Alex Smith Trade Thread (Details Inside)

[OVCChairman]

1 minute ago, Nerm said:

 

I think the optics of considering a franchise tag for Kirk could be a bad thing.  You can really turn off prospective Free agents if you further the narrative that you are vindictive towards your ex players/employes.  Those one year "prove it" deals look a lot more risky for prospective free agents.

Another risk that I feel is getting overlooked.... the human factor of it all. 

[Jericho]

42 minutes ago, WelshSkinsFan said:

 

Not an apples to apples comparison.

 

1. It was a first tag not a third so way less money involved.

2. New England was in a position to keep Cassel and Brady and still operate in FA so they didn't need a fast trade.

3. Cassel had a great relationship with the team and was happy to facilitate a trade.

 

These are relatively true facts (though it's highly debatable the team really had the cap space to pay both Brady and Cassel. In fact, it would have meant about 25% of the cap back then to pay just two players at one position. Not quite as much percentage wise as the Redskins would, but this would have been on a team competing for the Super Bowl that was pretty tight against the cap). The simple fact is that the Patriots controlled an asset, and letting Cassel walk as an UFA meant he would have been able to sign with any team without compensation to the Patriots. So they did what needed to be done to get compensation. Cassel's relationship with the team was better, but I don't think he or his agent was thrilled to not to hit the open market.

 

Bottom line, the Pats made a business decision to get more draft picks. It worked. They are praised for their genius. The situation really isn't different. It's a business decision to get assets for a player. The relationship between the team and player may be strained, but it's still a business

 

 

 

[XtremeFan55]

On 2/3/2018 at 11:52 AM, Burgold said:

I found it interesting, but not really telling or meaningful, that at the Superbowl this weekend Kirk Cousins has told reporters that he is only doing paid interviews. I get that he doesn't want to be beseiged, but I also know (as a reporter who has done these things) a celebrity, politico, or athlete saying they aren't doing interviews won't stop the hordes from asking. In fact, the fun of those events, as a reporter, is getting the unexpected get and wrangling someone that knocks your producers socks off.

 

I remember getting John Kerry once this way. He was at a hockey game and I got him in a friendly ambush. People were floored that he gave me ten minutes to talk sports, charity, and even a few serious issues. This was back when he was pretty big time too.

 

Kirk only wanting to the paid interviews is kinda lousy of him. Kirk making it clear that he will only do a limited number of interviews is fine. After all, the small fish who gets picked up by the big boys gets a chance to be noticed. Anyway, as I said, it doesn't mean anything, but I thought it interesting.

Doesn’t fit the reality or history of the Kirk Cousins we know.  The guy made $44 million last two years yet he still lives in a little townhouse in Farmwell Hunt subdivision just up the street from Redskins Park and still drives his grandma’s old conversion van.  I can’t seem to find any reference to paid interviews on Google but even if true, knowing his background as a Christian and his father being a highly respected Christian leader, he most likely would do it with the intent to give it away to some charitable cause.  In no way do I see Cousins as another greedy money grabbing player but as someone who is steadfastly looking for his freedom to be able choose wherever he wants to spend the prime years of his football career.  Refusing to sign a LTD and using up the tags is the only way he will gain that privilege.  Besides...this talk about paid interviews smacks of the same petty and seedy way of spreading dirt that regularly seeps out of Redskins Park when those losers are trying to save face.  We have seen this so many times that you almost have to expect something to show up in the media to paint Cousins in a negative light among the fans.  This is tantamount to slander.  We need to be careful that in our disappointment in Cousins leaving that we don’t muddy his reputation because he just happened to desire something we all would want if in the same position as him.  

