2010 Record bad enough to the get franchise QB in 2011 draft???

[Renegade7]

I've been reading a lot of threads lately, and it looks like a lot of ya'll think Jason Campbell sucks. Some of you believe he's so terrible that there is no hope for him in DC at all; or that he's a lifetime backup at best, possibly out the league in the couple years. Others even whole-heartedly believe his play is so atrocious that he'll hold us back from ever winning anything if he stays. But the hatred in some of you has now ignored all forms of logic; to the point of being a personal vandetta (this absolutely is NOT the place for that ****, so please grow the **** up or leave).

There's a mixed pool of people that believe we're A) officially rebuilding, looking for playoffs and more in 2010, or C) somewhere in the middle. Put me down for , especially if we fill our needs at LT and RT through the draft this year. But we were just 4-12, so I can understand the sediment that we aren't that much improved and it will take a while to even be respectable again. Our coaching and o-line play were the main reason in my eye why we were losing game after game; even some close ones. Is JC perfect? Absolutely not, hell he cost us a couple games. But adding a superbowl winning coach and stopping the revolving door on o-line is at least a 3-4 game improvement.

A 3 or 4 game improvement is a 7-9 or 8-8 record. This year, that's a range from the #10 overall pick (Jax at 7-9), to #17 overall (San Fran 8-8). My question to you is if JC is so inept at QB, and/or our team is so far away from competing in 2010, is it possible to fall between something of that range in the first round and be in position to draft a new franchise QB? Even if it's the 14th overall pick, we should be in position to either hold pat or move up in the draft as well, right?

Flacco was the 18th overall pick the year he was drafted, Big Ben #11, Aaron Rodgers #24. Hell, Shanny moved up from 15th to 11th to draft Cutler (this is fresh off losing in the AFC championship game). In my eye, drafting a QB with the #4 pick over a tackle is like giving up on the 2010 season. I'm going to go on record and say we'll be 9-7 in 2010 (which is the 18-20 overall pick range in this years draft), new terminology on both sides of the ball and two rookie tackles.

Jason did his part in the 4-12 debacle last year, we all saw it. I'm saying with a better coaching staff and o-line (our two main weaknesses last year) we're going to shock a lot of people in 2010.

If JC holds us back in 2010, we'll easily be able to tell. I also believe we'll be in a realistic position to replace him with someone else via the draft if he doesn't show improvement, or worse shows signs of regression. Again, if he sucks next year, we should replace him in the 2011 draft. I'm looking for a definitive improvement on offense, because there will be few, if any excuses for JC left after this coming draft (if we get two tackles like we should).

JC isn't going to be an elite QB just yet in 2010, but I do believe he's going to take that next step forward with all that he's being surrounded by right now. If we do what we need to do to protect him, the coaching staff will put our offense in position to score more points then the defense allows (last I checked, that's usually how you win football games). It's been a long, long time since we've been able to do that on a consistent basis. If 2010 is a failure, I will continue to call it how I see it, rest assured.

I'm saying we should not give up on our present because of fear of the future. JC is a respectable QB that can win us football games, so rushing for the new flashy toy instead of helping him and the rest of the football team succeed right now is impulsive. We should give JC what he really needs this year to help him reach the next level (keeping him off his back) so we can be perennial playoff hunters/contenders again. If he fails in 2010, we should be in ample position to replace him and move forward with a new QB on a very good football team (or "rebuilding process", depending on our record or how you want to look at it).

So, I guess the question is: Are we going to suck so bad next year that we'll easily be able to replace a failed JC, or is this our only chance to do it for the forseable future? Is that #4 pick burninig in your pocket so bad, that you believe we won't get that high again any time soon, and that's the reason to draft a QB? If we end up in the 23-30 range, I wouldn't be against sacrificing our 2012 first rounder in a move up scenario, if JC is terrible and the only thing holding us back from winning it all. If you end up in that range, that usually means you're a pretty good football team.

[tml6157]

Shanahan finished worse then 8-8 once in his coaching career. Winning four more games then last year isn't an impossible task. With the way Shanahan has been talking he expects to contend this year so its not far fetched to say we have talent misused the he sees he can use differently and be successful here. So unless you want to trade up next year and burn more picks which we desperately need then you take a QB this year while you are in a prime spot to where we might not be again for a while.

[Unforgiven]

If you want to draft a QB in 2011 then it has to be Jake Locker (the separation between him and the next best will be sizable). We won't be bad enough to have that pick and it would require a lot to trade up.

