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The Figure Four - ALL Things ECW-WWF-NJPW-TNA-ROH-AEW


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By the way, the rumor is that Brock is heading back to UFC as soon as the WWE contract is up and that they want to get the title of him sooner rather than later.

 

If Brock drops the strap at the Rumble and leaves, did spending all that money help the WWE in any way, shape or form?

 

It felt like a bad decision at the time, and if this happens, it will be a complete bust. I could have seen putting the strap on him and developing a few mid-card guys and elevating them into title contenders, but that has not happened. The same guys are still at the same level and nothing has really changed all that much. It looks like the only guy to get that push was Reigns, and the injury derailed that. But that may have been the best thing to happen, because it is fairly evident that he is not ready.

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I think they're going to go another way with the title.

 

Brock will likely drop the title to Cena at Royal Rumble, but Cena is going to pin Rollins so Brock doesn't suffer the pinfall.

 

Bryan wins the Rumble.

 

Sting continues his feud with Triple H.

 

WrestleMania Card:

 

WWE World Heavyweight Title:

John Cena © vs. Daniel Bryan (Rumble Winner) - Look for Rollins to cash in on Bryan when Cena celebrates with Bryan to show him congrats. Authority/Rollins blame Cena for Bryan being vulnerable.

 

Triple H vs. Sting

 

Brock Lesnar vs. Roman Reigns

 

Undertaker vs. Bray Wyatt

 

Rollins vs. Ambrose

 

Harper vs. Rowan

 

Ziggler/Ryback vs. Kane/Barrett

 

Then who knows/who cares?

Edited by KDawg
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You know, that's actually a pretty great card.

 

Bryan certainly "deserves" the main event as much as anyone, and I know it's a cool story, but I think he and Brock in a match is a little ridiculous.

 

I like the idea of Reings going over Lesnar without the title on the line. He gets "the rub" but you aren't putting the company on the back of an unproven dude just because Vince likes the way his pecs look or something.

 

I don't like the idea of Rollins stealing the belt as the last image though. Is the Authority celebrating really the way to end Mania?

 

I actually like the idea of Rollins trying to cash in the next night in front of the Smarky Smarks....and failing. His character of being the constant schemer who never quite gets what he wants is a pretty good one. If anyone can fail and stay over, it's him. And it would allow you to build up Bryan as the new "overcomer of odds" even more. I would happily watch Rollins chase Bryan for months and fail. And then you can transition to Reigns if you want after he gets a little more seasoning and it won't feel nearly as rushed.

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By the way, here's a random question.

 

Does carrying angles from Total Divas to Raw make actual sense?

 

What I mean is: do people watch that show and think, "Oh man....I can't wait for the match."

 

Because I have to think the dudes watching Raw have no idea what the hell is going on in those Diva matches right now. I would love to see a Venn Diagram of Total Divas and Raw.

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By the way, here's a random question.

 

Does carrying angles from Total Divas to Raw make actual sense?

 

What I mean is: do people watch that show and think, "Oh man....I can't wait for the match."

 

Because I have to think the dudes watching Raw have no idea what the hell is going on in those Diva matches right now. I would love to see a Venn Diagram of Total Divas and Raw.

As of this season, I'm pretty sure every Diva that's on the roster right now has been in it except for AJ Lee and Emma.

 

I don't watch it, not even a second of it actually, but I do know dudes who do. 

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As of this season, I'm pretty sure every Diva that's on the roster right now has been in it except for AJ Lee and Emma.

 

I don't watch it, not even a second of it actually, but I do know dudes who do. 

 

I've never watched an episode, but every recap of Raw has a line about "This match is a carryover from _____ on Total Divas" which is a really bizarre way to book wrestling in my mind.

 

I get it though. Total Divas is one of the few things they have going that is actually working right now.

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Oh, I'm not a TNA fan. 

 

But...

