Former/Current Season Ticket Holders.......why did you leave or why do you stay?

[hail2skins]

The "opposing fan takeover" thread and discussion within prompted me to start a thread for comments which probably have historically been sprinkled in other threads, but wanted to see if I could capture them in one thread.

 

For those folks who used to have season tickets but no longer do, what were the factor(s) that led you to give them up? Was it price, team's performance, too time consuming?  And have you found yourself patronizing the other pro sporting teams more (go to more of their games) with the money you save not going to Skins games (unless you still go to every game via tickets bought on the secondary market or elsewhere)?

 

For those folks who remain STHs, why do you stay?  Is it the routine, still get psyched for tailgating, like being in the same seats every game? And do you feel like you might be at a point where you might give your seats up in the foreseeable future for reasons similar listed to those who have given them up?

 

Curious to see the responses..................

[HouseBowlrz]

My first response was going to be something along the lines of "stepping in it" but I also see some value here as long as people stay on point.

 

As a fan since my relocation to this area appeared permanent (1978 plus a couple of years), I've been a season ticket holder since 2004 mainly because my original application in 1988 probably fell by the wayside with the address changes I had incurred once FedEx opened.  Back when I signed up, being a season ticket holder definitely had prestige: small stadium, a franchise with consistent winning seasons and playoff appearances, and so on.  The years that followed the Gibbs I administration were lean but had signs of promise.  I got the letter late in 2003 and, with Gibbs coming back the next season, I felt like I had won the lottery.

 

As we can see, that did not last near as long and the history should speak for itself.  Yet, I kept renewing for two reasons: keeping hope that we turn corners with players, front office management; and that I had waited so long that I still felt they were like gold.  The hiring of McCloughan, with the history of turning around two other franchises, gave me that feeling that we were laying the foundation for long term success.  I was hesitant to renew in the wake of changes but did so with cautious optimism.  Even if we wind up with a winning record this season, I'm likely NOT going to renew after 14 seasons.

 

The "opposing fan takeover" seems to be worse this year, especially with teams you would not expect to flood FedEx Field outside of our divisional foes and marquee teams such as NE, PIT and GB.  Tickets are much more readily available on the secondary market and anyone who thinks ticket brokers don't buy up blocks of seasons in the west corner end zone needs a reality check.  (I sit in that area and ... every game ... is like that.)  Winning won't completely solve this problem ...

 

Lacking in the stands is any form of etiquette (scream on defense, quiet on offense) and, worse yet, respect for the fellow fans; the often drunken "I paid X amount of dollars for these seats and I'll do whatever I damn well please" with fists being raised within a few seconds of trying to talk reasonably to them.  Also, the social media "hounds" who seem to be obsessed with stand up selfies every 30 seconds and/or standing up while talking on their cell phones waving while telling whoever is on the other end, "I'm over here!!"  Ask them later about the game and they won't even know the score.

 

The injection of political rhetoric into the league has made it divisive and I find myself less and less interested in the NFL.  That nonsense falls squarely on Goodell who imposes heavy fines for celebrating a score but looks the other way when players snub the flag.  (The fact that Goodell wants a raise to $50M/annum and a private jet for the rest of his life makes me no longer want to support the NFL.)

 

Sporting events, until now, have always been what unifies us and serves as an escape to the nonsense around us.  Not anymore ... 

 

(There are two other things for which I bear the burden alone.  A few of the regular posters know but it's probably not fair to discuss here.)

 

Ultimately, it comes down to the feeling that this franchise will not go anywhere: every time we do something good that puts in a position to become a consistent 10-plus win season team, something ridiculous (bordering on stupid or petty) happens to set us back.

 

I can't justify spending $3k on tickets and parking as well as whatever I spend on tailgating; not anymore.  The seats are great but the interest and desire is not there for me.

[Cooooley47]

I'm a current season ticket holder, but 50/50 on renewing for next year. The amount of opposing fans in the stadium each week is just ridiculous. When they win, it is kind of sweeter, but when they lose and seeing opposing fans rub it in is just too much.

