RedBeast Posted April 23, 2016 Share Posted April 23, 2016 Breeland Island.... Norman Island.... We just got ourselves a backfield Archipelago.... The Carnivore Islands...eating up all who pass between them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evmiii Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 Has anyone seen or figured out the salary cap impact this year? How much do we need to free up? Who will be the casualties? We are continuing to get better. HTTR! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinsfan35yrs. Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 Initially I was totally against this move, and thought that Dan should "put down the remote" and let Scot run things. It seemed like a old time Snyder move. But believing Scot still is in control, and the trust he earned last year I have reconsidered and am now excited. Basically with the recent moves at CB and the emergence of Dunbar, Culliver is now going to be cut. Also Andre Roberts. So looking at it this way, I would rather have an elite corner than a decent one coming off injury and an overpaid WR. Looking forward to the 2016 season with great expectations. Maybe we dont have to cut them just yet, possibly we can get something in trade one or both of them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nemocystem Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 The Carnivore Islands...eating up all who pass between them What about... The Hot Gates! no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinny21 Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 Maybe we dont have to cut them just yet, possibly we can get something in trade one or both of them? I'd be amazed if we got something for Roberts given his salary. If Culliver shows he's healthy, then maybe. Of course, if he's healthy enough to trade, he'd probably be healthy enough to be an asset to us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinsfan35yrs. Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 ESPN with the hottest of hot takes: http://espn.go.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/202489/washington-overcommitted-for-josh-norman As several have said, Norman is our best CB since Champ. He and Breeland will make an excellent, physical pair. If we have anything resembling a pass rush, I'm going to like our defense. If I remember right Chump wasn't really that good for us. Lots of 3rd down plays went his direction resulting in 1st downs for opponents, stone hands and the fact he wanted out of DC. Most fans seem to have wanted to show him the door. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostofAlvinWalton Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 If I remember right Chump wasn't really that good for us. Lots of 3rd down plays went his direction resulting in 1st downs for opponents, stone hands and the fact he wanted out of DC. Most fans seem to have wanted to show him the door. You don't remember right... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goskins10 Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 Has anyone seen or figured out the salary cap impact this year? How much do we need to free up? Who will be the casualties? We are continuing to get better. HTTR! Based on overthecap.com it's $8M for this year, $20M for next. Also they can walk away with only $9M dead cap after 2017 if he is not living up to the contract. It's definitely a nice paycheck for him, but it's also fairly team friendly. Next year is the only one that he hits the cap hard at $20M. Details below. http://overthecap.com/player/josh-norman/1177/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickyJ Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 Breeland Island.... Norman Island.... We just got ourselves a backfield Archipelago.... At first I read that as Archuleta.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreek1973 Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 The more I look at the numbers the more Iove what the front office did with his contract. Forget about the fact that we got a top 5 CB, the biggest hit on his contract will be 2017...So We have/had between $50-$60 million in cap space going into next year because we know Jackson and Garcon’s contracts being expired among others. I am certain Roberts is gone this year, and probably Riley giving us over 7 million this year which almost covers Norman's hit on this years cap. But in 2017 the hit from Norman's contract is $20 million so suddenly you’re at $30 million under the cap and you still must sign probably Cousins, Reed, Baker. But away contracts (net savings) that are still on the books Culliver ($6.75M), Hall ($4.25M), Lauvao ($4M), Lichtensteiger ($3.5M) and we are now now back to $52.5M under the cap. So I don't see an issue with signing Cousins (you can bet his hit will be bellow what it is right now by several million, Reed and Backer. The issue will be to find one or two starting WRs (Garcon & Jackson), an edge rusher (Galette), an ILB (Will Compton), and a free safety (Hall). You have replaced Culliver with Breeland, hopefully by this time guys like Dumbar have become solid, Lauvao with Kuandjio, Roberts with a draft pick or Grant or Ross anyone, and Licht with somebody else (Long, Reiter, draft pick, etc). So in net we should be comfortable in our CAP unless Scott totally misses in this year's and next year's draft. If he hits a few of our needs like he did last year not only we are good, but we could be seriously contending in 2017, especially if Cousins keeps improving and the D plays to its potential. