ES Soccer Thread

[RichmondRedskin88]

Been debating whether to post here or not this week considering I expect comments of Moyes is moron, Man Utd is done,*insert other random taunting crap*,etc.  Honestly I wasn't too upset about the game. The line up was bad from the start.  Moyes has yet to realize out near 40 year old player shouldn't be starting.  Then again many Utd fans including myself wonder if Moyes realizes is not at Everton anymore.  Because his comments have been pretty dumb lately especially the ones talking about "it worked at Everton".  This ain't Everton bud.  You are with the big boys now.  Like I said though I wasn't extremely upset.  Moyes better get it together soon though because poor play and lack of success doesn't roll in this club.  Everyone knows the expectations when you join a club like a Utd, Real, Barca, Chelsea, etc.  If you don't live up to them you won't be around long.  

 

Anyway, Congrats GHH.  I'm sure its a exciting time for Liverpool fans right now.

 

-----

Oh Arsenal finally made a big move with Ozil. Shouldn't have waited so long though.

Edited September 2, 2013 by RichmondRedskin88

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

Been debating whether to post here or not this week considering I expect comments of Moyes is moron, Man Utd is done,*insert other random taunting crap*,etc. .....

 

Hey! I've been consistent from day one in telling you David Moyes Football Genius would be a complete and utter disaster. Not just this week. 

 

Thanks for the congrats. Very magnanimous of yers Richmond. 

 

Hail. 

 

*PS.Someone wants to tell him it's not Everton after the Fellaini signing. 

[Elessar78]

I don't know if Özil could've happened sooner. I think it might've been dependent on the Bale deal going through.

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

I don't know if Özil could've happened sooner. I think it might've been dependent on the Bale deal going through.

 

And then Wenger reverts to type and stops you getting Ba in over a measly £ 1.5 mill. 

 

What he giveth with one hand .....

 

Hail. 

[Elessar78]

And then Wenger reverts to type and stops you getting Ba in over a measly £ 1.5 mill. 

 

What he giveth with one hand .....

 

Hail. 

I think we can live without Ba. Gooner nation is pretty happy with Ozil. 

 

We wanted Mata. Chelsea didn't want him coming over to us, but Ba is okay? Tells you something about how good Ba is. 

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

I think we can live without Ba. Gooner nation is pretty happy with Ozil. 

 

We wanted Mata. Chelsea didn't want him coming over to us, but Ba is okay? Tells you something about how good Ba is. 

 

Ozil's a great player no doubt. (If heavily over priced.).But I think you could of been FAR better served strengthening in other areas. And Ba for a season at 3 million would of at least given you attacking cover. 

 

Hail. 

[ixcuincle]

Moyes is "The Chosen one" 

 

Best reserve judgement until a few weeks later

 

 

That being said I hope Sturridge dances more. 

[Elessar78]

Ozil's a great player no doubt. (If heavily over priced.).But I think you could of been FAR better served strengthening in other areas. And Ba for a season at 3 million would of at least given you attacking cover. 

 

Hail. 

Ba is a warm body, no doubt. We'll see how it plays out. 

[RichmondRedskin88]

and now someone needs to die for what happened at the end of transfer window.  Complete embarrassment for Man Utd supporters.  Heads need to roll at Man Utd for the crap pulled.  Our club has forever been known for treating its players with dignity and respect.  Tomorrow I expect Spanish newspapers to rip us a new one.  Once again someone's head better roll. And not just roll but get kicked down the steps. A public apology better be coming tomorrow.

[SJValleySkinz]

and now someone needs to die for what happened at the end of transfer window.  Complete embarrassment for Man Utd supporters.  Heads need to roll at Man Utd for the crap pulled.  Our club has forever been known for treating its players with dignity and respect.  Tomorrow I expect Spanish newspapers to rip us a new one.  Once again someone's head better roll. And not just roll but get kicked down the steps. A public apology better be coming tomorrow.

 

Might as well wait for the facts here. United screwed up but depending on the nature of the screw up Herrera might still want to join in January. Woodward is a Glazer man so the best we can do is hope he just screwed up and will learn from his mistake, and not that he is doing business in a prudent and petty way on behalf of the owners.