[gutlead74]

Becuase there's a franchise qb in every draft

[Renegade7]

Shanahan finished worse then 8-8 once in his coaching career. Winning four more games then last year isn't an impossible task. With the way Shanahan has been talking he expects to contend this year so its not far fetched to say we have talent misused the he sees he can use differently and be successful here. So unless you want to trade up next year and burn more picks which we desperately need then you take a QB this year while you are in a prime spot to where we might not be again for a while.

Shanny gave up up a third rounder with his first rounder to move up and get Cutler. That 3rd rounder moved him up 4 spots to right outside the top 10 (#11). I here what you're saying on saving draft picks, but Shanny's gonna do what Shanny's gotta do, he's proven it.

Odds are this is our one chance to get the highest rated QB in the draft for a while. So I guess the question is: is this really about improving a glaring weakness at a position on the football team, or are people just not wanting to pass up the chance to draft a possible elite QB? Genuine concern for our football team or not, I see a lot of greed and hatred on this message board. Much more then anytime I can remember.

[Sellersfan]

Shanny gave up up a third rounder with his first rounder to move up and get Cutler. That 3rd rounder moved him up 4 spots to right outside the top 10 (#11). I here what you're saying on saving draft picks, but Shanny's gonna do what Shanny's gotta do, he's proven it.

Odds are this is our one chance to get the highest rated QB in the draft for a while. So I guess the question is: is this really about improving a glaring weakness at a position on the football team, or are people just not wanting to pass up the chance to draft a possible elite QB? Genuine concern for our football team or not, I see a lot of greed and hatred on this message board. Much more then ever before.

Agree with the greed and hatred part. I notice alot of people have a short term memory around here. Remember Brunell? As glaringly obvious his short comings were, I dont remember there being this level of hostility towards him. JC gets named the starter, and I remember this site being bogged down with traffic. Everyone was thrilled.

Wonder how long Brunell would have lasted behind the 09 line?

[Renegade7]

Agree with the greed and hatred part. I notice alot of people have a short term memory around here. Remember Brunell? As glaringly obvious his short comings were, I dont remember there being this level of hostility towards him. JC gets named the starter, and I remember this site being bogged down with traffic. Everyone was thrilled.

Wonder how long Brunell would have lasted behind the 09 line?

Gut, Brunell wouldn't have lasted at all. Few QBs would've.

It's eerie, really, seeing some of the things I've seen posted lately. JC isn't great, but he's definetly out-performing a good majority of recent Redskins QBs. Mathews? Wurffle? Ramsey? Hasselback? Did Banks even get chewed out like this? That I can remember, none of them got half the vile language JC is getting right now. I can understand people being passionate about their football team, but some posters are taking it to the level that I wonder if it's even really about football anymore.

[Tay]

If U get the chance to get a franchise QB U do it. If Shanny can get his guy (whoever that is) that is who he should get. U can't count on next year if U can get your guy now. There is too much that is out of our control on getting our QB any given year.

[kiingspadee]

As some of my posts and threads state - NO! We won't be THAT bad this coming season. We could be one of those zero to hero stories that happens often in the NFL get the QB this year

[wvtbred]

If you are Shanny you have to believe this is the closest you will get to the 1st pick while here so you take the shot now.

[FunBunch7]

Did the Bengals win their division last year with a 10-6 record????

They couldn't have since they finished 4-11-1 the season before!!!!

In 2008 did the falcons make a Wild card berth with an 11-5 record????

They couldn't have cuz they were 4-12 the year before!!!!

Oh yeah...does anyone know what the Saint's record was in 2008? Uhhh, they were 7-9 folks!

My point, you ask.

4-12 last season puts us as close to the Super Bowl as anybody. Let's play the games and see if we can turn some of those 3 to 8 point losses into some wins and we'll see what happens...

[alwaysaskin]

Jimmy Clausen is not a franchise QB, we can get Ponder in 2011 or Mallett if he improves.

[Ashburn Dave]

I'm not convinced there is a franchise QB this draft. SB is probably going to be fragile and not sure that JC is worth the 4th pick.

[bobzmuda]

Becuase there's a franchise qb in every draft

[Tay]

I think Jimmy is a franchise QB, not sure about Bradford but my opinion means nothing. It all depends on if Shanny think he can get his guy or not. And U get him when U can because that's the most important position in football. He might not be in a position to get his guy for another 10 yrs. Too many factors go into that

[Renegade7]

Becuase there's a franchise qb in every draft

Sometimes none, sometimes more then one.

I see a couple people saying "we'll never be this high again" or "we don't know who will be avaliable next year". So what? We have a QB right now, but he doesn't have anyone to protect his blindside. The last thing you want to do with a #4 overall pick is reach, especially on a non-position of need.

[wvtbred]

Sometimes none, sometimes more then one.

