2019 Comprehensive Draft Thread

[Anselmheifer]

I think Cody Ford is going to go higher than 15. He is an extremely solid prospect at a position of importance and should be an immediate starter and potential pro-bowl caliber player. 

[volsmet]

On 1/3/2019 at 2:53 AM, sportjunkie07 said:

i also feel the qb makes the oline more than the opposite.

 

As a human, I find that very difficult to believe.

 

23 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

Failing to grasp the central importance of the QB position is lacking imagination.  Ignoring this entire QB class to chase grass is greener fantasies of name recognition freshmen and sophomore QBs playing for starry programs who haven't even been evaluated yet is lacking imagination.

 

There is no such thing as building a foundation for your roster without a QB.  QB is the foundation.  It's what allows you to begin a window of legit competitiveness.  If you load up on other positions before securing that quarterback foundation, then you're, at best, wasting a year(s) of everyone's career.  At worst, you're entering a cycle of roster churn where talent comes in and out without ever even having the chance to win anything.

 

None of that is correct. 

21 hours ago, Tedskins 21 said:

My limited knowledge order of preference right now is:

 

Josh Allen (Won’t be available)

Daniel Jones

Devin White

Cody Ford

Hollywood

 

We need speed on defense (especially at linebacker.) We also need a QB. LG has been a hole for years.  No speed at our skill positions besides CT who has regressed/cannot stay healthy.

 

If we could somehow get Daniel Jones and then Marquise Brown in the 2nd I think you see a major upgrade on offense.  

 

 

A rookie QB is going to offer more than Smith if that rookie has Brown? I don’t think you really believe that.

[Califan007 The Constipated]

So how many draft picks do we have again?...and how many in the first rounds?

[volsmet]

19 hours ago, skinny21 said:

So, just toying around with the idea of trading up for Haskins...

 

Obviously you can throw the draft chart out the window (for the most part), but, I was wondering what it would take - in relation to the draft value charts - to trade up to the 4th pick.  More specifically, say we’re 750 pts shy of meeting the value after giving up the 15 spot.  What value does a 2020 1st round pick net?  

 

Trading up for Haskins would be brutal, imo. I don’t get the infatuation. 

[volsmet]

On 1/2/2019 at 9:30 PM, nonniey said:

It's not that Allen is terrible it is just that he lacks the imagination (as do most posters judging from this thread) to build a team. Everything is in the now he seems to be unable to look past the current year/ season - which is the best way to build a team. Best option to to push for as many picks as we can get in 2020 and 2021, I'm sure that hasn't even crossed his mind.

 

Absolutely correct. We should be moving to give ourselves the ability to get the guy we want in a future draft unless we love someone in this draft. We should have traded Trent to begin this process a year ago, but we wasted a tremendous opportunity. Incredibly, no one else on this board seemed to understand what was obvious last winter, Trent needed to go & we should have traded our first for future firsts - or taken Derwin. I like Payne, but this, 2019, is the line draft, build the lines and then bring in the QB. The ravens are winning with a guy who can’t throw, the Rams are winning with a QB nobody thought belonged in the nfl 18 months ago, the Bears are winning with a guy who makes most of his big plays with his legs — they win because their lines make it so — the same with Philly & Dallas - cheap QBs, strong lines, that’s the easiest path to becoming a contender. 

 

 

A protected bum at QBs is better than an elite QB, like Luck, behind bums.

 

On 1/3/2019 at 1:53 AM, wolfsire said:

Devin white is the pick. If available.

 

Not a chance he’s available. Imo. But, I’m in, if he is.

[volsmet]

On 1/2/2019 at 2:31 PM, sportjunkie07 said:

I feel like we always struggle with drafting a qb at the same time as a new regime and it is almost imperative to do so. 

 

We are in a tricky spot because spending big free agent money on a qb will hurt our team yet a cheap rookie qb will likely be a throw away pick once we have a regime change. 

 

I think we should go for the bpa at our pick and/or try to build a dominate facet of our team. Seeking to improve the run game will also help us in the short and long term. 

