Prison Reform

[Zguy28]

Figured since I couldn't find a thread for this in my search, I'd start one.

 

Looks like the House passed the FIRST STEP Act. I can understand both sides of the debate over it, wanting sentencing reform or getting it done progressively a piece at a time. I am more toward the latter.

 

https://www.themarshallproject.org/2018/05/22/is-the-first-step-act-real-reform

[LadySkinsFan]

We see over and over when Republicans push through a bill that doesn't really address the issues and promise to get back to the issues at a later date, THEY DON'T. It's just another watered down bill to make it look like they are behind resolving the issues while not really doing anything.

 

I support the more comprehensive Senate bill because it addresses all of the issues now.

 

[Zguy28]

2 minutes ago, LadySkinsFan said:

We see over and over when Republicans push through a bill that doesn't really address the issues and promise to get back to the issues at a later date, THEY DON'T. It's just another watered down bill to make it look like they are behind resolving the issues while not really doing anything.

 

I support the more comprehensive Senate bill because it addresses all of the issues now.

 

134 Democrats supported it in the House.

[LadySkinsFan]

So what? They're up for re-election too and probability are going along with the crowd.

 

Why not comment on my main point that Republicans pass a half assed bill, promise to "fix it later", and then never get back to it. It happens so often you can set your watch by it.

[grego]

52 minutes ago, LadySkinsFan said:

So what? They're up for re-election too and probability are going along with the crowd.

 

Why not comment on my main point that Republicans pass a half assed bill, promise to "fix it later", and then never get back to it. It happens so often you can set your watch by it.

 

 

no doubt politicians do just about everything for some political gain. what issues does it not address that it should?

[Zguy28]

2 minutes ago, grego said:

 

 

no doubt politicians do just about everything for some political gain. what issues does it not address that it should?

removal of mandatory minimum sentences. Particularly in drug-related offenses. The link in the first post is very good. Takes about 3-5 minutes to read.

[grego]

nevermind- i think i see it. not addressing mandatory minimums. 

 

 "The bill, sponsored by Reps. Hakeem Jeffries, a New York Democrat, and Doug Collins, a Georgia Republican, seeks to add educational and vocational training and mental health treatment in federal prison. It earmarks $50 million a year over five years to expand these in-prison opportunities. It also expands the number of days in a halfway house or home confinement that inmates can earn for good behavior and self-improvement. It would expand the use of risk assessment tools—algorithms that try to predict future behavior. It bans the shackling of pregnant women; calls for placing prisoners in facilities that are within 500 driving miles of their families; and helps them get identification cards upon release."

 

ok, i do like this, to some extent, even though it doesnt address mandatory minimums.; but i do have my doubts about the true effectiveness of vocational training. 

[China]

The Tragedy of Mental Illness in American Prisons

 

At the time of his death, following a violent altercation with guards, Karl Taylor was one of thousands of mentally ill inmates who are confined to institutions that are supremely ill-equipped to handle them.

 

On the morning of April 13, 2015, a guard at Sullivan Correctional Facility, a New York State maximum-security prison nestled deep in the woods of the western Catskills, ordered a prisoner named Karl Taylor to clean his cell. By all accounts, the cell, in the prison’s E North housing block—a special unit for inmates classified as mentally ill—was a rancid mess, strewn with papers and clothes, and soaked with shampoo and other liquids. Taylor, however, had balked for weeks at cleaning it. He insisted that as part of an ongoing campaign of harassment, guards had trashed his cell and stolen his belongings while he was being held in a mental-health observation unit in a separate wing of the 550-inmate prison.

 

Taylor had been in prison since 1995, serving a minimum sentence of 27 years for a rape conviction in his hometown of Troy, New York. After his arrival in state custody, he was diagnosed with delusional disorder and paranoid personality disorder. By 2015, he had already made two trips to the state’s prison psychiatric hospital, where he’d received medication to quiet his symptoms. And while he had periods of relative calm, he had spent almost half of his time behind bars—nearly 10 years—in solitary confinement, a debilitating experience that experts say disorients even the sanest of prisoners.

 

Most witnesses to what followed on that April morning agree that after a guard opened Taylor’s cell door, the stocky, 51-year-old African American inmate walked away, shouting that he wanted to be left alone and sent back to the observation unit, where those in crisis are monitored by doctors and nurses. The witnesses differ entirely on what happened next: Guards say Taylor wheeled around without warning and punched the officer, a muscular, 27-year corrections veteran named Bruce Tucker, in the face. Inmates on the cellblock say Tucker, who is white, struck first, cracking Taylor over the head at least twice with his heavy wooden baton. “You heard two loud bangs,” an inmate named Malik Thomas recalls, “like you would hit a hardball in baseball.”

