Presidential Election: 11/3/20 ---Now the President Elect Joe Biden Thread

[88Comrade2000]

4 hours ago, clietas said:

 

News flash. They're going to do that no matter who the nominee is.

True, but this country will not vote an actual Socialist as president in 2020.

Maybe by 2028; when AOC is the Democratic nominee.

Having Bernie as the nominee, while bring in some new voters; will be offset by the people that he will scare away from voting Dem in 2020. I don't see an actual Socialist winning against Trump.  That doesn't mean all those votes are going to Trump; it just means Bernie won't be getting them.

[Captain Wiggles]

Don't fall for the Republican propaganda. They've been screaming socialism for over 80 years. There is not one true socialist running to be the Democratic nominee. Social Democracy and socialism are quite different.

 

Social Democracy is the way forward. This country was headed that way thanks to great public servants like FDR and Truman. Unfortunately so much of the New Deal has been destroyed and forgotten.

 

[visionary]

 

[twa]

 

 

[Simmsy]

Once again, I'm going to have to disagree. A socialistic policy has been popular for a while, as of right now, its more popular than ever. Yes, Trump won, but he was a weak candidate running against a weaker candidate. Trump is at the weakest he's ever been right now, running a popular, progressive like Sanders would be the an incredibly great idea right now. Look at how many progressives and "non white males" came in on the blue wave.

[Bozo the kKklown]

The other thing is Trump is not that popular in the midwest thanks to his economic policy.

 

This is why it's important that the Dems run a candidate that has a policy that will help those in that region. 

[grego]

26 minutes ago, Simmsy said:

Once again, I'm going to have to disagree. A socialistic policy has been popular for a while, as of right now, its more popular than ever. Yes, Trump won, but he was a weak candidate running against a weaker candidate. Trump is at the weakest he's ever been right now, running a popular, progressive like Sanders would be the an incredibly great idea right now. Look at how many progressives and "non white males" came in on the blue wave.

 

I've been saying for years a halfway decent moderate candidate would beat trump. 

 

The problem with that is that moderates don't fire up the far left crowd. These people seem to hate trump the most, yet they'll stay home come election time with such a candidate. 

 

The problem with the far lefties as candidates is that they turn off moderates, so they may sit it out. 

 

I think the one reliable factor is that no matter the policy positions, the candidate has to be charismatic like Obama to get people from different political perspectives to show up. Without a charismatic candidate, I don't think anything else matters. 

[Bozo the kKklown]

 

[Llevron]

27 minutes ago, grego said:

 

I've been saying for years a halfway decent moderate candidate would beat trump. 

 

The problem with that is that moderates don't fire up the far left crowd. These people seem to hate trump the most, yet they'll stay home come election time with such a candidate. 

 

The problem with the far lefties as candidates is that they turn off moderates, so they may sit it out. 

 

I think the one reliable factor is that no matter the policy positions, the candidate has to be charismatic like Obama to get people from different political perspectives to show up. Without a charismatic candidate, I don't think anything else matters. 

 

Agree with all of this, but I do wonder if our failure with Trump will be a factor in the turnout of other elections. I could see how it may happen that way. But there is really no way to know what happens 2 years from now let alone 10 or more. 

[Bozo the kKklown]

Democrats have been running to the center for 30 years. It is absurd for anyone to say "run a decent moderate candidate." 

[grego]

11 minutes ago, BenningRoadSkin said:

Democrats have been running to the center for 30 years. It is absurd for anyone to say "run a decent moderate candidate." 

 

You didn't finish reading after that sentence. 

[88Comrade2000]

We'll see. It's not going to be policy so much as in personality vs Trump.

 

We live in a climate where Donald Trump got elected. The more flawed candidate won, electorally. 

 

The Dems need to win the Hillary states plus 3 that Trump won.

 

 Best chance are the Midwest states Trump won or a combo of say Georgia,  Florida and Arizona.

 

It won't matter if they actually like some o f the Bernie policies. There's enough people who will believe the Socialist/Socialism boogieman that Bernie will not get their vote.

Bernie will bring in some voters but I believe that will be offset by the people who Will not vote for him. That will be enough to give Trump reelection.

 

Could I be wrong,  sure. We will find out next year.

[NoCalMike]

For me, all the usual anecdotes and platitudes of "we need this kind of candidate" are out the window for 2020.  If after 4 years of Trump in office you either:

 

A: Are an Obama voter, that didn't like Hillary, and gave Trump a chance, and would consider voting for him again

 

B: Not sure if you'd turn out for a Dem candidate, unless it's "insert candidate here" 

 

Then you are part of the problem. 