 

I'd be OK with a later round pick on a qb though. Throw him in the fire. If we get lucky.. that's great. If not, there is a regime change and that 4th rounder didn't hurt us too badly, plus we likely have a high pick next year with which to get a qb. 

 

Thorson may be your guy, he’s got a decent but to work with, he was mocked in round 1 not all that long ago, but now it seems he’s mentioned in 3-5.

[JamesMadisonSkins]

Current Walter Football mock draft is interesting. Not saying I’d necessarily go this route but if they did, I think it would reinvigorate the fan base. 

 

R1: A.J. Brown, WR Ole Miss

R2: Jarrett Stidham, QB Auburn

R3: Garrett Bradberry, C N.C. State

 

You’d need to divert your FA resources to solve EDGE, slot WR and secondary but the offense would be nicely set up for a few years if everyone developed.

[Going Commando]

35 minutes ago, JamesMadisonSkins said:

Current Walter Football mock draft is interesting. Not saying I’d necessarily go this route but if they did, I think it would reinvigorate the fan base. 

 

I think they're overrating both Brown and Stidham.  Brown is probably a second round pick IMO.  And I think Stidham is going to fall.

[dballer]

33 minutes ago, JamesMadisonSkins said:

Current Walter Football mock draft is interesting. Not saying I’d necessarily go this route but if they did, I think it would reinvigorate the fan base. 

 

R1: A.J. Brown, WR Ole Miss

R2: Jarrett Stidham, QB Auburn

R3: Garrett Bradberry, C N.C. State

 

You’d need to divert your FA resources to solve EDGE, slot WR and secondary but the offense would be nicely set up for a few years if everyone developed.

 

I am cool with Brown. We so badly need a big time WR. 

 

Not sure about Stidham, but hey, we need a QB.

 

And as an NCSU alumnus i LOVE Bradberry, but we have glaring holes that could be filled with that 3rd rounder, center not being one.

[JamesMadisonSkins]

28 minutes ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

I think they're overrating both Brown and Stidham.  Brown is probably a second round pick IMO.  And I think Stidham is going to fall.

That's fair. I also think there's a chance these guys rise back up the draft boards. Many had them as 1st rounders this year, too.

While this 2019 QB class pales in comparison to the 2020 class, there were quite a few guys who had 1st or 2nd round grades going into the season. Theyve fallen off a bit but the potential is there.

[clskinsfan]

2 hours ago, Califan007 said:

So how many draft picks do we have again?...and how many in the first rounds?

We have a 1,2,3,5 and 7 before any comp picks. We will get another 3rd for Kirk. Plus we should get an additional 5th, 6th and two 7th's for other free agents. So ten picks:

1 

2 

3

3

5

5

6

7

7

7

 

https://overthecap.com/compensatory-draft-picks-cancellation-chart/

 

[Going Commando]

2 minutes ago, JamesMadisonSkins said:

That's fair. I also think there's a chance these guys rise back up the draft boards. Many had them as 1st rounders this year, too.

While this 2019 QB class pales in comparison to the 2020 class, there were quite a few guys who had 1st or 2nd round grades going into the season. Theyve fallen off a bit but the potential is there.

 

Brown was heavily overrated heading into the season IMO.  I think the idea was that he was the leader of this incredible bunch of WRs and TEs in the Ole Miss offense, and as such, he should be an early first round pick.  But it's become clear over time that he's not the most talented WR/TE in that offense.  He's tough and he's strong and has swagger but at the end of the day, he's a glorified slot possession receiver.  If he were a more talented YAC guy like Golden Tate or DJ Moore, then I think he might be able to sneak into the end of the first.  But that's not him.  Honestly, he reminds me too much of LaQuon Treadwell in the lack of elusiveness and inability to separate on intermediate and deep part of the tree.  Treadwell even played on the outside.  I got burned ignoring those weaknesses and thinking he'd be able to make a living for himself based on toughness and swagger.  I'm not making the mistake of buying into the overhyped Ole Miss alpha possession receiver again.

