Am I the only one who thinks our secondary might be best in the league?

[Warhead36]

Yeah and he is so average its unreal that fans think he is a good SS...again, he is average at best.

There is a reason that he was a 7th round pick...he got very lucky on 2 of those pics...the dallas one was very nice though...he was splitting time at the end of last year...I think the coached might agree.

Just because you don't make the Pro Bowl doesn't mean you aren't good. Horton's a good, solid Safety. Is he a star? No, but he's a solid starter. You're not going to have 53 Pro Bowlers.

[dellman]

Of course they look good; they ARE good. A good defense makes players look good and Baltimore and Pittsburgh have phenominal defenses. You say there's no one besides Ed Reed (which is erroneous because we also have Landry, Foxworth, and Rolle) but who in the league is even close to him? Only one guy: Troy Polamalu... hmm what a coincidence, he happens to play for Pitts.

What makes the Baltimore and Pitsburgh defenses so good is not their secondary as much as their linebackers. Both teams regularly put 2 or 3 linebackers in the pro bowl.

Great linebackers keep your secondary playing the secondary and because your safeties are not worried about the run. Their secondary also doesn't have to blitz as much because they have linebackers who can pass rush. We don't.

One of our problems has been no pass rush so we have to use our corners and safeties as blitzers. Perhaps now that Orakpo is going to be used as a linebacker, and if Blache ever learns how to design blitzes properly, then maybe our safeties and corners can just focus on the pass defense like Baltimore and Pittsburg do.

Everybody blitzes safeties and corners occasionally, I know that. But the Redskins are just prone to more of that because they have no pass rush from their linebackers.

[No Excuses]

I think Baltimore and Pittsburgh are better than us simply because Polamalu and Reed are more of a difference maker than anyone in our secondary.

After that, no one has the depth and the physical ability of our secondary. Tennessee is laughable at best. These guys were burnt toast when Haynesworth and Vandenbosch weren't dominating.

[IbleedBnG83]

I can't believe Mosely put us in front of the 'Boys. Lets see, the Eagles lose Dawkins and they are still ahead of the 'Skins!? And how are the Giants first?

Pfffft.

I would say we definitely have the best and deepest secondary in the NFC East, and top 5 in the league

[darklight1216]

What makes the Baltimore and Pitsburgh defenses so good is not their secondary as much as their linebackers. Both teams regularly put 2 or 3 linebackers in the pro bowl.

Great linebackers keep your secondary playing the secondary and because your safeties are not worried about the run. Their secondary also doesn't have to blitz as much because they have linebackers who can pass rush. We don't.

Uhm... so basically you're saying that the best defenses run like a well oiled machine and all the parts function as they should?

That's good to know.

One of our problems has been no pass rush so we have to use our corners and safeties as blitzers. Perhaps now that Orakpo is going to be used as a linebacker, and if Blache ever learns how to design blitzes properly, then maybe our safeties and corners can just focus on the pass defense like Baltimore and Pittsburg do.

Everybody blitzes safeties and corners occasionally, I know that. But the Redskins are just prone to more of that because they have no pass rush from their linebackers.

So would Campbell be just as good as Peyton Manning if he had Indy's O-line?

Yeah, the linebackers and the D-lines are great, but so are the guys behind them.

[kramdizzle]

its not the best however its top ten

[jrfriedm]

Am I the only one who thinks our secondary might be best in the league?

Yes

[skinsince72]

Considering our pass rush and the number of sacks we generated, coupled with being the 4th defense in the league, I would agree that it is WAS the best in the league. Springs is not here anymore. Not saying he was great but teams really respected our secondary. Carlos is a great cover corner(not great hands), Springs had that veteran ability and very solid, and Landry cleaned up. Strong Safety was not as solid but Horton impressed me.

IMO, Hall's performance should be something we all pay attention to.

[illone]

Our secondary is still the best because they still covered everyone with NO pass rush.