 

Regardless of who started the violence, it ended badly: Tucker suffered a badly fractured arm after Taylor grabbed his baton and chased him across the cell tier, striking him repeatedly. Another officer had a serious concussion after also being struck and falling while trying to wrestle the baton from the prisoner. Things went much worse for Taylor. As he was being subdued by a throng of officers who had responded to the emergency, inmates heard him rasp that he couldn’t breathe. Handcuffed, he was frog-marched down a series of corridors to the prison’s clinic. Within minutes of his arrival there, he was declared dead.

 

“Jails and prisons are among the least therapeutic environments in the world,” says Alisa Roth, who toured facilities across the country for her recent book, Insane: America’s Criminal Treatment of Mental Illness. “You’re not bringing out the best in their behavior; you’re bringing out the worst in their behavior,” Roth told me.

 

At the time of his death, Taylor was one of nearly 10,000 people in New York’s state correctional facilities diagnosed with a mental illness—one out of every five prisoners. Roughly half are, like Taylor, considered “seriously mentally ill,” suffering from schizophrenia or another psychotic disorder. They are men and women who have trouble coping with daily living needs, often unable to follow orders in a setting where a military-style strictness governs every movement.

 

Click on the link for the full article

Edited November 28, 2018 by China

[China]

West Virginia Inmates Will Be Charged by the Minute to Read E-Books on Tablets

 

Inmates at several West Virginia prisons are getting free electronic tablets to read books, send emails, and communicate with their families—but there's a catch.

 

Any inmates looking to read Moby Dick may find that it will cost them far more than it would have if they'd simply gotten a mass market paperback, because the tablets charge readers by the minute.

 

Under a 2019 contract between the West Virginia Division of Corrections and Rehabilitation (WVDCR) and Global Tel Link (GTL), the company that is providing electronic multimedia tablets to 10 West Virginia prisons, inmates will be charged 3 cents a minute to read books, even though the books all come from Project Gutenberg, a free online library of more than 60,000 texts in the public domain.

 

The WVDCR says the tablets provide access to educational materials, incentives for good behavior, and an easy way to stay in touch with loved ones. But the Appalachian Prison Book Project, a nonprofit that offers free books and education to inmates, says the fee structure is exploitative.

 

"If you pause to think or reflect, that will cost you," says Katy Ryan, the group's founder and educational coordinator. "If you want to reread a book, you will pay the entire cost again. This is about generating revenue for the state and profit for the industry. Tablets under non-predatory terms could be a very good thing inside prisons. GTL does not provide that." 

 

Click on the link for the full article

[PleaseBlitz]

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2019/12/1/20989336/private-prisons-states-bans-califonia-nevada-colorado

 

Private prisons face an uncertain future as states turn their backs on the industry

 

Quote

Increasingly, these criticisms of private, for-profit facilities have been reflected in policy and spending. Fueled in part by opposition from their constituents, lawmakers of states like California and Nevada have banned private prisons from operating. Businesses are also increasingly cutting ties with the industry following pushback from their customers.

 

The number of inmates in these facilities are also seeing a downward trend: In comparison to its peak in 2012 of about 136,220 people, the private prison population has decreased about 12 percent in the past five years as more facilities are closing. Given private prisons rely on facilities being full to remain economically viable, there is concern among executives that these falling numbers could eventually drive these businesses to their demise.

 

Some in the industry have begun to accept that private prisons may not exist in the decades to come. CoreCivic, the nation’s largest and oldest private prison firm, said it has begun to plan for a federal private prison ban if a Democratic candidate wins the 2020 presidential election (current frontrunners like former Vice President Joe Biden and Sen. Elizabeth Warren support its abolishment), according to Nashville Post. Rather than house inmates for the government, the company would simply lease real estate, CEO Damon Hininger said on a conference call last month.

 

[tshile]

the whole private prison thing should be a black eye for us. i realize there are worse things we have done (or are doing), but selling out your citizens for corporate profit this way is pretty bad.

 

I realize the whole 'eye for an eye' thing has flaws but it'd be really nice if we had a machine we could put people in and make them live a life of the people they've hurt.

 

like Roy

(there's a NSFW curse word in this video so I'm linking instead of embedding.)

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmwk_OiUtxQ

 

 

 

Edited December 2, 2019 by tshile

[daveakl]

Does it get rid of the cash bail system?

[tshile]

so, pardon my ignorance, i get the general premise of the issue with the bail system (although I've read no reports to understand how it does/doesn't actually hurt people, I just have read the complaints)

 

what is the proposed alternative to the idea of bail vs no bail for a pending case?

 

[skinsmarydu]

15 minutes ago, tshile said:

so, pardon my ignorance, i get the general premise of the issue with the bail system (although I've read no reports to understand how it does/doesn't actually hurt people, I just have read the complaints)

 

what is the proposed alternative to the idea of bail vs no bail for a pending case?

