Eagles Redskins Post Game Assessments

[Reaper Skins]

Completely forgot about this until now but it really pisses me off.

 

At the end of the game when the eagles player was short of the first down marker and Gruden didn't challenge it.  Pretty sure they scored on the next play right?

[CTskin]

8 minutes ago, 50yrSKINSfan said:

Yes we did get away with a FEW holding calls but on that play where Wentz came out of the pile and ran for 15 yards, instead of a sack, that was a 25 yard turnaround and our LB that was behind Wentz, when he was cornered, got HEADLOCKED to his back! WTF. Add holding to it and the Birds most likely do not score. Big play. R. Karragan was held on every play. Not excuses, it was reality.

I mentioned this previously and thought that I was the only one seeing this... I was watching from a bar back home in CT where there were 5 eagles fans and I was the lone redskins fan. I don't know if it's because they weren't from philly, but they weren't dbags and we all got along fine. Anyhow, Kerrigan kept getting held and I was starting to lose my mind and told all of them to start looking for it. Sure enough, it continued to happen. Again and again where even they were counting their blessings. I admit that the Eagles were better than us last night, but it'd be ignorant to say this kind of stuff isn't gamechanging. 

[Unbias]

9 minutes ago, 50yrSKINSfan said:

Yes we did get away with a FEW holding calls but on that play where Wentz came out of the pile and ran for 15 yards, instead of a sack, that was a 25 yard turnaround and our LB that was behind Wentz, when he was cornered, got HEADLOCKED to his back! WTF. Add holding to it and the Birds most likely do not score. Big play. R. Karragan was held on every play. Not excuses, it was reality.

 

 

I don't see a hold. We blitzed and sent 6 against 6 blockers. They almost got home, but didn't quite get him down. 

 

Why can't we just say Wentz made a great play? Not many QBs have the desire to stay up or the strength to do so. I'm not saying he's going to do that for the next 10+ years every Sunday, but give some respect when it's due. 

[Suffolk_Skins]

This is one of the games you come away from and tip your hat to the opposition or at least their QB. Eagles are the most complete team in the NFL right now but they no way dominated us we had a chance first half to be up by two scores, I still think the Eagles would have come back at us but if we go up by two scores we would have had a very good chance. I don't hate the play calls on 3rd 1 but man how frustrating. Reed got to run a better route. Huge momentum shift.

 

On a side note I was there last night and there were ZERO problems with Eagles fans, just some good matured stuff. They were all fine and a good atmosphere. WE just have to find a way to win 2 of our next 4 to set ourselves up for a wildcard shot.

[50yrSKINSfan]

6 minutes ago, Unbias said:

Regarding Barnett - His block on Scherff should have been a penalty (block in the back), but I don't think it was a cheap shot. It wasn't like a blind side, decleating type hit (think Baker on Foles). As for Barnett jumping at Scherff's legs I'll have to see the play again. It looks like he was making an inside move and was blocked down into Scherff's knees. Scherff's knee looked more like a hyper extension and it also seemed like Barnett held back a bit. He could have just jumped forward and totally destroyed Scherff's knee. If he was being cheap and wanted to hurt him worse there was ample opportunity on that play to do so.   

The play where the Bird DB almost made a interception, Scherff ran to make the tackle but slowed up as the ball fell incomplete and at the same time the Eagle lineman pushed him with both hands from behind, and when BS fell the dirt bag Eagle jumped on him with all his weight, well after the play was over. BS was hurt and had to come out and went right to the ref complaining why was there no call. Even the announcers complained about the no call. If that was not a cheap shot then I am the pope. The play where the Eagle guy hit BS in the knee was not a mistake. BS had his legs planted and the Eagle guy made believe he was being blocked but he could have missed BS but he chose to plant his shoulder right into Brandon's knee instead of missing it. If he did not want to hit. BS in the knee he should have put his hands out to break his fall. Eagles, total scum bags.

[Darrell Green Fan]

18 minutes ago, Unbias said:

 

We might be able to slam the progressions built into the play design, where Kirk is being asked to look short first then deep second. If that's the case it's on Gruden, not Kirk. 

 

 

I was going to say the same thing.  We all know plays are designed to have a first look, then a second etc. Those guys running free could have very well been running pattern designed to clear the are for the intended target.  A fan in section 707 has no idea what the specifics of the play are so we don't know if it's on the QB or not. 

