so what's the reason the skins cannot be like the seahawks, patriots, or ravens?

[HogHeaven1983]

Why are the redskins a perennial loser?  And those other teams fantastic? 

 

Is the cancer being spread by their loser owner Dan Snyder?  Is it bad karma from having a racist team name?  Is it our loser scouting department?  

 

Let's hear your thoughts

 

Once thing is certain

 

Five, Ten, Twenty years from now, those winning teams will still be winning ... and the skins will still be steeped in drama, dysfunction, and a loser mentality.

[Momma There Goes That Man]

The Ravens have been around for what 18 years and have had good management throughout. They are extremely young. It won't last. 

 

The Seahawks...people thought they were an arena league team prior to 2005 and even after that they weren't world beaters until a couple seasons ago. They have a great FO and staff/team now but it remains to be seen how long it lasts. 

 

The Patriots were nothing, less than nothing even for their entire existence outside of a few years until Kraft, BB, and Brady all hooked up. 

 

You could have said this same thing about Dallas after 96 or SF after 95, Pittsburgh after 82ish or even us after 91 etc. 

 

It's all cyclical. Teams will go up and come back down its the way it works. 

[Epochalypse]

There's no reason we can't get there, but it will take more than a few years for an abysmal team to get there saddled with the cap penalty and missing first round draft choices from getting its franchise QB.

 

And let's see what the Pats and Seahawks look like in a few years.  Brady can't go forever.  The Seahawks are just recently good and find themselves in a good position with Wilson's contract.  There's no guarantee that Carroll can maintain his current success if he can't get them there soon.

 

And I know this might not be a popular thing to say but I'd argue that we as fans aren't doing our part.  If we could make Fed Ex Field as big a home field advantage as say Seattle or New Orleans, we wouldn't find ourselves with these 3-13 seasons.  They are aided by the fact that they hardly ever lose at home.  Our stadium many times has more visiting fans.

[StephenDavis]

Not sure, but it's very frustrating.  Nothing feels better than when your team wins.  And I've never seen this team win more than 10 games in a season, never have I seen them make it past the divisional round of the playoffs, nor have I seen them make the playoffs 2 years in a row.  And I'm 27.  It sucks.  I've seen my favorite baseball team win the world series 18 years ago, and my favorite college basketball team win 2 national championships.  I hope one day before I die the Redskins will win a Super Bowl.  Shoot at this point I'd like to see 11 wins in a season.  I know sports teams winning and losing is cyclical, but damn 20 years of **** is getting old.

[BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93]

Outside of the Gibbs years and a few years in Baugh era, haven't we just been losers or mediocre?

[StephenDavis]

And I know this might not be a popular thing to say but I'd argue that we as fans aren't doing our part.  If we could make Fed Ex Field as big a home field advantage as say Seattle or New Orleans, we wouldn't find ourselves with these 3-13 seasons.  They are aided by the fact that they hardly ever lose at home.  Our stadium many times has more visiting fans.

That is hard to do when you have a team that is expected to suck.  As Redskin fans we have been programmed to expect terrible things and we usually get it.  When something good happens like making the playoffs, I'm so surprised you'd think I had one the lottery.  The team is going to have to start winning for that to happen.  And winning consistently.

[BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93]

I'm legit going through a huge crisis as a fan. I'm so sick of the joke that this team has become. I hate being embarrassed to be a fan.

[Rufus T Firefly]

[General NSJ]

I'd say its due to those teams having some type of structure starting with the front office.  They create a plan to be sucessful, put people in positions to be their best and try not to stray from the plan. 

 

Not us tho.  Seems like we're just going to keep throwing crap at the wall and hopefully something will stick.

[Boss_Hogg]

The Seahawks were trash up until 2012. The Patriots were horrid for decades and the same goes for the Steelers and Packers in the 80s.

The Skins will get there eventually. I think what makes it feel worse is the 24 hour media (NFL Network, Twitter, blogs, etc)

Loser teams in the 80s didn't have to deal with so much negative attention.