[Gibbit]

4 minutes ago, XtremeFan55 said:

Doesn’t fit the reality or history of the Kirk Cousins we know.  The guy made $44 million last two years yet he still lives in a little townhouse in Farmwell Hunt subdivision just up the street from Redskins Park and still drives his grandma’s old conversion van.  I can’t seem to find any reference to paid interviews on Google but even if true, knowing his background as a Christian and his father being a highly respected Christian leader, he most likely would do it with the intent to give it away to some charitable cause.  In no way do I see Cousins as another greedy money grabbing player but as someone who is steadfastly looking for his freedom to be able choose wherever he wants to spend the prime years of his football career.  Refusing to sign a LTD and using up the tags is the only way he will gain that privilege.  Besides...this talk about paid interviews smacks of the same petty and seedy way of spreading dirt that regularly seeps out of Redskins Park when those losers are trying to save face.  We have seen this so many times that you almost have to expect something to show up in the media to paint Cousins in a negative light among the fans.  This is tantamount to slander.  We need to be careful that in our disappointment in Cousins leaving that we don’t muddy his reputation because he just happened to desire something we all would want if in the same position as him.  

what does fit is he didn't want to be here unless nobody else wanted him. Was his draft party silent like a funeral at his pick because he was picked behind rob in the 4th round (when every team would be picking for a backup) or because they knew he didn't want to be in Washington.

Kirk never liked us...he was willing to put up with us

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

I like how folks think Kirk would be seen as some petty jerk to play hardball with a tag and trade scenario.

 

Meanwhile it's cool for Bruce and the gang to utilize a 3rd franchise tag strictly for the purpose of trying to squeeze something out of nothing.

 

Of course it's personal for Bruce, given how the last time something remotely close to this happened was when Eli said he wouldn't play for the Chargers.  No matter how you slice it, it's got to be embarrassing to have your starting QB for the last three years not want to sign with you because he thinks you're wack and a douche.

[NewCliche21]

8 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

I like how folks think Kirk would be seen as some petty jerk to play hardball with a tag and trade scenario.

 

Meanwhile it's cool for Bruce and the gang to utilize a 3rd franchise tag strictly for the purpose of trying to squeeze something out of nothing.

 

Of course it's personal for Bruce, given how the last time something remotely close to this happened was when Eli said he wouldn't play for the Chargers.  No matter how you slice it, it's got to be embarrassing to have your starting QB for the last three years not want to sign with you because he thinks you're wack and a douche.

 

Which is reason 239582350 that we need to get rid of Bruce.  If we fired Bruce, then we would have already won the offseason.

[Gibbit]

19 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

I like how folks think Kirk would be seen as some petty jerk to play hardball with a tag and trade scenario.

 

Meanwhile it's cool for Bruce and the gang to utilize a 3rd franchise tag strictly for the purpose of trying to squeeze something out of nothing.

 

Of course it's personal for Bruce, given how the last time something remotely close to this happened was when Eli said he wouldn't play for the Chargers.  No matter how you slice it, it's got to be embarrassing to have your starting QB for the last three years not want to sign with you because he thinks you're wack and a douche.

for a tag and trade to happen both sides have to be lovingly understanding that it was never going to work.....has this ever happened in the history of divorces? We just need one instance to hang onto

 

Kirk was never going to sign here besides the time he was a question mark to the entire league...so maybe he gives us a parting gift for what the skins did for his career. Really we just need kirk to have a heart here, since we are th only ones to benefit.

 

If he helps out he leaves a hero .........hey now, think about that one kirk

[Skinsinparadise]

1 hour ago, OVCChairman said:

 

 

We're paying Smith $17 mil this year.. By all accounts, Kirk would have demanded at MINIMUM a transition tag @ 28 mil just to start things off.  Thats a savings of $11 mil this season.  We can only speculate what the next 4 years of the deal will consist of, but the report of $23.5 mil per with $71 guaranteed has come out.  It's also come out that the $71 mil guarantee is the injury guarantee.  We dont yet know what the actual guaranteed money at signing is... yet.   There is also speculation that Kirk could see $30 mil per year with the highest guaranteed contract in NFL history....

 

This year is less that part is true.  Then 23.5 million. Though I heard on a radio show it would be 17 but 20 million against the cap?  Not sure how that works? I hope its 17.   But then afterwards its 23.5 million.  As for the injury guarantee stuff, I don't care.  From the perspective that Bruce can cut bait with Alex and get out of the contract since its not fully guaranteed -- that part didn't float my boat with the Kirk negotiations and it doesn't float my boat with Alex Smith.   

 

As for Kirk getting 30 million a year.  Doubt it.  I am with Schefter, its likely in the 27-28 million range.  But I agree we don't know until it plays out.  