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Probos Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 Total BS article and analysis, since its obvious the writer didn't even mention the fact that QBs going against Norman had the lowest QBR rating of any CB. The entire article is bias against him. And to ad something else here yes the front 7 of Carolina are good but if we find one stud DL in the draft, ours might just be as good. Kerrigan, Galette and Smith should all be 100% healthy going into camp (Kerrigan was never 100% last year to begin with). Smith will be in his second season, and if he just improves a little then we are talking 3 great pass rushers. I don't know too many teams that have that. How many times did Kerrigan come close to getting sacks last year. if Norman and Breeland can hold up on average for half second more the QBs then we are talking trouble for every QB that plays us. Also the writer refused to even mention we play the exact D and again forgot to mention that we have the potential to be as good as the Panthers in our front 7. Total fail there IMO. BTW everyone is saying why the Panthers didn't sign Norman for the big money. In a way they did, by tagging him, if they thought he wasn't all that they would made him an low-ball offer and let him walk. The pulled the tag when they realized he wanted to be paid the most in the NFL, or the issue he had with Cam last year maybe just maybe didn't get resolved and they decided its better to walk away and let their cry baby QB have his way. The article is not "total BS". It makes a lot of good and correct points about Norman's play and the Panthers defense. He's not a "shut down CB". He's a very good CB excels in a zone scheme, and had a lot of success last year on a top rated defense that went to the Super Bowl. The Panthers didn't want to pay "man-to-man, shut down CB-type money" to him because they think their scheme and overall team strength is good enough to get them back to where every team wants to be. His age is a concern as well. Seems like it was a decision the Panthers made based on their current situation as a team. Skins are in a different situation -- they're up and coming, still building, but considering the state of the division (I'm guessing) think they have a good chance of winning it again. Norman's the type of CB that fits the Skins D scheme and he fills a need that won't have to necessarily be addressed in the draft. This makes it easier for the Skins to target specific players in the draft and more likely that they'll try to trade down to get an additional(s) pick. Which is good -- I'm sure Norman will be more than solid in the defense this coming season. I think they over paid for him. I bought into the slow/measured approach Scot was taking,..so this signing seems to not fit with the way I thought he was building the team. I just don't see the Skins getting the value out of this signing relative to their current state of the team -- but, what do I know. I'm nothing more than a fan,...just like you. I hope I'm wrong,.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
posse87 Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 The criticisms I have heard in the media have pretty much been bogus. This is essentially a two year prove it deal and the skins can get out with relatively little cap penalty if he isn't proving it. The player has the work ethic, instincts, and attitude of a winner and was a legitimate top 5 CB last year and a difference maker. Some say he had only 4 int's, but he had 19 passes defended! That's an incredible number. Some have said he had the 15th lowest rating of all CB against WR's, but he was number one in total QBR. I saw some statistic that said according to QBR, that on average, QB's would be better throwing the ball into the dirt than throwing at Norman. His age isn't much of an issue for two main reasons: 1) he has only played 4 years in the NFL with a relatively low pitch count and 2) He ran a 4.66 40 at the combine, so he has never been a burner and that bodes well as he ages, burners are the ones that tend to fall off a cliff. If he is a transcendent DB he could have many years ahead of him including a possible move to safety in the latter stages of his career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Probos Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 The criticisms I have heard in the media have pretty much been bogus. This is essentially a two year prove it deal and the skins can get out with relatively little cap penalty if he isn't proving it. The player has the work ethic, instincts, and attitude of a winner and was a legitimate top 5 CB last year and a difference maker. Some say he had only 4 int's, but he had 19 passes defended! That's an incredible number. Some have said he had the 15th lowest rating of all CB against WR's, but he was number one in total QBR. I saw some statistic that said according to QBR, that on average, QB's would be better throwing the ball into the dirt than throwing at Norman. His age isn't much of an issue for two main reasons: 1) he has only played 4 years in the NFL with a relatively low pitch count and 2) He ran a 4.66 40 at the combine, so he has never been a burner and that bodes well as he ages, burners are the ones that tend to fall off a cliff. If he is a transcendent DB he could have many years ahead of him including a possible move to safety in the latter stages of his career. I don't know the exact details of the deal -- is that info available anywhere? How is it a "two year prove it deal"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goskins10 Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 The article is not "total BS". It makes a lot of good and correct points about Norman's play and the Panthers defense. He's not a "shut down CB". He's a very good CB excels in a zone scheme, and had a lot of success last year on a top rated defense that went to the Super Bowl. The Panthers didn't want to pay "man-to-man, shut down CB-type money" to him because they think their scheme and overall team strength is good enough to get them back to where every team wants to be. His age is a concern as well. Seems like it was a decision the Panthers made based on their current situation as a team. Skins are in a different situation -- they're up and coming, still building, but considering the state of the division (I'm guessing) think they have a good chance of winning it again. Norman's the type