 

My grandfather got the tickets when FedEx opened up after being on the waitlist for years and the seats were at the very top of the upper deck. Now we are in the lower level in row 5 at about the 10 yard line. He eventually passed them to my Father who actually dropped them for a few seasons, but got them back when RGIII was drafted and now my Father and I split them. I really enjoy the experience of tailgating and being at the stadium for games, especially going with my Dad. I don't care how good the experience at home gets, being at the stadium is so much better in my opinion. I guess we just hold out hope that eventually Snyder will figure things out and be able to put out a decent product year after year making tickets harder to get in the after market. Right now, I do feel like an idiot paying about $135 plus parking plus $10/beers when you can get tickets on stubhub for about $40/game in the same section.

 

The amount of opposing fans at each game and the prices of tickets on the secondary market will probably get us to not renew. If Cousins is not re-signed, we will definitely 100% drop the tickets. I like Gruden and I think he will get things going in the right direction if given enough time. I think he is a good talent evaluator and would like to see him continue drafting for this team. So if there is turnover again after a bad year, again I think we'll drop the tickets.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

I'm both sad and glad to see long time STH's chime in and provide their view on the opposing fan situation.  Too often I see that glossed over by folks that don't attend games at FedEx Field.  I get sick of hearing that it's like this everywhere, it's a league problem not a Redskins problem, etc.  All that stuff is true to some extent but until you attend a game at FedEx vs. a non prestigious, division opponent and absorb just how bad it is to be surrounded by their fans, your opinion on the matter doesn't really hold any weight. 

 

Add to the fact that these STH's are paying full price to be surrounded by these fans that pay a fraction of what they do.  I can totally understand letting the tickets go.

 

 

[OVCChairman]

I had season tickets for 5 years in my late teens and early 20s (I'm 33 now so this was from 2002 - 2006 I believe).  My mom was nice enough to 'fund' them for me, which was freakin awesome and I didnt deserve, but thats a different topic.  

 

The biggest reason was expense.  I was in the Obstructed View seats, Section 221 and it still was north of $2k for a season, something she couldn't afford to continue, and I was not in a place to take over on a lump sum type situation.  

 

I can tell you I loved having season tickets.  We were kind of the abused fans of the group... under the overhang (nice when the weather sucked or when the sun was blaring) and the wind would blow almost constantly at your back as it was pushed up from the lower concourse.  This drove away the people who had purchased the tickets from people online, or via brokers.  It was not the best view but none of us cared.  We mostly all knew eachother and we loved going to the games together.  I'll never forget Clinton Portis' first carry as a Redskin, Darrell Green's last game, the Jumbotron tribute to Sean Taylor the game after he passed, or seeing Novak hit the game winner vs Dallas after ST picked up the fumble and ran it back, getting facemasked and putting us in position.  It was amazing to be there in that atmosphere.  

 

It's not the same now.  I told a story in another thread about how my Uncle and I were being borderline harassed by the ushers during the game vs San Fran because we were being too loud... We were not in any sense being obnoxious, rude, or disrespectful.... we were CHEERING.  It's broken, and because that, I'll mostly likely never get season tickets until they are out of Fedex, or they start to embrace the fan again. 

 

The other thing that killed me is the commitment in time.  It's a WHOLE DAY INVESTMENT.  I'm a huge fan of the Nats / Caps and the way they are set up is great.  When i had season tickets, on Monday Night games, you had to get to the stadium before 4 pm, or it would take 2 hours to get from Springfield, Va (where i lived) to Landover because of rush hour.  This doesn't bother mas much because I love to tailgate, but I now have a 15 month old daughter, am married, and I have a job that requires me to work every other Saturday.  If I go to a Sunday game, after working on Saturday... I get NO time on the weekend with the family.  It's not a convenient situation if I wanted to not forgo the tailgating because if you delay leaving for the game, chances are you'll miss the kickoff.  The whole process  is cumbersome.  I feel like the Metro being at the stadium would thin this a lot.... especially for those who DON'T use it.  