[kleese]

Outside of the Gibbs years and a few years in Baugh era, haven't we just been losers or mediocre?

Team struggled mightily in the post Baugh/pre Lombardi era, which spanned about 25 years. 50's and 60's were bad decades. The Lombardi came in 1969 and changed the culture in one year. Unfortuatey, he wasn't able to see it through, but in comes George Allen and he is very successful.

From 1969-1991 the franchise was very good, very competitive, and very relevant, culminating in 5 SB appearances and three titles. "Bad years" during that period was hovering around .500 and narrowly missing the playoffs.

So the early years of the ornganization were great, followed by a long trek into darkness, followed by a long stretch of greatness, followed by another stretch of highly disappointing results.

It seems cyclical, yes.

Can't forget that the Packers went through a similar drought from the late 60's to the early 90's. Seahwaks were nothing for almost 30 years. 49ers just ended a really poor decade.

This current Redskins string is starting to stretch past the levels of comfort for most fans, no doubt about that.

But it really does take just one or two guys to change it. Just have to hope we can find those guys.

I'm legit going through a huge crisis as a fan. I'm so sick of the joke that this team has become. I hate being embarrassed to be a fan.

You will survive. Saints fans did--- 20

Years of wearing bags on their heads, then a nice 5 year run, followed by about 12 more years of bags to get to Payton and Brees. Bucs fans survived... 20 years of misery-- think Redskins minus 1999, 2005, 2007, and 2012. Every year for them was Redskins 2009 over and over again. They then had a nice deade and now are struggling again. Colts pre Manning? A joke.

Just gotta hang in there.

[Epochalypse]

That is hard to do when you have a team that is expected to suck.  As Redskin fans we have been programmed to expect terrible things and we usually get it.  When something good happens like making the playoffs, I'm so surprised you'd think I had one the lottery.  The team is going to have to start winning for that to happen.  And winning consistently.

I didn't say it was easy.  I'm just saying that as fans the most impactful thing we can do to help the team win is to fill Fed Ex with Skins faithful on gamedays and scream when we are supposed to scream.

 

We all point out what the HC, the QB, the coordinators, the owner, etc. aren't doing that they should be.

 

I just feel that it should be pointed out that neither are we.

[goskins10]

Team struggled mightily in the post Baugh/pre Lombardi era, which spanned about 25 years. 50's and 60's were bad decades. The Lombardi came in 1969 and changed the culture in one year. Unfortuatey, he wasn't able to see it through, but in comes George Allen and he is very successful.

From 1969-1991 the franchise was very good, very competitive, and very relevant, culminating in 5 SB appearances and three titles. "Bad years" during that period was hovering around .500 and narrowly missing the playoffs.

So the early years of the ornganization were great, followed by a long trek into darkness, followed by a long stretch of greatness, followed by another stretch of highly disappointing results.

It seems cyclical, yes.

Can't forget that the Packers went through a similar drought from the late 60's to the early 90's. Seahwaks were nothing for almost 30 years. 49ers just ended a really poor decade.

This current Redskins string is starting to stretch past the levels of comfort for most fans, no doubt about that.

But it really does take just one or two guys to change it. Just have to hope we can find those guys.

You will survive. Saints fans did--- 20

Years of wearing bags on their heads, then a nice 5 year run, followed by about 12 more years of bags to get to Payton and Brees. Bucs fans survived... 20 years of misery-- think Redskins minus 1999, 2005, 2007, and 2012. Every year for them was Redskins 2009 over and over again. They then had a nice deade and now are struggling again. Colts pre Manning? A joke.

Just gotta hang in there.

 

Sorry that I can only provide one "like"!  I would "like" to have a 1000!!   The only slight disagreement is the Colts. If you mean the Indy Colts, yes. But they had a very nice run in Baltimore with the Johnny Unitas years then into the Bert Jones. Don Shula was their coach too when they won their first SB. Lot's of great players in the 60s and 70s. Not much till Peyton.

