NEDCSLIM Posted November 18, 2013 Share Posted November 18, 2013 2nd year doesnt seem to be hurting ... Luck, Foles, Wilson, etc Those guys are SO MUCH BETTER than RG0 RG is going through a learning process and makes mistakes but LOL major flaw in your logic sir, none of these guys are off a major injury and all have more explosive players. Even though Luck still gets hit a lot he has a better O line and receiver corp until Wayne went out Keep in mind he is running the same offense from Stanford which he knows better than anybody on that team. His old coordinator is now the Colts OC, the offense is basically run, dink and dunk, screen and the occasional deep shot to TY Hilton. Colts special teams are also very good. Eventhough they have been outscored 66-3 in the first half of the last few games that coaching staff is good at adjustments, Luck is good, but his org puts him in position to be successful. Foles, well anybody could stand back there and do that, classic case of the system being successful. He's throwing to wide open receivers, and when he does throw a bad ball his WR's bail him out, oh and lets not forget one of the most elusive backs in the NFL that gets huge chunks of yardage. Wilson shouldn't even be in this equation, lets see not only does his team have one of the top 5 defenses and special teams, he has the luxury of one of the best O lines, and lets not forget Beast mode, Sidney Rice, Golden Tate, Baldwin and Zach Miller to throw to and if that wasn't enough the Percy Harvin is back and good lord he is fast and such a threat. How can he fail with so many options. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted November 18, 2013 Share Posted November 18, 2013 .........Wilson shouldn't even be in this equation..................he has the luxury of one of the best O lines, and lets not forget Beast mode, Sidney Rice, Golden Tate, Baldwin and Zach Miller to throw to and if that wasn't enough the Percy Harvin is back and good lord he is fast and such a threat. How can he fail with so many options. Woah, you do realized the Seattle lost both starting OTs? And net-net the Seattle receiving corps isn't better then ours they didn't have a WR on par with Garcon till this week and they don't have a TE in the same ballpark as Jordan Reed. The difference is their offense is well coordinated ours is not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Momma There Goes That Man Posted November 18, 2013 Share Posted November 18, 2013 Woah, you do realized the Seattle lost both starting OTs? And net-net the Seattle receiving corps isn't better then ours they didn't have a WR on par with Garcon till this week and they don't have a TE in the same ballpark as Jordan Reed. The difference is their offense is well coordinated ours is not. haha I was expecting you to say something and not let that Wilson comment go free. But I agree with you for the most part except that when healthy like last year and parts of this year I believe, their OL is a lot better than ours. But again, they are also a lot better coached and prepared than our offense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bedlamVR Posted November 18, 2013 Share Posted November 18, 2013 I think while it is fair to criticize players everyone knows a fair critique of a players ability is not where it ends - i also think the WaPost article kind of goes too far ..and mostly this back lash puts our fans in a bad light - but most of all i think what gets forgotten is this guy who we want to tell the world he stinks is a 23 year old kid ... (man that makes me sound old) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajax4132 Posted November 18, 2013 Share Posted November 18, 2013 I think he needed this season has a humbling experience. He read too much of his own press. He needs to focus on developing as a legit pro passer because he is far from it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Momma There Goes That Man Posted November 18, 2013 Share Posted November 18, 2013 I think he needed this season has a humbling experience. He read too much of his own press. He needs to focus on developing as a legit pro passer because he is far from it. Because of course, he wasn't focused on that before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IrepDC Posted November 18, 2013 Share Posted November 18, 2013 Watching Manning play last night I was struck by how quicky he gets rid of the ball. 2 seconds I think they said is the average time ffom snap to throw? On the other hand, RG3 must be averaging 5 seconds assuming he doesn't get sacked. This whole offense seems to operate in slow motion. A thing that struck me as odd yesterday was not that RG3 was overthrowing receivers, but that in no pressure situations with time to plant and throw, he was throwing balls 10 feet over wide open receiver's heads. I can't recall a professional QB ever doing