 

It's the "cash only" ones that are extremely unfair. A suspect may have a family member with property they would put up, but the judge said it must be all cash. 

Edit add: bail isn't supposed to be punitive, which that system is. 

Edited December 2, 2019 by skinsmarydu

[tshile]

8 minutes ago, skinsmarydu said:

It's the "cash only" ones that are extremely unfair. A suspect may have a family member with property they would put up, but the judge said it must be all cash. 

Edit add: bail isn't supposed to be punitive, which that system is. 

 

See this is where i get into trouble because I have (what i think) is a logical way to think about it, but I don't actually understand the laws and constitution enough to really know anything about it.

 

Bail isn't supposed to be punitive. It's supposed to be assurance you'll show up for your trial, right?

 

I get that holding a person with no access to money for cash bail, when they were charged with simple possession, is ridiculously punitive (and I would argue counter-productive, as I believe socioeconomic issues drive crime, and the worst thing you can do to someone charged with a petty crime is to cause them to lose their job, or connections to their family/friends, etc)

 

But I also know that people skipping their court dates is a real problem.... 

[NoCalMike]

Prisons need to be just as much about rehabilitation as it is punishment.  Being in prison is punishment all by itself, just the fact that you are imprisoned is punishment.  Having people sit and rot for 5, 10, 15, whatever years means that they are going to be fully unprepared when they get out of prison.  It isn't very smart. 

[tshile]

4 minutes ago, NoCalMike said:

Prisons need to be just as much about rehabilitation as it is punishment.  Being in prison is punishment all by itself, just the fact that you are imprisoned is punishment.  Having people sit and rot for 5, 10, 15, whatever years means that they are going to be fully unprepared when they get out of prison.  It isn't very smart. 

 

in order to get you to respect society and take a productive position in society, we're going to remove you from society for 15 years. when you get out you'll have no job prospects, your friends will likely all be gone and you'll have no way to reach out to them and no relationship to build on, and who knows what will happen with your family. That 2 year old you left behind is now 17, you have no relationship with him/her, and statistics show they're likely to follow your path. 

 

We'll expect you to appreciate this opportunity we're given you to try to fit into society again, with absolutely nothing to hold on to for support; we (society) certainly aren't going to support you.

 

In fact, we'll mostly refuse to hire you, if we know your situation we'll make sure to treat you a second class citizen.

 

Oh and if you do something illegal again we'll lock you up for twice as long next time, and if it's even dicey as to whether you did anything wrong we'll just convict you as your aforementioned previous conviction removes any entitlement to benefit of the doubt.

 

Good luck!

xoxoxoxoxo 

Society

 

[PeterMP]

2 hours ago, tshile said:

 

in order to get you to respect society and take a productive position in society, we're going to remove you from society for 15 years. when you get out you'll have no job prospects, your friends will likely all be gone and you'll have no way to reach out to them and no relationship to build on, and who knows what will happen with your family. That 2 year old you left behind is now 17, you have no relationship with him/her, and statistics show they're likely to follow your path. 

 

We'll expect you to appreciate this opportunity we're given you to try to fit into society again, with absolutely nothing to hold on to for support; we (society) certainly aren't going to support you.

 

In fact, we'll mostly refuse to hire you, if we know your situation we'll make sure to treat you a second class citizen.

 

Oh and if you do something illegal again we'll lock you up for twice as long next time, and if it's even dicey as to whether you did anything wrong we'll just convict you as your aforementioned previous conviction removes any entitlement to benefit of the doubt.

 

Good luck!

xoxoxoxoxo 

Society

 

 

I want to respond with the laugh, but that doesn't seem appropriate.

 

(Good job!)

[c slag]

Did anyone ever meet a person who spent a considerable amount of time in a prison and when they get released find it difficult to perform every day tasks such as going to a grocery store?

 And eventually actually want to return to the prison because it was much "simpler" there 

So they purposely break conditions of the parole 

[TheGreatBuzz]

1 hour ago, c slag said:

Did anyone ever meet a person who spent a considerable amount of time in a prison and when they get released find it difficult to perform every day tasks such as going to a grocery store?

 And eventually actually want to return to the prison because it was much "simpler" there 

So they purposely break conditions of the parole 

We've all seen Shawshank Redemption. 

[PleaseBlitz]

18 hours ago, c slag said:

Did anyone ever meet a person who spent a considerable amount of time in a prison and when they get released find it difficult to perform every day tasks such as going to a grocery store?

 And eventually actually want to return to the prison because it was much "simpler" there 

So they purposely break conditions of the parole 

 

As a pro bono thing, for the past 2+ years I've been working with a guy that has been in prison for 28 years.  They have TV and stuff, they aren't in a time capsule.  They have a convenience store too, it's called a commissary.  I haven't seen it, I imagine it's like a 7-11 but 3 times as expensive. 