[Unbias]

1 minute ago, 50yrSKINSfan said:

The play where the Bird DB almost made a interception, Scherff ran to make the tackle but slowed up as the ball fell incomplete and at the same time the Eagle lineman pushed him with both hands from behind, and when BS fell the dirt bag Eagle jumped on him with all his weight, well after the play was over. BS was hurt and had to come out and went right to the ref complaining why was there no call. Even the announcers complained about the no call. If that was not a cheap shot then I am the pope. The play where the Eagle guy hit BS in the knee was not a mistake. BS had his legs planted and the Eagle guy made believe he was being blocked but he could have missed BS but he chose to plant his shoulder right into Brandon's knee instead of missing it. If he did not want to hit. BS in the knee he should have put his hands out to break his fall. Eagles, total scum bags.

 

It was the same guy on both plays. Rookie DE Derek Barnett. He was a standout at Tennessee and before becoming an Eagle was a guy I liked in the draft. In Throughout the draft process he was regarded as a high character guy. Maybe going pro or playing in his second division rival game made him a dirty player? Who knows, but let's not pretend he's Vontez Burfict going out of his way to hurt players. 

 

Anyway, I said it should have been a penalty. I'm not debating that at all. It should have been a block in the back. Was it dirty? I don't think so. Illegal blocks happen a lot. Mostly on returns, which are very close to an interception return. I can understand fans being mad about a player being hurt on what should have been a penalty, but that doesn't mean it's immediately a dirty play and that's a dirty player. 

[Darrell Green Fan]

I thought he was hurt on the play that looked like it may be an INT, where he was hit from behind. That's what a previous tweet said. 

[skinny21]

Still going through this thread, but some thoughts...

 

1) I don't know if he's totally ready, but I'd like to see Joshua Harvey-Clemons get some work as dimebacker.  He presents the speed and size to matchup with TEs and reduce throwing windows.  Tackles like a boss too.  

2) Don't like Swearinger playing single high, particularly on 3rd and long.  Nicholson seems like a very fit there.  

3) Not seeing a plan for mobile qbs.  

4) thought our depth played fairly well actually.  Dunbar, outside of the PI looked like starting material.  Didn't notice the backup olinemen.  Sucks that we haven't had Nsheke to rely on.  Thought the dline got some pretty good pressure on Wentz.  

5) Reed stepped up in the pass game.  Whiffed against Barnett in pass pro, but you can't put him in that situation.  

6) I'd like Gruden to let Kirk run hurry up early in games.  If it doesn't work, your defense isn't tired yet and you can switch back to churning clock.  If it does work, you tire their defense early.  I did like some of the plays that were called to try to limit the pass rush, but we could have done a bit more on that front.  

 

My overall frustration is that we have a better a better dline, ILbs, OLBs, corner group, and better safeties than we've had in a long time... yet we're still struggling (particularly at at crucial times).  How the heck do you fix that?

 

On offense, we need a blocking TE.  A dynamic one would be even better.  Can't trust our guys to run block or pass block, and that affects playcalling in a big way.  

 

Gruden obviously could have done some (many?) things better, but I can't imagine how hard it is to call plays when you aren't sure you can trust your hurting olinemen, the backups that fill in, your receivers to get separation (or catch the ball, in Pryor's case), or your TEs to block.  On top of all that, your best weapon is a 3rd down back.  Most of that applies to Kirk as well.  

 

Don't understand the criticism for Kirk not throwing deeper passes.  Against good pass rushing, you use the width of the field and misdirection.  If you go with 7 step drops, you're playing into the Defense's hands.  

[sempre_victrix]

52 minutes ago, Unbias said:

 

It was the same guy on both plays. Rookie DE Derek Barnett. He was a standout at Tennessee and before becoming an Eagle was a guy I liked in the draft. In Throughout the draft process he was regarded as a high character guy. Maybe going pro or playing in his second division rival game made him a dirty player? Who knows, but let's not pretend he's Vontez Burfict going out of his way to hurt players. 

 

Anyway, I said it should have been a penalty. I'm not debating that at all. It should have been a block in the back. Was it dirty? I don't think so. Illegal blocks happen a lot. Mostly on returns, which are very close to an interception return. I can understand fans being mad about a player being hurt on what should have been a penalty, but that doesn't mean it's immediately a dirty play and that's a dirty player. 

 

And yet it was the same player on both cheap shots.  I'm happy to call him a dirty player.  Too bad BS didn't bust him in the chops.

[Diehard Otis]

14 hours ago, Burgold said:

Overall: Too little too late, too many injuries, and damn they pulled off a lot of miracle plays.

 

Offense: A tale of two halves. First half they were aggressive and mostly effective. Second half they went conservative and fell apart. The play I hate most is 3rd and one in shot gun. Why tip off the defense!!! It's a stupid play and we do it over and over again. Running game was actually okay, but sparsely used. Passing game was only effective when we threw to our tight ends. The play where Scherff was hurt was a dirty play. **** dove straight at a lineman's knees. Play where Kirk was intercepted there should have been a roughing the passer penalty. As for Cousins, there are sacks you can not take. When you are outside the pocket and you see the rusher coming at you you don't hold the ball. You heave it out of bounds. The rules favor you. He took several sacks via stupidity.