of CB that fits the Skins D scheme and he fills a need that won't have to necessarily be addressed in the draft. This makes it easier for the Skins to target specific players in the draft and more likely that they'll try to trade down to get an additional(s) pick. Which is good -- I'm sure Norman will be more than solid in the defense this coming season. I think they WAY over paid for him. I bought into the slow/measured approach Scot was taking,..so this signing seems to not fit with the way I thought he was building the team. I just don't see the Skins getting the value out of this signing relative to their current state of the team -- but, what do I know. I'm nothing more than a fan,...just like you. I hope I'm wrong,.... Some of what you say I get. But there are a few things either misleading or a bit exaggerated. First. his age. He is only 28, not exactly like he is ancient, even in football terms. Also, he does not have a lot of wear and tear since he has only been in the league for 4 years. As for over paying him, a closer look at the contract shows it's a bit more team friendly than being reported. First only $36.5M is fully guaranteed and will be fully paid at the of 2017. The other $13.5M is only guaranteed if he is still on the roster the start of the 2018 league season. So we can walk away in two years with only a $9M dead cap hit. Not bad for the upside this guy brings. Also, it cannot be stated enough that we play the same schemes that Carolina. Also, he will not be expected to be the only guy on D. Breeland is a pretty damn good CB himself. This gives us bookends. Another thing not talked about much is the reason Culliver may stick around is he played Safety in college. He could come back and play that tweener FS/Slot CB position really well! One of the current guys (hoping Duke comes around) can surely man the SS position and we will have the potential for a deadly defensive backfield. I get the concerns and they may end up being true. But at least at this point it appears to be a well thought out prudent football move. The best part is unlike some of those other contracts that haunted us for years after the player was gone (I think we are still paying Deion Sanders), this one allows to separate with little lasting impact after 2 years. That to me is the biggest difference. I don't know the exact details of the deal -- is that info available anywhere? How is it a "two year prove it deal"? Here are the details. Notice the dead cap after 2017 is only $9M. I get that's a relative ONLY, but in football terms it's not much considering the up side to the deal. That's what makes it a 2 year prove it deal. http://overthecap.com/player/josh-norman/1177/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theTruthTeller Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 I'm not totally against the deal because he is certainly a great corner and you can expect to pay through the nose for a great corner in FA, but I'm having a hard time accepting this as a "team friendly" or "prove it" deal. He's guaranteed $37M by the end of 2017 (when you include roster bonuses), which means a two-year payout of $18.5M/year. That's more money than any other corner has received over two years in the history of the NFL. It's friendly only in terms of ending the relationship after two years; but there is really only one reason he would be cut after two years and that is poor play. His third year payout drops down to $13.5M, so if he's playing good-but-not-elite, he probably wouldn't be cut. If he plays poorly his first two years, this contract is an unmitigated failure - I don't think anyone will be saying "good thing we only paid $37M for him". His contract guarantees the 2018 salary against injury and the Skins would need to cut him in March 2018 to avoid $13.5 M salary from becoming fully guaranteed. I don't see this happening unless he just really sucks. So it's realistically a three year, $51M contract. For this to be a good contract, Norman has to play at an elite level and not get injured. He doesn't have to be the best ever, but he does need to be in the handful of corners that are considered the best in the league. He's proven he can do that at Carolina, now he needs to do it in the B&G. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adamyesme1111 Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 I have been a huge fan of avoiding big free agent splashes in recent years and building through the draft. This signing makes a lot of sense in helping us build through the draft though as we can signed him to a long contract and he should be able to play at a very high level throughout that entire contract. Now the position cornerback goes from being a question-mark and a need to a strength for the team. This helps us focus on other things in the draft as well. I like this. I was hearing praise about Culliver and we all know what Breeland can do. If we can steal a good safety somewhere in the draft (from what I understand there probably won't be any available in the 1st or 2nd round worthy of our pick, but I might be wrong; you never know what is going to happen in the draft). I LOVE this signing for these reasons, and when watching Josh Norman play last year I was in awe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