 

With the WWE product being on and off (I do enjoy some of their shows and I equally HATE some of their shows), I figure TNA can't be much worse than what I saw on RAW this week. The only saving grace for RAW's awfulness is that I fast forward and watch the whole thing in around an hour/hour and a half.

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It felt like a bad decision at the time, and if this happens, it will be a complete bust. I could have seen putting the strap on him and developing a few mid-card guys and elevating them into title contenders, but that has not happened. The same guys are still at the same level and nothing has really changed all that much. It looks like the only guy to get that push was Reigns, and the injury derailed that. But that may have been the best thing to happen, because it is fairly evident that he is not ready.

 

there's not many midcarders people would have bought as beating Lesnar considering they wanted him to destroy the main eventers to make him look good.  I mean I remember when people said having Miz just stand his ground against him was insult to Lesnar

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there's not many midcarders people would have bought as beating Lesnar considering they wanted him to destroy the main eventers to make him look good.  I mean I remember when people said having Miz just stand his ground against him was insult to Lesnar

 

Lesnar is dealing with the Andre problem.

 

I'll be brief on this old school memory. Vince, Sr. probably made more money sending Andre around the world and taking a piece of his fee that he ever would have made keeping Andre in New York full-time. The idea behind Andre was that he was unbeatable. (And for everyone that only knows the Andre of Wrestlemania 3, this was much more believable in the 70s and early 80s. Andre WAS bigger than everyone and was ridiculously agile in his prime). So, if you make the unbeatable guy the champion....what do you do? Bob-Backlund versus Ken Patera was a big money match often because the challenger was bigger and stronger than the champion. Andre-Patera was a big money match once because the whole idea was seeing Andre kick Patera's ass. For once, Patera would be the smaller weaker guy. But once it happened, it happened. Andre beating Patera three times would only bore the fans and kill Patera.

 

Sending Andre around the world made sense. I told you: I was able to watch three territories in the early 80s, and an Andre appearance was always the highlight of the year. Dusty is in trouble. He's outnumbered. He's outmanned. He needs a tag team partner. Wait, he's bringing in Andre!!!!! Dusty is saved!!!!! Andre never even showed up on tv. You just said: He'll be in the Omni on Saturday Night and people would **** themselves.

 

But you couldn't have him in the Omni every Saturday because then it would be "Watch Andre beat up the Freebirds for the 15th consecutive week."

 

That's the problem with Lesnar. He's really only interesting when he's beating the **** out of people. But it's also kind of boring to watch him only beat the **** out of people. And it doesn't make sense when he is NOT beating the **** out of people.

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Which is why Andre never won the strap technically

It's hard to have an unstoppable beast as your champ. That's why Goldberg's character took a huge dive after he won the belt.

How do you book a feud when your champion has run roughshod over everyone?

WCW came up wth the ****ty ending to Starrcade 98 and the rest is history

Edited by BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93
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That Goldberg run tho. EPIC

As a 9-10 year old kid, you dont quite understand yet that some guys are made to look more beatable than others, but at that point I literally thought he was the most dangerous dude on planet Earth. Bigger than Austin even.

Then I tune into more WWF and like a year later, I turn to Thursday Thunder, and he's getting his ass beat by Sycho Sid

Edited by Mr. Sinister
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Which is why Andre never won the strap technically

It's hard to have an unstoppable beast as your champ.

 

That's reason #1 why I was never a huge Hogan fan in the 80s. It just never seemed possible that he could lose. Certainly not to the Kamalas and Big John Studds of the world.

To his credit, Hogan in the early years always did a masterful job of making his opponent look good right up to the point where he squashed him. It usually went "Hogan gets jumped on the weekend tv show, Hogan has match at MSG or Spectrum where he loses by countout or DQ or it's a double DQ or some schnozz, Hogan has follow-up match at MSG or Spectrum where he triumphs." They could 4 months out of a Kamala sneak attack this way - even if it never really felt like Hogan was going to lose.

