The Official Washington Basketball Thread: Wizards, Mystics etc

[Going Commando]

Of all the things to get hysterical and angry about, picking Tomas Satoransky with our second rounder is the one people are fixating on?

Guys, second round picks in the NBA draft have the equivalent value of the compensatory seventh round picks in the NFL draft. Who cares?

[NavyDave]

Of all the things to get hysterical and angry about, picking Tomas Satoransky with our second rounder is the one people are fixating on?

Guys, second round picks in the NBA draft have the equivalent value of the compensatory seventh round picks in the NFL draft. Who cares?

Yeah 2nd rounders are sooo useless for our All star loaded, playoff bound team, that its okay to draft another Euro stiff. Oh wait.

[Skin'emAlive]

Eh, im not upset about the 2nd pick. I just found humor in the fact that we spent a pick on a guy who was a back up to a nobody, has little to no game in most facets, and will not even likely be on the team any time soon. Im looking forward to next season, and hoping wall learns how to finish at the rim this offseason.

[pjfootballer]

I knew we'd get stuck with Beal. I'm not too happy with him. As soon as I saw the Bobcats take MKG, I knew Cleveland didn't have a deal and we were stuck with Beal. I'm sorry, right now I just can't get excited about a shooting guard who played one year in college, averaged a measley 14 ppg and nobody ever heard of the guy until a month ago. I was cracking up laughing (Sarcastically of course) at the ESPN guys saying he can be another Ray Allen. In your dreams. See you next year at the Lottery Selection Show ****ing Wizards.

---------- Post added June-29th-2012 at 07:58 AM ----------

Of all the things to get hysterical and angry about, picking Tomas Satoransky with our second rounder is the one people are fixating on?

Guys, second round picks in the NBA draft have the equivalent value of the compensatory seventh round picks in the NFL draft. Who cares?

Why waste the pick on a nobody? Set up a deal with another team and select a player for them and trade their rights for a future pick. It's really not that hard....well, for Ernie it is, I guess.

[SuperBash]

There is still some decent prospects that went undrafted. They could be brought in for a shot. Like Machado and Hollis Thompson. Machado is a guy I'd actually rather have that Mack, or at least to compete with Mack in training camp since I don't think Mack's contract is guaranteed.

[Going Commando]

Beal will be fine pj. He's a perfect fit and has very little bust factor. He'll come in, play hard, and improve our team bball IQ by leaps and bounds the moment he sets foot onto the court (and pushes Crawford to the bench).

Beal is a complete SG. He defends, rebounds, shoots, and thrives off the ball. You couldn't draw up a better SG to complement Wall. I love where our back court is headed.

---------- Post added June-29th-2012 at 08:46 AM ----------

The only thing I'm really worried about moving forward is our PF spot. We're flush for now, but our entire front court is tweeners who don't rebound all that well. Okafor is the only truly good rebounder we've got, and he's a one or two year rental that has had trouble staying healthy the past two or three seasons.

I'm worried that our rebounding issues could become acute. Seraphin has got to improve as a rebounder moving forward.

Wall and Beal are potentially the best rebounding back court in the NBA though. That puts a band-aid on the problem.

This is how I figure we're set for our bigs:

- Nene is a fringe All Star scoring big that could probably lock down our PF spot if we need him to. He doesn't rebound well himself, but he does improve our team rebounding rate by a statistically significant margin. What that says is he's a boxer outer. He'll do the dirty work while his partner scoops up the rebounds. So we need to feature a rebounder with some hands beside him in the lineup.

Defensively, Nene is the same way. He does the dirty work of playing disciplined, positional defense on an opponent's big. Our team defense improved vastly last season when Nene was in the game. But he's not going to be a guy who is a menace with weak side help and above the rim play on that end. This is where you complement him with and athlete.

Offensively, Nene is pretty much perfect for us. He's the rare player who has great scoring tools but absolutely thrives on limited shots and selfless team play. He moves and handles the ball well for a big. He's got a bag of tricks in the post. He can knock down 15 footers with ease.

You know it's ironic, but JaVale might have actually been a good complimentary center to Nene at PF because of his length and natural athleticism. Oh well.

- Booker and Seraphin were second year bigs with PER over 15 last season. That indicates those guys can actually play. Booker is an energy guy that good teams have coming off their depth. He's a bit of a luxury for us right now, but as we actually improve, that will become less the case. You need role players like him to hold the roster together. He's strong and fast as hell, plays extremely hard, rebounds (really the only guy aside from Okafor that does), and seems like he could be a nifty asset offensively if he starts knocking down mid range jumpers. He's a tough low post defender that's fearless and he plays the game with intensity. As our third or fourth big, there really isn't a whole lot to complain about.

