IWantMyATV Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 I think every coach and former coach/GM I've heard talk on TV has seemed to state firmly that the goal is to draft the best player available. I think it's sort of an emotional response as opposed to an objective look at how to maximize draft picks when people decry the front office for doing what I presume was drafting a player they believed is the best player available. Going with the most popular personnel decision is what caused this team to be put together atrociously for a solid decade. When you begin to consistently draft the players you deem best player available those players will feel valued and buy into the fact that their talents will be put to good use, which is just my one perspective on it. I think there are probably a hundred reasons why the BPA strategy strictly dominates drafting for need. Have some faith in the front office -- aren't there a ton of threads about how smart our scouts supposedly are? I think the awful Stephen A./Skip Bayless/Eric Mangini conversation brought up a good point, which is that football decisions can be made due to public pressure. I can't help but think that public pressure has contributed to piss poor team management. Maybe I'm romanticizing things, but I think the Packers and Steelers don't worry about that, because they've built up enough trust with their fan bases. Every Redskin fan wishes they were in Dan Snyder's shoes, getting to call the shots. And, hate to break this to you all but, like Dan Snyder, none of us belong anywhere near the controls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDawg Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Alameda Ta'amu, who's expected to start Week One for the Pittsburgh Steelers if Casey Hampton is unable to play, could certainly crack this lineup. Certainly? Or has the possibility to crack the lineup? Be careful when dealing in absolutes. They're never absolute. LeRibeus might work out, but just want to throw this in, because it's funny. I know it's not rocket science, but I thought intelligence was required for the ZBS. I can't tell if you just added it to be funny, but the "I thought intelligence was required for the ZBS" line gives me pause. let me see if I follow you here... He swore. So he's an idiot? Alrighty. I'm the biggest moron on the planet, then Gettis and Compton may work out, too. I don't know if people saying Gettis is a better prospect than LeRibeus is praise of Gettis or criticism of LB. But Phillip Blake and Joe Looney (drafted by the Niners in their ZBS scheme), were both picked in the fourth and should have at least as much ability to contribute as the guys we did bring in, certainly more than Cousins will unless RG3 busts. There's a lot to talk about in this small paragraph. Shanahan said that we got the top three linemen on our board. I believe him. All three of the guys we drafted are tremendous zone blocking linemen at their respective levels. They're quick and powerful. They have excellent footwork. Furthermore, the 49ers do not run a ZBS. They are a power running team. And to top it off, Cousins doesn't only have value if RG3 busts. He has value if RG3 is injured. People keep overlooking that. Almost as if it's not a REAL possibility. It is, folks. He could potentially get hurt. Great info about the draft secondary thanks. Question, not arguing: So you think Boykin, who's still projected to be a speedster, wouldn't be a great asset to our secondary not known for it's 1-1 cover guys? What does speed have to do with coverage ability as a whole? I think everybody in the 3rd and 4th round is usually depth (Ta'amu being kind of an exception with the Steelers, with Hampton's uncertainty). All the guys we picked 4th round and later are depth with the possibility of starting. Except Cousins with whom, unless he's the next Tom Brady, we're screwed if he has to see significant playing time the next couple seasons. No. If he doesn't see significant playing time the next few seasons that's a good thing, because that means our franchise quarterback is doing his thing. The reason we drafted him is just in case he HAS to see significant playing time. Obviously, Shanahan believes he could contribute. The guys I listed here and in my previous posts including good LB picks (Brandon, Wilber), could contribute immediately and have a chance to start even if things go well for us. Cousins is only starting if we have a disaster. How do these linebackers have a chance to start this year? London Fletcher and Perry Riley both played very well last year. As did Rak and Kerrigan. Who are they starting over? No one. Drafting them means slightly more PT than a backup quarterback would get, but ultimately, it's the same position. Depth. Why is it more important to DRAFT depth there than it is to DRAFT depth at QB? We signed Jonathan Goff and drafted Keenan Robinson at LB. We resigned London and we have Riley. We did the same thing at QB. We drafted a starter (RG3), resigned a backup (Rex) and drafted a backup (Cousins). And if anything, quarterback is more important to have options at. If your argument is Cousins stinks, that's your cross to bear and battle out. But I'd argue that the Shanahan's judgment is better than yours or mine. Lol, good one. What I mean is, the guys we passed over in the 4th round have far, far, more chance to start and help us win than Cousins. If Cousins starts, unless he's Tom Brady 2.0, we're in trouble with a 5-11 team with no #1 draft pick the next two years. So this is more about YOUR evaluation of Cousins more than it is selecting a backup quarterback? That's an entirely different conversation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinC Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 This may have been done already but I thought it would be interesting to see who we drafted with past 4th round picks. 2011 - Roy Helu - made a good contribution, started some games and looks like a keeper. 2010 - Perry Riley - spent rookie year on teams, won starting job part way through 2011, looks like a keeper. 2009 - None. 5th round pick was Cody Glenn. Did not stick. 2008 - Justin Tryon. Played teams and 4th corner. Traded to Colts for a bag of footballs. 2007 - None. 5th rounder was Dallas Sartz. Did not stick. 2006 - None. 5th rounder was Anthony Montgomery. Rotational player on D'Line, showed some promise but went as part of clear out when we moved to a 3-4. 2005 - Manuel White. ES man crush candidate who did not stick. The above proves nothing specifically but it does kind of highlight the point that not many recent 4th round picks stick around very long let alone crack the starting line up. Virtually none have made a significant contribution outside of special teams in their rookie year - Helu would be the exception. That might be because we drafted badly with Vinny in charge - the last two years look MUCH better than the previous years - and it does not mean that a player we drafted in the 4th other than Cousins might have made a big contribution. Its also shocking looking back how few picks we actually had in some years ...... My summary would be to everyone - especially the media - to calm down and remember its a 4th round pick. Odds are no one we drafted this year in the 4th would have addressed an immediate need outside of special teams and getting a solid to good back up QB would be a heck of an improvement on what we got from say Manuel White or Dallas Sartz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HailGreen28 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 I'd argue that shanahallen are 2-0 so far on fourth rounders, until they took a flyer on a backup qb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDawg Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 I'd argue that shanahallen are 2-0 so far on fourth rounders, until they took a flyer on a backup qb. And how can you argue that the QB pick won't be successful? That's ridiculous logic to me. And on top of that, you're arguing that it's ALREADY a strike on the Redskins FO for even drafting him. How?