 

I think there might be only one or two WRs who go in the first this year.  Maybe Arcega-Whiteside or Metcalf can go that early.  Maybe none do, this is kind of a warty group with clear limitations.  But it's also a pretty deep class in starting caliber talent and I think there will be a big scrum for second and third round positioning from over a dozen prospects.  I think Brown is in the middle of that scrum, not above it.

 

Personally, I know for certain I would rank him below Arcega-Whiteside, Metcalf, Brown, Butler, and Samuel, and I don't think he's even that close to them.  There might be others too that I haven't gotten to yet.

 

I haven't evaluated Stidham yet, but I do know that he put some bad film out there this season.  He's got a game manager vibe and I think he might have been overrated heading into this season based on the success that Auburn had last year.

[skinny21]

2 hours ago, volsmet said:

 

Trading up for Haskins would be brutal, imo. I don’t get the infatuation. 

I was trying to roughly guess what it might cost if the team were to get Haskins (because it’s a logical choice to try to up fan appreciation)... I’m not exactly pushing for it.  

 

Just out of curiosity, what makes it brutal for you?  The compensation?  The player?  The extended shelf life for Allen/Gruden? 

[JamesMadisonSkins]

This is an odd draft for QB. Outside of Haskins, any of the other 6-7 guys could sneak into the 1st round with good off-season workouts/tests/bowl games. If you're the Redskins and you want to address QB this off-season, this is actually a decent year for it. If we wanted to stay at 15, we'd likely have our choice of anyone in that '2nd tier' ... and would likely even have a shot at some of them with our 2nd round pick. After doing some reading up on them, here's where I think it stands. This is also assuming Kyler Murray commits to football over baseball.

 

Top 10:

1. Dwayne Haskins, QB Ohio State

 

Mid-1st to Late 1st:

2. Daniel Jones, QB Duke

3. Kyler Murray, QB Oklahoma

4. Drew Lock, QB Mizzou

 

Late 1st-2nd Round:

5. Will Grier, QB WVU

6. Jarret Stidham, QB Auburn

 

3rd-5th Round developmental guys:

7. Ryan Finley, QB NC State

8. Gardner Minshew, QB Wash. State

9. Brett Rypien, QB Boise

10. Clayton Thorson, QB Northwestern

11. Jake Bentley, QB South Carolina

12. Trace McSorley, QB Penn State

 

So IF by April Alex Smith is looking like his career is done or at least on the rocks as it currently is, I think you're looking at getting one of the Top 4-6 guys in Rounds 1-2.

 

If Alex Smith is recovering well and looking like he'll be back at some point in 2019 at full strength, I think you likely draft one of the guys from 7-12 to sit behind Smith and Colt and learn the ropes. And if you bomb out in 2019 (I don't think they will, personally) and one of those guys you draft doesn't look like he is going to develop into a top-line player, then you can reach back at the position in 2020.

Let's say we go LG and EDGE in Rounds 1-2 and take a guy like Rypien with one of our 3rd round picks. Team goes 6-10 and Smith doesn't play much if at all. Clean house after 2019 with a new coaching staff ... I think you move forward at QB with a 1st round guy in 2020 and you have whoever you draft this year as your new backup and move on from Colt and Smith. Basically what the Giants are likely to do this year with the position after moving on from Eli and drafting the Richmond QB in the mid-rounds last year.

 

[JamesMadisonSkins]

7 minutes ago, skinny21 said:

I was trying to roughly guess what it might cost if the team were to get Haskins (because it’s a logical choice to try to up fan appreciation)... I’m not exactly pushing for it.  

 

Just out of curiosity, what makes it brutal for you?  The compensation?  The player?  The extended shelf life for Allen/Gruden? 

He's a shot in the dark one-year wonder. I think he has some real potential in the NFL. I'm sure someone will trade into the Top 5 to get ahead of the Giants to take him. If not the Giants likely get him at #6. But to go from #15 to, say, #2 to draft him ... would require our 2nd and 3rd, and probably a 1st round pick next year.

