2018 Comprehensive NFL Draft Thread

[skinny21]

7 hours ago, Koolblue13 said:

Fitz does help the run game immensely. He allows everyone in front of him to play downhill without fear of giving up the big play. Think about Seattle with Earl Thomas. Big corners, small fast LBers, smaller dline. Fast and attacking. Swearinger doesn't understand this because he's a **** Free and arrogant. People think a fat **** is going to solve everything in 15 plays a game aren't seeing the field. Sure, Hood and the McReplacements suck. 

 

I don't want a nose in the first, but would be cool with Payne later. No interest in VV. 

For me, I want a guy that can play multiple positions on the line - NT and DT would be great, DE and DT would be good as well.  Spending an early pick on a pure nose?  No thanks.  A big body can be had later.  

 

Some do believe Vea can play DT and NT.  I have no opinion on that, but the production/metrics are very concerning, especially if there are clean prospects on the board.  

[bowhunter]

If a nose like VV or Hankins is able to stop an opponents drive on a 3rd and short, they are worth every penny. It may determine if the opponent makes a long sustained TD drive or is stopped on their side of the field. Getting the opponent off the field makes things easier on everybody. The fact that they have another dimension as DT and can stay on the field brings even more value. That's what separates an elite NG/DT from all of the other fat guys.  Seriously folks, think about how nice it would be to feel confident that the odds are stacked in our favor every time an opponent is in a 3rd/4th and short situation. The league may have progressed to a passing league, but the importance of the ground game is returning. Surprisingly, we were ranked in the top ten in opponents 3rd down conversion rate but we were dead last in 2016. I want to see that trend continue.  

[PortisBetts]

19 hours ago, Alcoholic Zebra said:

 

Minkah isn't your average DB.  I feel weird seeming so sure about this, but he'd instantly be one of the best Nickel's against the run as a rookie.  He could also slide inside and play the Su'a Cravens role.

 

Granted, I feel you, it's not a fat boy up front that doesn't get blown off the line of scrimmage...but there's a chance someone is there at #44.  Like in the Dane Brugler mock with Harrison Phillips.

I want Minkah more than anyone at 13 and am just hoping that he falls. I cant imagine anyone that has a chance of falling to 13 that I want even remotely as much as Fitzpatrick. He is going to be an absolute stud in the NFL. All over the field, creating turnovers, taking tight ends out of the game, hawking the safety spot....plug and play type of player where you can move him all around. He is the dream pick for me. 

[tmandoug1]

Nelson Rd 1

Settle Rd 2

 

See, it is just that easy. 

[Mannix]

*determine if the opponent makes a long sustained TD drive or is stopped on their side of the field. Getting the opponent off the field makes things easier on everybody. The fact that they have another dimension as DT and can stay on the field brings even more value. That's what separates an elite NG/DT from all of the other fat guys.  Seriously folks, think about how nice it would be to feel confident that the odds are stacked

 

 

Great post.  As a Chiefs fan it’s hard for me to believe that the Chiefs weren’t the 32nd ranked team against the run last year.  There were two games last year (these are the two I remember the most) for the Chiefs that demonstrated how a pathetic run defense will be penetrated and used to ultimately win the game.  The first was the game in Dallas where KC took the lead early in the third quarter only to have Dallas take the ball and go on an 8 minute drive then punch it in to go on top.  In that game there was at least one other time the Cowboys had an 8 plus minute drive.  It destroyed the Chiefs psychologically and ultimately made them lose on the scoreboard.  The other was the beat down on the ground the Titans gave the Chiefs in the playoffs.  Yes the Titans qb completed a touchdown pass to himself but the Titans went on long drives throughout the game mainly on the ground with the worst being converting a 3rd and 11 on the ground with just over 2 minutes in the game keeping the ball out of the offenses hands.

 

If the Redskins run D is worse than the garbage I saw as a Chiefs fan you better use some draft capital and fix it.  How many 340 pound men can run like Vea.  Effective two gap tackles many times don’t have big tackle, TFL and sack numbers.  Vea isn’t Aaron Donald or Warren Sapp.  After watching games it is a fair criticism to say he does have some conditioning and or effort issues.  He also embarrasses/rag dolls the people in front of him more than any other tackle I’ve seen in the crop coming out this year (two gap tackle).  

