SG: No Matter Who Wins the Snyder vs. City Paper War, Redskins Fans Have Already Lost

[SMOSS89]

(Mods, I'm sorry if this is overkill, I only checked the one thread about this, didn't realize there were several. If this is overkill you can yank the thread if need be)

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At this point, everyone is aware of Daniel M. Snyder's case against the Washington City Paper. And judging by the fervor that the Snyder camp is attacking this issue with, this situation only looks to get even uglier than it already is right now.

But I don't want to talk about the actual case here. The big point to me is this: it doesn't matter who's right or who's wrong. Even though it looks like Snyder will be the biggest loser from all of this, in truth it might actually be the Redskins fanbase that are actually hurt most.

Remember, over a year ago, the fanbase had a revolt against ownership, and demanded that he hand over control to real football people who know what they were doing. Well, everyone got their wish when Bruce Allen and Mike Shanahan were hired. And with Snyder's relatively quiet 2010 season, it looked like all things were peachy when it came to owner involvement (or lack thereof).

Then, of course, this happens. All this incident does is brings back old wounds and pours salt on them. The (relatively few) Snyder apologists will take his side, saying the City paper needs to get their facts straight and stop attacking the owner to promote their agenda. For the Snyder bashers (and there still are plenty of them), all it does is add more fuel to the fire.

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[Rdskn4Lyf21]

I'm so ****ing happy that I've been traveling and have been too busy to look at this site. I saw all of the threads, and I'm happy not knowing more.

[Ashburn Dave]

The fans will suffer but Snyder is the one that has lost.

[ATLredskin]

Thing about this whole Snyder v Paper thing is I don't understand how it effects the team. This is a Snyder issue and in no way, shape, or form has nothing to do with the Shanahan making moves this offseason. So why is everyone upset about something that has nothing to do with them. I am a fan of the Redskins so why should I care if the owner of the Redskins is suing a newspaper, You guys are feeding into something so small and is blowing it out of proportion.

[Mooka]

Lost what?

The great relationship between the Washington Redskins and the local media?

[Destino]

Lost what?

The great relationship between the Washington Redskins and the local media?

Even more respect for the franchise we hold so dear? Last year fans were furious and Dan reacted the same way he did when Spurrier had the fans on suicide watch... he bought time with a big name head coach. Now he's made himself the center of attention again (and made the career of his target) and it's just another shameful moment to throw on the pile.

[Henry]

What have we lost?

The Washington Redskins.

This team used to be one of the Old Guard. One of the storied and respected franchises of the league, like the Giants or the Bears or the Packers. On top of that we were part of the greatest rivalry in football.

And it wasn't just about winning. In the seven years between Gibbs leaving and Snyder buying the team we lost a lot. We didn't know when we were going to become a winning team again. But we were respected. Other teams embarrassed themselves with offseason circuses and chronic bouts of unnecessary drama. Not us. We knew who we were. We were the Washington Redskins. You could feel good rooting for the team no matter what the scoreboard said.

Then Dan Snyder bought the team. And as soon as he could he let Casserly go. And then he signed Deion Sanders. And the circus began.

Ten years later we are a joke. The respect and Burgundy and Gold greatness that was built on the sweat and blood of the first Joe Gibbs era has been completely erased. We're not just a bad team. We are a bad team that everybody else enjoys seeing lose. We're a punchline.

We no longer have The Washington Redskins. We have Dan Snyder's Redskins.

That Dave McKenna, he's a hack. But he didn't do this to our team. And yes, we've already lost.

[RFKFedEx]

Remember the days when CP wasn't the City Paper around here.

[SMOSS89]

For me it's more a thing about how the fans suffer the most when stuff like this goes down.

I want to talk about the team, how to rebuild the roster, etc.

But now we have to go back and revisit the tired subject of the owner.

No other franchise has to worry about crap like this. It doesn't even matter if you take his side or not, the point is I don't want to even DISCUSS this, I wish things like this don't even HAPPEN.

I just want the conversation to be about the roster, and when stories like this come out, all it does is rile up the fan base even more.

That's why we lose, IMO.