All the teams people keep listing as having better secondaries would get torched if they had no pass rush like the Skins.

[.THEkid.]

Uhm... so basically you're saying that the best defenses run like a well oiled machine and all the parts function as they should?

That's good to know.

So would Campbell be just as good as Peyton Manning if he had Indy's O-line?

Yeah, the linebackers and the D-lines are great, but so are the guys behind them.

dude, honestly you cant sit there, and tell me your DBs are just as good as your LBs and DLs. Your front 7 could easily make the Pro Bowl. Only guy in your backfield who is by far good, is Ed Reed. Not to knock the guy, cause the man is just unreal, but how would his stats look if he didnt have, Bart Scott, Ray Lewis, T. Sugg, H. Nata, T. Price, J, Johnson. I mean come on man. Even before that group you guys had Adeluis Thomas. Everytime i watch the Ravens play. NO ONE CAN RUN ON THEM. ABSOLUTELY NO ONE. And when Qbs get the chance to throw the ball. They're already looking to be killed.

I hate the ravens with a passion, and thats because my ex bestfriend was a die hard ravens fan. And we would debate who had the better safety. Ed Reed or Sean taylor. I know some of you hate to here his name over and over after his passing, but i think he was the only MAN who i thought was better than Ed Reed. Shows you how good he really was, cause i think as of right now. Ed Reed is arguably the best safety EVER.

[darklight1216]

dude, honestly you cant sit there, and tell me your DBs are just as good as your LBs and DLs.

Did I say that?

Your front 7 could easily make the Pro Bowl. Only guy in your backfield who is by far good, is Ed Reed. Not to knock the guy, cause the man is just unreal, but how would his stats look if he didnt have, Bart Scott, Ray Lewis, T. Sugg, H. Nata, T. Price, J, Johnson. I mean come on man. Even before that group you guys had Adeluis Thomas. Everytime i watch the Ravens play. NO ONE CAN RUN ON THEM. ABSOLUTELY NO ONE. And when Qbs get the chance to throw the ball. They're already looking to be killed.

That's what you call team work.

Here's the thing: if the secondary allowed people to score passes on them, barely anyone would remember that the line didn't allow anyone to run. The Ravens were the second best pass defense, whether you like it or not; incidentally, their run defense was third in the league.

I hate the ravens with a passion, and thats because my ex bestfriend was a die hard ravens fan. And we would debate who had the better safety. Ed Reed or Sean taylor. I know some of you hate to here his name over and over after his passing, but i think he was the only MAN who i thought was better than Ed Reed. Shows you how good he really was, cause i think as of right now. Ed Reed is arguably the best safety EVER.

I've never actually taken the time compare the two statistically, but I think I will...

Here are some stats from Sean Taylor's first three years and from Ed Reed's first three years. It just so happens that both of them were physically unable to play all 16 games of their fourth years so I left them off.

Tackles Sacks Ints(Yards)* FF** Tds

ST:257 ST:2 ST: 7 ST:144 ST:6 ST: 1

ER:232 ER:4 ER:21 ER:684 ER:4 ER: 3

*(Average yards:

ST (2004-2006) 21.2, 17.0, 25.0

ER (2002-2004) 33.4, 18.9, 39.8)

** (This stat is from Yahoo, all others are from Nfl.com)

Sean Taylor had more forced fumbles and more tackles, which is particularly impressive since he was a free safety. Ed Reed had more interceptions, yards, sacks, and touchdowns.

Some things to consider:

Not only did Sean Taylor have an incredible amount of tackles, he was also recognized as one of the hardest hitters in the National Football League.

Sean Taylor had one pro-bowl appearance, Ed Reed had two.

In his third year Ed Reed made his record breaking 106 yard interception touchdown.

This is, of course, a moot point because Sean Taylor will not be helping the Redskins secondary in 2009.

[GIBBS LIVES]

were one of the best secondaries in the league WITHOUT a pass rush.

just imagine how good this secondary could be if we had a legit pass rush. then some wonder why i flip out when i hear that orakpo is gonna be a linebacker the majority of the time.