 

[Skinsinparadise]

2 hours ago, bowhunter said:

If a nose like VV or Hankins is able to stop an opponents drive on a 3rd and short, they are worth every penny. It may determine if the opponent makes a long sustained TD drive or is stopped on their side of the field. Getting the opponent off the field makes things easier on everybody. The fact that they have another dimension as DT and can stay on the field brings even more value. That's what separates an elite NG/DT from all of the other fat guys.  Seriously folks, think about how nice it would be to feel confident that the odds are stacked in our favor every time an opponent is in a 3rd/4th and short situation. The league may have progressed to a passing league, but the importance of the ground game is returning. Surprisingly, we were ranked in the top ten in opponents 3rd down conversion rate but we were dead last in 2016. I want to see that trend continue.  

 

I agree with the premise of the point.  The thing is though apples to apples if someone like Fitzpatrick or James lets say are elite at their position and one of them fall and Vea isn't an elite guy and someone they can get in the 2nd round or later like lets say Hill or Settle are close enough ability wise to Vea then its slam dunk IMO to go BPA at 13.

 

I go back and forth on Vea.  He's far from my top choice at 13. But the one reason why I wouldn't hate it though is I am tired of the scenario you describe -- its 3rd and 1 and our opponent converts and conversely we have 3rd and 1 and we won't convert.  Hence IMO DT-RB top needs.  And I am tired of the FO being cute at both positions so I'd like an over the top high pick and or high end FA signing. 

[Mannix]

One other note on Vea when he is playing end to me often times he is playing contain.  Some of the times he is not and is not as effective (gets beat). You watch these games when he slides inside and it’s an obvious rundown and they tell him to reset the line of scrimmage and you see a guy destroy the man or men in front of him.  Watch his UCLA game.  He’s pretty dominant throughout but there is a play in the first half where UCLA is around the Washington 35 and it’s a run to Vea’s side he blows his man clear into the backfield and the back makes the first down because of a great individual play.  

 

If you have Vea exclusively Inside and tell him on run downs to reset the LOS a yard back between the center and guard over and over again I bet he can do it more times than not.  That aspect of his game is better than any of the other DTs I’ve seen in this class.  (I’ve really only studied Phillips, Settle and N.C. state guy). What little I’ve seen from Payne doesn’t leave me super impressed.

 

[Mr.Will]

I’m sold on all players mentioned above!!..IDC who we grab first as long as it’s the best player available,someone able to plug&play immediately,and be a force at that position..It’s not just a matter of D-Line or DB,we desperately need impactful players at all three levels on Defense..Grabbing anybody at any level will be helpful no matter which position is picked!!..Grab the best stud,fill that need and consetrate on the others as those positions are available!

[RemoveSnyder]

If you want to watch d-line, watch Senat. 

 

That is all. 

[Skinsinparadise]

I got some fear that we go business as usual at RB and start fishing in the 4th round at RB because that's how their board falls.  And if so I just don't trust our evaluators to find that guy in the late rounds.  I was listening to T. Matich who was touting R. Freeman as an option in the 3rd or 4th.

 

Looking (granted purely at highlights) at Freeman.  He has more speed than Perine -- there is also some stiffiness in his hips that remind me though of Perine.  At least as to his highlight runs, he had massive holes to run through.   He has good hands, though.   But comparing him for example to Chubb -- Chubb for a big guy has some quick cutting ability and shiftiness (that you don't see to the same degree from Freeman at least among the highlights) with stiffer defenses on the other end.  Chubb to me looks distinctly better. 

 

Not to make this all about Freeman but I got some worries about who would be left in the 4th at RB.  Judging by buzz, Walton is unlikely going to fall to the 4th, heck Freeman might not even.   So we got guys left in that case like Ballage, Kelly, Wadley, Adams, Scarbrough perhaps?  

