HTTR24-7; Fun With Weapons; Chris Thompson Can Take Redskins Offense Over The Top

[flexxskins]

Every now and then we ran a kind of swing pass to Banks coming out of the backfield that I would love to see Thompson run. Banks always got positive yards on the play, but as we all know he had a tendency to head straight for the sideline once some yards were picked up (probably best that he did since he bobbled/fumbled the ball so much). But, I think a player like Thompson could be used in a play like that for even more positive yards and a bigger possibility of taking it to the house.

[RG3Hunna]

'Over the top' to me means far more then the benefits I wrote about Thompson's adding to the offense.

Yes, I have NFL rewind but I don't need to re-watch those games to know the offense sputtered at times. But that does not change the facts about our still underrated production on offense.

But, I don't think the offense sputtered because of lack of an explosive 3rd down back. To my eye the offense sputtered because of injury (Garcon, Davis and to a lesser extent Aldrick Robinson and Josh Morgan) and lack of pass protection in the non-playaction passing (specifically RT Tyler Polumbus) and an overall consercative approach on 3rd downs (rightfully so, which helped limit Griffin's turnovers).

Regardless of whether or not DC have been trying to 'stop' the read-option. (If they could 'stop' the read option they would already be doing it). No one is saying we should head into the season without adding to the offense, that's absurd. And I hope people don't expect the same production as last year and you mention above. Last year was a rare and imo underappreciated high water mark that is a nice goal to strive for but should not be the expectation. (#1 rushing #4 in points #5 in yards #6 passing efficiency).

This offense is going to expand for several reasons regardless of the RB: health, chemistry, growth/development of Griffin, expansion of schemes and concepts, (hopefully) improved pass protection, development of receivers Hankerson, Morgan, Robinson and Reed.

I respectfully disagree with both of those statements extremely.

You state the offense is going to expand simply because of health,chemistry growth development of griffin and expansion of scheme and concept yet you fail to realize you can't expand if you don't have the explosive play makers to accomplish that. Hankerson (Average still needs work and not a play maker) Morgan (Average yet very consistent and not a play maker ) Robinson (is a super fast player however only straight line speed and yet makes NO play maker like impact on the field currently). Garcon and Fred Davis are our only explosive play makers (Fred Davis coming off an Achilles injury) (Garcon with a nagging foot injury)

Chris Thompson is a explosive play maker, adding him to the roster opens up the offense because now we can run screens etc with our RB when blitzed. Screens neutralize overly aggressive defenses, This year we were not able to incorporate that in our offense, teams are going to be coming after us trying to out physical us (Even though RG3 is very good against the blitz) we still want to be able to punish them other ways by a simple "RB screen".

How many times have we had Evan Royster line up on the line of scrimmage? or run a screen? or run the football? quite a few times and he has accomplished absolutely NOTHING with those opportunities. Imagine Chris Thompson put on the line of scrimmage? Who are you going to cover him with? Imagine Chris Thompson on a screen? Imagine Chris Thompson actually finding a hole in a running opportunity? Chris Thompson is going to take our offense to another level he brings speed and explosion and he's a play maker you can't coach that.

1:01 we don't have ANYBODY on the roster who can do that (even with Roy Helu he was more straight line speed he's never had the play maker like agility Thompson has) and now we do in Chris Thompson, Kid is a BEAST.

[DaGoonie55]

Great article and great discussion.

The thought of a two TE and two back zone read offense makes my head hurt. This could definitely keep the DCs on their toes.

Thompson may very well be a missing piece of this team. That, in conjunction with other additions and healthy returning players, we could be primed for a deep run in the paloffs.

HTTR!

[darrelgreenie]

What exactly do disagree with? That offenes improve with chemistry? As a QB grows in the system? As the WRs develop? As the scheme itself expands? Improved pass protection? How can you disagree that any of the above make an offense better?

...~a lot of stuff about the offense...we don't have ANYBODY on the roster who can do that (even with Roy Helu he was more straight line speed he's never had the play maker like agility Thompson has) and now we do in Chris Thompson, Kid is a BEAST.

Dude, did you read my posts? I agree with most of what you say about Thompson, in fact I've already said many of the things you mention above. However, you are not going to change my opinion that a back-up RB cannot and will not put an offense 'over the top'. I explained the specific and schematic ways I think Thompson can have a postive effect on the offense. But a checkdown option isn't going to make an offense dynamic.

