No Excuses Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 Marc Stein ✔ @ESPNSteinLineFollow Links to OKC are inevitable when subject of Shumpert comes up after OKC showed interest in defensive specialist at trade deadline I do not understand their fascination with defense only wing players. They need a JJ Reddick. Floor spacing in the worst way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sticksboi05 Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 OKC needs more than a defensive wing player, they need an actual offense if they want to win a championship not two player hero ball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bubble Screen Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 hahahaha...Dirk better than Kobe. That is simply absurd. Dirk did have some help, he was not alone in his championship. Some of you need to watch games and not numbers. It's so crazy to me. Dan Marino with zero rings is one of the top 5 QBs to ever play the game. Completely agree. It's absurd. I think people get carried away with advanced stats these days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeWolf990 Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 (edited) Thanks for answering. Is there a realistic way for a club that doesn't have much money to break into the top tier of the league? And do you think the big European leagues really have much interest in parity? Also, how much would you say a very average player in a top European league makes? Is it a situation where most of the money the players make is going to the big stars with the regular guys making a lot less--like in MLB? Or is it a little more even like it is in the NBA/NFL? yeah, it can happen. You need to make smart purchases and some teams have really strong youth academies. No, the European leagues have no interest in parody. They want to curtail the billionaires that come in and prop up clubs in to an artificial position, but no interest in helping smaller sides. England is probably the best because they share the TV revenues while other leagues do not and keep a large chunk among the big clubs. But if a club is making European competition, then that kills that. As for the last part, it depends. Star players make the most money (Cronaldo and Messi both get about $23 million a year from their clubs) and then mid tier players can get about 6 or 7 million, Youth players can make little money but unlike in the US sports where they will keep you on terrible salary because the teams control everything, in Europe they try to get their salary to the level of their ability within the squad. Reason being that a club could jump in and offer more money. THats one of the good and bad of those leagues. Players can get paid off a great stretch of form, but that contract could be an albatross if they do not live up to it. Its more like MLB, but even that comparison isnt fair. Think of those leagues as pure capitalism. Edited June 24, 2014 by JoeWolf990 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonArtest15 Posted June 24, 2014 Author Share Posted June 24, 2014 Chris Broussard @Chris_Broussard 7m LeBron James' agent Rich Paul has told Heat LeBron will exercise early termination option Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattFancy Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 Decision Part II Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinsfan834 Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 Well this just got interesting.. Any teams out there with the cap space to pair LeBron and Carmelo? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrypticVillain Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 You can find a generator for anything lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 yeah, it can happen. You need to make smart purchases and some teams have really strong youth academies. No, the European leagues have no interest in parody. They want to curtail the billionaires that come in and prop up clubs in to an artificial position, but no interest in helping smaller sides. England is probably the best because they share the TV revenues while other leagues do not and keep a large chunk among the big clubs. But if a club is making European competition, then that kills that. As for the last part, it depends. Star players make the most money (Cronaldo and Messi both get about $23 million a year from their clubs) and then mid tier players can get about 6 or 7 million, Youth players can make little money but unlike in the US sports where they will keep you on terrible salary because the teams control everything, in Europe they try to get their salary to the level of their ability within the squad. Reason being that a club could jump in and offer more money. THats one of the good and bad of those leagues. Players can get paid off a great stretch of form, but that contract could be an albatross if they do not live up to it. Its more like MLB, but even that comparison isnt fair. Think of those leagues as pure capitalism. Again, thanks for answering. It sounds like MLB in a lot of ways--the value of farm systems, the lack of a ceiling on player contracts, the lack of a cap. But it also sounds like money has more of an influence on the outcome of matches in soccer than it does in MLB. I say that because it seems like great individual soccer players can have more of an impact than baseball players, and you see a lot of baseball teams in this 70-90 million in payroll range competing just as well as the ones that spend way more. The reason I'm asking is because I sensed that the European leagues were a lot more capitalistic than the American leagues and are kind of a control case for American leagues. American leagues are pretty