 

Thinking about it even though they've poked around Ronald Jones he doesn't fit that primary back thumper that Jay mentioned that he's looking for. And he also expressed in an interview they prefer someone who can catch.   So if so that leaves it to Chubb (not sure about his hands though), Guice, Michel, Penny -- all of whom different people have said they like and the order for them seems to be:

 

1. Guice

2. Chubb

3. Penny

4. Michel

 

Most draft geeks some to value Michel over Chubb and Penny.  And out of those 4 RBs, its seems almost a given that at best the only one left at the 44th pick will be Penny.  Maybe Chubb is still there.  That's my long winded way of saying if they don't trade down in the first and pick up a RB then the odds seem to be Penny or we are talking 4th round.  Unless Portis talked them into Walton but Walton doesn't strike me as having the size Jay wants for a 1st-2nd down RB. 

 

In the early 2nd before our pick, we got the Lions, Dolphins, Giants, Colts, Bucs and some others potentially too like the Raiders, Pats.  Granted the action in the first will influence it.  But I understand why Keim keeps saying the FO is concerned about their position in the 2nd round to get their RB.

[RWJ]

I'd be all over this trade scenario:

http://walterfootball.com/draft2018trades.php

 

13. New England Patriots: Mike McGlinchey, OT, Notre Dame

 
*** Trade 5: Patriots acquire No. 13 overall from Redskins for No. 23 overall and second- and third-round picks (Nos. 63, 95) ***

The Patriots move up, but not for a quarterback. They lost Nate Solder this offseason, so acquiring a new franchise left tackle makes sense. Mike McGlinchey is the top prospect at the position, and it's not very close. New England would have to leap Arizona to obtain McGlinchey, in all likelihood.

http://walterfootball.com/draft2018trades_1.php

 

23. Washington Redskins: Derrius Guice, RB, LSU

 
It would take a Laremy Tunsil bong-type situation for Saquon Barkley to slip to No. 13, so taking any other running back at that juncture would be a major reach. Getting Derrius Guice at No. 23, on the other hand, is much more reasonable. Guice would be a nice boon for the Redskins and their dormant rushing attack.

 

[mistertim]

Just finished watching cutups of Settle (finally) and I'm a little underwhelmed, but with caveats.

 

There are definitely some things to like about him. Great burst off the line, extremely agile and athletic for a guy his size, some nice gap shooting and pass rush moves, excellent balance, very high motor, pretty good production in 2017 (12.5 TFL, 4 sacks).

 

Things I don't like. For a guy his size he get's stonewalled at the point of attack and/or pushed back WAY too easily. He really is pretty much a pure gap shooting interior DL which is usually the opposite of what a 6'3 335 lb guy does. His gap shooting is really good but his anchoring is downright awful many times and he often gets easily handled by one OL. Once a blocker gets his hands on him and is locked onto him it's mostly over...he shows very little ability to get off of blocks and disengage. High motor but seems to give up on plays sometimes when they aren't in his immediate vicinity.

 

The main caveat to the criticisms above is that he's really raw so it might just be an issue of learning better technique and leverage as he's basically only a 1 year starter. He really needs to learn how to anchor. He can't consistently take on single blockers and beat them, let alone double teams. In the NFL it will be just that much harder. As of now he really looks more like a gap shooting 3-4 DE or a DT in a 4-3 as opposed to a NT. If he can improve his technique, hand usage, and leverage he could be really good. But as of right now IMO he's a project.

 

Probably wouldn't take him before the 3rd.

[HigSkin]

http://www.espn.com/blog/washington-redskins/post/_/id/36227/alex-smiths-transition-in-redskins-offense-should-be-smooth

 

 

Keim: Now, take this for what it’s worth: the opinion of someone I respect in a front office. He did not think any of the top four quarterbacks would fall to 13, thereby perhaps prompting a team to trade with Washington to draft one. Nor did he think Lamar Jackson would go before late in the first round with Mason Rudolph following, perhaps in the second. His guess for Rudolph: New England. We’ll see if that proves right. But his opinion on the four quarterbacks is what I’ve heard from others, too. There's always a chance one could fall, but at least a few people don't think it'll happen. We'll see. If none do, that won’t help the Redskins trade back necessarily, but it would push a good player down who ordinarily would have gone top 10. And that could mean the Redskins have a handful of players they like and, therefore, would be OK trading back a few spots. The hard part will be finding a dance partner and having a quarterback there makes it easier. But without a quarterback it still certainly isn't impossible; it’s not as if every team only trades up for a quarterback.