I see a couple people saying "we'll never be this high again" or "we don't know who will be avaliable next year". So what? We have a QB right now, but he doesn't have anyone to protect his blindside. The last thing you want to do with a #4 overall pick is reach, especially on a non-position of need.

I am not as high on Rex as you are but I'll take your word on it.

[mistertim]

If we get a QB this year with the #4 pick, we probably will be that bad next year, especially if we jettison Campbell and try to start the rookie, who would likely be either injured or end up with PTSD behind a line that was hardly upgraded, even if you get a RT in the 2nd round (the chances of getting a guy who can come in and start immediately at LT, our biggest and most glaring hole, and play at a decent to high level in the 2nd round are very slim). Or we could let Rex start; the guy who, when he gets rattled and pressured early tends to end up with games where his QBR is below 40. I guess there is an outside chance that Colt could end up decent. But he would still be behind a bad line.

Even if we kept Campbell the line would still have major holes (aka "absolutely no NFL level LT whatsoever"). The playcalling might make up for it to where we could win a couple more games with him, but there are no guarantees.

Also, I think this QB class is pretty weak. There are only two guys with 1st round grades and I think both of them are reaches because they both have questions marks and red flags. Unfortunately for the Rams they are in a position where they, almost literally, HAVE to draft a QB. They'll take their chances with Bradford I'm assuming.

[Renegade7]

I am not as high on Rex as you are but I'll take your word on it.

Oh, wow, you're hi-larious! That's a knee slapper right there.

I think I got a good idea where you stand on this issue already.

[MrJL]

I'm really amazed by the people here. The people who think our QB is horrible and desperately needs to be replaced still apparently think we'll have a good record despite lack of O-line, two RBs who should be past their primes, WRs who've yet to develop, a new defense with several people asked to play out of position.

Does everybody else in the NFL suck or something?

[Renegade7]

I'm really amazed by the people here. The people who think our QB is horrible and desperately needs to be replaced still apparently think we'll have a good record despite lack of O-line, two RBs who should be past their primes, WRs who've yet to develop, a new defense with several people asked to play out of position.

Does everybody else in the NFL suck or something?

It's crazy some people honestly believe that, but they do. Our success or failure next year will rest on the shoulders of Jason Campbell. Even if he plays at damn near pro-bowl level, we're still implementing a new offense with a rebuilding o-line possibly starting rookie book-ends. Coming from last season, I'm just hoping we can at least get in the top 16 on offense, for real for real; the potential is definetly there. But if JC can play lights out next year, why the hell would we draft a QB anyway?

If JC bombs there's no way we're even .500 next year. There's no reason we couldn't be able to make a move if we had to.

[Tay]

Just because we draft a QB, doesn't mean we will be great or not this year. It simply means Shanny has his guy (a potential franchise QB). If Shanny thinks that is Campbell, we stick w/ him and build around him. If he thinks it Bradford or Clausen and can draft them, he will pick that person. If he doesn't see that person on the roster or draft this year, U wait. We will build around our QB. I don't understand what's hard to comprehend. Shanny and Allen said it when they were bought on, they believe a strong franchise needs a franchise QB.

[mistertim]

Just because we draft a QB, doesn't mean we will be great or not. It simply means Shanny has his guy (a potential franchise QB). If Shanny thinks that is Campbell, we stick w/ him and build around him. If he thinks it Bradford or Clausen and can draft them, he will pick that person. If he doesn't see that person on the roster or draft this year, U wait. We will build around our QB. I don't understand what's hard to comprehend. Shanny and Allen said it when they were bought on, they believe a strong franchise needs a franchise QB.

Shanny has also commented on how important having a good offensive line is to be successful in the NFL.

[Tay]

Shanny has also commented on how important having a good offensive line is to be successful in the NFL.

Yep, but U build around your QB and its a lot easier to get quality OLinemen than it is to find a Franchise QB. I'm not denying the importance of a quality OL, but it's a lot harder to get a franchise QB. That's the position U must draft when U get the chance. But he must be the QB you want.

[JSheets]

If we get a QB this year with the #4 pick, we probably will be that bad next year, especially if we jettison Campbell and try to start the rookie, who would likely be either injured or end up with PTSD behind a line that was hardly upgraded....Or we could let Rex start; the guy who, when he gets rattled and pressured early tends to end up with games where his QBR is below 40. I guess there is an outside chance that Colt could end up decent. But he would still be behind a bad line.

+1.

Shanny is no fool, he's bringing his A+ game and will make all of our QBs better....It's time to inflict pain and suffering on the eaglets, midgets and cowgurls and their jabronie fans for a change.