[SkinsFTW]

You're already paying way more for an inferior product by going to the games and I don't see how this really changes anything at all other than give you more reasons not to support the guy who owns the team but the fans will anyway.

I live downtown in one of the most expensive cities in the country and season tickets to the Chargers (a winning team even with Norv Turner coaching them) are less than 1/2 what it costs to see the Redskins lose regularly at home. I just don't get why people pay so much for the garbage, and the ****ty stadium and parking fees, etc. Snyder and his marketing owns all of you who buy into his win now philosophy year after year, while never winning, you still support it.

[thebluefood]

What have we lost?

The Washington Redskins.

This team used to be one of the Old Guard. One of the storied and respected franchises of the league, like the Giants or the Bears or the Packers. On top of that we were part of the greatest rivalry in football.

And it wasn't just about winning. In the seven years between Gibbs leaving and Snyder buying the team we lost a lot. We didn't know when we were going to become a winning team again. But we were respected. Other teams embarrassed themselves with offseason circuses and chronic bouts of unnecessary drama. Not us. We knew who we were. We were the Washington Redskins. You could feel good rooting for the team no matter what the scoreboard said.

Then Dan Snyder bought the team. And as soon as he could he let Casserly go. And then he signed Deion Sanders. And the circus began.

Ten years later we are a joke. The respect and Burgundy and Gold greatness that was built on the sweat and blood of the first Joe Gibbs era has been completely erased. We're not just a bad team. We are a bad team that everybody else enjoys seeing lose. We're a punchline.

We no longer have The Washington Redskins. We have Dan Snyder's Redskins.

That Dave McKenna, he's a hack. But he didn't do this to our team. And yes, we've already lost.

Can someone put this on a plaque or something?

Snyder apologists always say "the team was bad before then." That maybe, but it seems like we were just going through a bit of a rebuilding period and we were on our way up. That 1999 team was the old regime's making, not Snyder's. 2000 was the first full year of Snyder's influence over the team and...well, we all remember what happened.

The worst of it is...it's his team. He owns it and he's probably going to own it for a long, long time.

Strap yourselves in, folks.

[worstSeat]

Thing about this whole Snyder v Paper thing is I don't understand how it effects the team. This is a Snyder issue and in no way, shape, or form has nothing to do with the Shanahan making moves this offseason. So why is everyone upset about something that has nothing to do with them. I am a fan of the Redskins so why should I care if the owner of the Redskins is suing a newspaper, You guys are feeding into something so small and is blowing it out of proportion.

RLY?

In brief, The New Snyder is The Old Snyder. Do you really want 12 more years of his teams? 60? It's this same guy who fired Schottenheimer, who forced in Jeff George, who signed Deion and Carrier... There's only one near constant in the NFL now, and that's not the coach. It's the owner. And our constant remains constant. That's a bad thing.

[SkinsFTW]

The worst of it is...it's his team. He owns it and he's probably going to own it for a long, long time.

Strap yourselves in, folks.

Stop going to the games. If he's losing money he's gotta sell. Don't buy jerseys, just watch the debacle on TV. Saves you a lot of heartache.

[PortlandSkins]

He's a pig, guys. And after the superbowl, all you will be hearing about from the mainstream sports media is what a pig he is. Again, negative redskins coverage will dominate the offseason.

Happy groundhog day!

[bedlamVR]

Can someone put this on a plaque or something?

Snyder apologists always say "the team was bad before then." That maybe, but it seems like we were just going through a bit of a rebuilding period and we were on our way up. That 1999 team was the old regime's making, not Snyder's. 2000 was the first full year of Snyder's influence over the team and...well, we all remember what happened.

The worst of it is...it's his team. He owns it and he's probably going to own it for a long, long time.

Strap yourselves in, folks.

Yeah ... more BS revisionism . From 1993 to 1998 we were rudderless, there simply was no direction from terrible drafts (Heath Shula, Andre Johnson) crap free agents bringing in Stubblefield and Wilkinson and top free agents planning their tours of prospective teams around us (Remember Reggie White? - "anywhere but washington") , letting HoF players walk (Art monk reaching his milestones in Jet Green was horrible to watch) and open player revolt (Sean Gilbert) to coaching choaking jobs going from 7-2 to 9-7 and missing the playoffs in 1997.