 

Hogan's first face run in WCW was the exact opposite of this. He crushed Flair right out of the gate....even though they had two rematches scheduled. He no sold Vader's powerbomb even though that match should have been a huge PPV draw. He was "revived" by Randy Savage's flying elbow which made no sense at all and killed the finisher of the dude who should have been the next money feud even before it happened. He and Savage beat the Dungeon of Doom and the Horsemen combined in a PPV match. Pre NWO Hogan in WCW was ridiculous.

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That Goldberg run tho. EPIC

 

 

The Locker Room in WCW did Golberg no favors.

 

He should have kept beating dudes for months, but they immediately just made him a guy after he won the belt. And the end to his match with Nash was stupid. I know Nash claims that he was "protecting" Goldberg in the way the streak ended, but it should have ended simply:

 

A more experienced wrestler outsmarts him into a mistake. Then you can do the rebuilding of Goldberg leading to him correcting that error in a rematch down the road. I mean Brett Hart was on the roster and seems like the perfect dude for that role - especially since Bretty had nothing else to do and would have eventually made Goldberg looked like a million bucks when he gave the belt back. They did a variation of this eventually when Goldberg gave Hart a speak but Hart had a plate on under his clothes. It didn't need to be that kind of thing, but I think you could have kept the streak up for at least six or ten more months. Done the loss. Done the chase for three or four months. And then had a normal Goldberg run for a year or so.

 

But Hogan wanted the belt. And Hall wanted the belt. And there weren't enough belts to go around.

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LKB...I would love to hear your review of the Hogan-Dungeon of Doom feud in WCW lol

OMG...the Yetayyyyyyyyyyy!

 

If you guys get a chance, watch this vid (It's pretty long).

 

These guys are from Ireland and review a lot of shows. It's very well done (it's not just 3 guys talking. They actually have footage of the show spliced in very well) and hilarious as well. This is their Halloween Havoc 95 review 

 

http://oswreview.com/media/oswreview46/

Edited by BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93
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That's reason #1 why I was never a huge Hogan fan in the 80s. It just never seemed possible that he could lose. Certainly not to the Kamalas and Big John Studds of the world.

To his credit, Hogan in the early years always did a masterful job of making his opponent look good right up to the point where he squashed him. It usually went "Hogan gets jumped on the weekend tv show, Hogan has match at MSG or Spectrum where he loses by countout or DQ or it's a double DQ or some schnozz, Hogan has follow-up match at MSG or Spectrum where he triumphs." They could 4 months out of a Kamala sneak attack this way - even if it never really felt like Hogan was going to lose.

 

Hogan's first face run in WCW was the exact opposite of this. He crushed Flair right out of the gate....even though they had two rematches scheduled. He no sold Vader's powerbomb even though that match should have been a huge PPV draw. He was "revived" by Randy Savage's flying elbow which made no sense at all and killed the finisher of the dude who should have been the next money feud even before it happened. He and Savage beat the Dungeon of Doom and the Horsemen combined in a PPV match. Pre NWO Hogan in WCW was ridiculous.

Man listen....lol

 

Ppl say Hogan was throwing his weight around during the NWO era? That has nothing on 94-95 era Hogan. Jobs out Vader (one of the best monster heels ever) and Flair (THE guy in WCW) AND GETS BRUTUS BEEFCAKE IN THE MAIN EVENT OF ****ING STARRCADE!! WUT???

 

They let that dude do whatever the hell he wanted. I also heard the Dungeon of Doom was partly his idea as well smh. No wonder he started getting booed more during this period 

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LKB...I would love to hear your review of the Hogan-Dungeon of Doom feud in WCW lol

OMG...the Yetayyyyyyyyyyy!

 

If you guys get a chance, watch this vid (It's pretty long).