What type of production do you expect from Thompson to warrant his 'putting the offense over the top' and which players will those targets come from? Garcon? Davis?

And imo it is hypocritical to dismiss the potential of Hankerson, Morgan and Aldrick Robinson, players who have already proven they can contribute in the league then turn around an extol an unproven rookie ahead of them.

---------- Post added May-13th-2013 at 06:46 PM ----------

The impact you are describing is the impact a lead back would have not a 3rd down/change of pace back.

[RG3Hunna]

---------- Post added May-13th-2013 at 09:35 PM ----------

What exactly do disagree with? That offenes improve with chemistry? As a QB grows in the system? As the WRs develop? As the scheme itself expands? Improved pass protection? How can you disagree that any of the above make an offense better?

Dude, did you read my posts? I agree with most of what you say about Thompson, in fact I've already said many of the things you mention above. However, you are not going to change my opinion that a back-up RB cannot and will not put an offense 'over the top'. I explained the specific and schematic ways I think Thompson can have a postive effect on the offense. But a checkdown option isn't going to make an offense dynamic.

What type of production do you expect from Thompson to warrant his 'putting the offense over the top' and which players will those targets come from? Garcon? Davis?

And imo it is hypocritical to dismiss the potential of Hankerson, Morgan and Aldrick Robinson, players who have already proven they can contribute in the league then turn around an extol an unproven rookie ahead of them.

---------- Post added May-13th-2013 at 06:46 PM ----------

The impact you are describing is the impact a lead back would have not a 3rd down/change of pace back.

Wait, so Darren Sproles a "3rd down change of pace back" doesn't put New Orleans offense over the top? LMAO

If Darren Sproles was removed from the saints roster they would lose so much explosion from that offense. Sproles is the one player on that offense other than Graham that puts fear in defensive coordinators. You lose sproles and that offense becomes Brees and Graham (Colston doesn't scare me anymore) . 90% of the teams in the league would love to have a Darren Sproles element on their roster.

What have Hankerson, Morgan or Alderick Robinson showed you? We were considering finding their replacement at #51 in the draft this year bro plus Robinson and Morgan might not even be on the roster after next year. This is a make or break year for hankerson, if he doesn't beat out morgan for the starting job Shanahan will find his replacement this offseason and hankerson will become "Depth".

Just like you have your opinion I have my opinion and my opinion is play makers like Chris Thompson and Jordan Reed are going to put our offense over the top if used properly. Shanahan said he had a 1st/2nd round grade on Chris Thompson prior to the acl injury so obviously he sees something in chris thompson and the difference between Thompson and other fast explosive change of pace backs is he actually will embrace contact and stick his nose in a pile/run up the tackles rather than always looking to run to the sideline like "Reggie Bush" in new orleans.

[darrelgreenie]

Wait, so Darren Sproles a "3rd down change of pace back" doesn't put New Orleans offense over the top? LMAO

If Darren Sproles was removed from the saints roster they would lose so much explosion from that offense. Sproles is the one player on that offense other than Graham that puts fear in defensive coordinators. You lose sproles and that offense becomes Brees and Graham (Colston doesn't scare me anymore) . 90% of the teams in the league would love to have a Darren Sproles element on their roster.

They were a top offense BEFORE Sproles got there. In fact their highwater mark was 2009 (pre-Sproles), when they were the #1 offense and you know like won the Super Bowl and stuff.

What have Hankerson, Morgan or Alderick Robinson showed you?........ and hankerson will become "Depth".

Hello? Thompson hasn't taken a snap in the NFL, therefore Hankerson, Robinson, Morgan have all shown more then Thompson and Thompson will come into camp as "Depth"

Just like you have your opinion I have my opinion and my opinion is play

makers like Chris Thompson and Jordan Reed are going to put our offense over the

top if used properly.

Its cool to disagree, there is no need to get all bent out of shape over it.

But I ask again what type of production do you expect from Thompson to quantify 'putting the offense over the top' is he gonna have Darren Sproles like production as a rookie? I'm asking but you seem to avoid having the discussion about quantifying the impact you think Thompson will have.

And are you gonna answer any of the questions I ask?

...the difference between Thompson and other fast explosive change of pace backs is he actually will embrace contact and stick his nose in a pile/run up the tackles rather than always looking to run to the sideline like "Reggie Bush" in new orleans.

