btfoom Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 Interesting thought watching the Seahawks game and the nasty injury/hit at the end of the half. If that was in a public school would the prayers be allowed? IMHO, a spontaneous decision to sit together and say a prayer (or hold hands, kneel down, etc) is very different than a coach who as led prayers on a continuous timeline AND told by the governing body not do do so again. As Destino said, I wish that folks would concentrate on things that bring people together, not tear them apart. In the end, though, I believe that people need to follow the rules and if not, they suffer the consequences (though I agree with another poster that singing Seger goes WAAAYYYYY over the line). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dont Taze Me Bro Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 Stuff like this just gets on my nerves. You wanna pray during any event, pray. Whether it be to God, Satan, etc. If one is doing it as an individual or group (ones that choose to participate) who cares? People need to mind their own ****ing business and let others do what it is they do. Don't believe in God? Ok, then how is it offensive to you if someone chooses to pray to God, anywhere? Grow a set and let them do their thing. Different religion? Great, don't get your ****ing panties in a wad when someone of [insert religion here - that is different than yours] prays to their God. Let them do their thing. There are so many other problems in this country/world that need attention, yet society feels the need to worry about what a few people think about a high school football coach praying before or after a football game. So much wasted energy/time/effort spent on something so harmless. If they aren't asking you to pray or trying to shove religion down your throat then what does it really ****ing matter? Like mentioned above, acceptance. Across the board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterMP Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 I shouldn't have to point this out, you should know this, but Jesus was condemning those who prayed in public for attention, basically they were trying to be attention whores through their prayers. That is not what is happening here. The man literally prays for the safety of the players and their families when they go home. Have you never heard of a practice called prayer-walking? And he can't do that silently to himself (even on the field) or in his office/locker room/car by himself before/after the game out of sight of the public? He has to do it vocally on the field directly before and after the game? Even if AFTER it became an issue? It still isn't for show? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dont Taze Me Bro Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 And he can't do that silently to himself (even on the field) or in his office/locker room/car by himself before/after the game out of sight of the public? He has to do it vocally on the field directly before and after the game? How does it harm you if he does it to himself or bows his head? It doesn't. People don't like it, get over it, move on about their own business. When he comes up to you asking you if you have found God, Jesus, and starts preaching to you, then have a problem. Otherwise, it's just a bunch of people trying to start **** for the sake of starting ****. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redskins Diehard Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 He has to do it vocally on the field directly before and after the game?Is that why he got fired? I don't think that is what the link reported Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hersh Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 How does it harm you if he does it to himself or bows his head? It doesn't. People don't like it, get over it, move on about their own business. When he comes up to you asking you if you have found God, Jesus, and starts preaching to you, then have a problem. Otherwise, it's just a bunch of people trying to start **** for the sake of starting ****. What purpose does it serve for him to do it in the middle of the field or anywhere on the field vs in his office? Doesn't seem very meaningful if the sole reason is to do it on the field. BTW, not sure if many read the article, but good for the class president. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterMP Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 How does it harm you if he does it to himself or bows his head? It doesn't. People don't like it, get over it, move on about their own business. When he comes up to you asking you if you have found God, Jesus, and starts preaching to you, then have a problem. Otherwise, it's just a bunch of people trying to start **** for the sake of starting ****. Realistically, I think it hurts Christians in terms of what is a Christian and the public's perception of what it means to be Christian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redskins Diehard Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 IMHO, a spontaneous decision to sit together and say a prayer (or hold hands, kneel down, etc) is very different than a coach who as led prayers on a continuous timeline AND told by the governing body not do do so again. . Right. So the governing body told him not to do it again. And a kid tears an acl and he does it again. He doesn't make it mandatory for anyone else. He simply takes a knee...does the sign of the cross...silent for a minute. ..does the sign of the cross again. Is that okay? Assume it was brought to the attention of the governing body. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterMP Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 Is that why he got fired? I don't think that is what the link reported "Kennedy has vocally prayed before and after games, sometimes joined by students, since 2008. But the practice recently came to the district's attention, and it asked him to stop. He initially agreed, but then, with support from the Texas-based Liberty Institute, a religious-freedom organization, he resumed the postgame prayers, silently taking a knee for 15 to 20 seconds at midfield after shaking hands with the opposing coaches. His lawyers insist he is not leading students in prayer, just praying himself." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redskins Diehard Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 "Kennedy has vocally prayed before and after games, sometimes joined by students, since 2008. But the practice recently came to the district's attention, and it asked him to stop. He initially agreed, but then, with support from the Texas-based Liberty Institute, a religious-freedom organization, he resumed the postgame prayers, silently taking a knee for 15 to 20 seconds at midfield after shaking hands with the opposing coaches. His lawyers insist he is not leading students in prayer, just praying himself." I think when you reread the second paragraph it is different than what you payed previously. It appears he stopped doing it vocally before and after the game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterMP Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 I think when you reread the second paragraph it is different than what you payed previously. It appears he stopped doing it vocally before and after the game I guess he didn't do it vocally that one time, but he's done it repeatedly vocally. And while it wasn't vocal, it was done in a manner that was apparently clear to people what he was doing. But the basic point remains. He can't do it in a manner that isn't obvious to the public. From my original post: “And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. 6But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you." Which part is taking a knee in the middle of a field after a football game consistent with when you already know there is attention on you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redskins Diehard Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 I guess he didn't do it vocally that one time, but he's done it repeatedly vocally. And while it wasn't vocal, it was done in a manner that was apparently clear to people what he was doing. But the basic point remains. He can't do it in a manner that isn't obvious to the public. From my original post: “And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. 6But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you." Which part is taking a knee in the middle of a field after a football game consistent with? It's ridiculous to use the bible as justification to outlaw prayer. The bible should have no bearing on what is permitted in a school or not. You are welcome to judge what this person does. . I'm sure if you look hard you could find a passage or 2 about that as well. The fact is you claimed he was vocally praying before and after games and you were wrong. He modified his behavior...just not enough apparently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hersh Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 I think when you reread the second paragraph it is different than what you payed previously. It appears he stopped doing it vocally before and after the game It appears he agreed but started again by a group that is interested in making this a public issue. No, he isn't doing it for show now...(hint: that is sarcasm) It's ridiculous to use the bible as justification to outlaw prayer. The bible should have no bearing on what is permitted in a school or not. You are welcome to judge what this person does. . I'm sure if you look hard you could find a passage or 2 about that as well. The fact is you claimed he was vocally praying before and after games and you were wrong. He modified his behavior...just not enough apparently. He could have modified by praying privately in his office or after the game at home. Why does he have to do it on the field? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterMP Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 It's ridiculous to use the bible as justification to outlaw prayer. The bible should have no bearing on what is permitted in a school or not. You are welcome to judge what this person does. . I'm sure if you look hard you could find a passage or 2 about that as well. The fact is you claimed he was vocally praying before and after games and you were wrong. He modified his behavior...just not enough apparently. I never said anything about the law. I'm talking as a Christian. This behavior isn't consistent with Christianity. This is exactly what Jesus told people NOT to do. I'll further point out that I'm not judging this guy. I'm not saying is going to heaven or hell. I don't know if he's a good guy or a bad guy. I'm a sinner too. It is certainly possible this guy is a better than me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dont Taze Me Bro Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 What purpose does it serve for him to do it in the middle of the field or anywhere on the field vs in his office? Doesn't seem very meaningful if the sole reason is to do it on the field. BTW, not sure if many read the article, but good for the class president. Point is.......who cares where he does it? Or how he does it? It's not interfering with the game, at all. How is some guy, kneeling down on a football field, after a game, praying, harm or offend anyone? He's not hurting anyone, he's not preaching to anyone, he's not asking anyone to participate. It's harmless. Period. Nobody that believes in God, believes in another deity, doesn't believe, etc. should really give a ****. Realistically, I think it hurts Christians in terms of what is a Christian and the public's perception of what it means to be Christian. That's silly man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redskins Diehard Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 He could have modified by praying privately in his office or after the game at home. Why does he have to do it on the field?You're right. He could have. Would you have a problem with the same behavior in response to a non trivial injury? A kneel and sign of cross?Overt religious displays are prohibited...could a jew wear a yarmulke? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hersh Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 You're right. He could have. Would you have a problem with the same behavior in response to a non trivial injury? A kneel and sign of cross? Overt religious displays are prohibited...could a jew wear a yarmulke? I seriously doubt anyone would care in response to a nontrivial injury but that is not what this ever was about. You are taking it to an absurd level that doesn't actually prove any kind of point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaceman Spiff Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 We've got to get better at accepting eachother. If someone wants to pray, let them and be glad for them. If someone doesn't want to pray, or prays differently, then let them and be glad for them as well. We are different and that's not going to change any time soon. Tolerance is not achieved by asking that people hide themselves and the things that make them different from ourselves. We're living in some strange times. Seems like there are so many people out there preaching tolerance and respect yet there are so many others who just aren't. I hate stories like this. Honestly, it makes me not want to get married, start a family, etc. It makes me want to live in a pretty remote area and just not deal with anyones ****. Being a member of society just seems to being an increasingly larger pain in the ass as time goes on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redskins Diehard Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 I seriously doubt anyone would care in response to a nontrivial injury but that is not what this ever was about. You are taking it to an absurd level that doesn't actually prove any kind of point. I thought it was about separation of church and state? And state endorsement of religion? Someone complimented the student president earlier right? Wasn't the quote that we needed things defined in black and white? Or is overt display of religion okay sometimes and just not others? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d0ublestr0ker0ll Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 So they have a prayer after the game, but is it players and coaches only? I mean, this atheist group, who calls themselves "Satanists", want to just walk on the field, having nothing to do with football, and do their thing? You aren't football players though... If a football player wants to fake-throw lightning bolts in honor of Zeus after the game, then go the **** ahead. If you're a spectator, make your statement in the parking lot. Do they let spectators on the fields after games? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 It appears he agreed but started again by a group that is interested in making this a public issue. No, he isn't doing it for show now...(hint: that is sarcasm) He could have modified by praying privately in his office or after the game at home. Why does he have to do it on the field? Off the top of my head, because it's not something to be ashamed of, it's not something that should need to be hidden, and now... because people are trying to make it those things. That's just me though, if you want to know why he does it you'd have to ask him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dont Taze Me Bro Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 I just say let people pray to, worship, etc. who/whatever they want to, where ever they want and mind your own business if it's not intrusive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PokerPacker Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 A coach prays on the field during a stoppage for an injury. Significant enough that prompts people who would turn to prayer to do so. Maybe it's a player knocked out. Maybe motionless. Maybe dead. Maybe joey t leg situation. Is that a violation of the rule? Pretend that someone in the crowd has access to a video recording device and is able to disseminate beyond their immediate friends.what the heck does "significant enough to cause people to pray" mean? If he gathers them around to pray, that may be a problem. If he gets down on a knee and says a prayer on his own, I really doubt anyone will care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redskins Diehard Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 what the heck does "significant enough to cause people to pray" mean? If he gathers them around to pray, that may be a problem. If he gets down on a knee and says a prayer on his own, I really doubt anyone will care. It means use your head and envision a hypothetical. He was removed from the team for getting down on a knee and saying a prayer on his own. People cared out there. People cared in this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsburySkinsFan Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 Is it a presentation? How do you know, did you ask? You have no idea. Perhaps. just perhaps, the man cares deeply for both people, and for God. Is that so hard to understand? Its not for me. I understand that prayer is not for presentation, nor to be a mini sermon etc. It is to draw us closer to God as you say, but it is also for others around us to build them up and draw them closer to the Lord as well. Else, you would never have had any of Jesus' prayers recorded in the gospels or Nehemiah's prayer, Solomon's prayer, etc. Biblically, prayer is something that is both private and public. I prayer walk areas ahead of time that I am putting particular focus on. I pray out loud and quietly. I can guarantee you its not for proclamation or presentation. So you see no difference between your prayer walk areas and walking out to the center of the 50 yard line before and after a football game to kneel down and be seen praying? Look, I get that you want to serve as an apologist for every Christian who you feel is persecuted in our society, but get serious and look objectively. Oh and the public prayers in scripture were before those who were willingly there for that purpose so please spare me the false equivalency. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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