 

 

 

I guess the gameday experience as a whole is extremely frustrating top to bottom.  I haven't even mentioned the frustration I have with ownership / upper management but I don't put AS much of it on that because I'm a Redskins fan and I know in my heart I always will be, so I'm not gonna pump my fist saying 'take it to the man' but it absolutely has an influence on my spending habits.  

[LightningBuggs]

I had planned a response but @HouseBowlrz already nailed it for me, practically word for word.

 

STH since 2003 but this is the last year for all the reasons he listed in his response.

 

The last game I went to, the opener versus Philly, I felt like I had completely wasted a precious weekend day.  I used to love going to RFK.  No matter how many times I went, I always got a rush the first time I saw the green grass of the field after walking thru the gates.

 

I've never felt that way about FedEx.

[LadySkinsFan]

My parents bought season tickets back in 1963 or 4, four of them for our family. Then a couple of years later they got two more from neighbors who were moving. We had them through the 1997 season, when my mom died. My brother and I decided to turn them in. He was living in Southern Maryland and I watched the games on TV, and the prices were too high.. 

 

Experiencing the games in RFK was great! None of us liked Fed Ex Field, nor the ticket prices and concessions. 

[ComManDersFan57]

I was on the waiting list for almost 15 years. When my number came up I was more excited than a kid on Christmas morning. To top it off, Gibbs was returning that year. 

Our seats were in the nose bleed but it didn’t matter. We were there, loud and proud. We gradually moved closer and for the last five or six years our seats were in the second row of the upper deck. We didn’t want lower level since we didn’t want to stand for the entire game. 

We gave up our seats this year. The time commitment is probably the main reason. We live two hours away without traffic and I started leading music at church four years ago. We used to leave at 8:00 am or earlier for a 1:00 game but the job pushed that back to 11:00. We’d rush to the game only to get there half way through the first quarter. We no longer had time for tailgating. That alone was a big factor in the decision to give up the seats.

The number of opposing fans seemed to multiply each year regardless of our record. In addition, we’ve lost more games than we’ve won at FedEx. It’s no fun spending four hours trying to get home after a loss.

 
I miss the excitement of being there and seeing all the things that you can’t see on television. TV cameras generally follow the ball so you can’t see open receivers flying downfield, etc. Other than that, I don’t miss going to the games. We lose at home way too often. The cost is outrageous, it’s a whole day’s commitment and FedEx is… FedEx. 

[HouseBowlrz]

2 minutes ago, skinfan57 said:

I was on the waiting list for almost 15 years. When my number came up I was more excited than a kid on Christmas morning. To top it off, Gibbs was returning that year. 

Our seats were in the nose bleed but it didn’t matter. We were there, loud and proud. We gradually moved closer and for the last five or six years our seats were in the second row of the upper deck. We didn’t want lower level since we didn’t want to stand for the entire game. 

We gave up our seats this year. The time commitment is probably the main reason. We live two hours away without traffic and I started leading music at church four years ago. We used to leave at 8:00 am or earlier for a 1:00 game but the job pushed that back to 11:00. We’d rush to the game only to get there half way through the first quarter. We no longer had time for tailgating. That alone was a big factor in the decision to give up the seats.

The number of opposing fans seemed to multiply each year regardless of our record. In addition, we’ve lost more games than we’ve won at FedEx. It’s no fun spending four hours trying to get home after a loss.

 
I miss the excitement of being there and seeing all the things that you can’t see on television. TV cameras generally follow the ball so you can’t see open receivers flying downfield, etc. Other than that, I don’t miss going to the games. We lose at home way too often. The cost is outrageous, it’s a whole day’s commitment and FedEx is… FedEx. 

 

I still remember that feeling in January 2004 when the announcement came; definitely a second Christmas for me.

I live a few miles south of Dulles so it's 45 minutes to an hour one way and I harbored no illusions from the start that home games would be an all day affair.  And I've met some really great people at the tailgates so my thought process of letting them go is not without deliberation.