[RichmondRedskin88]

Might as well wait for the facts here. United screwed up but depending on the nature of the screw up Herrera might still want to join in January. Woodward is a Glazer man so the best we can do is hope he just screwed up and will learn from his mistake, and not that he is doing business in a prudent and petty way on behalf of the owners.

Better be some good facts.  I can tolerate doing poorly (not that I like it).  However,  I expect the organization to keep its class while things are going poor.  That shows the true integrity of the organization.  Not to mention the fact that if we had targets we had plenty of time to handle this.  But no lets create drama. 

[G.A.C.O.L.B.]

Can someone please explain the whole transfer system thing to me? Watching Sportscenter and on the crawl, soccer came up: "Notable moves before the transfer deadline". The first one up was "Aresenal: M Mesut Ozil (from Real Madrid for $66M)". Who the hell is getting $66M? The player? Is he like a free agent and that's how much his contract is worth? Or is it like they bought him from his old team (I guess Real Madrid in this instance) for $66 mil? The next two confused me even more: "AC Milan: M Kaká (from Real Madrid)" with no price and then "Manchester United: M Marouane Fellaini (from Everton for $43M)". So was Kakà free for some reason or did they just not know the price to put it up there? How many years does $66 and $43 mil get you? Is soccer that big a business? How does soccer finances/profits/money compare to say the NFL? Do they have revenue sharing? Is every league different?

Really appreciate any answers I get. I know I probably sound like an idiot in this post.

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

Can someone please explain the whole transfer system thing to me? Watching Sportscenter and on the crawl, soccer came up: "Notable moves before the transfer deadline". The first one up was "Aresenal: M Mesut Ozil (from Real Madrid for $66M)". Who the hell is getting $66M? The player? Is he like a free agent and that's how much his contract is worth? Or is it like they bought him from his old team (I guess Real Madrid in this instance) for $66 mil? The next two confused me even more: "AC Milan: M Kaká (from Real Madrid)" with no price and then "Manchester United: M Marouane Fellaini (from Everton for $43M)". So was Kakà free for some reason or did they just not know the price to put it up there? How many years does $66 and $43 mil get you? Is soccer that big a business? How does soccer finances/profits/money compare to say the NFL? Do they have revenue sharing? Is every league different?

Really appreciate any answers I get. I know I probably sound like an idiot in this post.

 

When you don't know a sport, you don't sound like an idiot for asking about it man so don't ever think you do.

 

I'll go for the short answer without going into specific player/ club examples you quoted and try simplifie:

 

Unlike US sports, there's no revenue sharing in soccer. (And as such MUCH less parity which doesn't exist at all TBTH. The disparity between the 'haves' and 'have nots' is criminal in many aspects.). Each club is an autonomous business concern, with it's players it's 'assets.' What revenue you generate through what ever means is your own. Unlike US sports, where there's an initial draft and subsequent trading/ FA to move players around; in the main in soccer there's the transfer system. Players are basically bought and sold. This used to be an all year round system, but now, for the top clubs at least, there's only two transfer 'windows' to get any business done. A couple of months prior to the season starting, and then a month mid season in January. (All major European league season's tend to run in the August through May time frame or there abouts.). Yesterday was the last day of the first window of the season, hence the crazy fees and last minute deals you referenced as clubs panicked to get their rosters set for the next 4 months. The fees you see go directly between the two clubs concerned. Sometimes as a lump sum, but more often than not in staggered payments over a duration given the enormity of the fees involved. Players, particularly at top clubs, often get a 'signing on fee' agreed between themselves and their new club which is often staggered through the duration of their contract (amongst a whole range of other incentive based bonus' to go with their equally astronomical base salary ala US sports); but the transfer fees go direct to the selling club. There's no initial draft for young players. Clubs are free to pick them up from an exceptionally young age (6/7 upwards) and develop them in their youth ranks whilst they are still in school. (There's no collegiate system as such. That is uniquely American in size and stature.). In many cases with little to no limitations on where in the World they can take that young talent from. Free agents come into play when they let their contract run down, and a club can't sell them prior. The player then has the right to negotiate with any club who's interested and can often garner a much better salary as there's no transfer fee to paid. Pretty much like US sport in that respect. 