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HailGreen28 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 And how can you argue that the QB pick won't be successful? That's ridiculous logic to me. And on top of that, you're arguing that it's ALREADY a strike on the Redskins FO for even drafting him. How?! because if all goes well cousins will never see the field? Because backup qb getting a high draft pick is the exception rather than the rule? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2cents Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Because they didn't draft any person's mock draft special instead. Its beyond silly at this point. We took a QB, agree or disagree, at least the folks in charge had a plan and a reason for doing it, which puts us light years ahead of the Vinnie years. "Hey his workout looked great. His knees....oh you mean medical reports and stuff.... Who needs that?" KDawg, what you need to do is make a list of all the names people wanted drafted instead of Cousins and see how many games they play and how many are out of the league in a year or two. Imagine that will be interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDawg Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 because if all goes well cousins will never see the field? Because backup qb getting a high draft pick is the exception rather than the rule? I can't see how you can POSSIBLY not see value in a backup quarterback. Joe Gibbs once said, "The most important position on the field is quarterback. The second most is backup quarterback". Grossman is the backup this year. Next year he'll get more expensive. He'll be gone. That means our backup will be a kid who fits the WCO, with a year in the system. Yes, if all goes well (meaning no freak injuries, no poor protection, no poor decisions that lead to injury) he'll never see the field. I believe the stat was posted that only 14/32 Starting NFL QBs played the entire year last year. Problem is, you can't operate in a perfect world. A backup QB is an important piece. And since when is a 4th rounder a high draft pick? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattFancy Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 And since when is a 4th rounder a high draft pick? That's what I don't get. This was a mid round pick. At this point, most of these players are on your roster for depth and if one breaks out, then good, but if not, no harm done. Who else would've been a better pick? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWFLSkins Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 I'd argue that shanahallen are 2-0 so far on fourth rounders, until they took a flyer on a backup qb. You can break an ankle jumping to conclusions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinC Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 I'd argue that shanahallen are 2-0 so far on fourth rounders, until they took a flyer on a backup qb. If the argument is that we should have used the 4th round pick to draft someone who could have helped RGIII this year - not saying that's your argument but its one I have seen on here and in print - then Shanny is 1-1. Riley hardly got any snaps on defense in his rookie year. Its rare that anyone drafted in the 4th round makes much of a contribution in their rookie year especially on offense - running back is the most likely position to be an exception. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDawg Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 If the argument is that we should have used the 4th round pick to draft someone who could have helped RGIII this year - not saying that's your argument but its one I have seen on here and in print - then Shanny is 1-1. Riley hardly got any snaps on defense in his rookie year. Its rare that anyone drafted in the 4th round makes much of a contribution in their rookie year especially on offense - running back is the most likely position to be an exception. Well... 0/2 I'd say. If he already thinks Cousins isn't a help because he's drafted to be a backup, then Helu certainly was drafted with the same purpose, and only got real shine once Hightower was injured. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrFan Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Mike Mayock talking about how much it makes sense to draft Cousins (see video around 3:00) "There is no greater depth need than a backup QB, it's an insurance policy that you develop." http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d828c84dc/article/nfc-east-draft-grades-cowboys-upgrade-d-giants-keep-rolling?module=HP11_hot_topics Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riggo-toni Posted December 9, 2012 Author Share Posted December 9, 2012 Yes I know we need OL and FS help in the worst way, but...We would be wise to pick up a developmental prospect in the draft this year. Griffin has great character and athletic ability, but noone can definitively know if he will be durable, provided he is successful. If there's a late round prospect with excellent potential to be had on the 2nd day of the draft, we should jump on it. Look at what happened to the Texans this year. RGIII is a humble guy...me, not so much. That's why I had to remind everyone how much so many of you dumped on me when I started this thread last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDawg Posted December 9, 2012 Share Posted December 9, 2012 I'd argue that shanahallen are 2-0 so far on fourth rounders, until they took a flyer on a backup qb. You were saying? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JuicyJ Posted December 9, 2012 Share Posted December 9, 2012 Well played, sir. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uptown Skins Posted December 9, 2012 Share Posted December 9, 2012 Good post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LetThePointsSoar Posted December 9, 2012 Share Posted December 9, 2012 Absolutely epic bump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redskins Ruckus Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 Repudiated w/ excellent and correct insight. Epic bump, sir. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMUSkins Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 :slowclap: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeluCopter29 Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 Well played Riggo-toni Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
santana_4_prez Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 One of the all time great calls on ES. :notworthy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhoRUSupposed2Be Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 Legends are made of threads Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Tater Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 RGIII is a humble guy...me, not so much. That's why I had to remind everyone how much so many of you dumped on me when I started this thread last year. Hey, even blind squirrels find nuts sometimes:) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riggo-toni Posted December 13, 2012 Author Share Posted December 13, 2012 Hey, even blind squirrels find nuts sometimes:) What do they scratch first thing in the morning on the other days of the year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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