that so consistently throughout a game. Instead of his mechanics improving each week they seem to be getting worse. It becomes even stranger when you notice that RG3 was reasonably accurate when throwing to covered receivers. So why is it he struggles when throwing to the open man but is accurate throwing to a covered man? Does he have a depth perception problem when a single player is open in space? In the final drive Moss had 3 steps on the defender for an easy tying touchdown and RG3 threw it 5 feet over his head and out of bounds. Very odd. Elite professional QB's complete that pass with their eyes closed. RG3 reminds me a lot of Jason Campbell. He is thinking too much rather than just reacting. You could tell at the goal line before the fumble he wanted to call time out but didn't because he had been given grief for wasting TO's. I believe this is why RG3 plays so much better in a fast paced no huddle offense. He has less time to think. Early signs of battered QB syndrome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajax4132 Posted November 18, 2013 Share Posted November 18, 2013 Because of course, he wasn't focused on that before. Considering how far he has regressed... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted November 18, 2013 Share Posted November 18, 2013 - RG3 was injured but it's week 11. Any offseason work he missed or questions about health have been more than answered and made up for by the fact that he's started and prepared for 10 games. If he's healthy enough to play every game than he doesn't get the injury pass for the entire season. - He's not missing his wide open receivers, or failing to see them entirely, because those receivers aren't very good. He's not seeing the field and he's off on his passes because right now, RG3 isn't a very good passer. - His lack of pocket awareness is not caused by his poor pass blocking line. The two things are not mutually exclusive. His line isn't very good at giving him time and he's not very good at feeling pressure. Having said all that, it's way too early to throw in the towel. While I'm one of those people that thinks RG3's ego is larger than his house I think he's a competitor and this season must be driving him insane. He'll work his butt off to get better and shut his critics up. There is no way a guy with his personality is going to just let this go and settle on being a mediocre passer. The reason I say this is this, look how fast he worked his way back from injury. Guys that aren't interested in working aren't going to go through the intense pain of rehabbing ahead of schedule and putting in the extra hours just to rush back to the field. He didn't spend the off season slacking off and patting himself on the back for another well done subway commercial. He set the insane goal of being the starter week one and he met that goal. He'll be better than ever next season. I really believe that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bantu Posted November 18, 2013 Share Posted November 18, 2013 Cooley called out the offensive scheme last hour on the Cooley/Czabe show. He said they are not even tapping into a huge chunk of the "true" Shanahan offense. For example, they have a true West-Coast timing offense that uses the WR route tree. The current offense doesn't even use a route tree at all for WR's. Cooley said he recalls the Shanahans saying last season "he [RGIII] needs time", basically meaning he needs time to develop before they throw the whole offense out there. Cooley implored, since it looks like playoffs are out of reach, that now is the time to transition into the traditional NFL part of Shanny's scheme if they truly want him to develop into a do-it-all QB. Some would argue that he'd get hit more in the pocket, but Cooley says that is exactly why he'll have to learn how/where to get the ball to so he can avoid those hits. I gotta agree with Captain Chaos on this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajax4132 Posted November 18, 2013 Share Posted November 18, 2013 Cooley called out the offensive scheme last hour on the Cooley/Czabe show. He said they are not even tapping into a huge chunk of the "true" Shanahan offense. For example, they have a true West-Coast timing offense that uses the WR route tree. The current offense doesn't even use a route tree at all for WR's. Cooley said he recalls the Shanahans saying "he [RGIII] needs time", basically meaning he needs time to develop NFL QB skills. Wow, big problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted November 18, 2013 Share Posted November 18, 2013 Cooley called out the offensive scheme last hour on the Cooley/Czabe show. He said they are not even tapping into a huge chunk of the "true" Shanahan offense. For example, they have a true West-Coast timing offense that uses the WR route tree. The current offense doesn't even use a route tree at