 

But, as other former STHs have told me, there comes a time when you realize enough is enough.  Some find it later than others but they eventually find it.

[ComManDersFan57]

44 minutes ago, HouseBowlrz said:

 

I still remember that feeling in January 2004 when the announcement came; definitely a second Christmas for me.

I live a few miles south of Dulles so it's 45 minutes to an hour one way and I harbored no illusions from the start that home games would be an all day affair.  And I've met some really great people at the tailgates so my thought process of letting them go is not without deliberation.

 

But, as other former STHs have told me, there comes a time when you realize enough is enough.  Some find it later than others but they eventually find it.

 

I can't agree more. I knew it would be an all day commitment, but like other former STHs have said, enough is enough. It simply became too much to deal with and I'm not as young as I once was. Not signing Captain Kirk, letting Garcon and Jackson go, firing Scott and various other FO factors weighed in as well. I'm finally starting to admit that it's rather nice watching from the warmth of the couch.

[HOF44]

I gave mine up about 3 years ago.  For me is was basically 4 reasons.

 

1.  Being forced to pay for preseason games.

2.  Traffic post game.

3.  Cost of tickets + parking

4.  I refuse to give Snyder any more of my cash.  

[BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93]

Skins have a sub .500 record all time at FedEx. That’s all you need to know. 

 

LL tickets for the thanksgiving game against NYG are going for 20 bucks 

 

Fans are fed up with mediocrity. 

 

 

[skinfan2k]

E-tickets have changed the game.  If you want to go to games, you can get uppers for under 15 dollars for every single game this season.  

[hail2skins]

Just checked Stubhub for club level......these are prices including fees for the Giants game a week out:

 

two below $40

34 between $40-50

312 between $50-60

285 between $60-70

 

I know its Thanksgiving night and the Giants are horrible, but has the secondary market ever been this bad for a particular game?

[TK]

14 minutes ago, skinfan2k said:

E-tickets have changed the game.  If you want to go to games, you can get uppers for under 15 dollars for every single game this season.  

$11.00 on Seat Geek for uppers.

[HouseBowlrz]

5 hours ago, skinfan2k said:

E-tickets have changed the game.  If you want to go to games, you can get uppers for under 15 dollars for every single game this season.  

 

5 hours ago, hail2skins said:

Just checked Stubhub for club level......these are prices including fees for the Giants game a week out:

 

two below $40

34 between $40-50

312 between $50-60

285 between $60-70

 

I know its Thanksgiving night and the Giants are horrible, but has the secondary market ever been this bad for a particular game?

 

5 hours ago, TK said:

$11.00 on Seat Geek for uppers.

 

All three posts are the best illustration of why the prestige of being a season ticket holder has all but lost its luster: larger stadiums and technology (laptops, mobile apps).

[Mr. S]

I was never a Season Ticket Holder but I do remember joining the list in February 2004 with Gibbs returning.  I was in college then and I thought heck, if I am number 83k or 153k (I am fairly sure one of those 2 were my number on the list when I signed up), I will get off the list in about 10 years when I hopefully have a job.  Well that time came in 2009, just five years later.  I found it laughable that despite being at least 83k spots behind on the list, the seats were open.  Even further, when I politely declined, they asked if I knew anyone else interested in purchasing the tickets.  I responded "I thought there was a long wait list?"  

 

I know all big corporations, especially in the entertainment industry, will fluff or misrepresent information to sell tickets, but the misrepresentations about the season ticket list is ridiculous.  Combine that with all of the other reasons referenced above, like fan experience, on-field product, the game takes up a whole day if you attend, being married and having a family, technology at home, etc..., and I can't of any reason why I should buy season tickets.  Heck, since 2010 I've only gone to games if a visiting friend really wanted to go or if someone had free tickets.  

 

I will say that, with the fan experience at most college football games, I would easily buy season tickets to my college football team if I lived closer to the town.