committed to parity and owners are generally very tight knit and cooperative. All of our leagues really are a true league of owners/executives. Relegation doesn't exist. Contraction is unheard of. These people do business with each other forever. Revenue sharing, a draft, a salary cap, and max/rookie scale contracts in the NBA/NFL are good for ownership, which I think ends up being good for the league as a whole. The product can end up being pretty state of the art for virtually every franchise and the prestige of the leagues is really high. The best talent in the world comes through. And the strong brands of the league really end up propping up the weaker ones so the overall brand of the league is very good. What I'm wondering is if, in the end, that's actually good for players too. As in, it increases player wages on average. The league gets X amount of revenue and the players get X percentage of total revenue as determined by the CBA. So if the league makes more money, they make more money. In a very regulated league like the NBA, wages for decent players are great. Marcin Gortat is most likely going to sign a 40+ million dollar contract this summer. And mid and lower level players make good money. The contracts are almost fully guaranteed too. I think parity is very valuable for a league and the NFL has really demonstrated that. The NBA has much less parity, but even fans of teams like the Wizards have hope. The Wizards brand can be strong even when they're awful. I mean jeez, the Bucks sold for 500 million dollars and the Clippers are getting sold for 2 billion. I'm thinking that the competition between ownership and players is not zero sum. Players give up control here (max/scale contracts, a salary cap, a draft), owners give up control there (guaranteed contracts, a salary floor, free agency), the end result is everyone makes more money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93 Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 Jesus man, this offseason is gonna be unbearable lol 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sticksboi05 Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 I think parity is very valuable for a league and the NHL has really demonstrated that. The NBA has much less parity, but even fans of teams like the Wizards have hope. The Wizards brand can be strong even when they're awful. I mean jeez, the Bucks sold for 500 million dollars and the Clippers are getting sold for 2 billion. I'm thinking that the competition between ownership and players is not zero sum. Players give up control here (max/scale contracts, a salary cap, a draft), owners give up control there (guaranteed contracts, a salary floor, free agency), the end result is everyone makes more money. Fixed it for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DM72 Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 Well this just got interesting.. Any teams out there with the cap space to pair LeBron and Carmelo? The Sixers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skin'emAlive Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 I think it's funny that there is a 0% possibility that Washington even tries to look at either Lebron or Carmelo. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sticksboi05 Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 Decision Part II I still think he'll just go back to Miami he just wants them to know he could leave if he wanted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93 Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 Yeah I'd say as this point, LBJ and Love stay and Melo moves to Chicago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 Chris Broussard @Chris_Broussard 7m LeBron James' agent Rich Paul has told Heat LeBron will exercise early termination option I really think this is a mistake for him. You never know what the future holds, but I really think he'll make way more money in the end if he opts into his deal the next two years and then negotiates his next contract in the summer of 2016. He's 31 then, I think it's a really good bet he commands a five year max deal at that time. But say he leaves Miami, that's a four year max deal. Then he's negotiating his next deal in the summer of 2018 and he's 33 then. I don't think it's nearly as good a bet to get that 5 year max deal at that point. Or say he signs a 5 year max deal this summer with Miami. Then the next contract is summer of 2019 and he's 34. That's a sketchy bet for a five year max deal. His current contract is basically max money for the next two years. Sign another one for the five years after that. That's seven years where I believe you can be very confident he'll be making max money. But by opting out, he's only guaranteeing that he'll have four or five years at max salary. I don't know, I guess it can make sense to get the five sure thing years this sumer in lieu of the 7 probable years in two summers. There is always potential for a career altering injury. Plus the max he can get this summer will be 35% of the cap because he's passed 10 years veterancy. And maybe he will be able to negotiate another max deal when this deal he signs this summer ends. Then the bet paid off majorly. And who knows? Maybe he opted out because he wants to take a paycut with the hope it'll encourage Wade and Bosh to do it too so that Miami can get below the cap and get some help. Yeah I'd say as this point, LBJ and Love stay and Melo moves to Chicago. Minny will trade Love if they get a good enough offer. But unless Minny gets to the playoffs and makes a run this season, Love is gone next summer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattFancy Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 I still think he'll just go back to Miami he just wants them to know he could leave if he wanted. I think if we see Wade and Bosh both opt out, it's a lock all 3 will be back in Miami. If it's just LeBron, I think he could be gone. Where, I have no clue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@DCGoldPants Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 Watching folks on twitter questioning his loyalty to Miami. No....really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonArtest15 Posted June 24, 2014 Author Share Posted June 24, 2014 Lebron's "decision" (no pun), falls on the heels of what both Wade and Bosh do. He made a smart move, the rest is up to Wade/Bosh and the Heat FO to figure out where to go next. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeWolf990 Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 Again, thanks for answering. It sounds like MLB in a lot of ways--the value of farm systems, the lack of a ceiling on player contracts, the lack of a cap. But it also sounds like money has more of an influence on the outcome of matches in soccer than it does in MLB. I say that because it seems like great individual soccer players can have more of an impact than baseball players, and you see a lot of baseball teams in this 70-90 million in payroll range competing just as well as the ones that spend way more. The reason I'm asking is because I sensed that the European leagues were a lot more capitalistic than the American leagues and are kind of a control case for American leagues. American leagues are pretty committed to parity and owners are generally very tight knit and cooperative. All of our leagues really are a true league of owners/executives. Relegation doesn't exist. Contraction is unheard of. These people do business with each other forever. Revenue sharing, a draft, a salary cap, and max/rookie scale contracts in the NBA/NFL are good for ownership, which I think ends up being good for the league as a whole. The product can end up being pretty state of the art for virtually every franchise and the prestige of the leagues is really high. The best talent in the world comes through. And the strong brands of the league really end up propping up the weaker ones so the overall brand of the league is very good. What I'm wondering is if, in the end, that's actually good for players too. As in, it increases player wages on average. The league gets X amount of revenue and the players get X percentage of total revenue as determined by the CBA. So if the league makes more money, they make more money. In a very regulated league like the NBA, wages for decent players are great. Marcin Gortat is most likely going to sign a 40+ million dollar contract this summer. And mid and lower level players make good money. The contracts are almost fully guaranteed too. I think parity is very valuable for a league and the NFL has really demonstrated that. The NBA has much less parity, but even fans of teams like the Wizards have hope. The Wizards brand can be strong even when they're awful. I mean jeez, the Bucks sold for 500 million dollars and the Clippers are getting sold for 2 billion. I'm thinking that the competition between ownership and players is not zero sum. Players give up control here (max/scale contracts, a salary cap, a draft), owners give up control there (guaranteed contracts, a salary floor, free agency), the end result is everyone makes more money. thing is, that leads to a wack product. The NFL's quality of play has declined over the last few years. Its an open secret. Some teams do not have to compete because revenues are guaranteed. And like you said, there is a salary floor and cap. I actually prefer the European/South American model to sports. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattFancy Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 Watching folks on twitter questioning his loyalty to Miami. No....really. That is probably the best thing of the day. That and people calling him a "trader". Twitter really brings out all the stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hersh Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 There is no reason for LeBron to go back to Miami. Wade can't be relied on in the playoffs and, if you are Bosh, do you really opt out to take significantly less money? Either LeBron or Carmelo will end up in Chicago. If the Wizards were smart, they would at least have a conversation with LeBron and if he's not interested, inform him that they might be willing to help a team he wants to go get under the cap. Wiz need to think long term and keep acquiring assets, but I don't think EG is capable of that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeWolf990 Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 Bron is going to stay in Miami, he just making sure he the highest paid player in the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattFancy Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 Bron is going to stay in Miami, he just making sure he the highest paid player in the league. But doing that really limits the roster flexibility for the Heat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 That is probably the best thing of the day. That and people calling him a "trader". Twitter really brings out all the stupid. :lol: But doing that really limits the roster flexibility for the Heat Well, they aren't going to have any flexibility anyway unless Wade and Bosh take paycuts. If they're over the cap, they've at least got the MLE. I really doubt they'll be able to get 5 or 6 million under the cap so they might as well stay over it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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