 

Now, ask the Chiefs or Bears or Texas  if they regret giving up the picks they did to move up in the  2017 draft to get Trubisky, Mahomes or Watson. All are in the playoffs as a result and aren't "missing" that 2018 1st round pick they didn't have. If you're confident that's who Haskins is, then that's great. Rookie QB contracts allow you to build up the rest of the team, too. And Skins def. have a nice base layer of young talent on the defense. But personally, I would rather invest in the OL and defense for one more draft, and take a shot at the position in 2020 when there are likely some more options to be had. I also think if you "roll with it" in 2019 you also give yourself another year to deal with Smith's contract and not waste a year of a QB on a rookie deal with a hamstrung salary cap situation.

 

It's also a deep draft for developmental guys, which I would argue we need regardless of whether we expect them to be our 2019 starter or long-term depth at the position. So this might be a draft where you go QB in the 3rd or 4th to be your QB2 or QB3 (depending on Smith) with the upside to start and excite the fanbase if the season totally craps out.

[DJD2]

I think this is the year they should just keep trading down or trading out of the early rounds in the hopes of getting some serious draft capital in '20 or '21 to make a move for a franchise QB then.

 

It will never happen of course since "we're only a player or 2 away"...

[JamesMadisonSkins]

3 minutes ago, DJD2 said:

I think this is the year they should just keep trading down or trading out of the early rounds in the hopes of getting some serious draft capital in '20 or '21 to make a move for a franchise QB then.

 

It will never happen of course since "we're only a player or 2 away"...

I (somewhat) agree. I am not opposed to gaining some 2020 draft picks, but I wouldn't mind trading back to maximize on our needs. I think WR, LG top the list, and the sweet spot for those positions could be in the late 1st early 2nd range. So unless a Josh Allen falls (assuming you don't sign Smith), or you fall in love with Cody Ford and he's there at #15, I think you can trade back and target that crop later.

 

Put me in the camp of thinking we're a LG and speed WR away from being a good run-heavy play-making offense.

 

Also put me in the camp of understanding we are too good to tank in 2019 and Alex Smith and his injury recovery/contract are a huge part of all of this.

[skinny21]

3 minutes ago, DJD2 said:

I think this is the year they should just keep trading down or trading out of the early rounds in the hopes of getting some serious draft capital in '20 or '21 to make a move for a franchise QB then.

 

It will never happen of course since "we're only a player or 2 away"...

This is a bit maddening.  Not just because they’re less likely to make staff changes if they think they’re close.  Not just because it makes it tougher to land a top qb, but also because they’re less likely to make tough salary cap choices, and more likely to use up cap money rather than hold it for 1) making a splash once we get a qb and 2) for extending certain key young guys (Scherff and Ioannidas for example). 

 

 

[nonniey]

42 minutes ago, skinny21 said:

I was trying to roughly guess what it might cost if the team were to get Haskins (because it’s a logical choice to try to up fan appreciation)... I’m not exactly pushing for it.  

 

Just out of curiosity, what makes it brutal for you?  The compensation?  The player?  The extended shelf life for Allen/Gruden? 

You probably named all three issues.  Trading up from pick 15 would probably cost RGIII like compensation and this for a player that would not have gone before any one of last years 1st round QBs to work for a coach that likely is in his last season.

[JamesMadisonSkins]

FA is a total crapshoot. I don't expect us to cut a bunch of guys and suddenly be active. If I had to project/predict anything it would be:

1. Sign a premier Safety. Landon Collins or HaHa Clinton-Dix for a big deal ($8-10m per year average)

2. Re-Sign Jamison Crowder

3. Sign some depth guys at ILB, possibly a veteran CB, Jonathan Cooper type LG veteran with upside to compete

 

Go into the draft needing to add another speed/YAC guy at WR, a pass-rusher to complement Ryan Anderson. And a LG. Here's how I would, 4 months pre-draft, envision a "good draft" based on what I think is a likely Free Agent cycle. Using FanSpeak

 

1.15: Cody Ford, T/G Oklahoma --- two birds with one stone. You get a Scherff-esque college RT who can dominate at Guard. Ford can play LG and also could swing to RT if Moses goes down.