Prior to 1999 - In 1998 the season before we went 0-7 in 1999 we let the franchise QB walk away to the Rams (Trent Green) for pennies we got a Kings ransom for Ricky Williams (we could have got more) we had the chance to set the franchise for years and yet some how walked away with three players (Champ Bailey, Jon Jansen and through the Saints picks and the Panthers for Sean Gilbert Arrington/Samuels) We traded a 1st,2nd and 3rd round pick for Brad ****ing Johnson all under the old guard before Snyder got here - hell at the time the draft was going off Milstien was the prospective new owner .

So sure believe what you want the franchise was rosey before the Evil Dan Snyder took over the franchise over and the "joke" of the NFL we were rebuilding (Just like we were between 1945-1971 - rebuilding) ha (Hahahahahahahahahahaha)

Snyder is the devil - damn Jew .

---------- Post added February-4th-2011 at 07:14 AM ----------

RLY?

In brief, The New Snyder is The Old Snyder. Do you really want 12 more years of his teams? 60? It's this same guy who fired Schottenheimer, who forced in Jeff George, who signed Deion and Carrier... There's only one near constant in the NFL now, and that's not the coach. It's the owner. And our constant remains constant. That's a bad thing.

Errrm what has Marty Shottenhiemer (prostitute) ever done to be regarded as the hero I am sick of people harking back to a coach who stripped out talent in the name of cost saving - while bringing in friends and family to nussle at the teat of Snyder, a man he said he would never work for - and left a legacy of the likes of Kevin Locker, Tony Banks and Jimmy Raye ... Shottenhiemer went on to do his best to destroy the Chargers for 2 horrible seasons before AJ Smith stepped in and put together a winning roster and then managed to get fired from a playoff team .

You are also way off base by saying Snyder forced in all these free agents . If you were around in 2000 then no one was crying about the Redskins bringing in what were considered all the top free agents in 2000 and 2 of the top drafted prospects - in retrospect it was a horrible offseason but at the time it was amazing . Oh yeah one of the few high spots of the early Snyder days was bringing in Larry Centers after he used to run all over us with the Cards, Shottenhiemer cut him because he would not wear the right cap and rehab his injury at Redskins park .

[Redskins Diehard]

Thing about this whole Snyder v Paper thing is I don't understand how it effects the team. This is a Snyder issue and in no way, shape, or form has nothing to do with the Shanahan making moves this offseason. So why is everyone upset about something that has nothing to do with them. I am a fan of the Redskins so why should I care if the owner of the Redskins is suing a newspaper, You guys are feeding into something so small and is blowing it out of proportion.

The fans would much rather if Snyder focused on making the team better. You know...instead of this he should be out scouting players. Discussing the playbook with Shanahan. He should be planning a free agent strategy. Considering trades.

[21MadFan]

The fans would much rather if Snyder focused on making the team better. You know...instead of this he should be out scouting players. Discussing the playbook with Shanahan. He should be planning a free agent strategy. Considering trades.

Excuse me if I am wrong, but isn't this exactly what we don't want Snyder doing. In what way should Snyder have any input into the playbook? If there is a trade we want to make, Bruce will come to Snyder, and we have a scouting dept. for just that scouting. Now the scouting dept could probably use a few more people which I agree he would be hands on in hiring. Sorry if you were just being funny though

[aREDSKIN]

Yeah ... more BS revisionism . From 1993 to 1998 we were rudderless, there simply was no direction from terrible drafts (Heath Shula, Andre Johnson) crap free agents bringing in Stubblefield and Wilkinson and top free agents planning their tours of prospective teams around us (Remember Reggie White? - "anywhere but washington") , letting HoF players walk (Art monk reaching his milestones in Jet Green was horrible to watch) and open player revolt (Sean Gilbert) to coaching choaking jobs going from 7-2 to 9-7 and missing the playoffs in 1997.

