Election 16: Donald Trumps wins Presidency. God Help us all!

[tshile]

Trump is an insecure, ill-informed narcissist. 

 

This seems to fit most politicians...

[RedskinsFan44]

It's a demonstration of Trumps honesty when asked the hard questions he doesn't shirk.. He gives you the truth even if it's hard for you to hear it.. and then typically he explains it and the people and moves them.

He's been killer on that. and I think that's one source of his popularity.

Not so sure on the strength of his answering questions:

[JMS]

Remember when candidate Obama promised to shut down Gitmo?  He has been the Commander in Chief of the US Military for 7 years and hasn't managed to shut down a military base!  Is that because I don't think he is capable?  No.  I think it is because there are a lot of things candidates make promises about that they don't know the whole story because they don't yet have the proper clearance for everything.  So that 's why I don't put much stock in what a candidate says they will do when they take office.

Yep candidate Obama said he would close Gitmo as his first official act in the White House. When he got into office his pragmatism took over. He could have closed it that first evening with a presidential order. But President Obama has always sought consensus and compromise than provocative unilateral actions. Problem is another word for provocative unilateral actions is leadership.. It's taken President Obama five years to figure out this congress is going to give him nothing and start to lead using the powers of his office instead of seeking consensus.. Trump won't have that problem for 5 minutes.

 

EDIT:  What is even scarier is the similarities that can be drawn between Trumps campaign and Hitlers campaign.  Let that sink in.

(1) The Nazi's didn't come to power through elections.. They never won a popular election.. They seized power from a government which was too timid and ineffective to protect itself or it's citizens from fanatics.

(2) When Trump said the way to take care of ISIS was to target the innocent families of it's members.. It was right out of Mein Kampf. Hitler spent a lot of pages talking about terrorism in Mein Kampf. Hitler's position was in order to defeat terrorism the state must be better at terrorism than the terrorists. So I hear what you are saying...

I think their biggest similarities is they are both popularists Given popularists are less preditable than establishment candidates.

[tshile]

what i like about trump is that he's not afraid to say what he thinks. even if it pisses people off or gets him called names. it's refreshing to see.

 

i also like that he's not a typical politician. He doesn't have a ton of hands in his pocket. Sure, he used daddy's money to build his fortune and there's a solid argument that he did a poor job all things considered, and when you look at some of the ways he earned his money it's questionable/shady/not something the average persons should support. But he doesn't have a long line of lobbyists or other politicians waiting for their turn to get repaid for whatever it is they did to get him there.

 

That's about all I can find to like about him. It doesn't help that he hasn't told us much of anything on policy ideas to review. We're kind of left with either likely/disliking his personality.

 

Oh, he's making the GOP establishment have nightmares every night, and **** all day. That's something to like.

 

I don't really care if he's a bully, or mean, or anything else. I find it laughable some of you think the other politicians are somehow better. They just do a better job of hiding it from the general public. Most of these people are assholes, they had to be to get where they are. They'll step on you no problem if it means advancement for them.

[Predicto]

Coming across like the kind of guy you would like to sit down and have a beer with is pretty much how we got George W Bush as our President.  

[JMS]

Trump is an insecure, ill-informed narcissist.  By all evidence, his grasp of important policy issues registers at the level of an average middle school student.

Absolutely true all except for the ill-informed bit. He's closer to a Rubio than he is to a Carson.

I think he's more knowledgeable than Clinton, Bush Jr, or President Obama were when they were running for there first term..

I base this on the fact that he has consistently touched the issues which most resonate with the American people. He's been astounding at it and he doesn't use pollsters or speech writers.. He fired his chief political advisor on the eve of the first debate.. Donald is a smart guy, and he's very intuitive on his positions.

 

He forwards bigoted and bogus chain emails like your Aunt Gladys does.  He hurls personal insults at anybody who disagrees with him.  He is a loathsome bully and a despicable human being. 

 

Other than that, he's the perfect GOP candidate.

I don't think he's bigoted and I don't think he's wrong on illegal immigration. Hell you go down to Mexico and get yourself a job without a VISA and see what happens to you.. You'll be deported faster than you can say "double standard". I also like it that Trump uses the term Illegal Immigration and not "undocumented Immigration" suggesting illegals aren't breaking the laws..

Finally I like that the stupid politically correct revisionist history that is coming from both left and right is getting a little reality. We've been deporting illegal immigrants with every administration since Teddy Roosevelt. Trump's policy isn't anything new.. Isn't anything even notworthy except he's the only guy with the guts to propose it in 2016. Obama is deporting folks today because he's afraid if he doesn't start to enforce our laws the courts are going to overrule him on it. Not that President Obama wasn't doing anything George W. didn't do before him.

Both Parties are in love with the large Hispanic voter block and want to play poltics on our boarder security policy to land that block.