 

2.14: Andy Isabella, WR UMass --- this guy is a YAC monster. He would be a replacement for Crowder should he leave, but also a solid guy to add to our offensive weaponry

 

3.12: Austin Bryant, EDGE Clemson --- with Preston Smith walking for big $$, I would expect the team to address EDGE somewhere. Depends on whether they think Anderson steps in and replaces Smith. If they are confident in Anderson, then I would think EDGE gets addressed with one of the 3rds. You can never have too many rushers, and Bryant may fall as he's the 4th stud lineman on a dominant Clemson team.

 

3.32: Trevon Diggs, CB Alabama --- Diggs has been going higher in some mocks, but is also going in the 3rd/4th range in others. The Bama connection is obvious, and you'll need another young guy to come in to eventually replace Norman, who I think departs before 2020, not this off-season.

 

5.15: Jarrett Stidham, QB Auburn --- here's your developmental guy. The guy who is either QB2 behind Colt or QB3 behind Alex/Colt. If the season falls apart, this is the guy you turn to for some "excitement" to see what he can give you. Something we sorely lacked this year when the season fell apart (Sorry JJ, no long-term potential here).

 

5.33: Christian Miller, ILB Alabama --- He may go back to school, and he may rise way up the draft board. I'd loveeee him in the 5th as he screams 2019 Dion-Hamilton, from a loaded Bama defense but with injury issues. Whether it's Miller or someone else, I think this is the range you address ILB to back-up Foste/Foster/Hamilton.

 

6.32: Isaiah Prince, OT Ohio State --- This is more of a practice-squad or 9th OL type of pick. Someone you can have on the back-end of the roster should **** hit the fan with injuries again. Earlier pick of Ford gives you flexibility and depth at LG and RT, but another young piece on the OL never hurts. Likely replaces Nsheke's roster spot when he leaves via FA

 

7.13: Tanner Muse, S Clemson --- don't know much about the prospect, but more just a "usual" 7th round DB to be a ST guy and add depth

 

7.38: Alec Eberle, C Florida State --- another practice squad/late round OL flier. I doubt 3 rookie OL make the final 53, but it can't hurt to add as many young bodies as you can when you have the injuries the Skins have had along the OL the last few years.

4 minutes ago, nonniey said:

You probably named all three issues.  Trading up from pick 15 would probably cost RGIII like compensation and this for a player that would not have gone before anyone of last years 1st round QBs to work for a coach that likely is in his last season.

Yep, for this reason I think it's most likely we go with the mid-round developmental type. Someone the fan-base can get excited about or at least tune in to watch if the season falls apart. But not someone you invest so much draft capital in that you have to start him from Day 1. I would much rather do that, and hope that player is decent, than break the draft capital bank to get a guy who a new coaching staff in 2020 (potentially) will want to have their choice of picking.

[Going Commando]

Quinnen Williams, DT, Alabama, RS Sophomore - 6.9

 

Strengths
- Tall, columnar build with very little sloppy weight.  Good bulk through his lower half.  Build is remeniscent of Jarran Reed's.
- Vine arms and heavy hands.  Punch is very quick and placement is consistent.
- Pretty good first step and excellent balance.
- Good flexibility.
- Comes alive in fourth quarters.  Well conditioned.
- Excellent functional power.
- Elite run defender. Strong read and react two gapper.
- Good play recognition.  Finds the ball.
- Commanded a constant double from the one technique.
- Anchor strength is what you look for in the A gap.  Can plant his roots and hold ground all day against the double.
- Does a pretty good job working gap to gap and catching cutbacks in his area.
- More than fast enough to fire gaps and spill runs.
- Good enough athlete to make tackles off his frame.
- Plays with nastiness.  Tone setter.  Bruises guards and chipping backs.  Hurts QBs.
- Good motor.  Relentless when he senses an opening in the middle of the line.
- Pretty good arsenal of initial rushes.  Film shows him using bulls, arm overs, rips, and jab and gos.
- Has a pretty good spin move.
- Splits doubles.
- Closing speed is excellent.
- Weapon in the stunt game.
- Fast enough to line up at five technique.  Looked effective from this position in his limited opportunities here in Bama's D.