[OVCChairman]

2 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

This year is less that part is true.  Then 23.5 million. Though I heard on a radio show it would be 17 but 20 million against the cap?  Not sure how that works? I hope its 17.   But then afterwards its 23.5 million.  As for the injury guarantee stuff, I don't care.  From the perspective that Bruce can cut bait with Alex and get out of the contract since its not fully guaranteed -- that part didn't float my boat with the Kirk negotiations and it doesn't float my boat with Alex Smith.   

 

As for Kirk getting 30 million a year.  Doubt it.  I am with Schefter, its likely in the 27-28 million range.  But I agree we don't know until it plays out.  

thats probably assuming we're wrapping a portion of his signing bonus into this years salary.... it's hard to speculate it all 

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

4 minutes ago, Gibbit said:

 

If he helps out he leaves a hero .........hey now, think about that one kirk

Not that I think he cares enough to know this, but most of the folks hellbent on this concept are the folks who trashed him for years.  I don't see how throwing the team a bone changes anyone's mind.  I also don't see why he would care at all about leaving here a "hero" and setting his new team back a draft pick.

[Burgold]

44 minutes ago, XtremeFan55 said:

Doesn’t fit the reality or history of the Kirk Cousins we know.  The guy made $44 million last two years yet he still lives in a little townhouse in Farmwell Hunt subdivision just up the street from Redskins Park and still drives his grandma’s old conversion van.  I can’t seem to find any reference to paid interviews on Google but even if true, knowing his background as a Christian and his father being a highly respected Christian leader, he most likely would do it with the intent to give it away to some charitable cause. 

It's something I heard from one of the radio guys, I think it was 106.7 FM, on radio row during their Super Bowl coverage.

[Gibbit]

10 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

Not that I think he cares enough to know this, but most of the folks hellbent on this concept are the folks who trashed him for years.  I don't see how throwing the team a bone changes anyone's mind.  I also don't see why he would care at all about leaving here a "hero" and setting his new team back a draft pick.

I was a kirk guy, but Ive realized he didn't want to be a skin. if a tag and trade happens we know kirk finally bent a little...as his parting gesture.  and if Denver/minny are pushing it...whos to argue

[sempre_victrix]

I see no problem at all wringing anything we can get out of this deal. It has already cost us enough. 

[Gibbit]

9 minutes ago, sempre_victrix said:

I see no problem at all wringing anything we can get out of this deal. It has already cost us enough. 

cross your toes, fingers...do the salt thing over the shoulder, wish on stars, blow on dandelions, find pennies on heads, knock on everything wood....theres got to be more

[XtremeFan55]

50 minutes ago, Burgold said:

It's something I heard from one of the radio guys, I think it was 106.7 FM, on radio row during their Super Bowl coverage.

I found it.  It was in an article with Mike Jones.  Said Cousin’s handlers and publicist were telling the hordes of reporters that Cousins was only doing paid interviews.  Probably due to Cousins being more newsworthy than the Super Bowl with the timing of the trade so wanting to keep him from talking too much.  Will be glad when this circus is finally over and we can move on.  

[Gibbit]

how much does a kirk cousins interview cost nowadays

[LadySkinsFan]

I like the trade, welcome to the Redskins Alex. 

 

Let Kirk go on his way unencumbered. Thanks, Kirk, best to you.

 

Draft a QB to develop after Alex. 

 

Draft well the picks we have this year.  Draft players for what their skill set is, not what you want to cram them into your scheme. Then coach them to their potential.

 

Have a great year!

[sempre_victrix]

27 minutes ago, XtremeFan55 said:

I found it.  It was in an article with Mike Jones.  Said Cousin’s handlers and publicist were telling the hordes of reporters that Cousins was only doing paid interviews.  Probably due to Cousins being more newsworthy than the Super Bowl with the timing of the trade so wanting to keep him from talking too much.  Will be glad when this circus is finally over and we can move on.  

 

I have no evidence to support this, but it’s possible that these fees go to support his football camp. When he sold his number to Roberts, that where the money went I believe.

[Rufus T Firefly]

3 hours ago, kingdaddy said:

I look at how Alex Smith stepped up and won the game vs the Skins on MNF by leading his team down the field for a TD while KC had the game and could not produce the TD. I know KC threw a catchable ball to Doctson but the fact is we only needed a few yards for the first down in that situation. Smith is a smarter, more confident QB than KC is in my opinion and will beat you in more ways that KC can. All that being said, I still hope we get a rookie QB in the middle rounds that can be a starter for us down the road. Neither KC or Alex Smith are all that special but both are solid NFL QB's.