Anyway Donald is a vindictive egotist and yes he can be a bully..... which are all acceptable flaws for those who support him. At least his followers know where he stands and what he is.

Coming across like the kind of guy you would like to sit down and have a beer with is pretty much how we got George W Bush as our President.

Absolutely, it's even worse though.. Bush Jr didn't tell you on the campaign trail he would use the military to target and murder the innocent family members of terrorists. That sent cold shivers down my spine.

[The Evil Genius]

I don't think he's bigoted and I don't think he's wrong on illegal immigration. Hell you go down to Mexico and get yourself a job without a VISA and see what happens to you.. You'll be deported faster than you can say "double standard". I also like it that Trump uses the term Illegal Immigration and not "undocumented Immigration" suggesting illegals aren't breaking the laws..

 

 

Funny you should mention that. But hey, he's so smart that I'm sure he will learn the truth and present that message next, right? Yeah, I didn't think so. 

 

http://www.sacbee.com/opinion/opn-columns-blogs/foon-rhee/article57293723.html

 

 

Donald Trump hasn’t let the facts get in the way of anything he decides to say, ever since he kicked off his presidential campaign by painting the image of hordes of illegal immigrants coming across the Mexican border. He’s kept flogging the issue all the way to the front of the Republican pack.

 

But a study out this month shows that Trump is flat wrong.

 

In truth, the number of undocumented immigrants declined every year between 2008 and 2014. That year, the undocumented population dropped below 11 million for the first time since 2004 and was 1 million less than in 2008.

In California, home to the most undocumented immigrants of any state by far, the number dropped by 11 percent from 2010 to 2014 – from more than 2.9 million to about 2.6 million, says the nonpartisan Center for Migration Studies in New York.

 

Immigrants from Mexico account for the vast majority of the decline. Nationally between 2010 and 2014, their numbers dropped by 9 percent, or 612,000, including 252,000 fewer in California, according to the study. As Mexico’s economy improved, many returned home.

 

At the same time, the number of legal immigrants from Mexico and other

countries is increasing.

 

Between 1980 and 2014, the legal population from Mexico grew faster than the undocumented population. Over those 34 years, the number of legal residents grew by 5 million to nearly 6.1 million, while the illegal population increased by 4.5 million to 5.6 million.

 

“These trends should be applauded by partisans on all sides of the immigration debate,” the center’s executive director, Donald Kerwin, said in a statement.

Read more here: http://www.sacbee.com/opinion/opn-columns-blogs/foon-rhee/article57293723.html#storylink=cpy

 

[JMS]

Not so sure on the strength of his answering questions:

You think that's more offensive than Cruz or Rubio trying to represent themselves as get hard on illegal immigration candidates when they proposed legislation which granted amnesty their first years in Washington? I mean Cruz was sent to Washington on that core issue and he flop flop'd his first year in office and now he's trying to say he didn't. Rubio had his own amnesty bill co-sponsored by Senator Shummer.

Hillary has the same thing going on... She's never made a decision in her life without first checking with her pollsters, and her record on the issue is irrelivent to what she can gain and loose in the present.

Both Bernie and Donald have huge flaws.. but what folks are finding refreshing from them is they both seem like straight shooters.. Bernie because he's a True Believer. Trump because it's just kinda who he is.

[JMS]

Funny you should mention that. But hey, he's so smart that I'm sure he will learn the truth and present that message next, right? Yeah, I didn't think so. 

 

http://www.sacbee.com/opinion/opn-columns-blogs/foon-rhee/article57293723.html

Illegal immigration is not a Trump created issue. It's a real issue that both Democrats and Republicans have refused to deal with for decades... Hispanics are today the largest minority group in the country by a vast amount and we still don't have any politicians with a serious plan practical plan to take control of our boarders..

And he's Trump talking about it and highlighting the hypocrisy on the GOP stage with him is a sign that he's willing to speak truth to power. Willing to do what he thinks is necessary to take control of our boarders back.

As for your article... Wonderful example of hypocrisy.. Are they suggesting that we somehow got control of our boarders during the economic downturn? Are they suggesting that in 2014-15 and now in 16 when our economy is getting stronger that illegal immigration won't come back stronger than ever.

We have the worst of either world right now.. We have millions living outside of our legal system and our policies are making that worse. The former is the worst imaginable thing and neither party has the balls to address the latter.

The mere fact Donald became the instant front runner when he first brought up this topic shows how much grass roots ferver their is over it.

[chipwhich]

Yeah I agree with you.. It's amazing to me that women actually having the final say in their healthcare could be called a progressive/liberal idea in the 21st century.

I always thought being pro-CHOICE, was a libertarian issue.. you know that whole thing about "smaller less intrusive government".

 

Well I am pro choice, doesn't take away that it is a barbaric procedure that isn't very progressive.