 

I was all for MS early and have strongly supported him. But to say this year was a disappointment is an understatement. It's not just the losing, it's all the stupid drama associated. Unfortunately, as i have said before, until DS hires a real GM who gets his own coach and then goes to Hawaii and just watches us on satellite and pays the bills, this circus will continue. Maybe after the MS era Dan will get the hint and hire a GM.

[goskins10]

Why are the redskins a perennial loser?  And those other teams fantastic? 

 

Is the cancer being spread by their loser owner Dan Snyder?  Is it bad karma from having a racist team name?  Is it our loser scouting department?  

 

Let's hear your thoughts

 

Once thing is certain

 

Five, Ten, Twenty years from now, those winning teams will still be winning ... and the skins will still be steeped in drama, dysfunction, and a loser mentality.

 

NE and Baltimore have FO personnel that work well with the HCs and they have solid HCs with innovative minds. I hate Belichick but you can't argue with the results (well maybe some of them, see Jets game where they cheated).

 

Please do not put Seattle in this category. they are playing well this year. Th4ey finished decent last year. Out side that, please show me the SB trophies....  Show me all the NFC championships?  Also, Browner just got an indefinite ban. They have a few others guys one step away from a 1 yr ban. Until they actually win  something, they are just mouth running punks.

 

We need a true GM. When Snyder hires one it will take a few years but we will then be back to being at least competitive. Thered is no magic elixir.

[PorkSkins]

Who wants to be like the Seahawks?  How many SB's?  As far as the Pats, I remember when they were full of number one draft picks and couldn't beat the Jets with Richard Todd.  The Ravens however are another story.  It all starts with the Wizard of Ozzie.  We haven't had a great GM since Beathard.  He built teams for the long haul. Vinny took what Charlie left and ran it into the ground.  Now you have Bruce who came back to restore order between the old vets that were his dad's team and the new regime.  The team was left to be run by Mike.  Mike, Mike, Mike.  What day is it?  And here we are.  We need a GM and scout team to fill this roster with bonafide starters.

[Mr. Sinister]

We have an owner, who can't seem to find the right structure to his organization, and over the course of almost 15 years, has to keep learning lesson after lesson on how consistent winning football teams are built. That, and the team has never been truly bad enough over a period of time to get a game changing top 3 pick year after year (where even football retarded people can build a winner)... Until this year. Go figure.

 

We also don't have an Adderall lab underneath the practice facility. 

[redskins4ever28]

Its the quarterback.

Seattle is the only team that has an average (maybe above average) qb and is beastly but I gotta give Wilson credit cause two years ago before they had Wilson that same Seattle team was 6-10.

Flacco gets hot in the playoffs for some reason.

Patriots, packers, saints, steelers and any team Peyton manning is on will always be great. If Romo sits to pee doesnt choke all the time or make silly mistakes they would be elite as well. Eli's been bad this year but he gets hot in the playoffs n is usually a great qb. Roethlisberger, rivers Etc;

Look at it like this, all the elite teams right now in the nfl have great qb play:

Denver - manning

Pats - Brady

Saints - Brees

Packers - rodgers(if he wasn't injured they would be fighting for a 1st rd bye)

Steelers are still elite just had a couple down years but Ben makes them elite. Without ben they are a 5-11 team.

Seahawks as I said are the only complete team. Wilson's good, but far from great IMO. Next time you watch a Seahawks game watch how if a defense plays to contain him in the pocket how bad he is. He can't throw from the pocket at all, he has to be outside to be good.

Now lets look at the above average teams

Lions - stafford

Chargers - rivers

Bears - cutler

Cowboys - Romo sits to pee

Bengals - dalton

Eagles - foles(he's having an amazing year but I'm still thinking its more luck + Kelly's offense, wait another year before I call him above average.

49ers - Kaepernick

Panthers - newton

Colts - luck(who will be elite)

Dolphins - tannehill

Cardinals - Palmer

Giants - Eli (again a down year but way above average)

Falcons - ryan(again a down year but last year they were 1 seed in NFC)

Chiefs - smith

Ravens - flacco

The only team in this category that has a below average qb IMO is the jets, with geno.