[skinsmarydu]

I'd give a lot just to be at a home game.  Bucket list ****.

My dad, the minister, did start service at 10:30, so even if his sermon ran a little long everyone could still be in their recliners by kickoff. were super important to him.  (Because of his "job", we knew we'd never be able to actually go to a game.)

[OVCChairman]

11 minutes ago, Mr. S said:

 

 

I will say that, with the fan experience at most college football games, I would easily buy season tickets to my college football team if I lived closer to the town.

 

 

I feel like this is an interesting comment and it sheds a LOT of light on the issues that are killing Fedex.  The college atmosphere is dedicated to the game, the pride of the school, and to the advantage of being at home.  It's truly GAMEDAY.  That's been lost with the Redskins.  Now it's an EVENT and a football game breaks out.   People go to the game, but they're not involved.  They root, but there's minimal screaming.  When they can't go to the game, they don't care who sits in their seats.  When I was a season ticket holder, I refused to sell my tickets to an opposing fan.  There were times my seats stayed vacant, because of this, and I was ok with it.  Even friends of mine asked to have / buy them and I said no.  It's not about being a Redskin fan anymore.  It used to be on Monday that my knees and back were KILLING me because I hardly ever sat down during the game, the floor to the 200 section was metal so all the regulars in my section would wear boots and stomp as hard and loud as we could.  Thats lost.  It's almost gotten to (and now passed) the point where being a season ticket holder was more about social prestige then it was about being a fan.  That people still have season tickets, not because they WANT them, but because they've had them for so long and they want to keep saying "i've had season tickets for 30 years."  Yeah, you have... but you're also telling people to sit down when were on defense and selling your tickets to broker sites where opposing teams fans can buy them up.  There's no PRIDE in being a REDSKINS season ticket holder, now it's just a title.  Obviously I'm generalizing and this is not fact for everyone.  There are still 'die nevers' that do it the 'right' way, but there are also plenty that sell off the 2 big games a year to pay for their whole season, and they don't care who's buying them.  

9 minutes ago, skinsmarydu said:

I'd give a lot just to be at a home game.  Bucket list ****.

My dad, the minister, did start service at 10:30, so even if his sermon ran a little long everyone could still be in their recliners by kickoff. were super important to him.  (Because of his "job", we knew we'd never be able to actually go to a game.)

What about a Thurs / Sun / Monday night game?

[skinsmarydu]

44 minutes ago, OVCChairman said:

What about a Thurs / Sun / Monday night game?

Youth group, choir practice, yada, yada. 

Now that I'm in my 50s, I can navigate my own schedule. 

[skinfan2k]

i have gone to 3 games this year.  i still haven't spent 50 bucks for tickets. 

[ThomasTomasz]

I got tickets last year by the visitor tunnel on my first try somehow, aisle seats, and was shocked to get them.  I gathered them up, and I buy a parking pass from a guy who has dream seats.  Best I can figure is that they thought I was my dad and a returning season ticket holder so they opened up all of the seats for me to view.

 

Why will I keep my tickets, at least for now?  

 

1.) My best memories are attending games with my dad and/or uncle, coming early and staying late.  

 

2.) I like to take friends of mine who rarely get to go to games.  Last year, I took three people to Redskins games who had never been to NFL games.  Same with my Orioles tickets.  

 

3.) I love getting there early, tailgating and until this year, staying after no matter the win or loss.  Now, they are kicking people out......this does bum me out a little bit, but we still use the whole four hours on the oth end.

 

My biggest problem is that some people judge themselves versus others as fans.  I am not on my feet all of the time, I am trying to dissect the game.  If a big play happens or we have a big third down, obviously I will get up and cheer, but I tend to be more on the quieter side because I grew up with coaches and another uncle used to play and coach for the Redskins.  

 

Also, I had some guys heckling me the last game because I fell asleep during the game.  You might ask how someone can fall asleep during a football game, so I will tell you:  

 

Friday: At 12 pm, I packed up my car at my house for the tailgate.  Went into work to work 2 pm until 1 am, as we are a subcontractor to the concession company at the Naval Academy and they had a two game basketball tournament there.  