posse87 Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 I don't know the exact details of the deal -- is that info available anywhere? How is it a "two year prove it deal"? Yes widely available on the internet. His contract is guaranteed for even poor performance in the first two years. 3rd year is only guaranteed against injury, similar to Griffin last year. Then the 4th and 5th year are only guaranteed if he makes the roster. And basically the performance guaranteed portion of the contract averages out to $14 million per year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grego Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 All the "DAE SNYDER!!!" bull**** is beyond tired at this point. Seriously. It's been 7 years since this team followed that approach to free agency. It's impossible for some folks to accept that Dan has been doing little more than signing checks for awhile. But he and the team are easy targets (despite some recent success). Paper thin analysis is about what the public has time for. Facts are for losers, apparently. Click bait gonna click bait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoVaSkins21 Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 Just feeling a lot better about facing Antonio Brown, Byant, Beckham Jr. the 1st 3 weeks of the season. Week 3 better not turn into WWE though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Est.1974 Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 Just feeling a lot better about facing Antonio Brown, Byant, Beckham Jr. the 1st 3 weeks of the season. Week 3 better not turn into WWE though. The new 2 personal foul ejection rule might just prevent that.....maybe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zazzaro703 Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 When we play the Giants, we should have Bryce Harper walk around pre game warmups with his baseball bat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuhBuhBiggie Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 And ever since, I've had to listen to Cowgirl and Midget fans hate, hate hateeeeee! One Dallas fan went on and on, about how Norman is no better than Carr. Just wanna see him play already! We haven't had a shut down corner since Bailey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobandweave Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 Total BS article and analysis, since its obvious the writer didn't even mention the fact that QBs going against Norman had the lowest QBR rating of any CB. The entire article is bias against him. And to ad something else here yes the front 7 of Carolina are good but if we find one stud DL in the draft, ours might just be as good. Kerrigan, Galette and Smith should all be 100% healthy going into camp (Kerrigan was never 100% last year to begin with). Smith will be in his second season, and if he just improves a little then we are talking 3 great pass rushers. I don't know too many teams that have that. How many times did Kerrigan come close to getting sacks last year. if Norman and Breeland can hold up on average for half second more the QBs then we are talking trouble for every QB that plays us. Also the writer refused to even mention we play the exact D and again forgot to mention that we have the potential to be as good as the Panthers in our front 7. Total fail there IMO. Completely agree with you and I honestly have no idea why that trash article is being reposted here over and over again. I enjoy football outsiders but man they get it wrong a lot and that was a biased article. Writer seems to have an issue with us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Probos Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 Some of what you say I get. But there are a few things either misleading or a bit exaggerated. First. his age. He is only 28, not exactly like he is ancient, even in football terms. Also, he does not have a lot of wear and tear since he has only been in the league for 4 years. As for over paying him, a closer look at the contract shows it's a bit more team friendly than being reported. First only $36.5M is fully guaranteed and will be fully paid at the of 2017. The other $13.5M is only guaranteed if he is still on the roster the start of the 2018 league season. So we can walk away in two years with only a $9M dead cap hit. Not bad for the upside this guy brings. Also, it cannot be stated enough that we play the same schemes that Carolina. Also, he will not be expected to be the only guy on D. Breeland is a pretty damn good CB himself. This gives us bookends. Another thing not talked about much is the reason Culliver may stick around is he played Safety in college. He could come back and play that tweener FS/Slot CB position really well! One of the current guys (hoping Duke comes around) can surely man the SS position and we will have the potential for a deadly defensive backfield. I get the concerns and they may end up being true. But at least at this point it appears to be a well thought out prudent football move. The best part is unlike some of those other contracts that haunted us for years after the player was gone (I think we are still paying Deion Sanders), this one allows to separate with little lasting impact after 2 years. That to me is the biggest difference. Here are the details. Notice the dead cap after 2017 is only $9M. I get that's a relative ONLY, but in football terms it's not much considering the up side to the deal. That's what makes it a 2 year prove it deal. http://overthecap.com/player/josh-norman/1177/ Thanks for the info on the deal. Knowing that makes it seem a better signing then I originally thought. Hoping he continues his high level play this coming season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobandweave Posted April 24, 2016 Share Posted April 24, 2016 Has anyone seen or figured out the salary cap impact this year? How much do we need to free up? Who will be the casualties? We are continuing to get better. HTTR! Nothing this year he will count 8 million against the cap this season and after paying that we sit at just under 4 million on the book. Guys will be cut to free up money next year and my guess is it will be Roberts and Perry Reily who will save us between 9 and 10 million once they are healed until to pass a physical I'd be amazed if we got something for Roberts given his salary. If Culliver shows he's healthy, then maybe. Of course, if he's healthy enough to trade, he'd probably be healthy enough to be an asset to us. The Browns have no recievers like there top guy is Brian Hartline. Give them Roberts for a 7th and clears up space for us and we get a pick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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