Is chipwich blushing? He IS.  He's blushing.  I think he's developing a crush.

 

 

You should spend more time reading the onion.  LOL   I am not for Trump, but I am against your girl Hill.

[TheGreatBuzz]

Yep candidate Obama said he would close Gitmo as his first official act in the White House. When he got into office his pragmatism took over. He could have closed it that first evening with a presidential order. But President Obama has always sought consensus and compromise than provocative unilateral actions. Problem is another word for provocative unilateral actions is leadership.. It's taken President Obama five years to figure out this congress is going to give him nothing and start to lead using the powers of his office instead of seeking consensus.. Trump won't have that problem for 5 minutes. (1) The Nazi's didn't come to power through elections.. They never won a popular election.. They seized power from a government which was too timid and ineffective to protect itself or it's citizens from fanatics.(2) When Trump said the way to take care of ISIS was to target the innocent families of it's members.. It was right out of Mein Kampf. Hitler spent a lot of pages talking about terrorism in Mein Kampf. Hitler's position was in order to defeat terrorism the state must be better at terrorism than the terrorists. So I hear what you are saying...I think their biggest similarities is they are both popularists Given popularists are less preditable than establishment candidates.

Well you made my point about Gitmo. Candidates make promises without thinking them through. Then they get in office and realize they can't/shouldn't do something. So why do we put so much stock in campaign promises?

As for the Nazis bit, I'm aware of the lack of normal elections. I actually meant the way hitler got a country behind him and got so many many to blindly follow him down a horrible path. The rhetoric that was used, the way he gave the population a group of people to blame, etc.

[TheGreatBuzz]

No clue what the political persuasion of this newspaper is but I'm sharing just for the sake of discussion. Seems like more email news about Hillary. Can't wait to see how both sides twist it to mean what they want it to mean.

http://www.stripes.com/news/us/top-secret-info-found-in-clinton-emails-state-department-says-1.391323

WASHINGTON — The Obama administration confirmed for the first time Friday that Hillary Clinton's unsecured home server contained some of the U.S. government's most closely guarded secrets, censoring 22 emails with material demanding one of the highest levels of classification. The revelation comes just three days before the Iowa presidential nominating caucuses in which Clinton is a candidate.

More at link.

EDIT: READ THE ARTICLE. Yes I'm aware it says they retroactively classified, etc. I didn't quote those parts because of rules on quoting large blocks of text. You must click the link and read on your own.

[chipwhich]

No clue what the political persuasion of this newspaper is but I'm sharing just for the sake of discussion. Seems like more email news about Hillary. Can't wait to see how both sides twist it to mean what they want it to mean.

 

Nothing to twist.  The dems in the tailgate don't think classified data matters.  Close topic.

[The Evil Genius]

Nothing to twist.  The dems in the tailgate don't think classified data matters.  Close topic.

 

Name names.

 

The back and forth argument all along has been 2 things.

 

1) Were the emails and their attachments included within classified (and clearly marked as so) when it was housed (opened/forwarded/responded to) on Hillary's private email server.

 

2) Were there rules in place against having such email server at the time.

[China]

[TheGreatBuzz]

Nothing to twist. The dems in the tailgate don't think classified data matters. Close topic.

Well glad we got one side to chime in with a dig at the other. Now for the other side to do the same but say theirs is justified in 3....2....1....

EDIT: Haha...that was faster than expected.

[The Evil Genius]

From what I can tell, no one investigating has been able to offer substantive proof of either (in #12139). Until then, we are left with nothing.

[s0crates]

No clue what the political persuasion of this newspaper is . . .

FYI: Stars and Stripes is a military paper. They've had some controversy about the DOD making editorial decisions in the past. Not that I trust them any less than any of the MSM outlets.

I couldn't give two ****s about Hillary's emails. I'm still trying to figure out what the big deal is with that.

If you really want to go after Hillary, she and Bill are connected to far more nefarious stuff than a few classified emails being unsecured.

[JMS]

Well you made my point about Gitmo. Candidates make promises without thinking them through. Then they get in office and realize they can't/shouldn't do something. So why do we put so much stock in campaign promises?

The only way we have to gage who we are electing to office is to listen to what they say.. The only control we have ultimately is to hold them accountable for what they do in the next election.

 

As for the Nazis bit, I'm aware of the lack of normal elections. I actually meant the way hitler got a country behind him and got so many many to blindly follow him down a horrible path. The rhetoric that was used, the way he gave the population a group of people to blame, etc.

The NY Stock Exchange crashed in 1929, In the German elections of 1930 the Social Democrats(25%), Nazi's(18%) and Communists(13%) split the votes.. In the July 1932 elections The Nazi's became the largest party in the Reichstag.. The Nazi's (37%), Social Democrats(21%), and Communists (14%).. That was their high waters mark for popular support. They were unable to form a political alliance necessary to form a government.

