Moving Towards our Future Front Office and Coaching Hires. All the Way to the Water Boy - Adam Peters Hired as GM! The Mighty Quinn is HC Kliff Kingsbury as OC. Joe Whitt jr at DC.

[Conn]

2 minutes ago, ThatNFLChick said:

 

Spielman's history with QBs:

 

 

It really doesn’t matter, almost every GM has a bad hit rate on QB swings and very few of them get to swing at the premium guys anyways. 
 

He’s also just consulting on finding the next GM. Who will in theory be a better evaluator and hire than himself. Otherwise we’d just hire him. 

Edited January 8 by Conn

[JamesMadisonSkins]

Good thing Spielman isn’t the GM. Just advising on the GM process. I don’t think we should be reading too much into his personnel takes. Just my $.02

[ThatNFLChick]

4 minutes ago, clskinsfan said:

And none of them were anywhere close to the consensus top prospects Maye or Williams are considered. Plus Spielman wont be the one making that decision. He is helping find the person that will.

 

Yes so again while it is fun to talk about his perspective, when he was in the GM position he made absolutely TERRIBLE decisions and was just flat out bad at scouting the QB position (also was instrumental in Kellen Mond)

Edited January 8 by ThatNFLChick

[Skinsinparadise]

Every Vikings Draft Pick Under Rick Spielman, by Round

Vikings Draft Picks by Round, 2012-2020

1st Round

**2020 — Justin Jefferson (WR) 22
2020 — Jeff Gladney (CB) 31
2019 — Garrett Bradbury (C) 18
2018 — Mike Hughes (CB)  30
2016 — Laquon Treadwell (WR)  23
2015 — Trae Waynes (CB) 11
**2014 — Anthony Barr (LB)  9
**2014 — Teddy Bridgewater (QB) 32
2013 — Sharrif Floyd (DT) 23
**2013 — Xavier Rhodes (CB) 25
**2013 — Cordarrelle Patterson (WR) 29
**2012 — Matt Kalil (OT) 4
**2012 — Harrison Smith (S) 29

 

https://vikingsterritory.com/2021/general-news/every-vikings-draft-pick-under-rick-spielman-by-round

 

He worked in the FO previously but didn't become GM until 2012.   

[bearrock]

13 minutes ago, KDawg said:

We’re requesting HC interviews without a GM in place. Part of me likes that we are ensuring we talk to great candidates… but isn’t that what the GM is supposed to do?

 

9 minutes ago, KDawg said:

I understand that. But I’m hoping that the GM is hired before they sit with the HC interviews. Requesting interviews now makes a ton of sense. Hope it plays out the way it seems like it will.

 

So this was touched upon in two parts of the Q&A.  In one of his answers, he talked about how availability of talent may factor into the schedule and how they may need to move quickly.  Then Svruluga posed the direct question of how he views the HoFOP's role in hiring the coach and this was the answer:

 

Quote

"My desire is to have the head of football operations in place, and then to listen very hard to what that person wants to do in terms of the coaching staff,” Harris said Monday at the Commanders’ Ashburn headquarters. “In other words, I think those two things have to work together.

“And obviously, as I’ve said before, I want to get the best talent here and then hold them accountable and work with them, right? So what that person wants to do or not do is really important in our decision process. Doesn’t mean that you are not involved in it, but it means that to a large extent, you’re relying on that person to bring a series of candidates to the table.”

 

Then he added that as he said before other considerations may influence the timeline.

 

It may not be a total hands off, let the GM hire the coach approach that I used to see as the healthy normal NFL operations, but then I realized that even in normal NFL franchises, the final decision on the coaching hire is probably at least signed off by ownership.  Anyway, that's what I gleamed today on that subject.

[KDawg]

I don’t particularly care if Spielman likes these prospects or not. He’s not our GM. I don’t love that he’s helping decide who to hire, but at the same time finding FO talent doesn’t always mean the same thing as finding player talent. So it’s not even worth worrying about his takes on these players or who he’s drafted…

 

Unless he becomes our GM.

 

And then we should all panic.