Now lets look at the below average-average teams and their qbs

Skins - rg3/cousins(could just be a down year for griffin or he could be nothing like we thought, so this is just a question mark right now) [ps don't get mad at me for saying this griffin apologist I'm just making an opinion that's all so chill]

Vikings - ponder/Cassel

Rams - Bradford/Clemons

Bucs - Glennon

Bills - manuel(rookie but still not good right now)

Browns - Campbell (lol)

Jaguars - henne/gabbert

Texans - keenum(worst division in football, colts have it easy)

Titans - Fitzpatrick (locker could be good if he stayed healthy but he's stafford-like in injuries his first few years it seems)

Raiders - mcgloin/Pryor

Am I forgetting anyone?

Anyway a lot of people will disagree but truth is a qb= wins. And we just never had a good one, neither have the browns. Since the lions got stafford their franchise turned around (0-16 megatrons rookie year). You gotta have a qb.

Right now on college the kid from central Florida looks like a pro. And i guarantee the psu qb hackenberg will be the next manning when he gets drafted. In 5 years remember this I will be right and I never make guarantees

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

 

Holy Mother of God how do you know I do that? 

 

And good God I've doomed this franchise for EVER because I can't a life's dedication in that regard up.

 

Hail. 

[FrFan]

I don't want us to be associated with the Seaderalls and Cheatriots. Take off the drugs and the cams, what's left ?. Ravens are now done for a few years, they lost too many players, got a thin cap space, and since Flacco signed his huge contract he's back to his old self (18 TD 17 INT 76.5 QBR). We beat them last year. They also have all those UFAs: Michael Oher, Dennis Pitta, Ed Dickson, Corey Graham, Daryl Smith, Arthur Jones, James Ihedigbo, Jacoby Jones.

I'm still pulling for Snyder to sell the team, I think this is the only way for us to get out of our misery.

[Rakpwned427]

I don't want us to be associated with the Seaderalls and Cheatriots. Take off the drugs and the cams, what's left ?. Ravens are now done for a few years, they lost too many players, got a thin cap space, and since Flacco signed his huge contract he's back to his old self (18 TD 17 INT 76.5 QBR). We beat them last year. They also have all those UFAs: Michael Oher, Dennis Pitta, Ed Dickson, Corey Graham, Daryl Smith, Arthur Jones, James Ihedigbo, Jacoby Jones.

I'm still pulling for Snyder to sell the team, I think this is the only way for us to get out of our misery.

Agreed with all of this but the snyder part. Snyder had made A LOT of mistakes, but some teams would kill for an owner who is ready to open his check book to get who his people want. He had not had the right people to handle the team to this point. Bruce was a start. Lets move Bruce to VP, hire and GM and let him hire a coach. I think Snyders next move could be the redeeming one. All we can do is hoped for the best. After all the wrong decisions he has made I hope that he eventually gets lucky and makes the right one.

[TexasSkinsFan]

The Redskins have not yet understood how tanking in the NFL actually works or when to do it. The Colts have mastered it and hardly anyone really noticed. I think that is part of the solution, you can't be noticed when you tank. Look at the Colts the past two times they openly tanked for the betterment of the franchise, 2011 and 1996. 

 

2011 Colts featured Donald Brown, Joseph Addai. Pierre Garcon, Reggie Wayne, Austin Collie, Dallas Clark, Jacob Tamme, Adam Vinatieri, Robert Mathis, and Dwight Freeney. They were a stacked team and had been in the playoffs the previous year with Peyton Manning at QB. Then Manning had his neck issue and the Colts went into full tank mode that season. They lost all but two of the last three games of the year. Management went into the season with Kerry Collins at QB who in his previous seasons had a combined record of 2 wins and 11 losses. As the season wore on the fans of the team caught on and Suck for Luck was born and everyone was happy. After the season had been decided and the Colts knew they could win a game they ended the season on a winning note. They got Andrew Luck for the year of suck and two years later could be the #2 seed in the AFC playoffs this year.