The reason that they say what they say about our secondary is that our secondary is dead last within the last 5-6 years in pick/TD's. In other words, the secondary hasn't made game changing plays.

It's understandable. Especially when we added "hands of stone" Carlos Rogers who struggles to hold onto the ball.

[Stadium-Armory]

If we retained Springs, maybe.

Without him our secondary becomes fragile. If Carlos injures his knee again then our secondary is all of a sudden a liability. Unless of course we have something special in Barnes.

I think just about every secondary in the league is one injury away from a big hole - there just aren't that many good CBs in the league. We have 3 guys there who could start a game without giving up much, and that is better than most teams can say. Throw in a solid Landry and rising star Horton and we're clearly one of the best.

[skinny21]

Well, I've done a little research and here's what I came up with:

(For dbs only)

Passes defensed - WAS 73, NYG 70, PHI 69, DAL 33

Total Tackles*- WAS 373, NYG 423, PHI 362, DAL 337

Ints - WAS 11, NYG 15 PHI 10, DAL 7

*assists and solo tackles together

The stats don't tell the whole story by any means, but I thought they were interesting nonetheless.

Just based on stats I'd put the eagles, skins and giants all together (the giants maybe a slight step ahead) and dallas easily in 4th.

[truskin4life]

Why would someone give this thread 1 STAR????? It seems some people in here only like to discuss the negative aspects of this team and look down on our strong characteristics.

Amen ! That is exactly what I was thinking.

[alwaysaskin]

The opinion will change because we have a pass rush now which will force Opposing QB's to make mistakes that our secondary can capitalize on. I like our starters, and I hoper Barnes and/or tryon is ready to go

[Justsomeguy]

The opinion will change because we have a pass rush now which will force Opposing QB's to make mistakes that our secondary can capitalize on. I like our starters, and I hoper Barnes and/or tryon is ready to go

I am with you 100% on that note.

[rubynj]

Of course they look good; they ARE good. A good defense makes players look good and Baltimore and Pittsburgh have phenominal defenses. You say there's no one besides Ed Reed (which is erroneous because we also have Landry, Foxworth, and Rolle) but who in the league is even close to him? Only one guy: Troy Polamalu... hmm what a coincidence, he happens to play for Pitts.

Why do you dislike #20?

Im sorry for flaming man,but Samari rolle? My best friend told me he was at a ravens game wearing his rolle jersey and he got burnt so bad and often that he threw it right in the trashcan before the game was even over.

Foxworth played for denver last year right? nuff said,and only betters the argument that a dominant front 7 is necessary.

Landy is decent,but returning from a scary injury.

so ive counted 2 injury prone starting corners in washington,and rolle. The loss of bart scott,rex ryan and jim leonard(who made plays at big moments last year) and i assure you that the ravens will still have a good defense but not as good.

Haloti Ngata,ray lewis, ed reed and Suggs are your best players obviously and the rest of the guys are pieces built around them. 2 of those 3 get after the qb as best as anyone in the nfl,and all people here are arguing is now that we have a dominant dt and pass rush off the edge in RAK...we will get to see our secondary feast on quarterbacks throwing ducks and when it usually was 4 to 6 seconds to cover recievers it now becomes 2 to 3 seconds and the opertunity to jump routes becomes available.

Ed reed is a world talent. but put him on the redskins last year and hes not the same player because hes 30 yards deep every play. He has great return skills once he gets the ball,but soo does deangelo hall,and i for one cannot wait to see him grab a few pick 6's.

noone said ed reed isnt any good. one guy just said they didnt like him.

[darklight1216]

Im sorry for flaming man,but Samari rolle? My best friend told me he was at a ravens game wearing his rolle jersey and he got burnt so bad and often that he threw it right in the trashcan before the game was even over.

Well, I could point to a game in which Ed Reed looked bad, so what? Everyone has a bad game or two.