Um what? We should all hope Thompson comes close to being the back that Reggie Bush was/is.

Reggie Bush (rookie season) 8 TDs 565 yds rushing 88 catches 742 yards receiving.

Its kinda hypocritical to pan Reggie Bush and praise Sproles. Its also hypocritical to praise Thompson for his potential to 'put the offense over the top' then turn around and pan a guy who has actually produced at the level you expect Thompson to produce.

You are all over the place bro.

Bottom line for me is this: I like Thompson but the way I understand this offense he'll be back-up complementary player. And imo those players cannot/do not put an offense 'over the top'.

For me its primary players like feature RBs, primary receivers (#1-3 WR, #1-2 TE) quality bookend OTs that have the ability to put an offense 'over the top'.

I'm not sure what you find so disagreeable about that.

And unless you answer the questions or give quantifiable expectations for 'putting the offense over the top' there really isn't much to discuss.

We can simply agree to disagree.

[Kindred]

1:01 we don't have ANYBODY on the roster who can do that (even with Roy Helu he was more straight line speed he's never had the play maker like agility Thompson has) and now we do in Chris Thompson, Kid is a BEAST.

word. This one clip has me super excited

[MartinC]

Are you guys trying to say Psyched or....

am I just too old to understand the "new fangled" language kids are speaking these days?

I was thinking it was just me - but then given my age is similar to yours ......

---------- Post added May-14th-2013 at 03:48 AM ----------

Banks always got positive yards on the play, but as we all know he had a tendency to head straight for the sideline once some yards were picked up (probably best that he did since he bobbled/fumbled the ball so much). But, I think a player like Thompson could be used in a play like that for even more positive yards and a bigger possibility of taking it to the house.

Banks was flat a waste of a roster spot last year. He averaged less than 2 yards per pass reception (18 yards on 8 catches). He has 1 single positive play last year on offense which was a carry (on a reverse I think ) that went for 21 yards. Take out that one single play and you might as well have lined up me in the backfield. His returns were average at best and poor at worst and then he started fielding punts inside his own 5......

Adding a player like Thompson with his speed, running ability and ability to make players miss if he gets to the open field will add something we were missing last year - a home run threat out of the backfield and someone defences have to account for out of the backfield on passing downs as more than just a checkdown.

[Thinking Skins]

Okay, then in that case I agree.

I do wish we had a more complete back as part of our depth. I feel like all our backs outside of Morris are specialty guys that couldn't sustain a 20+ carries diet if needed.

But, I guess we'll see come camp. I always liked Helu and Royster but neither seem like the backs they were 2 years ago.

Why do you say that? I wasn't really that impressed with them two years ago, but that being said, I don't think they've lost much from that point. The problem with them then and last year was that they couldn't stay healthy. And what you saw was Morris take advantage of that. I don't know how much stock I'm putting in this Chris Thompson guy for that same reason. Given he doesn't have anything like chronic knee issues, but he may just bruise easily which still doesn't make me feel good for an every down back. Maybe Royster and Jamison can compete for the backup spot and hopefully one of them can stay healthy.

I really just hope Morris doesn't take a step back this year. I think about what happened in Tampa Bay with Cadillac Williams and then Lagarrette Blount and then Doug Martin, its like a revolving door and they've all had good seasons - given none as good as Morris's season last year. Hopefully Morris's second season is closer to his first than to Blount, Martin, Helu and Royster's.

[martytheman]

1:01 we don't have ANYBODY on the roster who can do that (even with Roy Helu he was more straight line speed he's never had the play maker like agility Thompson has) and now we do in Chris Thompson, Kid is a BEAST.

Some thoughts on the post and video:

Fl St. has some LOUSY run blocking.

Thompson has some SICK lateral agility.. that plus his speed really stands out on tape.

I hope he is able to stay healthy, because that guy could be dangerous in this offense..

[LD0506]

Amazing to see such a heated argument on a 5th round RB that has yet to play a single down.

He'll get his chance but like so many other conversations, this one focuses strictly on him in a vacuum when his usefulness will be determined by things like, how well he learns the scheme or can he pick up a blitzer and block him. Shanny absolutely demands multitasking players, ie. WRs blocking downfield, etc. There is a wider context to how Thompson might produce for us, he's interesting at this point but little else.