 

And no, if someone has been in for decades, they don't go back because it's "simpler."  If they got 20+ years, then they've just spent a lot of that time being model inmates so they can get the **** out.   The LAST thing they want is to go back.  If they go back it's because they can't make ends meet on the outside (because prison did not prepare them for employment and because of societal views of felons) and have to do something to survive.  

Edited December 3, 2019 by PleaseBlitz

[China]

Gangs allegedly run Mississippi prison where three inmates were killed in three days

 

Calls for prison reform are rising after a spike in violence in correctional facilities in Mississippi. In the last 10 days, five inmates were killed in different state prisons.

 

Three inmates were murdered in three days at the Mississippi State Penitentiary, an all-male facility in Parchman, Mississippi known as Parchman Farm. Two inmates also escaped the facility last week amid a week of riots, but they have since been caught. 

 

Inmates at Parchman Farm claim gangs run the place, CBS News correspondent Mark Strassmann reports.

 

"My little brother stabbed, beat up, just in a cell, and then they're putting him in cells with the rivalry. How could you do that?" Angel Taylor asked. 

 

At least one lawsuit alleges "barbaric" conditions at the prison, including rats, open sewage, abusive guards and corruption. Yet since 2014, Mississippi has slashed funding and staffing, and gangs like the Vice Lords and Black Gangster Disciples have thrived inside.

 

"We are going to stop it. We have it under control as best we can," Mississippi Governor Phil Bryant said.

 

But almost half of the roughly 1,300 corrections positions in three major facilities in Mississippi remain unfilled. Even with a degree, guards start around $26,000, which is around the national poverty level for a family of four.

 

Sixty-five percent of the state's corrections officers are women "because men don't want the jobs," said Jerry Mitchell, an investigative reporter who has looked into Mississippi's prison problems for years. 

 

Click on the link for the full article

[skinsmarydu]

Parchman is the setting for quite a few John Grisham books. Even in fiction, that place is scary AF. 

[Renegade7]

On 12/2/2019 at 5:18 PM, NoCalMike said:

Prisons need to be just as much about rehabilitation as it is punishment.  Being in prison is punishment all by itself, just the fact that you are imprisoned is punishment.  Having people sit and rot for 5, 10, 15, whatever years means that they are going to be fully unprepared when they get out of prison.  It isn't very smart. 

 

It is if you want them to come back to prison.  Which is why i agree with you that the goal of corrections should be doing what you can to make sure they dont come back.  But this is why I also believe they should get rid of life sentences and expedite executions to focus as much of the resources on this as they can.

 

@tshile I recommend looking into the number of people in jail right now because they cant afford.  Youd think that's the point, but that's the point, it so wildly dispportiantly affects folks without resources, which is likely what lead them to doing the crime in the first place. Or worse, they are innocent but look close enough and have to wait in jail to prove that, with what, a court appointed attorney?

 

This opposed to folks with means that typically can afford bail no matter what it is.  Get rid of bail all together and send it back to whether the judge believes it is safer for society to make the criminal stay in jail until trial.  There may be innocent folks that get caught up still, but it will be far less then right now, and an even smaller number that plead guilty jus to get it over with or prevent it from possibly being worse once sentenced, innocent or not.

 

https://www.vox.com/future-perfect/2018/10/17/17955306/bail-reform-criminal-justice-inequality

 

Feds could do a lot of good here by lifting some enlistment restrictions in regards to certain crimes in order to join, say, the marines.  

[China]

Kentucky appeals court rules jails can force inmates to pay for stay even if not guilty

 

LOUISVILLE, Ky. (WDRB) – The Kentucky Court of Appeals on Friday upheld a lower court’s ruling allowing Kentucky jailers to take booking fees and daily charges from inmates and keep the money even if the person is found not guilty.

 

The 2-1 panel ruling goes directly against the intent of the law passed in 2000 meant to let a judge decide once a case ended if a person could afford to pay jail fees and how much is owed, if anything, according to a WDRB News analysis of the legislation.

 

The dissenting judge, Sara Combs, wrote that the way the law is currently being followed is unconstitutional and implored the Kentucky Supreme Court or General Assembly "to rectify this glaringly unjust state of affairs."

 

But the majority of the three-member panel, judges Jeff Taylor and Allison Jones, ruled that under the law, jailers are allowed to take money from "prisoners," meaning anyone charged with a crime and taken to jail.

 

"And, the jailer's ability to bill and collect unpaid fees is not contingent upon an order from a sentencing court," Taylor wrote in the opinion for the majority. "Rather, this authority exists by statute independent of the court."

 

The issue is likely headed to the state Supreme Court now.

 

Click on the link for the full article