[Skinsinparadise]

3 minutes ago, JamesMadisonSkins said:

Good thing Spielman isn’t the GM. Just advising on the GM process. I don’t think we should be reading too much into his personnel takes. Just my $.02

 

Agree.  But its fun for me to know what he thinks in part because of people's tendency to have some confirmation bias

[KDawg]

1 minute ago, bearrock said:

 

 

So this was touched upon in two parts of the Q&A.  In one of his answers, he talked about how availability of talent may factor into the schedule and how they may need to move quickly.  Then Svruluga posed the direct question of how he views the HoFOP's role in hiring the coach and this was the answer:

 

 

Then he added that as he said before other considerations may influence the timeline.

 

It may not be a total hands off, let the GM hire the coach approach that I used to see as the healthy normal NFL operations, but then I realized that even in normal NFL franchises, the final decision on the coaching hire is probably at least signed off by ownership.  Anyway, that's what I gleamed today on that subject.

I don’t mind cursory interviews or anything like that. The owners have to be okay with the HC hire.

 

But the GM is going to be tied to the HC. I do not want to see the HC hired without heavy GM input. They have to be compatible and on the same page.

 

They likely will be. And I understand the timeline considerations for interview requests and how the GM interviews will occur first, so I’m sure it’ll play out as it should. 

[clskinsfan]

3 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Every Vikings Draft Pick Under Rick Spielman, by Round

Vikings Draft Picks by Round, 2012-2020

1st Round

**2020 — Justin Jefferson (WR) 22
2020 — Jeff Gladney (CB) 31
2019 — Garrett Bradbury (C) 18
2018 — Mike Hughes (CB)  30
2016 — Laquon Treadwell (WR)  23
2015 — Trae Waynes (CB) 11
**2014 — Anthony Barr (LB)  9
**2014 — Teddy Bridgewater (QB) 32
2013 — Sharrif Floyd (DT) 23
**2013 — Xavier Rhodes (CB) 25
**2013 — Cordarrelle Patterson (WR) 29
**2012 — Matt Kalil (OT) 4
**2012 — Harrison Smith (S) 29

 

https://vikingsterritory.com/2021/general-news/every-vikings-draft-pick-under-rick-spielman-by-round

 

He worked in the FO previously but didn't become GM until 2012.   

Thanks for this SIP. Pretty decent hit rate. And he had ONE top 5 pick in his entire tenure and nailed it with Kalil. He had one other top 10 pick and hit that Barr. 

[skinsfan66]

3 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

That's easy to say but Ian Rapport needs to do his homework. They were not getting 1 from the top of draft. They avoided all the QB busts. Carolina, S.F. Jets Pitts NE... They would have had to get lucky like SF with the last pick. They made the right top picks at the top of the draft. F.A. or Trade is where it had to come from. Lawrence and Stroud are the only 2 the last 3 years and Lawrence played like crap the last 6 games only beating Carolina. They pick 8th this year, maybe it's the year. Why does the coach get fired anyway or did he have control? If it was easy they would have one.

[Skinsinparadise]

9 minutes ago, clskinsfan said:

Thanks for this SIP. Pretty decent hit rate. And he had ONE top 5 pick in his entire tenure and nailed it with Kalil. He had one other top 10 pick and hit that Barr. 

 

Yeah its fine.   The people here who say it doesn't matter what he thinks about these QBs are correct.  But I'd put money that these QBs come up in the interview.  And its psychology 101, that people tend to like those that see things similar but that impact is likely too subtle to matter.

 

Not that his view on these QBs is anything crazy.  He's Caleb #1, Drake #2 and he suggests most of the NFL sees it the same then Daniels or Penix #3.   But agree it likely doesn't matter.

 

Personally I'd rather have an ex GM evaluate GM prospects than an owner.  You'd figure a dude who knows the business of being a GM is better at evaulating others in that same position than a dude who doesn't have the background.

 

But I bet Myers, Harris weigh in, too.  I don't get the vibe that its just Spielman.