In the end I'm positive about him though, the staff has some serious competition there and someone is going to have to really step up to earn that slot. I do believe that Kyle is drooling over all the "what if?s" the same way we are, teams that prepare for last season's Skins will find some new wrinkles to deal with.

[WhoRUSupposed2Be]

Are you guys trying to say Psyched or....

It's a DC saying my good man.

am I just too old to understand the "new fangled" language kids are speaking these days?

Yeah, you're way beyond the language barrier now

[Kindred]

Amazing to see such a heated argument on a 5th round RB that has yet to play a single down.

He'll get his chance but like so many other conversations, this one focuses strictly on him in a vacuum when his usefulness will be determined by things like, how well he learns the scheme or can he pick up a blitzer and block him. Shanny absolutely demands multitasking players, ie. WRs blocking downfield, etc. There is a wider context to how Thompson might produce for us, he's interesting at this point but little else.

In the end I'm positive about him though, the staff has some serious competition there and someone is going to have to really step up to earn that slot. I do believe that Kyle is drooling over all the "what if?s" the same way we are, teams that prepare for last season's Skins will find some new wrinkles to deal with.

If Shanny's 6th round RB's end up like Morris, imagine what his 5th round RB's might be capable of

[Lavarleap56]

Amazing to see such a heated argument on a 5th round RB that has yet to play a single down.

He'll get his chance but like so many other conversations, this one focuses strictly on him in a vacuum when his usefulness will be determined by things like, how well he learns the scheme or can he pick up a blitzer and block him. Shanny absolutely demands multitasking players, ie. WRs blocking downfield, etc. There is a wider context to how Thompson might produce for us, he's interesting at this point but little else.

In the end I'm positive about him though, the staff has some serious competition there and someone is going to have to really step up to earn that slot. I do believe that Kyle is drooling over all the "what if?s" the same way we are, teams that prepare for last season's Skins will find some new wrinkles to deal with.

Thompson isn't your average late round flyer taken by Shanahan.. Mike, Kyle , and Bobby T LOVE Thompson & brought him in to play and play early. He already knows most of the scheme and it's down to verbage and getting healthy.

[Mr. Sinister]

Thompson isn't your average late round flyer taken by Shanahan.. Mike, Kyle , and Bobby T LOVE Thompson & brought him in to play and play early. He already knows most of the scheme and it's down to verbage and getting healthy.

Any info on how the rehab has gone?

[Lavarleap56]

Any info on how the rehab has gone?

Great.. being cautious and he will be ready for camps.

[kingdaddy]

Mark my words.....if Chris Thompson is healthy, and good enough to make this team, and if RG lll is healthy for at least 12 games this season, the Skins will at least be in the NFC Championship game. I believe Chris Thompson is a 3rd down game breaker. He's our Darren Sproles. The Skins will be loaded on offense if everyone is healthy. RG lll is gonna go crazy.

[Saqs]

Great.. being cautious and he will be ready for camps.

Good news. I'm pulling for the kid for sure.

[darrelgreenie]

Why do you say that? I wasn't really that impressed with them two years ago, but that being said, I don't think they've lost much from that point. The problem with them then and last year was that they couldn't stay healthy.

In their rookie years both backs showed the vision to be 100+ yard backs in this system when given the carries. Helu also proved to be a reliable checkdown receiver. Last year Helu was down with a rather serious injury for a RB and Royster played but was banged up during camp and looked to my eye like he lost his quick footed cutting ability he displayed as rookie. Now I have my doubts about either back being a 100+ yard capable.

And what you saw was Morris take advantage of that. I don't know how much

stock I'm putting in this Chris Thompson guy for that same reason. Given he

doesn't have anything like chronic knee issues, but he may just bruise easily

which still doesn't make me feel good for an every down back.

I like Thompson a lot as a 3rd down back/specialty spread/read option player. But even at his best I don't see him as an every down back. I too hope Helu/Royster return to form or Jamison shows the ability to be a 20+ carries 100+ yard capable back.

I really just hope Morris doesn't take a step back this year. I think about what happened in Tampa Bay with Cadillac Williams and then Lagarrette Blount and then Doug Martin, its like a revolving door and they've all had good seasons - given none as good as Morris's season last year. Hopefully Morris's second season is closer to his first than to Blount, Martin, Helu and Royster's.