Foxworth played for denver last year right? nuff said,and only betters the argument that a dominant front 7 is necessary.

Everyone keeps ignoring the fact that I said we have a good line and good linebackers; the fact is: we have a good secondary as well.

D. Foxworth played for Atlanta last year, and several teams tried to get him when he hit FA.

Landy is decent,but returning from a scary injury.

So are Brady and Merriman... Ray Lewis was injured before, so was Ed Reed. That's football for you; people get injured and they get back in the game.

so ive counted 2 injury prone starting corners in washington,and rolle.

Dude, last year the Ravens were more injured than Mike Vicks dogs. If anything that points to the fact that they are tough enough to get past injuries, and suggests that if they are healthy, they will be even better than last year, which means other teams will have even further to catch up.

Btw, cornerback is actually the most competitive position right now. Several players, including Chris Carr, Frank Walker, K.G. and others, are in the running. The starters haven't been determined.

The loss of bart scott,rex ryan and jim leonard(who made plays at big moments last year) and i assure you that the ravens will still have a good defense but not as good.

I like how you talk about how injury prone last years starters were and then talk about Jim Leonhard- a guy who is proof positive that the Ravens have depth and can replace injured players.

Anything is possible, but let's not forget that all of the members of the new staff have done well so far, in fact they did much better than the previous management did in '07... why are you so certain the new DC (who is said to be more aggressive than Ryan) can't do the same?

Bart Scott is one starter... the Steelers don't have one of their starters from last year, yet no one is saying their defense will drop. J. Leo was a back-up and nothing more; Baltimore has always had good defensive players and he is not unique- there are others. (And by others I do mean "other decent back-ups")

Haloti Ngata,ray lewis, ed reed and Suggs are your best players obviously and the rest of the guys are pieces built around them.

There are many unsung heroes on B'more's defense, but yes, those guys are excellent. However, there are other good players as well. I don't get why people try to act like having good players and a good system is such a bad thing. "He's only good cuz of this guy or that guy." No, that guy is good and so is this one. It is actually possible to have multiple players on one team who are good.

2 of those 3 get after the qb as best as anyone in the nfl,and all people here are arguing is now that we have a dominant dt and pass rush off the edge in RAK...we will get to see our secondary feast on quarterbacks throwing ducks and when it usually was 4 to 6 seconds to cover recievers it now becomes 2 to 3 seconds and the opertunity to jump routes becomes available.

Baltimore led the league in interceptions and were third in defensive scoring without one of their best linemen. The secondary is also upgraded as well.

I never said that the Redskins couldn't be better than they were last year.

Ed reed is a world talent. but put him on the redskins last year and hes not the same player because hes 30 yards deep every play.

He has great return skills once he gets the ball,but soo does deangelo hall,and i for one cannot wait to see him grab a few pick 6's.

Ed Reed used to play close to the line when he was a strong safety and he got just as many interceptions and several tds.

noone said ed reed isnt any good. one guy just said they didnt like him.

Did I ever imply that someone had said Ed Reed was not good?

[Troy Fakeman]

To answer the OP...

"No, you are not alone"

To end up with a "Top 4" defense in the league without a pass rush...means your secondary is all world.

Some of the comments within his thread are absolutely str8 trifling...especially with regard to Laron Landry...aka Dr. Lurk.

Carlos Rogers = 1st Round Pick

DeAngelo Hall = 1st Round Pick

Laron Landry = 1st Round Pick..........

Horton is young and needs to repeat his freshman success. Our Secondary is in the top 3 of the league with or without Horton in the discussion. A lot of people in this thread feel Laron hasn't lived up to expectations...

Laron GAVE us the Seattle game on a silver platter with his TWO INTS in a PLAYOFF GAME...and Gibbs, Saunders, Portis, and Todd Collins couldn't get it done.

It's unfortunate that Sean was the most ridiculous athlete any of us have ever seen...especially at Safety of all positions. His supremacy still shadows Laron...

