Yahoo: Goofs mar Palin's Reagan college tribute, legal fund appeal

[Predicto]

The one that is most damning is the one about seeking out the politically active black students and Marxist professors. I'm sure it just burns half the board to no end that Beck doesn't have to make up something like that. Nay, he wrote it, proofread it, and read it into an audiobook. So apparently he's just fine with it.

Course, that's less funny than it is scary and sad.

Obama was writing an autobiography. He was explaining what he did and how he thought back when he was a naive and idealistic eighteen year old college student. Apparently, you find it sad that he was honest. He should have "proofread" that part out.

What is really sad is Glenn Beck trying to pretend that the Barack Obama of age 18 is the same as the Barack Obama of age 49, and that so many people buy into that logical fallacy. When I was nineteen, I could be found lying face down in a puddle of beer vomit. Clearly, that is a perfect reflection of the person that I am today.

[Predicto]

Excuse police...take cover. You can obviously see he even paused and thought about it before he said 57. He wasn't tongue tied.

No, he was exhausted.

You guys are hilarious.

[bird_1972]

No, he was exhausted.

You guys are hilarious.

Desperation, thy name is the GOP.

[Teller]

So you're saying McCain/Palin would have been better.

Gotcha.

So you can't argue with me unless you put words in my mouth first.

Gotcha.

[War Paint]

Dude, WTF is your problem? You're an embarrassment to your cause. You can't debate to save your life, so I don't know why I'm bothering other than to scratch a mosquito bite.

Putting money into the economy provides jobs. Tax and spend was the same in the Clinton years that got us that surplus. Lowering taxes and not spending gives us no public services, and the banks collapsing would've been a little bit bad, don't you think? You also can't tell me what would have happened without the stimulus, which many credit with the halt of the worsening recession and its eventual end. Your emoticons make you look like an idiot.

Translation: I don't know how to defend Obama saying "if we don't pass the stimulus, unemployment will rise above 8%," so I'll just call War Paint names. What jobs are you talking about? Census jobs? Halting the worsening recession and it's eventual end? Yeah, now there's talk of a double dip recession, some even talking possible depression.

So no, your assumptions are completely wrong, and they further prove how terrible you are at having a real debate.

Yet, you duck questions and hurl names. Seriously, you think you are debating?

A few days? Seriously? Were you asleep in 2005? It STILL wasn't done when Bush left office! Bush put a guy in charge of FEMA whose previous job was to run a horse farm, and you want to compare? Jesus Christ.

And Obama immediately addressed the issue. He let BP have the opportunity to clean it up, they didn't, so he got involved. He issued statements immediately and took action. Just because it's inconvenient for you to remember doesn't mean that it's false.

First of all, you keep trying to frame this into a Bush vs Obama argument. Both are puds. As for a few days, read the damn time line instead of getting your panties twisted.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_Hurricane_Katrina

August 28th, a day before Katrina's second land fall.

President Bush declared a state of emergency in Alabama and Mississippi, and a major disaster in Florida, under the authority of the Stafford Act.

August 29th, the day of the second land fall.

President Bush declared a major disaster for Louisiana, Mississippi, and Alabama, under the authority of the Stafford Act.

Thursday, September 1, 2005

U.S. Senate passes a relief package.

President Bush appeared on Good Morning America, and said that he understood the frustration of Katrina victims, many of whom are still waiting for food, water, and other aid. "I fully understand people wanting things to have happened yesterday," Bush said. "I understand the anxiety of people on the ground. … So there is frustration. But I want people to know there's a lot of help coming." He said that the government's first priority is to save lives, and described the devastation that he saw while flying over the hardest-hit areas as, "very emotional," but was also very optimistic about the prospects of New Orleans' recover

Friday, September 2, 2005

* Bush signs the $10.5 billion relief package after Congress passed it. [1]

* Bush tours the hurricane-battered Gulf Coast, saying that he is ordering additional active duty forces to the region. He also authorizes a drawdown of oil from the Strategic Petroleum Reserve

So you can see, the response time was in fact just a few days. Did everything go smooth? Of course not. It was a catastrophic event.

Now to Obama. You said Obama "immediately addressed the issue".

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2010/jun/29/bp-oil-spill-timeline-deepwater-horizon

April 20th

Explosion and fire on the BP-licensed Transocean drilling rig Deepwater Horizon, located in the Gulf of Mexico. Eleven people are reported missing and approximately 17 injured. A blowout preventer, intended to prevent release of crude oil, failed to activate.

April 23rd

White House press secretary Robert Gibbs says: "I doubt this is the first accident that has happened and I doubt it will be the last."