If healthy I don't see Morris production slipping unless something goes wrong upfront on the OL or Griffin is out an extended period of time. An back in our current scheme is going to benefit greatly from the open running lanes Griffin + scheme create.

[Thinking Skins]

If healthy I don't see Morris production slipping unless something goes wrong upfront on the OL or Griffin is out an extended period of time. An back in our current scheme is going to benefit greatly from the open running lanes Griffin + scheme create.

I don't know. Shanny doesn't really have a history of backs lasting long with him. Even TD and Portis left him (one retired, one was traded). Those are the two exceptions though. Look at everybody else and its full of one year wonders. Maybe I'm in my post-Caps loss mood where I'm doubting everything, but I just hope that Morris doesn't suffer a setback.

[Koolblue13]

I don't know. Shanny doesn't really have a history of backs lasting long with him. Even TD and Portis left him (one retired, one was traded). Those are the two exceptions though. Look at everybody else and its full of one year wonders. Maybe I'm in my post-Caps loss mood where I'm doubting everything, but I just hope that Morris doesn't suffer a setback.

I think we'll get a couple of years out of Morris before his eventual early fade out. He was what? Second in the league in carries last year? I doubt that will change. Shanny likes to pick his horse and run it into the ground.

[ArmchairRedskin]

I feel like Morris' workload will lighten. I think if both guys are healthy, then you can put Helu and Thompson in fairly often. Both Helu and Thompson ran the option in college so even though neither have done it with the Redskins, there is enough familiarity there for them to be comfortable in it.

I don't think you have to leave Morris in like last year when the other options were Banks and Royster, both of whom were a definite downgrade when you put them in the stead of Morris. Helu and Thompson each provide their own unique upsides.

I mean, maybe I'm wrong and Morris will still get 300+ carries, but honestly, unless it's a health issue, then I look for his carries to be well under 300.

[KCClybun]

I think ideally, the Redskins want to keep Morris fresher. Dude has a lot of miles on him; he was basically FAU's entire offense for four years, then we put 300+ carries on him last year. The great thing is he's still young so it's not like he's going to fall off a cliff, but the guy needs someone to spell him.

I'd expect either Helu or Jamison to be the spell back while Thompson was the change of pace back. Keeping Alfred fresher longer can only be a good thing for us.

[Momma There Goes That Man]

I feel like Morris' workload will lighten. I think if both guys are healthy, then you can put Helu and Thompson in fairly often. Both Helu and Thompson ran the option in college so even though neither have done it with the Redskins, there is enough familiarity there for them to be comfortable in it.

I don't think you have to leave Morris in like last year when the other options were Banks and Royster, both of whom were a definite downgrade when you put them in the stead of Morris. Helu and Thompson each provide their own unique upsides.

I mean, maybe I'm wrong and Morris will still get 300+ carries, but honestly, unless it's a health issue, then I look for his carries to be well under 300.

This is what I think as well. I look for Morris' production to drop but only because I look for his carries to drop. I'd get him about 18 touches a game and mix up Thompson or a Helu in for the others if their health warrants it. I want Morris around a long time so I'd rather not run the wheels off. I also expect Griffin to pass more this season which rescue the number of carries as well.

[Mr. Sinister]

I don't know. Shanny doesn't really have a history of backs lasting long with him. Even TD and Portis left him (one retired, one was traded). Those are the two exceptions though. Look at everybody else and its full of one year wonders. Maybe I'm in my post-Caps loss mood where I'm doubting everything, but I just hope that Morris doesn't suffer a setback.

I don't think he'll see as many carries this year, with guys returning from injury, and new guys being drafted, so I think he'll be fine health wise (If that's what you were referring to when you said "setback"). His production stat wise will definitely slip a little though, if all the the RB's stay relatively healthy during the season, and contribute. I don't think his YPC will suffer at all though. It might actually be better because of the fewer carries.

Contract wise I think they will look elsewhere when his current one expires. However, I can't see him staying on his current contract if he has another season like last year. It wouldn't even be right not to at least give a guy something decent when he would've outperformed his 6th round rookie contract to that degree.

Anyways, if Thompson is healthy throughout the season, playing all 16 then I could easily see something like this in terms of stats (again, assuming we keep at least 3 backs in a rotation with Morris obviously being the top dog):

Carries - 74

Yards - 398

YPC - 5.3

...

Catches - 32

Yards - 431

Total TD's - 8 (4 rushing, 4 receiving)