[NewCliche21]

To answer the OP...

"No, you are not alone"

To end up with a "Top 4" defense in the league without a pass rush...means your secondary is all world.

Some of the comments within his thread are absolutely str8 trifling...especially with regard to Laron Landry...aka Dr. Lurk.

Carlos Rogers = 1st Round Pick

DeAngelo Hall = 1st Round Pick

Laron Landry = 1st Round Pick..........

Horton is young and needs to repeat his freshman success. Our Secondary is in the top 3 of the league with or without Horton in the discussion. A lot of people in this thread feel Laron hasn't lived up to expectations...

Laron GAVE us the Seattle game on a silver platter with his TWO INTS in a PLAYOFF GAME...and Gibbs, Snyder, Portis, and Todd Collins couldn't get it done.

It's unfortunate that Sean was the most ridiculous athlete any of us have ever seen...especially at Safety of all positions. His supremacy still shadows Laron...

Snyder gets blamed for that game? Really?

I'd blame Moss the most for giving up on that play.

[Troy Fakeman]

Snyder gets blamed for that game? Really?

I'd blame Moss the most for giving up on that play.

Whoops - I meant "Saunders"...not "Snyder".

I definitely just got Monday'd......my bad.

Still.....Laron's second INT put us in a position to open the flood gates...and our multi-faceted coaching staff....all world running back....couldn't get the job done. We lost that game because we failed to score more than one or two TDs..........shocker.

Additionally..........Laron has put us in place to win with his INTs in the recent Ravens and Giants game..................and we failed to score after his INT in both games I believe.

Shocker.....

[NewCliche21]

Whoops - I meant "Saunders"...not "Snyder".

I definitely just got Monday'd......my bad.

Still.....Laron's second INT put us in a position to open the flood gates...and our multi-faceted coaching staff....all world running back....couldn't get the job done. We lost that game because we failed to score more than one or two TDs..........shocker.

Additionally..........Laron has put us in place to win with his INTs in the recent Ravens and Giants game..................and we failed to score after his INT in both games I believe.

Shocker.....

Just messing with ya!

And yes, LaRon should've won us that game in Seattle and put us in position more than once to win other games. The rest of the team just couldn't get it done.

[The Tris]

DL, Ed Reed is THE premier playmaker out of NFL DBs, hands down. But one player does not make Balt's secondary best in the league, nor does Polamalu make Pitts the best. For both of these teams, it starts up front with tremendous pressure. Hampton and Ngata swallowing the interior, and demons coming off the edges like Suggs and Harrison. It is a testiment to Balt's front seven that their defense was as tough as it was last year, when you had aging CBs who couldn't cover for more than two beats.

IMO, the best secondary in the NFL last year belong to the Tennessee Titans, lead by Finnegan and Chris Hope, with Nick Harper and Michael Griffin. They too benefited from DL pressure, the same pressure I hope we get from a certain ex-Titan. I would further argue that Green Bay has a better secondary that the aforementioned Steelers and Ravens, as they have the handicap of a similar derth of pressure to the Skins.

I won't even address how silly Mosley's rankings are in my eyes, and instead offer this ranking of secondaries in the league:

1. Titans (all four peaking)

2. Packers (worried about the CBs ages)

3. Steelers (benefit from best supporting cast)

4. Redskins (young core primed to realize potential with more complete D)

5. Ravens (single best DB, lacks solid CBs)

6. Eagles (still don't buy Sean Jones hype)

7. Giants (trying to remove Moseley's head from Phillips' posterior)

8. Chargers (young playmakers in Cason and Cromartie)

9. Cardinals (saw their absolute best in postseason run)

10. Cowboys (hahaha, yeah right, uh, I don't know, the Jets will be good with Rex's D I guess)

[pjfootballer]

No way they are the best in the league. I'd give them top 10, but not the best. If ST was still alive I'd say hell yeah.