In the November 1932 election the Nazi's lost 35 seats but remained the largest party in the Reichstag (196 seats 33.09%) but still were not able to form a government because no other German party would support a Nazi lead government. In January 1933, Hitler finally concluded a compromise with the National Conservative Party; Hitler would become Chancellor, with a vice chancellor being a National Conservative. The Nazi's would have a minority of the cabinent posts(3, Chancellor, Interior, and 1 minister without portfolio) in this government.. The national conservatives believed if they retained the majority of the cabinent posts they could handle Hitler and the Nazis. And from that position the Nazi's instigated a number of riots, assasinations and even set fire to the Reichstag; Then they seized complete power resulting in Hitler dispanded the Reichstag and declaring himself Chancellor for life.

No clue what the political persuasion of this newspaper is but I'm sharing just for the sake of discussion. Seems like more email news about Hillary. Can't wait to see how both sides twist it to mean what they want it to mean.

http://www.stripes.com/news/us/top-secret-info-found-in-clinton-emails-state-department-says-1.391323

WASHINGTON — The Obama administration confirmed for the first time Friday that Hillary Clinton's unsecured home server contained some of the U.S. government's most closely guarded secrets, censoring 22 emails with material demanding one of the highest levels of classification. The revelation comes just three days before the Iowa presidential nominating caucuses in which Clinton is a candidate.

More at link.

EDIT: READ THE ARTICLE. Yes I'm aware it says they retroactively classified, etc. I didn't quote those parts because of rules on quoting large blocks of text. You must click the link and read on your own.

It's a another big fat nothing burger. Nothing New here. It's politically embaressing manufactured muck to throw at Hillary.

Kirby said the State Department's focus as part of the Freedom of Information Act review of Clinton's emails was on "whether they need to be classified today." Questions about their past classification, he said, "are being, and will be, handled separately by the State Department."

Possible responses for classification infractions include counseling, warnings or other action, State Department officials said, though they declined to say if these applied to Clinton or senior aides who've since left the department. The officials weren't authorized to speak on the matter and spoke on condition of anonymity.

Nothing Burger

[JMS]

Nothing to twist.  The dems in the tailgate don't think classified data matters.  Close topic.

Chip... what part of No Criminal referral don't you understand?

The email investigations have never ever been about prosecuting a crime, as all agree no crime was committed.The investigations have always been a standard process which occurs prior to freedom of information act releases.

The fact that they are finding classified emails on Hillary's servers.. some 60 out of roughly 60,000 pages.. has everything to do with not releasing these pages to the public and nothing to do with wrong doing on the part of Hillary...

[JMS]

1) Were the emails and their attachments included within classified (and clearly marked as so) when it was housed (opened/forwarded/responded to) on Hillary's private email server.

 

2) Were there rules in place against having such email server at the time.

(1) Not reported so far.

(2) Absolutely not.. Colin Powel had his own private email server when he was Sec State before Hillary and John Kerry had his own private email server after Hillary.. No Sec State had a state.gov email account prior to John Kerry.

I would say it comes down to 1 simple question...

(3) Has any government official from State, IG, or Justice ever claimed there was criminal wrong doing with regard to Hillary and her emails after six months of investigating.. No.

[Kilmer17]

While not criminal, it's just another reminder of her complete disregard to stated policy and her belief that she has her own set of rules.

The left wants to muddle this as a legal matter. Don't fall into that trap. This is about her character.

[chipwhich]

Chip... what part of No Criminal referral don't you understand?

The email investigations have never ever been about prosecuting a crime, as all agree no crime was committed.The investigations have always been a standard process which occurs prior to freedom of information act releases.

The fact that they are finding classified emails on Hillary's servers.. some 60 out of roughly 60,000 pages.. has everything to do with not releasing these pages to the public and nothing to do with wrong doing on the part of Hillary...

 

Where did I say anything about being criminal.  For those who work in the federal government space, we know what would happen to us if it were our email servers in our house.

[Predicto]

I think he's more knowledgeable than Clinton, Bush Jr, or President Obama were when they were running for there first term..

 

 

 

Every once in a while you say something so astonishingly wrong that I am dumbfounded.  This is one of those times.

[Predicto]

While not criminal, it's just another reminder of her complete disregard to stated policy and her belief that she has her own set of rules.

The left wants to muddle this as a legal matter. Don't fall into that trap. This is about her character.

 

 

True.  She has an arrogant character.

 

 Of course it's not "another" reminder.   It's the same reminder, repeated for the 3700th time so that for some people it comes to feel that there have been 3700 scandals.  

Where did I say anything about being criminal.  For those who work in the federal government space, we know what would happen to us if it were our email servers in our house.

 

 

When you get to be Secretary of State someday, you might find that some things change for you.