Prior to 1999 - In 1998 the season before we went 0-7 in 1999 we let the franchise QB walk away to the Rams (Trent Green) for pennies we got a Kings ransom for Ricky Williams (we could have got more) we had the chance to set the franchise for years and yet some how walked away with three players (Champ Bailey, Jon Jansen and through the Saints picks and the Panthers for Sean Gilbert Arrington/Samuels) We traded a 1st,2nd and 3rd round pick for Brad ****ing Johnson all under the old guard before Snyder got here - hell at the time the draft was going off Milstien was the prospective new owner .

So sure believe what you want the franchise was rosey before the Evil Dan Snyder took over the franchise over and the "joke" of the NFL we were rebuilding (Just like we were between 1945-1971 - rebuilding) ha (Hahahahahahahahahahaha)

Snyder is the devil .

Irrespective of your rant the product on the field and the results for the last decade+ SPEAK for themselves. Snyder is the WORST thing that could have happened to the Redskins franchise.

[Skinsinparadise]

I don't see how this is a big deal aside from giving the media and us a football story in a dead media period aside from the Super Bowl.

The story relives old stuff. It's like having a tumultuous relationship with your girlfriend, breaking up, you are dating someone else, so far everything is OK -- and then someone goes back and wants to talk about the old girl friend -- granted though its Snyder opening up the old wounds.

i am far from a Snyder apologist. but as long as I am not reading about him going to scout college QB's for the draft with Vinny -- am not going to give him a hard time. I'll give him a pass for now. the old wounds we've lived through and rehashed to death, they aren't relevant to me now.

[Henry]

Yeah ... more BS revisionism . From 1993 to 1998 we were rudderless, there simply was no direction from terrible drafts (Heath Shula, Andre Johnson) crap free agents bringing in Stubblefield and Wilkinson and top free agents planning their tours of prospective teams around us (Remember Reggie White? - "anywhere but washington") , letting HoF players walk (Art monk reaching his milestones in Jet Green was horrible to watch) and open player revolt (Sean Gilbert) to coaching choaking jobs going from 7-2 to 9-7 and missing the playoffs in 1997.

Prior to 1999 - In 1998 the season before we went 0-7 in 1999 we let the franchise QB walk away to the Rams (Trent Green) for pennies we got a Kings ransom for Ricky Williams (we could have got more) we had the chance to set the franchise for years and yet some how walked away with three players (Champ Bailey, Jon Jansen and through the Saints picks and the Panthers for Sean Gilbert Arrington/Samuels) We traded a 1st,2nd and 3rd round pick for Brad ****ing Johnson all under the old guard before Snyder got here - hell at the time the draft was going off Milstien was the prospective new owner .

Like I said, it wasn't about winning. We were going through a bad stretch during that time. All teams do that. Plenty of teams have to endure bad coaches or mediocre GMs like we had in the 90s.

All teams do not, however, become loathed. Since Snyder has taken over we have become the NFC's Raiders.

Snyder is the devil - damn Jew .

:rotflmao:

I'm Jewish. Trust me, that ain't it.

[stwasm]

What have we lost?

The Washington Redskins.

This team used to be one of the Old Guard. One of the storied and respected franchises of the league, like the Giants or the Bears or the Packers. On top of that we were part of the greatest rivalry in football.

And it wasn't just about winning. In the seven years between Gibbs leaving and Snyder buying the team we lost a lot. We didn't know when we were going to become a winning team again. But we were respected. Other teams embarrassed themselves with offseason circuses and chronic bouts of unnecessary drama. Not us. We knew who we were. We were the Washington Redskins. You could feel good rooting for the team no matter what the scoreboard said.

Then Dan Snyder bought the team. And as soon as he could he let Casserly go. And then he signed Deion Sanders. And the circus began.

Ten years later we are a joke. The respect and Burgundy and Gold greatness that was built on the sweat and blood of the first Joe Gibbs era has been completely erased. We're not just a bad team. We are a bad team that everybody else enjoys seeing lose. We're a punchline.

We no longer have The Washington Redskins. We have Dan Snyder's Redskins.

That Dave McKenna, he's a hack. But he didn't do this to our team. And yes, we've already lost.