 

Soccer at the very top level dwarfs the NFL in revenue terms due to it being a World wide game as opposed to football, in the main although it is steadily growing; still being an American sport alone. For instance, Real Madrid have just broken the World transfer record with a fee equivalent to the region of $ 132 million. The last time the same club did that, for a player they paid around $ 124.5 million for in 2009, the club estimated they had made all that back in revenue alone on merchandise associated with the player in the first year alone. Such is Madrids global brand and the reputation of the player involved. There's ball clubs like the Redskins and Cowboys that are up there financial wise, but in the main Soccer is a far more lucrative game on the World stage. 

 

That was a pretty brief answer to your query, but anything more you wonder about, or any more details to anything you'd like to know; don't hesitate to ask. Far from sounding like an 'idiot', I think it's great that you're showing enough of an interest to ask on the World game. 

 

Hail. 

Edited September 3, 2013 by Gibbs Hog Heaven

[Old Bay]

Thank goodness Rovers kept Rhodes.  

[MisterPinstripe]

27.5 million for Fellaini? Im okay with that. Dont think he really fits Martinez system anyway, or at least not so effectively that we shouldnt have sold him. I am really excited to get Lukaku, finally have someone up front that can score some goals, this season should at least be exciting. I almost got really excited, then I realized it would be a loan.

Edited September 3, 2013 by MisterPinstripe

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

27.5 million for Fellaini? Im okay with that. Dont think he really fits Martinez system anyway, or at least not so effectively that we shouldnt have sold him. I am really excited to get Lukaku, finally have someone up front that can score some goals, this season should at least be exciting. I almost got really excited, then I realized it would be a loan.

 

To almost double your money after 5 years on the Belgium who's really only had the one season of any note is fantastic business, For Utd to end up paying over £ 5 million more than his release fee that they let run out. after Moyes was his manager when it was inserted; is beyond hilarious. For them to have added a guy who isn't a great contributor goals or assist wise from midfield, which they desperately lack, just makes the whole thing priceless quality. 

 

Lukaku was a fantastic pick-up. Sadly, lol. I honestly thought Mourinho would have him pegged as his new Drogba. The boy is top quality. Strong as an ox. Two great feet. Great in the air. Quick. Technically sound. Him and Benteke are a frightening prospect for the Belgium National team upfront going forward. I'll give props to Martinez there. Never saw that one coming and a fantastic bit of business for this year. 

 

But then you well over paid yourselves for the lad from Wigan so that levelled things out a bit. 

 

Thank goodness Rovers kept Rhodes.  

 

How insulting was the Wigan bid? Glad you laughed it straight off. Dave Whelan is one of the biggest dicks in football and someone needs to put him in his place. 

 

Hail. 

Edited September 3, 2013 by Gibbs Hog Heaven

[Harwich Hog]

Lukaku to Everton is great business. Would have loved to have seen Lukaku, Sturridge and Saurez triumvirate up top for Liverpool if i'm honest. Though I doubt Chelsea would have allowed him to move to a serious rival.

 

Happy with Liverpool's business though.

1. Aspas looks to be a solid, albiet not spectacular, recruitment at this stage. A decent contributor.
2. Ilori is one for the future. May not to muscle-up over the next season or so to play centre half.
3. Sakho can contribute right away and I expect him to spell Agger, Skrtel, Toure and Enrique, before establishing himself at centre-half in a season or two.
4. Moses will give us a bit out on the wing that we wouldn't otherwise have with Henderson out there.
5. Luis Alberto will provide good depth behind Gerrard, Lucas and Countinho.

No longer any glaring holes in the lineup. Maybe an extra striker in January. In the mean time lets hope Sturridge and Suarez stay fit.