 

 

Offense Overall: C

 

Defense: Another tale of two halves. Wentz has a talent for backbreakers. Way too many miracle plays and beautiful perfect passes. The football gods were against us. I actually don't think we played that bad, but damn every lucky bounce and every ridiculous play that couldn't possibly work out for the Eagles did. In the second half, they had their way with us.

 

Overall Defense: I don't even know how to grade us. I'm torn between a B and a D and I think both grades are warranted.

 

Special Teams: We gave up a return. We fumbled a return. Kickoffs were fine. We almost screwed up an extra point.

 

Overall ST: D

 

Coaching: What do you do when five guys all pile on the QB and he somehow bounces out. I thought we went into a shell offensively and trusted in the defense too much. The early gameplan worked. Then we went short, short, short. We are ****ing afraid of 3rd and one. We missed it twice. Once on a completed pass and once on a what the hell throw.

 

Refs: Refs really swallowed their whistles after the Eagles' first drive. **** em.

I agree with this post.

 

And let me say that I do believe that we have a good (and talented) Team.

 

BUT

 

These injuries are affecting our ability to compete.  And I'd hate to see the year washed away like this. 

 

But every key player I can think of has missed or is missing time, with the exceptions of Cousins, Vernon Davis, & Ryan Kerrigan (dammit!).  How can we navigate the teeth of our Schedule--as if it hadn't been tough to date--when our ability to compete has been so severely compromised?  That's the key question to our Season.

 

As for the game, the Houdini escape from the sack doomed us.  Guarantee you that'll be one of his signature plays going forward.  But I can't help but wonder how things would've fared had our Defense been healthier.

 

And putting Pryor in the doghouse in such a key ballgame leaves me nonplussed.  Yes, he has been a disappointment, but he needs COACHING & NOT punishment (we need our best 11 on The Field now more than ever).

 

What will this portend for the coming weeks?  That's the million dollar question.

[Darrell Green Fan]

I'll repeat what was the second play if he was not hurt on the clip on the near INT?

 

 

 

4 minutes ago, Diehard Otis said:

 

 

And putting Pryor in the doghouse in such a key ballgame leaves me nonplussed.  Yes, he has been a disappointment, but he needs COACHING & NOT punishment (we need our best 11 on The Field now more than ever).

 

 

 

What makes you say Pryor is one of our top 11?  Pro sports is all about playing players who have earned the right to playing time and Pryor certainly has not earned his playing time.  I'm not ready to blame the coaches.  How do you coach a player to stop dropping passes? 

[MartinC]

1 hour ago, Reaper Skins said:

Completely forgot about this until now but it really pisses me off.

 

At the end of the game when the eagles player was short of the first down marker and Gruden didn't challenge it.  Pretty sure they scored on the next play right?

Replay showed the tip of the ball just touching the first down line as the foot went out of bounds. It was close but had we challenged highly unlikely we win the challenge.

[Reaper Skins]

Just now, MartinC said:

Replay showed the tip of the ball just touching the first down line as the foot went out of bounds. It was close but had we challenged highly unlikely we win the challenge.

That makes me feel a little better.  All I remembered was both commentators being surprised we didn't throw the flag, then the Eagles immediately capitalizing on the momentum.

[Diehard Otis]

3 minutes ago, Darrell Green Fan said:

I'll repeat what was the second play if he was not hurt on the clip on the near INT?

 

What makes you say Pryor is one of our top 11?  He certainly has not earned more chances and pro sports is all about playing players who have earned the right to play.  How do you coach a player to stop dropping passes? 

It's in his head right now it would seem.

 

I confess, I don't know the answer, but he is far too talented (and a matchup nightmare for Defenses) when he does make plays.

 

My position is that you don't bury him on the bench.  You continue to work with him to help get his mojo back.

 

This much is for certain: if we cannot effectively throw outside the numbers, then we cannot achieve this Season's Goals.  Any of them.

[MartinC]

Just now, Reaper Skins said:

That makes me feel a little better.  All I remembered was both commentators being surprised we didn't throw the flag, then the Eagles immediately capitalizing on the momentum.

 

I was surprised we did not challenge as well but there was a still later which showed it was a first down - just!

[Tailgates of Hell]

1 hour ago, Darrell Green Fan said:

I didn't notice the hold on the Wentz escape, I'll have to look again. What I did notice is the refs giving an undeserved critical first down on a third down scramble by Kirk that kept a drive that would eventually lead to a TD that cut the lead to 7.  That was as big of a missed call as any we had called against us.  