all for WR's. Cooley said he recalls the Shanahans saying last season "he [RGIII] needs time", basically meaning he needs time to develop before they throw the whole offense out there. Cooley implored, since it looks like playoffs are out of reach, that now is the time to transition into the traditional NFL part of Shanny's scheme if they truly want him to develop into a do-it-all QB. Some would argue that he'd get hit more in the pocket, but Cooley says that is exactly why he'll have to learn how/where to get the ball to so he can avoid those hits. I gotta agree with Captain Chaos on this one. He was demanding the defense do more than bullrush Kerrigan and Orakpo a few weeks ago and to try moving them around and stunts. What did we see this week? Orakpo got a sack when he and Kerrigan were on the same side and ran a stunt. Cooley seems to know what he's talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinzfever2010 Posted November 18, 2013 Share Posted November 18, 2013 Cooley called out the offensive scheme last hour on the Cooley/Czabe show. He said they are not even tapping into a huge chunk of the "true" Shanahan offense. For example, they have a true West-Coast timing offense that uses the WR route tree. The current offense doesn't even use a route tree at all for WR's. Cooley said he recalls the Shanahans saying last season "he [RGIII] needs time", basically meaning he needs time to develop before they throw the whole offense out there. Cooley implored, since it looks like playoffs are out of reach, that now is the time to transition into the traditional NFL part of Shanny's scheme if they truly want him to develop into a do-it-all QB. Some would argue that he'd get hit more in the pocket, but Cooley says that is exactly why he'll have to learn how/where to get the ball to so he can avoid those hits. I gotta agree with Captain Chaos on this one. Cooley is awesome. I had no idea dude was the knowledgeable and entertaining. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodriggo Posted November 18, 2013 Share Posted November 18, 2013 ....with him running his mouth all offseason.... Agree with most of the OP but I don't understand this line. Guy was ready to go in one offseason after ACL surgery, said as much and is considered to have "run his mouth?" I don't get it. Would most people on here rather have Joe Flacco or Matt Stafford, some ******* boring, cardboard cut-out, personality-less, dumb as **** QB nobody is gonna remember the day after they retire? Don't see anybody criticizing Peyton Manning for schlocking Papa Johns in our face every ******* nano-second of the day. RG3 can't have an opinion, can't have a personality, can't do a documentary about his recovery, can't do this, can't do that.....why is that? He's a grown-ass man. What kills me is that he is constantly criticized for his success by REDSKINS FANS?!?! He's a corporate shill just like the rest of them, people need to get over it and stop qualifying their support. You need to draw a line and pick sides if you haven't already. You're either pro-RG3 or you're not. Honestly, if you're not an RG3 fan then what the heck are you? What are you defending against him? The franchise and it's multi-decade run of mediocrity? The owner and his epic ineptitude? The coaches and their complete lack of progress after four years? The other players and their lack of skill & intensity? Really?!?! Why? Wake up, he is the franchise. He is the best part and future of this team. If they get better lineman and receivers, and a coaching staff that can provide a middle-of-the-road defense and special teams he will deliver the wins, it's literally that simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingdaddy Posted November 18, 2013 Share Posted November 18, 2013 2nd year doesnt seem to be hurting ... Luck, Foles, Wilson, etc Those guys are SO MUCH BETTER than RG0 Would you trade Robert straight up for Nick Foles? I would not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted November 18, 2013 Share Posted November 18, 2013 Would you trade Robert straight up for Nick Foles? I would not. Not a chance. But I would trade Kyle's offense for Chip's. For all those who put the blame on Griff: what do you think Griff's numbers would be if he was on the Eagles and Foles was on the Redskins? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redskins55 Posted November 19, 2013 Share Posted November 19, 2013 I just looked at our five first half possessions.... 