Enter Apotheosis Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 Mildly concerned. I wouldn't necessarily say he was picked too early or that he's truly at risk of busting out but he may just end up being one of those mediocre/replaceable starters in the NFL. Anyone who is very concerned needs to remember that we are talking about a second year, 23 year old offensive linemen playing one of the most demanding positions in the game. It might take him another 3-4 seasons to really "get it" and reach his full potential. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elkabong82 Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 Trent has trouble with the inside move against top flight pass rushers. It seems part of it is breaking out too wide when he goes into his stance. If his knee was hyper-extended it would explain the limited mobility that game, because while I've noticed Trent struggle with the inside move, I haven't noticed him struggle throughout an entire game like that save for when he was nicked up previously. A 2nd year LT is still going to have struggles, it's a difficult position. I think those voting that his development is too slow are being rather impatient. 2nd year, no offseason, banged up, going against a talented Pierre-Paul. We all love Chris Samuels now, but people weren't always singing his praises, especially not during the Spurrier years, though scheme obviously factors into that, but my point is that a franchise LT isn't typically grown overnight and that his journey will likely have some bumps. To think a 2nd year LT w/ no recent offseason, learning a nuanced ZBS, won't struggle at times against good pass rushers, especially if banged up, is a rather absurd expectation. That's not to say Trent is a guaranteed success, but nor is he a guaranteed bust. Either outcome is possible right now, and IMO anyone claiming they already know the end outcome for Trent, good or bad, is simply reassuring their previously-made opinion of him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RemoveSnyder Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 These are some fragmented thoughts. By all accounts, and this could be my misinformed opinion, I'll grant anyone that - Williams was selected because of his freakish athletic ability. He was selected because of his speed and quickness and "apparent" agility, mostly shown during the combine, I should add - at the time. That agility and burst was shown in the pulling guard and kick-out drills. At the time it was rather impressive and by my own eyes, I said he'd be a great interior lineman if utilized in an scheme that had him do exactly that, pull and kickout, seal the edge, work in space on smaller, equally agile LBs. Which, in large part, he does here with Shanahan, by utilizing his speed. But as an edge pass protector, his tape was rather blase, so too his pro career thus far. Hence validating my initial concern. OR at least his career has been a bit mercurial. Forget validating anything. He has shown moments of getting downfield and providing a good block and he can definitely move his feet and shield a defender at times very well in pass-pro. Also, if people remember, there was a small and rather quiet rumbling about his lack of preparedness and effort to honing his god-given talent - "work ethic," as it were while at OU. Which many people can chalk up as typical pre-draft cliched detraction. It usually goes part and parcel with the "athlete" stereotype. Yet, there was still something that maybe rang true if you watched his effort on any given play, via tape at OU. Whereby he usually turned and would watch a play after his initial engagement with a defender - rather than get after another guy or continue with his man. Almost as if he had a quota of 5 to 6 seconds of action, then boom, 'I'm wheeling around and finding the play and watching / jogging.' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KCClybun Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 Not worried, really. Last season, I thought he played fine until injuries started to pile up. This year, he came into camp in much better shape and was leaner, and I thought he played really well in the preseason, and I didn't really have a problem with the way he played versus the Giants either. People act like he got abused the whole game, but I think he was about even with JPP most of the day, until he rolled his knee. Once he hurt his knee, that's when he really started to struggle, but I think any tackle would. I agree he needs to be more consistent, but I'm not panicky about it. I still think he plays well more often than he plays poorly. We probably won't be talking much about him next week, just like we didn't talk about him when he was up against Suggs in week 3 or talk about him in week 1. He's still a phenomenal talent that's only going to get better. Switching JB and TW now only weakens the o-line. It doesn't strength it. (And yeah, Brown went to the Pro Bowl, but I seem to remember him being close to the top 10 in QB pressures.