April 29th

President Obama talks about the spill in the Rose Garden, his first public comments on the issue. He pledges "every single available resource", including the US military, to contain the spreading spill, and also says BP is responsible for the cleanup.

Was this the immediate response you were talking about?

On day 37, even James Carville is upset with Obama.

qtvoLrQBxis

I don't know why you tried to pull me into a Bush vs Obama discussion. I dislike both of them. With people like you, it's no wonder our country has fallen as it has. You are so blind in your political beliefs, that you can't objectively discuss the topic. I have no horse in the race. Bush greatly disappointed me. I refuse to ever get caught up in party politics again. You were probably one of those starry eyed zombies at an Obama rally. Enjoy being a sucker.

[Teller]

Obama was writing an autobiography. He was explaining what he did and how he thought back when he was a naive and idealistic eighteen year old college student. Apparently, you find it sad that he was honest. He should have "proofread" that part out.

What is really sad is Glenn Beck trying to pretend that the Barack Obama of age 18 is the same as the Barack Obama of age 49, and that so many people buy into that logical fallacy. When I was nineteen, I could be found lying face down in a puddle of beer vomit. Clearly, that is a perfect reflection of the person that I am today.

I don't know about you, but my core values haven't changed much in 18 years. I was a conservative then, I'm a conservative now. I was a Christian then, I'm a Christian now. I was patriotic then, I'm patriotic now.

Unless beer, to you, is a core value. There's no comparison. And at what point do we start taking what he says about himself seriously?

[War Paint]

No, he was exhausted.

You guys are hilarious.

Hey there deputy excuse maker.

So rules for blind obamabots,

Obama gaffes=exhausted from being a hero all day.

Palin gaffes=She is probably an inbred with the IQ of her shoe size.

Okay, I get it. Thank you for enlightening me:ols:

[Hubbs]

The previous administration, which caused all but the oil spill, was a don't tax but spend TREMENDOUSLY administration. Hence them inheriting a surplus and leaving us more broke than we've ever been.

Clinton's surplus had much, much more to do with the Internet boom than his policies. Just like Bush's economic legacy will have much, much more to do with the housing bust than his policies. Flip their places in history, and Bush comes out looking pretty good as far as GDP and the budget go, while Clinton becomes villified as the man who choked off American economic growth with his evil Marxist/Communist/socialist/other-ist liberal agenda.

[Burgold]

I don't know about you, but my core values haven't changed much in 18 years. I was a conservative then, I'm a conservative now. I was a Christian then, I'm a Christian now. I was patriotic then, I'm patriotic now.

Unless beer, to you, is a core value. There's no comparison. And at what point do we start taking what he says about himself seriously?

I'll quibble a bit. A lot of my core values are the same also, however, I've loosened up on gun control and the death penalty a bit and life has taught me that a few things I believed either weren't true weren't or were naive. Life or experience has changed how I understand the world and how I interact with it. At 18 the world was a lot more black and white and my statements were a lot more stark. Today, I understand things differently and many of my views have been modified and some have outright changed.

Some days, that's a sad thing. What's amazing is that I thought myself cynical at 18. Rereading what passed as cynicism by my 18 year old self is like walking through a rainbow today.

[Rocky21]

It's blocked here at work.

Which clip?

I don't know if you've seen it. It's called Sarah Palin with a laugh track. Nothing mean spirited, just some good natured ribbing of SP's interview with Katie Couric.

[The 12th Commandment]

People, particularly young people who are highly educated, are exposed and sometimes naively enamored by ideas that are outside of our box about all kinds of things. Some times these outside the box looks wind up in progress or breakthroughs on the way we looks these things. No one can criticize that.

Great as we are, we have some serious problems with the way outr government runs and with those who profit most unjustly from it, (some believe illegals Mexican's some believe corporate fat cats) but taking a look during your life at the ideas that have been proposed throughout history to deal with government, by some really, really smart people (even if they eventually were misguided in their opinion) is SMART. It's not traitorous or indicative of some sinister political domination plan = just letting ideas rumble around in your head without categorically and immediately dismissing them is part of creativity. I applaud that, particularly in a leader. Communism is not necessarily the evil plot to take over the world that is always made out to be (the Russkies didn't do well with it for sure), many parts of it are common sense and see that people like you and me aren't taken advantage of robber barons. Which we know can happen if we're not careful so it's not some absurd concern it must be protected against with the same fortitude as we use to state of the wack job leftists.

My grandfather was that kind of communist back in the day, he saw a lot of managerial misconduct in his life as he was management, he saw the need for the worker to have some power too. The aspects of communism, as one of third parties (which is how it worked here), that dealt with those issue were amenable to him. He got kicked out of this free country because of those views but that's another story. Wish I could've talked to him about it all.