1) we drove the ball to the Eagles 38...everyone remembers the Paulsen overthrow, but that was 1st down....morris lost 1 yard on 2nd down and Polombus got shoved into Griffin on 3rd down for a batted pass 2) Started the drive at their own 2...drove to their own 39....1st down...Morris losses 3 yards...2nd down...Robert sacked by a blitzer..he had no chance...3rd and 19...drive over 3) 3rd and 2...Moss drops the pass 4) Redskins drive to the Eagles 5....2nd and goal....Robert in the pocket....nobody open and Helu is blocking Barwin.....I blame Kyle for a stupid play 5) Redskins drive to midfield....two runs by morris get stuffed....3rd and 9...Trent Williams gets beat by Cole. Stop blaming Robert! he's not perfect...he's not playing great....but their are many many many more problems then him Other than Wilson who is having a nice season, you're wrong. Foles can't be included because he's not been a starter since day one of 2012 and his 7 TD game is such an outlier it's ridiculous. Luck and RG3's stats are virtually the same this season. Robert struggling big time. Multiple reasons for this -- some outside of his control, some in his control. Outside of his control: - Bad, terrible, horrible defense and special teams. - O-Line mediocrity. - Lack of reliable targets to throw to. In his control: - Poor pocket presence/awareness. - Not good at reading defenses/seeing the blitz coming. - Erratic accuracy. - Still puts himself in too many situations to take unnecessary hits. All of these are correctable. Robert's been a freak athlete his entire life. He's relied on his physical gifts to get him to where he is today. He's also an intelligent guy so he CAN learn and get better at the position, and frankly, he HAS to in order for him to get better and to semi-insure his longevity in the league. I want the team to win as much as any fan, but at this point for this season the most important thing moving forward IMO is keeping Robert healthy. He takes sooo many hits. Too many! The Skins gave up too much for him and he has to be the guy moving forward for the near term future (2-4 years min). I hope he can make it through the rest of the season without a serious injury so that he can get a full off-season to work on the things he NEEDS to work on. And I hope as time goes he can check his stubbornness and ego at the door and realize he's got a lot to learn. He can be better, so much better. I agree with this the most. People expected so much after last year, they don't think the knee injury should have anything to do with where he his right now. Even if there wasn't a knee injury and he wasn't quite as good as last year (but close) people would be ****ting their pants around here. I agree with one of the other posts, this fanbase doesn't deserve a good QB, ever. For years we've known nothing but quarterback controversy and struggles and I think it's so ingrained in everyone that the minute a QB doesn't do well people start hollering for his backup. This fanbase is pathetic. The very people that built this kid up last year and praised him for everything he did are the first to turn on him when things aren't going well. All of a sudden he talks too damn much (does he really?) and is a selfish player when last year everyone thought he was humble and intelligent. No one was complaining when they were watching that ESPN puff piece about his rehab, but then all of a sudden it became a huge issue when he started the season and didn't do well. Yeah, it's obvious that he wasn't ready, despite what he thought and what he wanted (and what we wanted) to believe. But this is how some fans deal with adversity? You can't have it both ways, assholes. Either you're with him or you're not, pick one or the other. If you're with him, you enjoy the good times and ride out the bad ones. Sure, there's stuff that he needs to improve on, but I don't think he's like Kaepernick who seemed to spend most of his offseason doing photoshoots and living the high life and not working. Any progress you wanted to see in his throwing game was derailed when he had to spend most of the offseason working on his knee. And did you really want to see any throwing progress after he completed 65% of his passes last year? I don't remember anyone ****ing about him missing open receivers in 2012, all of a sudden it's a huge issue. Like some of the posters above, I don't think it was an aberration, you don't simply get that lucky that many times after almost 400 pass attempts. I think it's pretty sad that the fanbase is so quick to turn on him at the slightest bit of adversity. Sure, this season hasn't gone the way anyone wanted it to and RG3 isn't playing the way anyone has wanted him to, either. That doesn't mean the knee jerk reactions are necessary, that doesn't mean we should be looking at Cousins, that doesn't mean we should be total idiots about everything. I am so glad that our fan base STILL has knowledgeable football fans! Yall have made my day with these very accurate posts! HTTR!