 

The unfortunate reality of the situation is that Trump has been fully normalized.  His policies are Pat Buchanan-esque garbage that have been soundly rejected in the past, but mixed in with an heir of ignorance not seen by a President in the history of the country.  He has been rewarded by the GOP base and GOP elected officials for his ignorance in ways unseen in my lifetime. The GOP and right-wing media have gone out of their way to act like there is nothing abnormal about the way Trump conducts himself in the office, and any tiny instance of a peep of disapproval is usually quickly met with a retraction or revised statement. 

 

As much as the right-wing media would like to suggest, the reality is that there simply isn't any Dem candidate running that gets anywhere close to being "The left's Trump"  Some are progressive, some are more establishment, but none are anywhere close to the ballpark of Trump. 

 

[visionary]

 

[Springfield]

I don’t think that any of the Dem candidates are ACTUAL socialists.

[JCB]

It *is* frustrating that Warren's genuinely excellent policy proposals are being overlooked by and large, and Politico is running articles on Beto's poetry.

[Captain Wiggles]

Bernie going into the Lions den. Love it. 

[Captain Wiggles]

1 hour ago, BenningRoadSkin said:

Democrats have been running to the center for 30 years. It is absurd for anyone to say "run a decent moderate candidate." 

 

100% correct.

 

The Clintons were/are about as centrist as anyone in politics. The Third Way it was called. Conservatives still hate them with a passion. So much so they impeached one and ran a campaign centered around imprisoning the other.

[visionary]

Have any of the candidates put out much on foreign policy yet?  How they wooukd deal with Russia’s direct and indirect manipulation of other countries for instance?  Anything about Saudi’s Arabia?  Yemen?  Syria?  Venezuela?

 

 Obviously things could change between now and when they’re in office, but it would be nice to have a more general idea of how they would deal with some of these problems.  Of course foreign policy is often secondary to domestic issues when it comes to voting, but if they’re going to be president it would be nice to have a glimpse at how they would handle international issues and deal with the consequences here and abroad.

[NoCalMike]

2 minutes ago, clietas said:

 

100% correct.

 

The Clintons were/are about as centrist as anyone in politics. The Third Way it was called. Conservatives still hate them with a passion. So much so they impeached one and ran a campaign centered around imprisoning the other.

 

Exactly.  Every Democratic candidate I can remember in my life time has been called a socialist and/or communist.  This is nothing new, and it will happen regardless of how "centrist" the nominee is.    If FDR was running in 2020 he would be probably be accused of the same thing.  This is just boogeyman politics.   The fact of the matter is the economy is mixed.  It isn't purely capitalism and never has been and it wouldn't work very well that way either.  The problem is people tend to overlook the "socialism" aspects of the programs they like and depend on, but will spout off about how much they hate the idea of "socialism" if it is a program they disagree with.  It's gotten to be very ludicrous. 

16 minutes ago, JCB said:

It *is* frustrating that Warren's genuinely excellent policy proposals are being overlooked by and large, and Politico is running articles on Beto's poetry.

 

I remember thinking a year ago that Warren would be the "policy-hawk" of the group, and yet, no one would care.

[visionary]

I think Warren is at least partially hurt by Bernie’s entry since they share a lot of support.  I wonder what her support would be if Bernie had said he was done running or even endorsed her.  I have a feeling Bernie would also put her in his admin somewhere.  Maybe others would too.  

[visionary]

 

 

 

 

 

[Captain Wiggles]

FDR was called not just a socialist but a communist as well. Republicans have been using those labels since the 1930s on every Democrat. It's their go to move and will continue to be until Americans wake the **** up.

 

The Republican party as a whole has worked tirelessly against working class and poor since the 19th century. They have always been the party of the rich elite robber barons. 

 

https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2009/sep/22/barack-obama/obama-roosevelt-socialist-communist/

 

Quote

"Roosevelt is a socialist, not a Democrat," declared Republican Rep. Robert Rich of Pennsylvania during a debate on the House floor on July 23, 1935. That remark came after Republicans hinted they were considering a move to impeach Roosevelt, according to the New York Times .

 

[visionary]

Imagine if Beto, Bernie, or Harris had been helping get people fired up to vote for the Supreme Court candidate in Wisconsin.

[visionary]