[Predicto]

I don't know about you, but my core values haven't changed much in 18 years. I was a conservative then, I'm a conservative now. I was a Christian then, I'm a Christian now. I was patriotic then, I'm patriotic now.

Your experiences may not reflect everyone else's. Some people change. When Ronald Reagan began his career, he was a liberal Democrat, a fervent admirer of Franklin Roosevelt, and a vocal supporter of New Deal policies. He made speeches for Harry Truman in 1948. Needless to say, things changed.

I myself was a young Republican when I was 18, which is one of the reasons I went to the University of Chicago. I got that out of my system pretty well.

And at what point do we start taking what he says about himself seriously?

I take it very seriously. But I don't take a 300 page autobiography, turn to page 1, and say: "there is the answer." I look at page 299 for the answer.

[Heisenberg]

I don't know about you, but my core values haven't changed much in 18 years. I was a conservative then, I'm a conservative now. I was a Christian then, I'm a Christian now. I was patriotic then, I'm patriotic now.

Unless beer, to you, is a core value. There's no comparison. And at what point do we start taking what he says about himself seriously?

Count me in as someone who has changed a lot from what I was like as a 18-19 year old. My opinions and views have evolved a bit based upon my experiences.

I certainly wouldn't want someone to judge me based on my thinking back then. (and it was only 6-7 years ago)

[bird_1972]

So you can't argue with me unless you put words in my mouth first.

Gotcha.

Yeah right. So your witty attempt at an anti-Obama dig should just be taken at face value? Ha ha ... nice one. You'll have to try harder than that.

[Teller]

Yeah right. So your witty attempt at an anti-Obama dig should just be taken at face value? Ha ha ... nice one. You'll have to try harder than that.

No, of course. It should be taken at whatever you choose to misconstrue it into being.

I'm sorry if it's inconvenient for you that even as a conservative republican, who campaigned for McCain the first time around, I held my nose and decided to vote for Obama.

Anything else you'd like to claim you know better about me than I do, Captain Ignorance?

[Predicto]

I'm sorry if it's inconvenient for you that even as a conservative republican, who campaigned for McCain the first time around, I held my nose and decided to vote for Obama.

Aggg! You are going to milk that cow forever, aren't you? :doh:

[Teller]

Aggg! You are going to milk that cow forever, aren't you? :doh:

Moomoocachoo!

[Heisenberg]

No, of course. It should be taken at whatever you choose to misconstrue it into being.

I'm sorry if it's inconvenient for you that even as a conservative republican, who campaigned for McCain the first time around, I held my nose and decided to vote for Obama.

Anything else you'd like to claim you know better about me than I do, Captain Ignorance?

You (allegedly) decided to vote for him.

However, when you consider that the vote never happened you conveniently created a situation where you could say you decided to vote for him but not be blamed if he was a horrible President.

It must be nice.

[Mooka]

I don't know why you tried to pull me into a Bush vs Obama discussion. I dislike both of them. With people like you, it's no wonder our country has fallen as it has. You are so blind in your political beliefs, that you can't objectively discuss the topic. I have no horse in the race. Bush greatly disappointed me. I refuse to ever get caught up in party politics again. You were probably one of those starry eyed zombies at an Obama rally. Enjoy being a sucker.

You do realize you've contradicted yourself like 20 times and displayed an impressive amount of hackery despite claims of being above the fray.

Maybe its people like you that is the problem with politics in this country? :whoknows:

[Jumbo]

I'm sorry if it's inconvenient for you that even as a conservative republican, who campaigned for McCain the first time around, I held my nose and decided to vote for Obama.

Well, and to be honest and accurate, you didn't vote at all. You worked that day and couldn't make it. Remember? I sure do, and you should remember why.

I have seen you make this comment frequently, and I have also seen you express remorse over casting the vote (which you never did) a number of times and I think you need to quit. A claim that you intended to vote for Obama is fine.

Do you remember how that all went down now (if you had forgot)?

[NewCliche21]

War Paint:

You are utterly incapable of a real debate. Any other posts that you make regarding politics will be ignored. Your hypocrisy, inability to read or remember what you've written, tenendcy to want to inflame the argument rather than actually have one, inaccuracies in your statements, and outlandish comments speak for themselves.

Maybe if you learn how to have a debate look at your posts in this thread, and have a real self-analysis, then you'll realize how ridiculous look.

In the interim, have fun arguing with yourself. I'll be the one over here laughing.

[NewCliche21]

Clinton's surplus had much, much more to do with the Internet boom than his policies. Just like Bush's economic legacy will have much, much more to do with the housing bust than his policies. Flip their places in history, and Bush comes out looking pretty good as far as GDP and the budget go, while Clinton becomes villified as the man who choked off American economic growth with his evil Marxist/Communist/socialist/other-ist liberal agenda.

