Gibbit Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 mexico just needs to put up some of these, 500 miles before America. Everybody wins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
China Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 On 10/28/2018 at 10:51 AM, Sacks 'n' Stuff said: Why are we even pretending like there is any possibility whatsoever of this wall being built. It ain't gonna happen. Was never going to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 (edited) Edited October 30, 2018 by visionary 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 "All persons born in the United States .... are citizens of the United States ...." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCalMike Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 Yeah actually, I think you do, Trump. "Ran the idea by my counsel" I would love to see who his counsel is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cooked Crack Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 I'm going to ignore this for the time being. It's like the tax cut he's going on about. It's just a headline to get his base excited. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 29 minutes ago, Cooked Crack said: I'm going to ignore this for the time being. It's like the tax cut he's going on about. It's just a headline to get his base excited. I concur He can issue a EO, but it would probably end up like Obama's DAPA one. of course the courts do some strange reasoning at times,so who knows Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Why am I Mr. Pink? Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 The 14th Amendment states: "All persons born or naturalized in the United States and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside." Michael Anton, a former national security adviser for Trump, pointed out in July that "there’s a clause in the middle of the amendment that people ignore or they misinterpret – subject to the jurisdiction thereof.” "What they are saying is, if you are born on U.S. soil subject to the jurisdiction of the United States – meaning you’re the child of citizens or the child of legal immigrants, then you are entitled to citizenship,” Anton told Fox News’ Tucker Carlson in July. “If you are here illegally, if you owe allegiance to a foreign nation, if you’re the citizen of a foreign country, that clause does not apply to you.” https://www.foxnews.com/politics/trump-says-he-plans-to-sign-executive-order-ending-birthright-citizenship Its an argument and I could see how a strict constructionist could say this isnt taking a living breathing document interpretation approach bc the words "and subject to the jurisdiction thereof" are plainly written. Its not like you are trying to interpret whether the unalienable right to "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness" = right to same sex marriage. BUT .. if Stephen Miller and the band want to play this game .... then Id love to take another look at the 2nd A (and I think ppl should have guns but with registration, insurance etc). "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed." ^^ Thats plainly written that citizens only have the right to bear guns for the limited purpose of being "a well regulated militia, being necessary for the security of the free State", ... lets interpret "militia", lets interpret "regulated", etc .... --------------------- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 I would have a problem with claiming they are not subject to our jurisdiction since Texas took the US to court for the right to execute a illegal immigrant. Of course Mexico and the US govt argued they were not....and lost. The US govt certainly claims jurisdiction even in sanctuary cities ect, but then ..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bozo the kKklown Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 45 minutes ago, Cooked Crack said: I'm going to ignore this for the time being. It's like the tax cut he's going on about. It's just a headline to get his base excited. It wont move hte needle policy wise, but an American president saying this should not be ignored. Great thread on this: I keep having to say this, the media is complicit. They don't inform anymore. Every day they should be asking Sanders about Trump being a white supremacist. They should also as Republicans if they agree with Trump, and then talk about them being "strict constitutionalists," especially with regards to the second amendment. This needs to be hammered home and our media is continuously failing us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 32 minutes ago, twa said: I would have a problem with claiming they are not subject to our jurisdiction since Texas took the US to court for the right to execute a illegal immigrant. Of course Mexico and the US govt argued they were not....and lost. No they didn't. They argued that US treaties applied to Texas. (And Texas argued that they don't. Because Texas didn't sign the treaty.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 5 minutes ago, Larry said: No they didn't. They argued that US treaties applied to Texas. (And Texas argued that they don't. Because Texas didn't sign the treaty.) so which controlled?.....the international treaty the US president signed or state law under powers granted by the Constitution? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bozo the kKklown Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 The. Media. Is. Failing. Us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 19 minutes ago, twa said: so which controlled?.....the international treaty the US president signed or state law under powers granted by the Constitution? The judge ruled that the State of Texas had the authority (not contained anywhere in the constitution) to ignore the supremacy clause (Which is in the constitution) and US treaties (Which also are in the constitution). But to end your latest hijack, I'm really looking forward to Donald Trump issuing an executive order announcing that illegal immigrants, and their US-born children, are exempt from US laws. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 Also thinking more about this administration's utter dishonesty. Since we are now attempting to argue that citizenship requires one's parents parents to be subject to US law, does that mean Trump's children are no longer citizens? I mean, since US Presidents are exempt from US law, and all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 The Supremacy clause did not apply to a executive action counter to constitutional powers .....kinda like DAPA unless the court rules differently. I guess I get no credit for arguing against Trump Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCalMike Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 I get the feeling that this issue was one of the end goals from the get-go of all this immigration scare mongering. The idea of over-turning citizenship for being a birth right has been brought up before by other hard-line conservative but it never gained traction. Fast forward to the current administration and they have been pretty much non-stop whipping people into a frenzy on this issue ever since their campaign began. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cooked Crack Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 3 minutes ago, NoCalMike said: I get the feeling that this issue was one of the end goals from the get-go of all this immigration scare mongering. The idea of over-turning citizenship for being a birth right has been brought up before by other hard-line conservative but it never gained traction. Fast forward to the current administration and they have been pretty much non-stop whipping people into a frenzy on this issue ever since their campaign began. https://www.businessinsider.com/donald-trump-birthright-citizenship-14th-amendment-debate-2015-8 Watch more R's run on this come 2024. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hooper Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 (edited) Not surprised by this. His poll numbers are down. Stock market run coming to an end. Tax cut seen as giveaway to the rich, even by his base. Comes off as more of a buffoon in every interview. Might as well revert to racism/fear mongering during your nine hours of “executive time.” Edited October 30, 2018 by Hooper 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 (edited) Actually, I'm more inclined to think (hope?) that it's more a case oh "hey, let's swindle our base by hinting that we might do something that's even more stupid, immoral, and unconstitutional than anything we've done to date, but our mouth breathers will absolutely love, if we actually did it." Edited October 30, 2018 by Larry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 Remember when Harry Reid introduced a bill to exclude the children of illegal immigrants from citizenship in 93? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 2 hours ago, BenningRoadSkin said: The. Media. Is. Failing. Us. Pretty sure that map ignores in most of South America(including Mexico) citizenship and nationality are different, and citizenship is not simply by birth there.....just nationality. since detail seems to matter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 41 minutes ago, twa said: Remember when Harry Reid introduced a bill to exclude the children of illegal immigrants from citizenship in 93? i'v already seen this thrown up elsewhere.... soon i may make a new rule here re: "what about" and both sides and just give temp bans when it's a fail (at my call), especially if it come from a side or member on a topic where it's excessively hypocritical to yell hypocrite were it from another poster, i'd say it either suggests a deliberately disingenuous approach or living in an ignorant echo chamber where you googled your way to some right wing spin on this because they're being put out there now...at best it's folks in their partisan rut, comfy with intellectual laziness because it shouldn't take more than half a brain to figure the truth out just on the face of it reid didn't want that --it was part of a compromise with the gopers---if you weren't paying attention while it was happening, then go read up...and not on some political website 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 19 minutes ago, twa said: Pretty sure that map ignores in most of South America(including Mexico) I recommend discarding any maps you may own in which Mexico is shown as part of South America 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 Just now, Destino said: I recommend discarding any maps you may own in which Mexico is shown as part of South America Fake Maps! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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