Well said! It's Dan Snyder's team and we pay for the "privilege" of cheering for it. And he continues to destroy the franchise for his personal gain. This is why many season-ticket holders have gotten out and that will continue.

[sideshow24]

I'm Jewish. Trust me, that ain't it.

Hilarious!!

[Boss_Hogg]

Ten years later we are a joke. The respect and Burgundy and Gold greatness that was built on the sweat and blood of the first Joe Gibbs era has been completely erased. We're not just a bad team. We are a bad team that everybody else enjoys seeing lose. We're a punchline.

This is what gets me. Snyder is hated so much that even non-football fans want the Redskins to suck.

---------- Post added February-4th-2011 at 11:51 AM ----------

Well said! It's Dan Snyder's team and we pay for the "privilege" of cheering for it. And he continues to destroy the franchise for his personal gain. This is why many season-ticket holders have gotten out and that will continue.

and yes, this is Snyder's team, not Washington's team.

All we do is help finance his toy.

[Mooka]

Even more respect for the franchise we hold so dear? Last year fans were furious and Dan reacted the same way he did when Spurrier had the fans on suicide watch... he bought time with a big name head coach. Now he's made himself the center of attention again (and made the career of his target) and it's just another shameful moment to throw on the pile.

This is old news though. This current situation isn't making things worse, Snyder's reputation can't get any worse.

Articles like McKenna's are a dime a dozen. Rolling Stone wrote a featured article on how much Dan Snyder sucks.

[worstSeat]

Stop going to the games. If he's losing money he's gotta sell. Don't buy jerseys, just watch the debacle on TV. Saves you a lot of heartache.

If the Jags haven't been sold, what makes you think that 10% empties is going to get toxic man to sell?

Errrm what has Marty Shottenhiemer (prostitute) ever done to be regarded as the hero I am sick of people harking back to a coach who stripped out talent in the name of cost saving - while bringing in friends and family to nussle at the teat of Snyder, a man he said he would never work for - and left a legacy of the likes of Kevin Locker, Tony Banks and Jimmy Raye ... Shottenhiemer went on to do his best to destroy the Chargers for 2 horrible seasons before AJ Smith stepped in and put together a winning roster and then managed to get fired from a playoff team .

You are also way off base by saying Snyder forced in all these free agents . If you were around in 2000 then no one was crying about the Redskins bringing in what were considered all the top free agents in 2000 and 2 of the top drafted prospects - in retrospect it was a horrible offseason but at the time it was amazing . Oh yeah one of the few high spots of the early Snyder days was bringing in Larry Centers after he used to run all over us with the Cards, Shottenhiemer cut him because he would not wear the right cap and rehab his injury at Redskins park

You're saying Snyder didn't have any hand in Brad Johnson's benching? I didn't mind Deion or Smith, honestly, but George and Carrier were busts. George, thanks to Snyder, set the offense back to the stone age.

Marty, on the other hand, went 8-8 with Tony Banks, dude. With Tony Banks. Schott saved cash so that he could remake the team. The problem was that he didn't get to use his own savings and they went to a guy who didn't know how to spell NFL just yet. Hello, Trung and the "cheap and available" QB crew.

Look, Marty:Shanahan::Spurrier:Snyder. Discuss.

(That said, I like Spurrier. A few years as an OC and a good quarterback that'd actually listen to him and I think he'd have something.)

The bottom line is that all of these moves, in the FO or in business, right down to threatening the City Paper, suggests that the Skins will only win in *spite* of their owner, not because. I'm not sure that was the case in the 80s in DC. I'm pretty sure that's not the case with the Pats and Steelers. And even Jurrah hasn't sued a paper, much less a free local, has he? A real arse with Landry, but not quite this stupid.

Say something bad about me?!! I'll show ya! I'll get EVERYBODY to read it, remember that my team's mascot is RACIST, and then I'll put a quality local paper OUT OF BUSINESS!! I want you to find this nancy-boy Dan [sic] McKenna, I want him DEAD! I want his family DEAD! I want his house burned to the GROUND! I wanna go there in the middle of the night and I wanna PISS ON HIS ASHES!

Well played, Snyder. Good perspective.