 

These guys are from Ireland and review a lot of shows. It's very well done and hilarious as well. This is their Halloween Havoc 95 review 

 

http://oswreview.com/media/oswreview46/

 

Up front, I am a Kevin Sullivan mark. And I became a Sullivan mark through the wrestling magazines. I remember him as a white meat babyface in Georgia. I remember his heel turn there. But I never saw his Florida devil worshipping stuff at the time. I read about it in the Apter mags, and it sounded amazing. I've seen it since on tape and it's aged somewhat poorly but you can see why it was such a big deal. Also, young Nancy Sullivan/Benoit is ungoddamn believable looking. The fact that Sullivan was apparently doing unspeakable things to her in cheap Florida motel rooms at that time is enough to make anyone a mark.

 

Having said that, the Dungeon of Doom was as stupid as anything in wrestling history. I have no problem with nonsense in wrestling. I have no problem with stables I call Hobo's Armies. (Paul Jone's Army in Crockett is my favorite terrble stable ever if that makes sense). The problem with the Dungeon was that the nonsense wasn't entertaining AND - most importantly - it infected the top of the card. Hobo's Armies were meant to cut Jimmy Valiant's beard in the midcard, non main event PPVs.

 

But I blame Hogan for this more than anyone. He apparently wanted to wrestle Kamala and the Shark and whoeverthe****.

 

Now.....having said that....there are two things I adored about the Yeti:

 

1. He is not, in fact, a Yeti. He is, in fact, a mummy. A mummy is not a Yeti.

2. Everyone pronounces it Yetay, which is incorrect. The reason it is pronounced Yetay is because that is how Sullivan in his ridiculously thick Boston accent pronounced it. And everyone followed suit.

 

 

Seriously, go to youtube right now and pull up Sullivan calling The Purple Haze out of the surf on The Gulf Coast. That is pro wrestling to me, brother.

 

There are also few things in wrestling I find more entertaining than Kevin Sullivan and The Purple Haze (Mark Levin) squashing the **** out of poor jobbers on Florida tv. I hope to God they got paid double for those jobs because Sullivan and Levin would beat the piss out of those dudes.

 

I saw a shoot with Sullivan where he said that he and Levin used to drive around Tampa in their robes to really sell the gimmick. I like to imagine the stoned dude in 7-11 who had to sell a case of Schlitz and a carton of Camels to a 5'6 Sullivan and the 6'3 monster Levin as they stood in front of him in flip flops and their Satanist robes.

 

God, I miss pro wrestling.

 

This kind of stuff used to happen all over America. Now, it's the Ice Capades.

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By the way, Sullivan does a shoot with Raven where he describes the single greatest angle concept I ever heard and I can't believe it's never been copied.

 

Sullivan and Dusty are fighting forever. Dusty finally gets a Loser Leaves Town match with Sully. Dusty wins. Sully takes off. Fine. Basic stuff.

 

Cut to a few months later. They do a Happy Birthday, Dusty segment on Florida tv. Dusty's "sister" shows up to give Dusty a gift and talk about his childhood. I forget the details but Sullivan is under the ring or something and throws powder or a fireball at Dusty he ducks....and it hits the "sister." Sullivan sprints as Dusty's sister may be dying in the ring and is almost certainly blind for life.

 

Now, Dusty wants revenge. But Sullivan is banned from Florida. Dusty wants the stipulation lifted so he can get revenge. The board of directors agree. And they find Sullivan somewhere in - I dunno - Calcutta (or Tampa) and inform him that he can return to Florida anytime he wants.

 

Here's the best part: Sullivan refuses to come back. He's built a new life, hurt Dusty forever, and sees no need to come back. There was probably a snake and a beast and a witch involved in this.

 

So, now, Dusty has to find a way to get Sullivan back. I think it ended up by Dusty offering his retirement as a stipulation or something. But I love the idea of the Loser Leaves Town match not wanting to return.

 

They should do that with the pansies HHH just turfed. Have them hospitalize Steph and refuse reinstatement or something when HHH wants them in the ring.

Edited by Lombardi's_kid_brother
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  • TK changed the title to The Figure Four - ALL Things ECW-WWF-NJPW-TNA-ROH-AEW

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