- Seraphin is a gem, a true throwback one on one player. Last season he demonstrated legit starting center potential, which was a god send after we dealt away McGee. We didn't have to go out searching for a center, the guy we had stashed away on the bench is already a better player than JaVale. Offensively, Seraphin has a nice low post game with an elite jump hook as his go-to weapon. He can score in isolation post up situations. This gives our offense valuable balance because we can go out and get some buckets even when our sets fail.

Defensively, Seraphin is a one on one big man defender. Help defense and awareness on rotations is low. But he excels at bodying up the opponents biggest and strongest player and keeping him from getting to the spots he wants. You can't help but go back to his games against Bynum and Dwight and think that he's our best solution to keep guys like them from going off on us for 30 & 15 games. He'll keep them uncomfortable and muscle them around and hard foul them. He's also a pretty good shot blocker. That's about as much as you can hope for on the defensive end from a starting center who will never be an All Star.

The one big shortcoming Seraphin has demonstrated is as a rebounder. We really need him to improve his defensive rebounding. That's as important for us going forward as John or Vesely learning to shoot.

- Finally, Emeka Okafor does bring some rebounding credibility to us, and offers a nice option at either PF or C. However, that was the healthy Okafor that could rebound. We might not see him again. Healthy Okafor blocks shots, rebounds, defends well, has an efficient below the rim offensive game, and has a solid ability to hit jumpers from short range. I hope we get two years of this guy.

Vesely and Singleton both factor into here somewhere. Both can play PF and defend the PF position.

We've built a team with a true front court. Ariza is a swingman but Vesely and Singleton are combo forwards that play a traditional front court role. Singleton is a potential 3 and D player that came out of college with the ability to guard perimeter and post players well. Vesely is our answer to the lack of above the rim athleticism and quickness from our starting bigs. He can block shots and offer weak side help and he can also defend the perimeter, cover passing lanes, trouble stretch fours and 3s who have difficulty with extreme length. If only he could shoot...

Ariza is a pure perimeter stopper. That's all he brings to the table, but that in and of itself is valuable. Hopefully he holds the role down for the next two years until Vesely and Singleton are ready to take it over.

For now, the front court makes sense to me. It's not an overwhelmingly talented group, but it's all good players from top to bottom and each of them has a role that works into a greater than the sum of its parts whole. We've got a shooter and complete guard in the back court now for Wall (something the Bulls are still searching for) and a sparkplug offensive creator coming off the bench in Crawford. Plus, I think Mack was a generally competent backup PG last season (which is important).

Sign another pure perimeter shooter (Cartier Martin?) and then I'm happy with the way the roster shaped up this offseason. Basically now it's entirely up to Wall how good we get. He's got some pieces around him now. If he makes a leap like Derrick Rose did, then we'll make a leap like the Bulls did in the next year or two. Shooting, defense, turnovers, creativity on his finishes. Hopefully he checks a few of those weaknesses off his list when he comes into this season.

[Burgold]

I kinda wanted TRob, but I guess the trade, plus having Booker, Vesely, and Singleton made that impossible. The idea of getting the best shooter in the draft is appealing.

[Destino]

Is Nene worth 14 million a year at PF? His best production has been 14.6pts and 7.8rebounds. That's not a 14 million dollar PF IMO. His ability to do that at center makes him valuable because there are no centers in the league (though the position is improving). Emeka Okafor is more of a natural center and Seraphin hasn't shown the handles or mobility to move to PF. If Seraphin shows he can start Nene might be a contract that needs to be moved as soon as a real PF can be located.

All depends on what Seraphin can do.

[SuperBash]

It's gonna be a really quiet offseason now that the draft is over.

[BRAVEONAWARPATH]

I knew we'd get stuck with Beal. I'm not too happy with him. As soon as I saw the Bobcats take MKG, I knew Cleveland didn't have a deal and we were stuck with Beal. I'm sorry, right now I just can't get excited about a shooting guard who played one year in college, averaged a measley 14 ppg and nobody ever heard of the guy until a month ago.

I might be wrong but I'll just assume you don't follow college basketball or recruiting too closely.

Beal didn't just who come out of nowhere.

Beal was the 2011 Gatorade National HS Player of the Year. And that was over guys like MKG, Austin Rivers, Anthony Davis etc.

Look, I'm not predicting how good he'll be but rest assured that Beal isn't just "some guy" that the Wiz decided to draft. :2cents:

[Hersh]

I don't think there is any doubt that this team should be a playoff caliber team next year. Depending on cost, I would like a veteran three point shooter or point guard (preferably another player with playoff experience) on the team that can come off the bench cause I want a veteran or two coming off the bench with these young guys as part of the second unit. If we don't have that, I wouldn't mind Ariza coming off the bench maybe in a 6th man role.