While I agree that the dot com era had a lot to do with it, it is impossible to isolate that as the sole, or even main, cause of the surplus. As we saw, those websites were making fake money, and for the surplus to be what it was took a lot more than just reams of stock being sold in the private sector.

And Bush's legacy is well-earned. We've had a terrible economy since he took office, really. A failed war and an unnecessary one, each of which costing billions a month, certainly didn't help. Coupling that with just plain stupid tax breaks also exacerbated the situation.

[Teller]

You (allegedly) decided to vote for him.

However, when you consider that the vote never happened you conveniently created a situation where you could say you decided to vote for him but not be blamed if he was a horrible President.

It must be nice.

Conveniently created? I actually filed a formal complaint with the WV secretary of state's office, in reference to the "situation" I "created." I will admit that I never heard from them, and did not followup. I'm an American. Once my initial anger wore off, I became complacent. I'm not proud of that.

I did vote for him by proxy, courtesy of Jumbo and a friend of his. I think that help me put this to bed in my own mind.

It does kind of bother me that you would use the word "allegedly." (Or it would, if your opinion was one I actually cared about. :pfft:) Whether you agree with me or not, you know that I take politics very seriously, and enjoy doing so. I struggled more with the 2008 election than any other. My decision was a result of inner-struggle and dialogue, and learning from those with whom I generally differ. Though it may not show on the board, I actually grew considerably as a person during that election cycle.

I chose to vote for Obama. I don't shy from that. I don't deny it. If I believe he's not getting the job done -- and I do believe that -- then I am just as responsible for creating this situation as anyone else who actually pulled the lever, or pushed the touch-screen button.

I've been duped before. And prior to this, it was by a fellow republican' one George W. Bush. In both cases, I'd like to think I did my due diligence and then some. But it's clear to me that in each case, I arrived at the wrong conclusion.

I understand the appearance from the outside, truly. But let me just say again for the record, I did make the decision to vote for Obama. I have come to view that decision as a mistake; just as I did the second ballot I cast for "W." It's not hard to admit my mistake, because in the grand scheme of things, this is one of the smallest I've ever made. And I'm not proud of that either.

[Teller]

Well, and to be honest and accurate, you didn't vote at all. You worked that day and couldn't make it. Remember? I sure do, and you should remember why.

I have seen you make this comment frequently, and I have also seen you express remorse over casting the vote (which you never did) a number of times and I think you need to quit. A claim that you intended to vote for Obama is fine.

Do you remember how that all went down now (if you had forgot)?

With all respect, friend, I have never said I voted for Obama. In each case, I have said "decided to," and that is accurate. I did make the decision, I just didn't get to physically push the button.

And OF COURSE I remember how that went down. Your post that evening was the second time I shed tears over that election -- the first when I was unable to cast my vote, and the second when two people 3000 miles away, decided to right what they saw as a wrong. I was, and remain, incredibly grateful for that. As long as I live, I won't forget it.

Now, enough of the mushy stuff, and back to the thread topic, instead of me. Ever think THAT role would be reversed?

[NewCliche21]

Conveniently created? I actually filed a formal complaint with the WV secretary of state's office, in reference to the "situation" I "created." I will admit that I never heard from them, and did not followup. I'm an American. Once my initial anger wore off, I became complacent. I'm not proud of that.

I did vote for him by proxy, courtesy of Jumbo and a friend of his. I think that help me put this to bed in my own mind.

It does kind of bother me that you would use the word "allegedly." (Or it would, if your opinion was one I actually cared about. :pfft:) Whether you agree with me or not, you know that I take politics very seriously, and enjoy doing so. I struggled more with the 2008 election than any other. My decision was a result of inner-struggle and dialogue, and learning from those with whom I generally differ. Though it may not show on the board, I actually grew considerably as a person during that election cycle.

I chose to vote for Obama. I don't shy from that. I don't deny it. If I believe he's not getting the job done -- and I do believe that -- then I am just as responsible for creating this situation as anyone else who actually pulled the lever, or pushed the touch-screen button.

I've been duped before. And prior to this, it was by a fellow republican' one George W. Bush. In both cases, I'd like to think I did my due diligence and then some. But it's clear to me that in each case, I arrived at the wrong conclusion.

I understand the appearance from the outside, truly. But let me just say again for the record, I did make the decision to vote for Obama. I have come to view that decision as a mistake; just as I did the second ballot I cast for "W." It's not hard to admit my mistake, because in the grand scheme of things, this is one of the smallest I've ever made. And I'm not proud of that either.

Man, as long as you thought about it, and really thought about it regardless of the jackass or elephant logos, then you have my respect. Major, major props to you on that.