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThePreciating Posted September 12, 2011 Author Share Posted September 12, 2011 Don't get me wrong, Pierre-Paul is a rising star for sure. However, JPP froze TW in his stance on more than one occasion by doing nothing more than a little dance-and-slap. If that's enough to freeze Trent, what the hell are we going to do about DeMarcus Ware or the improved Philly line? Can you imagine what field days Osi and Tuck would have with TW if he played the way he did yesterday? I still have hope for Trent, but this is the NFC East. Unless we want Rex on the IR, Trent needs to step up his game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 I clearly saw the play where he tweaked his knee. He gutted it out from there. i still feel pretty good about him, especially in the run game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RemoveSnyder Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 This was a concern with drafting Williams - what does he do when banged up? Work everything else: film study, preparedness, technique to their max or does he become marginalized now that the athleticism takes a ding? That's up to him and his brain and willpower. Essentially his entire make-up, everything but the physical athlete that was drafted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laurent Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 I'm concerned about his knee more than anything after seeing it buckle during the game. Forgot exactly when the play took place, but I remember cursing up a storm when he stayed on the ground. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HailToTheRedskins14 Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 Honestly not too concerned. I think at worst he'll be a solid LT and he has the potential to be a top LT in the league. One iffy game and he's a bust? Come on now. Sometimes you get beat. I say props for playing a full game while injured. That's pretty impressive. At least he didn't roll over and quit like some of our former players would have. I like the toughness. And we saw plenty to be happy about last year when he ran the gauntlet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jflow78 Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 So, I will say, he's noticed WAY too much. I don't think I remember noticing Samuels after his rookie season for about 8 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinfan2k Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 There isn't really a big differene in our offensive line from last year. Chris Chester thats it. lol. Trent Williams is gonna play out his contract and then he will be gone. Since we have a lot of picks next year, i expect after the QB and ILB are chosen, we are gonna draft C/G combinations in rounds 3-5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HailToTheRedskins14 Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 There isn't really a big differene in our offensive line from last year. Chris Chester thats it. lol. Trent Williams is gonna play out his contract and then he will be gone. Since we have a lot of picks next year, i expect after the QB and ILB are chosen, we are gonna draft C/G combinations in rounds 3-5 Biggest addition of the offseason was addition by subtraction of Casey freaking Rabach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinfan2k Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 Biggest addition of the offseason was addition by subtraction of Casey freaking Rabach. Oh i agree but if u watch the tape again, Trent Kory and Will looked bad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thirtyfive2seven Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 I can't vote on this because there needs to be another option which is concerned that he may be injured. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gkekoa Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 He was not drafted as the best OT in the draft last season...he was drafted as the one with the most upside. I am concerned; however, time will tell ulimately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedskinsInFebruary Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 Check out the replay of the sack. All Jason Pierre-Paul does is swat Williams on his right shoulder and runs past him, like...well, like he was standing still...because he was. Hyper-extended knee or no, one would expect at least a minimal effort in order to keep your quarterback form getting killed. But it was like he was off in another world. And that worries me, it really does. Yeah that play struck me as just downright strange, like he appeared lost or like he was taking the play off completely. I'd love to be there for the debriefing by the coaches, "what happened here?" "what were you doing?" "what were you thinking?" just to find out what the heck happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoDeep81 Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 Im "Concerned" for sure.. So far he's not had a "hand full of bad games", imo he's had a "hand full of good games, with the rest being poor to ugly.. Definitely not going to be referring to him as "Silverback" anymore.. Brokenback maybe.