Starting...........2nd Unit

Wall.................Veteran PG

Beal.................Crawford

Singleton........... Ariza

Nene.............Booker/Vesley

Okafor............Seraphin

Edited June 29, 2012 by Hersh

[Destino]

I don't know if this is a playoff team and I'm puzzled as to why wizards fans seem to think it is. I could see this team making the playoffs if: Wall can operate in the half court and has a new efficient shot.... and Wittman installs an offense that fits the players.... and Beal manages to exceed his NCAA numbers as an NBA rookie. All of those look unlikely to me.

[RonArtest15]

I don't think there is any doubt that this team should be a playoff caliber team next year. Depending on cost, I would like a veteran three point shooter or point guard (preferably another player with playoff experience) on the team that can come off the bench cause I want a veteran or two coming off the bench with these young guys as part of the second unit. If we don't have that, I wouldn't mind Ariza coming off the bench maybe in a 6th man role.

Starting...........2nd Unit

Wall.................Veteran PG

Beal.................Crawford

Singleton........... Ariza

Nene.............Booker/Vesley

Okafor............Seraphin

Don't understand why we'd start Singleton over Ariza. Outside of Shelvin Mack, Singleton showed me next to nothing last year. He was in over his head, and IMO, on this current team...has no business starting or getting more than 10-12 MPG going forward.

Anyways, there are NO more excuses for this team. We will be fielding the best team we've had here since the big-3 were in town. There is no reason why they shouldn't win between 35-40 games next year. I EXPECT them to be in contention for either the 7th or 8th seed. Beal is going to help immensely. I can't wait to see him and Wall in the backcourt together.

I don't get why people are so upset about the 2nd round pick. Like it was pointed out, draft/stash was the best option. Let TS play another year in Europe and develop his game. Have him come over in 2013 and see what he can do. If anything, this should put Shelvin Mack on notice. Speaking of whom, I hope EG extends an offer to Scott Machado. I think he could really push Mack for a back up spot behind Wall.

*another thing...young Euro players usually have poor PPG. It's not a totally accurate measure of how they'll turn out on the next level. I'd be curious to see how he did playing in the U-19 from last year (assuming he played).

Edited June 29, 2012 by RonArtest15

[StillUnknown]

I don't know if this is a playoff team and I'm puzzled as to why wizards fans seem to think it is. I could see this team making the playoffs if: Wall can operate in the half court and has a new efficient shot.... and Wittman installs an offense that fits the players.... and Beal manages to exceed his NCAA numbers as an NBA rookie. All of those look unlikely to me.

Last night, Ted basically said he expects us to be a playoff team next season.

I think Wizards fans are banking on the fact that you usually don't even have to be a .500 team to make the playoffs in the east. Teams have made the playoffs in the east with 37-40 wins in the recent past. Given the roster upgrades, I think a win total of 35-40 games is a reasonable expectation.

edit: http://dc.sbnation.com/washington-wizards/2012/6/29/3125298/nba-draft-2012-washington-wizards-pick-bradley-beal/in/2753527

Tired of sweating out the NBA Draft lottery and obessing over morning-after NBA Draft grades? So is Ted Leonsis.

"I don't want to be in the lottery anymore," Leonsis said Thursday at the Wizards 2012 NBA Draft party. "I would find that unacceptable."

Unacceptable. That's a strong word, Mr. Leonsis

Edited June 29, 2012 by StillUnknown

[Hersh]

Even though I don't love the trade we made with New Orleans, this team is significantly better on paper. It's a much smarter/professional/higher character team with talent that should play some good defense. Of course a lot will depend on the improvement of John Wall and the rest of the young players.

[No Excuses]

If he feels that strongly, I hope he has plans to can Wittman and Grunfeld if this team doesn't make the playoffs. Fluff time is over.

Edited June 29, 2012 by No Excuses

[Going Commando]

We'll make the playoffs next season. We are vastly improved defensively, we've got a good mix of front court players that can score and defend, the young players will make strides, we had a real offseason to build something, we got a good player out of the draft who has a decent chance to contribute early, and John Wall is a transcendent talent at PG.

[Hersh]

Last night, Ted basically said he expects us to be a playoff team next season.

If we don't make the playoffs, I expect Ted to clean house GM and coach-wise based on what he is on record of saying. Hopefully this is a response to the negative outcry of keeping Ernie around.

[Going Commando]

Even though I don't love the trade we made with New Orleans, this team is significantly better on paper. It's a much smarter/professional/higher character team with talent that should play some good defense. Of course a lot will depend on the improvement of John Wall and the rest of the young players.