 

Saturday: Wake up at 9 am to go to work 11 am-10 pm for the Navy football game.  

 

Sunday: Church is just important as the Redskins, I woke up at 6:30 am to make 7:30 mass, then picked up my friend and we tailgated and were in our seats by kickoff.  

 

Also, throughout all of this season, almost every single game of ours has proceeded a day where I have to work a Navy football event.  I have been so busy with work that I haven't been to the doctor to figure out why I have trouble sleeping, as I wake up every hour or so.  So the fact that I am even at the stadium, briefly falling asleep, I take as a huge accomplishment and I'm there rooting for my team.  Drunkenly being an idiot in the name of the Redskins isn't supporting the team, neither is heckling other fans because they may not have the level of energy or involvement with the game.  You never know how they may be watching the game or enjoying it nonetheless.  

 

One last thought......I believe they are selling the seats they can't sell to Ticketmaster.  A friend of mine told me that they talked to a scalper, and most of them want parking passes at this point and have no interest in tickets.  The Redskins sell to Ticketmaster to keep the illusion of the wait list and to guarantee a sell out.  The unfortunate thing is that a ticket sale is a ticket sale, and a concession sale is a concession sale.  If the Redskins are indeed selling to Ticketmaster or any other ticket sites, they certainly aren't concerned with brokers who are essentially doing the same thing.  

[turtle2328]

I have kept my tickets to date because of fear I'll lose the opportunity forever. I have 4 of about the very best general admission seats in the house. With two young boys, I had visions of taking them to games when they were older and having a terrific family bonding experience. I hear great stories about how many wonderful memories people have with their fathers at games and wanted a piece of that nostalgia pie. 

I'm really honestly considering letting them go now. It'll be a couple more years until my kids would old enough to enjoy a game and even if they were old enough, I can't take them to a sea of blue stars or viking horns. 

The legend is that I was put on the waiting list at birth. I followed up on it after attending the first ever Dallas game at FedEx. It was on MNF.  I had a girlfriend who's father had tickets he threw us. Even on a Monday night in the club level, the crowd was electric. Seriously, the euphoria of the crowd was something I simply had to have - TOTALLY worth paying for, even for a starving college kid. I paid dirty filthy scalpers well over face for a few years until my name came off the list. Simple, I had to go to every game. Coming off the list was like winning the lottery.

Fast forward to now and the popular narrative is that Redskins fans will only pay for high probability wins. Which means Redskins fans aren't willing to pay for season tickets. With league parity, odds of making the playoffs are 6:16. Odds of a home playoff game, where you could say you're likely to win, are 1:4 (but really more like 1:8 - being the 3rd or 4th division winner isn't really different from being a wild card team) The regular season wins leading up to that 1:8 chance aren't pre-season predictable. If you're waiting for a likely winner to experience that mob euphoria you're banking your money for that once every 8 years kinda game. But that's just math... we haven't had that kind of game available since 1991.

Anyway, I'm paying for the crowd. It's truly the one thing I can't replicate at home. I can make better food. I can have more comfortable seats. I can watch my own jumbotron and even see the all 22 to catch all the things I watch in person. I can do all that way cheaper than ~$6k a year in tickets. 

If the ticket office is telling I will likely never be able to share that crowd experience with my children then the block of 4 tickets is clearly too many. If the ticket office is telling me I will likely never be able to attend a regular season game that's 80% Redskins fans, then I don't even want 1. 

[skinfan2k]

I don't why people think they cant go to every game if they don't have season tickets.  So much bull**** spewed here. You will save hundereds of dollars if you do that

[OVCChairman]

12 hours ago, skinfan2k said:

I don't why people think they cant go to every game if they don't have season tickets.  So much bull**** spewed here. You will save hundereds of dollars if you do that

Thats the sad part, didnt used to be that way... Season ticket holder was an honor.... now it's a burden.