Smith drove the Chiefs for a FG, just for the record.

[Gibbit]

alex's thread will come in due time

[Rufus T Firefly]

If I'm Kirk and the Redskins place the Franchise tag on me, I don't sign it and inform them that I won't be negotiating with any team that wants to trade for me. So the team is just stuck holding 34.5 mil in cap space for me, rendering them unable to pursue FAs and unable to deal me.

 

Then, if they are still holding me on the tag, I give them a week or two into the FA period, then inform them that I am now going to sign it, but still won't talk to any team that deals for me and that I intend to wait until unrestricted FA in year. So, either remove the tag before I can sign it, or you've guaranteed me 34.5 mil and any team that takes me off your hands knows I am a rental. 

 

That's how I play it, because no tag is best for me and I am trying to force the Redskins into that situation. If the Redskins wanted to deal Cousins, then they shouldn't have allowed the Smith deal to go public. They have no leverage now. 

[OVCChairman]

11 minutes ago, Rufus T Firefly said:

If I'm Kirk and the Redskins place the Franchise tag on me, I don't sign it and inform them that I won't be negotiating with any team that wants to trade for me. So the team is just stuck holding 34.5 mil in cap space for me, rendering them unable to pursue FAs and unable to deal me.

 

Then, if they are still holding me on the tag, I give them a week or two into the FA period, then inform them that I am now going to sign it, but still won't talk to any team that deals for me and that I intend to wait until unrestricted FA in year. So, either remove the tag before I can sign it, or you've guaranteed me 34.5 mil and any team that takes me off your hands knows I am a rental. 

 

That's how I play it, because no tag is best for me and I am trying to force the Redskins into that situation. If the Redskins wanted to deal Cousins, then they shouldn't have allowed the Smith deal to go public. They have no leverage now. 

This is the part that really makes a difference... i agree that he could absolutely do it this way and call our bluff on a hostage situation. 

[kingdaddy]

4 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I like Alex Smith so I am not going to rain on him here.  But if you read about what Alex Smith detractors have said about him -- its just about verbatim what Kirk critics have said about him.  He fails in the clutch.  You got a ceiling with him where you are never going to get to the big dance.  You need to have all the moving parts working around him -- he didn't really reach much higher than above average status until he got one of the best running backs in the league and arguably the best deep threat in the league last year.

 

Alex's background and even personality is about as close as it gets to Kirk.  Ditto the criticism of him as a player as to detractors.  We even got some Chief fans on these threads enjoying warning us about it.

 

Having said that, I do expect some Alex Smith love initially because hey he's not Kirk.  So he must be better?   But if some of these criticisms leveled at Kirk were genuine (and not driven by other things), I would figure Alex Smith is a nightmare choice for some. Because reputation wise he's just about Kirk's identical twin.  If anything Kirk light. 

 

I like Alex Smith.  Like Kirk, he needs a running game.  Arguably its even more important for him.  Like Kirk, he needs weapons.  Like Kirk, I am not blaming him for every loss.   Like Kirk, he's not Aaron Rodgers and I am not blaming him for that.  Unlike Kirk, Alex doesn't have all the history here with Shanny and the predecessor QB so he's not wrapped up in that soap opera.  I gather that will build him some good will from day 1.  And that's good. 

Well said.

[kingdaddy]

17 minutes ago, OVCChairman said:

This is the part that really makes a difference... i agree that he could absolutely do it this way and call our bluff on a hostage situation. 

However, the longer this plays out, the more teams there may be that may move on from KC which could limit his options and perhaps his market value...the team(s) that want him or gonna need to feel pretty confident that in the end they'll get him.

[Rufus T Firefly]

4 minutes ago, kingdaddy said:

However, the longer this plays out, the more teams there may be that may move on from KC which could limit his options and perhaps his market value...the team(s) that want him or gonna need to feel pretty confident that in the end they'll get him.

Which starts to raise the possibility that we get stuck with him at 34.5 mil. At least deep into the offseason.