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRAVEONAWARPATH Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 I was just listening to Chris Russell and I agree with his opinion that Trent will never be a dominant LT despite his physical gifts. I think he'll be a good lineman but not worthy of the 4th overall pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glongest Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 Maybe the reason he got hurt was because he was getting his butt kicked and was trying to catch up. He looked awful in pass protection and run blocking in my opinion. So much for that rededication he supposedly did in the offseason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbs Hog Heaven Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 I don't know if it's so much 'concern' as disappointment. He's certainly not progressed as you'd like a 4th overall pick to of done at this stage of his career. But there's been flashes that when he really applies himself, he can look very good. I think that's the biggest disappointment for me. You know he has the talent. He had it in college, and he's shown glimpses in the pro's. But it comes down to personal dedication. The very genuine knock on him from his time in Norman was how dedicated to his craft he actually was, driving his coaches nuts by half assing it in the weight room, on the practice field and in his prep. for games. I know he's only 23, and a 2nd year pro; but he seriously needs to take a long hard look at himself and just what he wants out of this game. If he carry's on the way he has been, revelling in the 'stardom' when he's done jack to back that up (the 'Silverback' B/S for example) without fully putting the dedication in; then he'll end up as 'just another tackle' in this league. If he knuckles down, and FULLY applies himself to his craft, then I fully believe he has the talent to go down as a modern day great tackle. And on a team that's going places, he could be an integral part for the next decade and more. It's all in Trent's hands. But to date, his embryonic career has been pretty disappointing when you know it could already be so much more. Hail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elkabong82 Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 Maybe the reason he got hurt was because he was getting his butt kicked and was trying to catch up. He looked awful in pass protection and run blocking in my opinion. So much for that rededication he supposedly did in the offseason. pass pro yes, but we were successfully running left early on until the Giants keyed in on the run essentially forcing Grossman to beat them through the air. It seemed once they were focused on stopping Hightower that Grossman didn't see as much pressure. I do recall noticing one play where JPP got past Trent, but Trent followed him and leveled him instead of giving up. I agree with those saying Trent wasn't the only one who struggled early on, but he and the entire line seemed to get their act together enough in the 2nd half to allow Grossman enough time to throw downfield and get us the win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 He was fine in the first half yesterday, only one blown protection given up from a misread on a stunt (common problem) and one instance where he got beat after being set up by an inside outside move, both of which led to pressures. He had two poor plays in run blocking, both of which resulted in rushes for no gain plus one poor attempt at a cut. Those were offset by a lot of lock down protections and some real beast plays at the line and in the second level when we ran left. In general, most of the pressure came from the interior and the right side in the first half. Most of our problems running the ball came from interior lineman failing to get push. We don't run right well and are forced to be very left hand dominant because of the presence of Trent. Jammal Brown, Kory Lichtensteiger, and especially Chris Chester were worse than Trent in the first half. We clearly don't trust them to run the ball their way. I'll finish rewatching the second half when he was supposedly hurt and see what he did. When Trent is mostly healthy, he and Montgomery are definitely our best offensive linemen. Trent is absolutely essential to our offense and the burden of playmaking is entirely on him. He matches up against the best pass rushers, he's on the most dangerous blitzing and stunting side, and he's the focal point of our running attack as a heavily left handed outside zone scheme. His level of responsibilities are by far the most intense on the line and for the most part he thrives despite the misguided popular sentiment to the contrary. The alarmism from the fans about Trent is unnecessary. He'll be alright. He's already a pretty good player and will get much, much better when he finds consistency. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chump Bailey Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 Jammal Brown, Kory Lichtensteiger, and especially Chris Chester were worse than Trent in the first half. We clearly don't trust them to run the ball their way. I'll finish rewatching the second half when he was supposedly hurt and see what he did. Chris Chester's not looking very good. I noticed that too yesterday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbs Hog Heaven Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 Chris Chester's not looking very good. I noticed that too yesterday. Outside of the tackles, the whole lines not very good period. Hail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 Chris Chester's not looking very good. I noticed that too yesterday. I think Chester's miscast here as a starter. He probably needs to be a 6th utility interior lineman on a good line. Someone who won't crap his pants if he has to come in as an emergency starter but also someone who isn't going to win a lot of his battles if he has to start for extended periods of time. Monty is competent at center, but we really need to upgrade our guards. I'm really enjoying watching this good Dolphins OL play early on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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