 

I know what your thinking, Hankerson fan lost it, but it's true. They did this in front of the world and it paid off for them. They knew they could get away with it because they did it in 1997.

 

The 1996 Colts were the #3 playoff team in the AFC and went on to win a playoff game that year. The 1997 Colts however were the worst team in the entire league and went on to the #1 overall draft pick.

The 1997 Colts team had stars on it as well...Marvin Harrison, Marshall Faulk to just name a few and that team started the season 0-10 just like they did in 2011. The head coach said during that 1997 season

“There’s such a fine line in this business between winning and losing on a given weekend,” said Infante. “It’s been well-documented that we’re probably 23 or 25 points away from being in the playoffs right now. But it didn’t happen.”

Such a fine line for this 1997 team who had been in the playoffs the year before and the AFC Championship game the year before that right? That franchise went from that to the worst team in the league the year before the GOAT (Greatest of all time) QB enters the league. Awaiting that pitiful Colts team in 1998 was Peyton Manning and no one was the wiser. It worked so well for Manning the Colts did it again in 2011. 

 

I bring this up because the Redskins do not know how to tank. The owner wants to win so badly he doesn't understand losing a battle to win the war mentality. If this team understood this they would have lost more games in 2011 to assure them the #2 overall pick in the draft. The difference in drafting Griffin with all of the draft picks that it took for the Redskins to draft him and being able to draft Griffin with no trade was 2 less wins.

 

2 less wins in the 2011 season would have meant that the Redskins record in 2011 was 3-13 and that record would have been good enough to draft from the #2 spot without that trade. The Redskins have been in such a "win now at all cost" mind set they don't understand this. If they had tanked that season how excited would this fan base be right now knowing we might have the #1 overall draft pick in the 2014 draft? Safe to say much more so then now.

 

Some teams just understand patience better then this owner does. If we were better at losing we would be winning now. Tanking is a strategy that this team needed and needs to use from time to time. I know this is unpopular with some of you "Win every game possible" but the art of war says sometimes you lose a fight to win a war. If this team ever wants to get back to being a franchise winning almost every year this is something the ownership needs to understand.

 

Nothing is going to change with that since Dan would fire a coach if he thought they weren't trying to win every single game and this fan base has the team under such a microscope that no one would not notice if the team wasn't fielding the best team possible. Thats the curse of the Washington Redskins. The Colts in 2011 used a washed up losing QB and a guy named Curtis Painter who never should have been in the league to accomplish it's own goals. "Always win every game" is not a sound strategy. Things could be much different today if this team had the foresight to see what it needed to do in 2011.

[Ghost of]

The Seahawks were trash up until 2012. The Patriots were horrid for decades and the same goes for the Steelers and Packers in the 80s.

 

 

I wouldn't say the Seahags were trash.  They WERE in a SB and beat us in the playoffs (though that was due to brunell being hobbled and Carlos dropping a sure pick six) in 05 and made the playoffs (granted at 7-9) and beat the Saints in what, 2010 season?  With Hasselbeck they were a decent team, esp once Holmgren had his GM duties stripped.

[IrepDC]

The reasons:

-lack of patience when patience is necessary(not referring to Shanahan)

-poor football decisions(personnel, coaches, schemes, philosophies on team building, player development)

[Zazzaro703]

We have an owner, who can't seem to find the right structure to his organization, and over the course of almost 15 years, has to keep learning lesson after lesson on how consistent winning football teams are built. That, and the team has never been truly bad enough over a period of time to get a game changing top 3 pick year after year (where even football retarded people can build a winner)... Until this year. Go figure.

 

We also don't have an Adderall lab underneath the practice facility. 

Was that a shot at the Seadderall Seahawks?

[End2round2sanders]

Consistency at the HC position.

 

B-more, NE, Sea= combined 5 coaches since 2000

 

Wash=6 coaches since 2000