 

The refs as a whole continue to be atrocious this season both for and against us. The fake PI on Garcon last week, the Vernon Davis "fumble" a ton of stuff last night... they're just bad. I don't know what it is, but the beginning of that game was totally unwatchable. Went both ways, but it was not good. 

[fjblair]

1 hour ago, Suffolk_Skins said:

This is one of the games you come away from and tip your hat to the opposition or at least their QB. Eagles are the most complete team in the NFL right now but they no way dominated us we had a chance first half to be up by two scores, I still think the Eagles would have come back at us but if we go up by two scores we would have had a very good chance. I don't hate the play calls on 3rd 1 but man how frustrating. Reed got to run a better route. Huge momentum shift.

 

On a side note I was there last night and there were ZERO problems with Eagles fans, just some good matured stuff. They were all fine and a good atmosphere. WE just have to find a way to win 2 of our next 4 to set ourselves up for a wildcard shot.

 

Exactly. They are the best team in the NFL and they won. The Redskins played a pretty good game overall, especially considering the injuries. Sorry crybabies, we are an above average team and KC did not lose the game last night.

[Darrell Green Fan]

15 minutes ago, Reaper Skins said:

That makes me feel a little better.  All I remembered was both commentators being surprised we didn't throw the flag, then the Eagles immediately capitalizing on the momentum.

 

Those commentators also said we were idiots to throw the challenge flag on a play where the Philly receiver was clearly touched, leg to leg. That idiot John Grudog even said they didn't even need to go to New York, it wasn't close.  . 

 

I hate the MNF crew so badly, Dandy Don is rolling over in his grave.

 

 

[NewCliche21]

3 minutes ago, Darrell Green Fan said:

 

Those commentators also said we were idiots to throw the challenge flag on a play where the Philly receiver was clearly touched, leg to leg. That idiot John Grudog even said they didn't even need to go to New York, it wasn't close.  . 

 

I hate the MNF crew so badly, Dandy Don is rolling over in his grave.

 

 

 

To me it was pretty clear that he was saying that he was obviously touched.  I think you're right about the crew sucking (NORTH DAKOTA!!!!!!!!!!!!!), but this one isn't what you think it is.

[Cliffmark1]

I don't understand why we didn't have a spy on wentz the whole game, we know he runs. 

[NewCliche21]

2 minutes ago, Cliffmark1 said:

I don't understand why we didn't have a spy on wentz the whole game, we know he runs. 

 

At one point we did, at least for a play.  I remember because I was like, "Why is he just sitting there?"  And then he missed the tackle on a short pass to the left.

[LavarArringtonMachine]

1 hour ago, 50yrSKINSfan said:

Yes we did get away with a FEW holding calls but on that play where Wentz came out of the pile and ran for 15 yards, instead of a sack, that was a 25 yard turnaround and our LB that was behind Wentz, when he was cornered, got HEADLOCKED to his back! WTF. Add holding to it and the Birds most likely do not score. Big play. R. Karragan was held on every play. Not excuses, it was reality.

 

 

It may be reality, who knows?  But do you think that everytime we have scored, there was clean blocking all across our whole line?  Nobody in the world can tell me we havent held on some of our scoring plays because I have seen it with my own eyes.

 

Holding happens in this sport.  They hold us at times and we hold them at times.  Im just tired of all the excuses of the refs did this or the refs missed this or that holding call.  THAT'S LOSER TALK!!!

 

You know who was guilty of holding ALL game???  OUR COACHING STAFF!!!  Their playcalling was HOLDING us back from competing at a higher level, our 3rd and short playcalling was HOLDING us back from picking up 1 or 2 damn yards, our redzone playcalling was HOLDING us back from scoring touchdowns and made us settle for FGs.

 

So if anybody wanna cry and whine about HOLDING....  Start with the playcaller of our offense HOLDING us back!!!

[Rattlesnake88]

They beat us straight up. They made some really big plays. Wentz on the Houdini scramble and the endzone toss with pressure in his face he made to go up by two tds after the half.

 

Both th of those plays are high skill high luck that don't happen every game unless you are a superstar. Wentz could be developing into that. I don't think the Eagles overall are better than us and I think we can beat them. We just had too many injuries and ****ty 3rd and short failures. It is what it is. Nothing to cry over. NFC is a **** show and a wildcard is very viable. 

 

Httr 

[LavarArringtonMachine]

26 minutes ago, Tailgates of Hell said:

 

The refs as a whole continue to be atrocious this season both for and against us. The fake PI on Garcon last week, the Vernon Davis "fumble" a ton of stuff last night... they're just bad. I don't know what it is, but the beginning of that game was totally unwatchable. Went both ways, but it was not good. 

 

 

Finally!!!  Someone who can take off their Redskins rosey glasses and see that it happens for and against us just like any other team.  Refs arent perfect.  They are human too!