 

Weaknesses
- Good athlete for his position, but not an elite one.
- Not a lot of muscle twitch.
- Playmaking range is mediocre.
- Has to land his punch to win on rushes.  No go-to counters when his first move fails.
- Motor runs hot and cold on pass rushes.
- Doesn't work to play passing lanes when he gets stoned.
- Can be neutralized by length.
- Stack and shed needs work.  Has trouble getting off velcro blocks.  Spends too much time handfighting for leverage.
- Tall for a one tech.  Pads and hips get high, particularly on rushes.
- Balance is generally excellent, but he'll get planted on tough combo blocks.

 

He's the latest blue chip Alabama DL prospect.  He compares well to Jonathan Allen and DaRon Payne.  He's not as athletic as Payne, but he's taller and has a better arsenal of initial rushes than Payne did.  He's not as crafty and instinctive and relentless a rusher as Allen was, but he's bigger and more powerful.  Probably a better athlete than Allen too.  So maybe he's not better at any one thing than them, but the totality of his skill set makes him more versatile than them IMO.  I believe he could play any of the interior DL positions at a high level, from one to five tech.

 

His balanced skill set makes him one of the cleanest prospects at the top of the class, and a good fit for every team.  You can one or two gap with him at the one and three tech.  You can play him at DE.  You can run stunts.  You can play him in nickel packages.  Honestly, I think his best position in the NFL might be five tech.  He came to Alabama as a 260 pound DE recruit and moved inside this year to take over DaRon Payne's position.  Responded to the move to one technique by winning the Outland Trophy.  But he could shine even more if he lined up wider and didn't have to take on so many doubles.  He has the body to do it.

 

As far as his place in the class goes, I don't think he's quite as special as Oliver.  He's not as good an athlete as Oliver.  But he's a cleaner prospect.  He's bigger.  He's healthy.  He's more scheme diverse.  You can put him into any interior DL position in any scheme and he'll thrive and I think he's probably more coachable than Oliver.  Seems like a sweet, low-maintenance kid.  And he's definitely better than all of the other interior DLs in the class.  He's the best offering of talent + fit for us.  We'd be unbelievably lucky if he fell to us like Payne and Allen did.  He's deserving of going top five.  Right now I've got him graded as the fourth best player in the class.

[PartyPosse]

if Gruden is a lame duck coach for the next year then I don't see the point of drafting a QB at all. Right now with this regime in place I'd rather continue drafting building blocks rather than pieces that are specific to a particular offense.

[dballer]

1 minute ago, PartyPosse said:

if Gruden is a lame duck coach for the next year then I don't see the point of drafting a QB at all. Right now with this regime in place I'd rather continue drafting building blocks rather than pieces that are specific to a particular offense.

 

Except, if they draft a QB that shows some promise, it would be good bait to attract a coach that otherwise wouldn't come here due to, well ya know...

[PartyPosse]

1 minute ago, dballer said:

 

Except, if they draft a QB that shows some promise, it would be good bait to attract a coach that otherwise wouldn't come here due to, well ya know...

Most coaches want their guy or at least someone that they feel comfortable running their scheme. By doing that we are already limiting an already limited collection of possibilities. Besides, I would imagine it would be more enticing to a coach to have the opportunity to literally hand-pick their own guy.

[Califan007 The Constipated]

10 minutes ago, PartyPosse said:

Most coaches want their guy or at least someone that they feel comfortable running their scheme. By doing that we are already limiting an already limited collection of possibilities. Besides, I would imagine it would be more enticing to a coach to have the opportunity to literally hand-pick their own guy.

 

Not that I think this is happening, but there's the scenario of already having behind-the-scene convos with the guy who will end up being your next coach and already having his input in terms of QBs he prefers.