I'm fine with the New Orleans trade now that we've drafted Beal. It ended up being that we got a potentially hellacious defense on paper. That'll help us win long before we get our offense figured out. I'm operating under the assumption that we're trying to compete while simultaneously keep the deck clear for 2014. So long as we don't make a long term contract commitment to someone that's stupid, I'm not going to worry about that deal any more.

Two years of playoffs seasoning before we get ready to make a legit push in 2014. That's not so bad at all.

[StillUnknown]

We'll make the playoffs next season. We are vastly improved defensively, we've got a good mix of front court players that can score and defend, the young players will make strides, we had a real offseason to build something, we got a good player out of the draft who has a decent chance to contribute early, and John Wall is a transcendent talent at PG.

It really all hinges on Wall. He has to take that step from "transcendent talent" to "transcendent player". If he's made improvements to his game, we make the playoffs easily I think. If not, it could be a long and disappointing season.

I really wanted that 10th pick last night. The fact that we went draft n stash with the 2nd round pick lends credibility to those who believe that Ernie probably didn't push that hard for that 10th pick.

Edited June 29, 2012 by StillUnknown

[Hersh]

I really wanted that 10th pick last night. The fact that we went draft n stash with the 2nd round pick lends credibility to those who believe that Ernie probably didn't push that hard for that 10th pick.

I would have settled for a future 1st round pick over the next few years. Good GMs accumulate assets as they improve their teams. It still amazes me that we actually gave them a draft pick in that trade.

[Going Commando]

It really all hinges on Wall. He has to take that step from "transcendent talent" to "transcendent player". If he's made improvements to his game, we make the playoffs easily I think. If not, it could be a long and disappointing season.

That's pretty much always been the case. That's how a #1 pick goes.

[Destino]

I would have settled for a future 1st round pick over the next few years. Good GMs accumulate assets as they improve their teams. It still amazes me that we actually gave them a draft pick in that trade.

Ernie has shown time and time again that he has nothing in common with good GM's. Despite this "changing the culture" narrative that the Wizards have put out there I'm betting that we see a lot of bad shots taking by guards with no consequences next season. People will blame Wittman, Beal, or Crawford... but it will be a product of the Grunfeld culture.

[pjfootballer]

I don't know if this is a playoff team and I'm puzzled as to why wizards fans seem to think it is. I could see this team making the playoffs if: Wall can operate in the half court and has a new efficient shot.... and Wittman installs an offense that fits the players.... and Beal manages to exceed his NCAA numbers as an NBA rookie. All of those look unlikely to me.

I don't get it either. We've been bottom of the barrel for years. We have missed the playoffs 4 straight seasons. We haven't won more than 45 games in a season the last 34 years. Playoffs? (in my Jim Mora voice). This team won 20 games (24 in an 82 game schedule) and you guys think one 14ppg college player (Beal), an underacheiving center (Okafor) and an average guy (Ariza) will vault us to the playoffs? My fellow Wizards fans have been smoking too much weed.

---------- Post added June-29th-2012 at 02:40 PM ----------

I might be wrong but I'll just assume you don't follow college basketball or recruiting too closely.

Beal didn't just who come out of nowhere.

Beal was the 2011 Gatorade National HS Player of the Year. And that was over guys like MKG, Austin Rivers, Anthony Davis etc.

Look, I'm not predicting how good he'll be but rest assured that Beal isn't just "some guy" that the Wiz decided to draft. :2cents:

I don't follow High School players or recruiting and I'll admit that I haven't followed college ball as closely the last few years as I used to. But I do know that Beal wasn't a popular guy about 2 months ago. Now all of the sudden, he's the next Ray Allen. As always, I'll stick to my tried and true "Prove it to me Wizards and Beal" until I'm wrong. Sad thing is, I haven't been wrong about this team in years.

---------- Post added June-29th-2012 at 02:50 PM ----------

And guys, I'm not trying to stir up trouble or be a bad fan. I'm not trying to be "that guy" that is constantly negative, but I can't help it with this team. They've given me nothing to look forward to for a long time. I just wish I could be as ecstatic as you guys, but like some Redskin fans, I'll believe it when I see it. I'm sorry to have brought the thread down as it was not my intention.

[endzone_dave]

I don't get it either. We've been bottom of the barrel for years. We have missed the playoffs 4 straight seasons. We haven't won more than 45 games in a season the last 34 years. Playoffs? (in my Jim Mora voice). This team won 20 games (24 in an 82 game schedule) and you guys think one 14ppg college player (Beal), an underacheiving center (Okafor) and an average guy (Ariza) will vault us to the playoffs? My fellow Wizards fans have been smoking too much weed.

I agree with this. This team is Wall, Beal and a bunch of roster-fillers. Wall has to be MUCH improved from last season and Beal has to be as good as EG thinks he is for this team to be a playoff team. I'm not holding my breath.