[Skinsinparadise]

5 hours ago, mistertim said:

Just finished watching cutups of Settle (finally) and I'm a little underwhelmed, but with caveats.

 

There are definitely some things to like about him. Great burst off the line, extremely agile and athletic for a guy his size, some nice gap shooting and pass rush moves, excellent balance, very high motor, pretty good production in 2017 (12.5 TFL, 4 sacks).

 

 

Settle has his critics I've noticed.  His combine numbers were bad.   Dane Brugler isn't a big fan.  Some other draft geek forgot which one talked about his lack of balance and he ends up on his butt way too often.  

 

Obviously, he has his fans, too.  It's just hard to notice he's one of the more polarizing NTs.  I haven't though watched him, yet.  I'll get to it considering according to Keim he's on the Redskins radar screen.

 

 

Kent Lee Platte‏ @MathBomb Mar 4

More

Tim Settle tied for the lowest #RAS for DT at the Combine, with low scores in nearly every metric. Low end nose tackle numbers here.

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

6 hours ago, RWJ said:

I'd be all over this trade scenario:

http://walterfootball.com/draft2018trades.php

 

13. New England Patriots: Mike McGlinchey, OT, Notre Dame

 
*** Trade 5: Patriots acquire No. 13 overall from Redskins for No. 23 overall and second- and third-round picks (Nos. 63, 95) ***

The Patriots move up, but not for a quarterback. They lost Nate Solder this offseason, so acquiring a new franchise left tackle makes sense. Mike McGlinchey is the top prospect at the position, and it's not very close. New England would have to leap Arizona to obtain McGlinchey, in all likelihood.

 

 

 

I'd take it.  Some think NE would really dig Fitzpatrick.  Saban's is Bill's pal.  And Bill loves the swiss army knife type of players.  I am bringing that up because I am listening to a podcast from Fanrag (via Joe Marino who supposedly had the most accurate mock draft last year) and the host is convinced there is a good chance Fitzpatrick isn't taken top 10 -- he goes that he has a source to Tampa and they like D. James better, SF and the Raiders are looking elsewhere, etc.  They go they think the Redskins are hot for him at 13.  If Fitzpatrick falls to 13, wonder if the Redskins would give up the pick (not sure I would do it in that case but I'd consider).  As for McGlinchey, I've seen him top 10 lately in some mocks, so wonder if he's there at 13. 

 

 

[OlufemiBiz]

53 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Settle has his critics I've noticed.  His combine numbers were bad.   Dane Brugler isn't a big fan.  Some other draft geek forgot which one talked about his lack of balance and he ends up on his butt way too often.  

 

Obviously, he has his fans, too.  It's just hard to notice he's one of the more polarizing NTs.  I haven't though watched him, yet.  I'll get to it considering according to Keim he's on the Redskins radar screen.

 

 

Kent Lee Platte‏ @MathBomb Mar 4

More

Tim Settle tied for the lowest #RAS for DT at the Combine, with low scores in nearly every metric. Low end nose tackle numbers here.

 

 

 

*...Yet, His PLAY (ON the Field) says 'OTHERWISE'!!!

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

9 minutes ago, OlufemiBiz said:

 

*...Yet, His PLAY (ON the Field) says 'OTHERWISE'!!!

 

 

 

I hear you.  Some draft geeks disagree.  The rap by his critics isn't great player if only his metrics measured up.  There are some that don't think he's that great of a player -- I recall Brugler was one and am forgetting who the other was.  I am not saying they are right.  And I know some like him, too.  But since I haven't watched him yet, I just know what people say about the dude and its hard not to notice that some prospects just about everyone rallys around and some aren't in that category -- Settle is one of those that has some prominent critics in that mix of those who praise him.  But I'll dive in and watch him soon.   I am personally agnostic about him until I explore further.  

