get into issues like the 3rd and 4th corners on the all-rookie team, presuming the top two corners play relatively well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yohan Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 Who is coaching the Alabama team. If it Sabin, then no, but if its Mike Ditka, I'll go Bama. Da Tide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PleaseBlitz Posted September 21, 2018 Author Share Posted September 21, 2018 1 hour ago, Major Harris said: actually, by rule, you have to have 5 lineman. They'd have plenty of serviceable linemen. They had a number of OL that were UDFA's, including a guy, William Vlachos, that was first team all SEC and a finalist for the Rimington award (and now coaches in the NFL). I'd bet he'd be okay against (at the time) Browns rookie starting DL Trevon Coley, who was also an UDFA, out of powerhouse Florida Atlantic, then waived by the Ravens, then released from the Redskins practice squad, then signed with the Browns. 1 hour ago, Yohan said: Who is coaching the Alabama team. If it Sabin, then no, but if its Mike Ditka, I'll go Bama. Da Tide. Obviously the reanimated corpse of Bear Bryant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justice98 Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 I think the talent on that '16 Bama defense could be as good as the worst NFL defense. The offense is where that team wouldnt hold up. I think experience factor and complexity of NFL schemes counts more than pure talent level in this scenario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 43 minutes ago, justice98 said: I think the talent on that '16 Bama defense could be as good as the worst NFL defense. The offense is where that team wouldnt hold up. I think experience factor and complexity of NFL schemes counts more than pure talent level in this scenario. Just pure talent alone makes this hard to believe. A handful of the guys on the best Alabama team would probably flash and clearly show that they belong. But, even with that, they wouldn't win individual matchups consistently enough to overcome the other teammates who are getting whipped on every play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
China Posted September 22, 2018 Share Posted September 22, 2018 8 hours ago, PleaseBlitz said: They'd have plenty of serviceable linemen. You mean like Mr. Moobies, Andre Smith... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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