Edited September 3, 2013 by Harwich Hog

[Elessar78]

Can someone please explain the whole transfer system thing to me? Watching Sportscenter and on the crawl, soccer came up: "Notable moves before the transfer deadline". The first one up was "Aresenal: M Mesut Ozil (from Real Madrid for $66M)". Who the hell is getting $66M? The player? Is he like a free agent and that's how much his contract is worth? Or is it like they bought him from his old team (I guess Real Madrid in this instance) for $66 mil? The next two confused me even more: "AC Milan: M Kaká (from Real Madrid)" with no price and then "Manchester United: M Marouane Fellaini (from Everton for $43M)". So was Kakà free for some reason or did they just not know the price to put it up there? How many years does $66 and $43 mil get you? Is soccer that big a business? How does soccer finances/profits/money compare to say the NFL? Do they have revenue sharing? Is every league different?

Really appreciate any answers I get. I know I probably sound like an idiot in this post.

Whatever you do, don't ask how these deals are brokered. 

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

Whatever you do, don't ask how these deals are brokered. 

 

For a 'small' fee in a brown paper bag, Harry Redknapp would be happy to meet in a deserted parking lot to discuss it. 

 

Allegedly. In case his lawyers are reading. 

 

Hail. 

[Elessar78]

27.5 million for Fellaini? Im okay with that. Dont think he really fits Martinez system anyway, or at least not so effectively that we shouldnt have sold him. I am really excited to get Lukaku, finally have someone up front that can score some goals, this season should at least be exciting. I almost got really excited, then I realized it would be a loan.

Was just talking about this with some Gooners, because some wanted Fellaini. He's not a very technical player. He doesn't add much to the attack. 

 

Still a long way to go, but how the heck did Ferguson win the title by double digits with this group? Well, 'cause he's a good manager and Moyes may not have a clue what he's doing. 

[Harwich Hog]

I don't mind extortionate transfer fees. I see them as an effective way of distributing the wealth between the larger clubs with high revenues and the smaller clubs. They also encourage academies to develop prospects so that down the line the youth system pays for itself. In turn, it also produces better players and improves the end product on the field.

 

My issue is with the wages. No football club ever went "under" by dishing out extortionate transfer fees - and if they did they deserved to go under for being stupid. But teams are putting their future at risk by paying their players "fair value" wages which are inflated by the one or two clubs at the top, to who money is no object.

 

A team salary cap needs to come in sooner rather than later.

 

Also - it should be against the rules for agents to be paid relative to the transfer fee. The agent's fee should come from the player's wages.

Edited September 3, 2013 by Harwich Hog

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

Was just talking about this with some Gooners, because some wanted Fellaini. He's not a very technical player. He doesn't add much to the attack. 

 

Still a long way to go, but how the heck did Ferguson win the title by double digits with this group? Well, 'cause he's a good manager and Moyes may not have a clue what he's doing. 

 

 

Bolded and underlined for emphasis. Just because it can't be said enough. 

 

Hail. 

Edited September 3, 2013 by Gibbs Hog Heaven

[JoeWolf990]

Simply put, box office club

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

also, Martinez had a better transfer window than Moyes has ever had at Everton.

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

..... also, Martinez had a better transfer window than Moyes has ever had at Everton.

 

Or Utd to date. 

 

Hail. 

[JoeWolf990]

The BBC where a tad off with that £ 18 million fee.

 

It's £ 42 freaking million. Desperate much Wenger?

 

Hail. 

desperate? you do realize he is one of the best playmakers in the world?

 

This isnt Andy Carroll we are talking about.

 

 

And contrary to what people believe about Arsenal, the club has needed a player like Özil since Fabregas left. Arsenal often struggles with creating chances, and Cazorla is better for the team out left. We've been starting old man Rosicky as the #10 since last season, which is far from ideal. Özil makes the attack so much more deadlier, which is what the team is missing. A quality attacking creator was needed more than any other position, minus striker. The defense is actually good, we may need another right back but that is more down to Sagna. I never believed for once the club needed a holding mid unless that player was world class difference maker type. (and really there are not many of those out there, except Martinez).

 

What this signing does is puts Arsenal on the table as an option for big time players. Arsenal are willing to spend for big time players for the first time in the premiership era (not including Sol Campbell, lulz) and can attract world class talent. This team probably wont win the title this year, but a title chase is def coming.