[JamesMadisonSkins]

Think I’m cool rolling with this mock:

 

*Trade 1.13 to Dallas for 1.19 and 2.18

1.19: Derrius Guice, RB LSU

2.12: Austin Corbett, G Nevada

2.18: Tim Settle, NT VT

4.9: Nick Nelson, CB Wisconsin

5.5: Quin Blanding, S UVA

5.26: ShaQ Griffin, LB UCF

6.31: Daurice Fountain, WR UNI

7.13: Cam Serigne, TE Wake

7.23: Javon Rolland-Jones, Edge Ark st 

[redskindan07]

Someone will pick Shaq Griffin before the end of the 5th I'll almost guarantee 

[Mr.Will]

1 hour ago, redskindan07 said:

Someone will pick Shaq Griffin before the end of the 5th I'll almost guarantee 

I thought the exact same thing when I read that too!

[Koolblue13]

2 hours ago, redskindan07 said:

Someone will pick Shaq Griffin before the end of the 5th I'll almost guarantee 

Classic great guy story for a year or two, then forgotten about. 

[fordranger76]

Quick snapshot of Vea vs Settle vs Senat vs Phillips production wise.

 

 

3-4 NT	Solo Tackles	Sacks	TFL	Backfield	School	SOS
	4.6 AVG	10.65 AVG	8.5 AVG	9.57 AVG
Harrison Phillips	6.8	23.8	23.4	23.6	Stanford	28
Deadrin Senat	6.3	16.6	10.2	13.4	South Florida	106
Tim Settle	4.8	12.5	12.3	12.4	Virginia Tech	55
Vita Vea	5.1	9.4	6.5	7.95	Washington	60

 

Now remember to those new to this the score is a percentage of how their stats related to their particular team percentage wise. Pay close attention to backfield pressure generated by sacks and tfl numbers.

 

[tmandoug1]

27 minutes ago, fordranger76 said:

Quick snapshot of Vea vs Settle vs Senat vs Phillips production wise.

 

 

 

3-4 NT	Solo Tackles	Sacks	TFL	Backfield	School	SOS
	4.6 AVG	10.65 AVG	8.5 AVG	9.57 AVG
Harrison Phillips	6.8	23.8	23.4	23.6	Stanford	28
Deadrin Senat	6.3	16.6	10.2	13.4	South Florida	106
Tim Settle	4.8	12.5	12.3	12.4	Virginia Tech	55
Vita Vea	5.1	9.4	6.5	7.95	Washington	60

 

Now remember to those new to this the score is a percentage of how their stats related to their particular team percentage wise. Pay close attention to backfield pressure generated by sacks and tfl numbers.

 

 

Sooooo... Harrison Phillips it is! 

[seantaylor=god]

It’s probably  a moot point, because I think John Elway will pick him, but if Rosen starts sliding it will be fascinating to watch. All it takes is a few “old school” GMs to pass on him and he will be in range of our pick.

 

I’m going to get killed for this but if he’s making it toward Buffalo I’m exploring a trade up to get him.

 

He’s the best quarterback in the draft. The character issue is garbage; I’m only worried about his injuries.

 

Assuming “character issues” won’t get a player suspended (which Rosen’s won’t) they matter very little; players want to win. A talented QB like Rosen (Aaron Rodgers) will be fine.

 

It sucks that we traded for a QB, but Alex Smith could start for a year while we groom Rosen. Then he’s an expensive (but manageable) backup. Or we could try and trade him.

 

Roast me ?

[JamesMadisonSkins]

I think there are some guys to be bad in the 4th or 5th at NT that have upside. The question is are we willing to gamble on waiting that long to go DL?

 

if Minkah is there and we don’t trade down and we take him, then go RB like Chubb at 44 ... you’re waiting til Round 4/5 to address the trenches