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cphil006 Posted November 19, 2013 Share Posted November 19, 2013 His form is terrible which is a direct indication of a lost offseason and thrown into game 1... I'm confident he will progress by leaps and bounds next offseason assuming he's healthy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCalMike Posted November 19, 2013 Share Posted November 19, 2013 Is it possible Robert isn't as far along physically as we all may think he is? In 2012 his accuracy was a standout, not just for a rookie, but for a QB period. When guys were open he hit them, in stride usually. I don't believe for one second that he can be that accurate of a passer, and then all of the sudden loses the ability to make similar throws...... Unless, something is not right. Now taking all factors into consideration, such as the awful O-line, NFL defenses adjusting, etc etc etc....there are still some clear examples of Robert simply missing some easy throws. Does he miss those last year? I don't think so. What could cause a QB just to not be able to make the kind of easy wide open throws that backup QBs can make, and that Robert himself was making with ease last season? I'm sorry but I can't buy into the theory that he simply forgot how to be accurate. There has to be other factors there that are causing some of these more routine passes to sail on him or be short. One thing is for sure. Next week the team plays on MNF, and no QB is safe under the Gruden microscope. When you are rocking n rolling he will slobber over you, but when you are stinking it up he will point it out and harp on what he feels the problem is. Should be an interesting watch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butters Posted November 19, 2013 Share Posted November 19, 2013 lmao his accuracy has been just as good as Lucks. Actually going into this game his completion percentage was higher than Lucks. And the amazing this is you're tired of people making excuses for Griffin but there's two threads where you make excuses for Luck. I'm sick of your biased ass posts regarding Young QBs not named Andrew Luck. Luck is his "Great White Hype' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redskins and Lions Posted November 19, 2013 Share Posted November 19, 2013 I've always felt that RG3 has the tools to be an Aaron Rodgers type player from everything regarding a strong, accurate arm and great mobility. So far, he hasn't taken the next step and gotten the mental side of the game down. Coaching is a strong part of that which is why we have to clean house for next year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylor703 Posted November 19, 2013 Share Posted November 19, 2013 This has been pointed out before, but his total stats are somewhat misleading. RGIII's stats are bolstered by games like yesterday when he was awful in the 1st half and then plays better in the 2nd half, but still not well enough. Luck's ratings by half are 87.2 and 86.7 RGIII"s ratings are 78.1 and 86.9. The other thing is Luck's high has been higher than RGIII and his low's not nearly as low as RGIII's, and he's been more consistent. My issue with RGIII is where is the improvement. As GHH said in this thread, this game was as bad as any game he's played (Honestly, though, the Denver game might have been worse). I mean he looks more comfortable running and stuff out there, but other than that, in terms of looking like a real pro QB out there, he doesn't appear to be any better than week 1. Luck lost 38-8 against the rams and turned the ball over 4 times, I'm pretty sure RGIII hasn't had a low like that lmao Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butters Posted November 19, 2013 Share Posted November 19, 2013 Luck lost 38-8 against the rams and turned the ball over 4 times, I'm pretty sure RGIII hasn't had a low like that lmao What was Luck's rating last year? Oh...it was abysmal... What was RG3's? Oh...it was the highest in the history of the NFL for a rookie... Luck has been poor to average his while career. His team carries him all the time. His lows have been lower and his high pales when juxtaposed with Griffin's... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted November 19, 2013 Share Posted November 19, 2013 Having just watched the Panthers beat the Patriots, why can't Griffin follow Newton and our team follow theirs? Newton was a weapon that didn't translate into much success for a couple years. Newton had a very good rookie season using his legs and continued to be up and down in his second year. He also led a very potent rushing attack and is seemingly experiencing a situation where the game is slowing down for him. We have similar characteristics with our team and even had more success in Griffin's first year. Maybe with some additions this off season and more development, we can evolve into a solid, contending team? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCalMike Posted November 19, 2013 Share Posted November 19, 2013 Do you think our defense stops that last drive from the Pats? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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