 

5 minutes ago, skinsfan66 said:

That's easy to say but Ian Rapport needs to do his homework. They were not getting 1 from the top of draft. They avoided all the QB busts. Carolina, S.F. Jets Pitts NE... They would have had to get lucky like SF with the last pick. They made the right top picks at the top of the draft. F.A. or Trade is where it had to come from. Lawrence and Stroud are the only 2 the last 3 years and Lawrence played like crap the last 6 games only beating Carolina. They pick 8th this year, maybe it's the year. Why does the coach get fired anyway or did he have control? If it was easy they would have one.

 

I think we've argued this in another thread where you made the case they'd have been no better with Justin Fields compared to Ridder?

Edited January 9 by Skinsinparadise

[Conn]

15 minutes ago, skinsfan66 said:

That's easy to say but Ian Rapport needs to do his homework. They were not getting 1 from the top of draft. They avoided all the QB busts. Carolina, S.F. Jets Pitts NE... They would have had to get lucky like SF with the last pick. They made the right top picks at the top of the draft. F.A. or Trade is where it had to come from. Lawrence and Stroud are the only 2 the last 3 years and Lawrence played like crap the last 6 games only beating Carolina. They pick 8th this year, maybe it's the year. Why does the coach get fired anyway or did he have control? If it was easy they would have one.

The coach got fired because he’s a ****ing moron with three top-10 premium pick offensive skill players that he barely used because he thinks he’s smarter than everyone else. Classic nepotism-aided career given his father was an NFL minority share owner (ours in fact) and billionaire. The guy’s arrogant as hell and not some sort of genius.
 

The fact they never found a QB just illustrates the fact that even a talented offense without a QB is a dead end.

Edited January 9 by Conn

[skinsfan66]

3 hours ago, Riggo#44 said:

I get that but it assumes that we'll just sit around smelling our farts without an answer if our OC gets snatched. We would have to groom a replacement in the pipeline--QB coach, WR coach, etc. to keep the same system.

 

It also assumes we lose our OC in a year or two. I'd be pretty surprised if Slowik gets nabbed this year. A lot of hot coordinators that get nabbed after a year or two at the helm flame out. Plus what Houston did is very, very rare.

Slowik comes from a line of Good young Head coaches around the league that were all here at one time. He needs to be interviewed.

[Skinsinparadise]

3 minutes ago, Conn said:

The coach got fired because he’s a ****ing moron with three top-10 premium pick offensive skill players that he barely used because he thinks he’s smarter than everyone else. Classic nepotism-aided career given his father was an NFL minority share owner (ours in fact) and billionaire. 
 

The fact they never found a QB just illustrates the fact that even a talented offense without a QB is a dead end.

 

Long article about Atlanta today in the Athletic

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[skinsfan66]

3 minutes ago, Conn said:

The coach got fired because he’s a ****ing moron with three top-10 premium pick offensive skill players that he barely used because he thinks he’s smarter than everyone else. Classic nepotism-aided career given his father was an NFL minority share owner (ours in fact) and billionaire. 
 

The fact they never found a QB just illustrates the fact that even a talented offense without a QB is a dead end.

Maybe, but its not his fault for the QB or the teams fault for passing on major busts at the top of the draft or 1st rd. those 3 years he was there.

[mhd24]

18 minutes ago, clskinsfan said:

Thanks for this SIP. Pretty decent hit rate. And he had ONE top 5 pick in his entire tenure and nailed it with Kalil. He had one other top 10 pick and hit that Barr. 

Kalil was a bust

[Conn]

1 minute ago, skinsfan66 said:

Maybe, but its not his fault for the QB or the teams fault for passing on major busts at the top of the draft or 1st rd. those 3 years he was there.

It doesn’t matter. If you don’t figure out QB in a timely manner, heads roll no matter what other talent you have accumulated and developed. That’s the lesson. It’s as simple as that. Sometimes it’s just bad luck. Sometimes it’s bad decision-making.

 

That’s the entire reason why people keep explaining to you that when you have a shot at it, you have to take the swing. 
 

[Redd]

I wouldn’t mind Mike Zimmer being the defensive coordinator. 
 

Definitely want an offensive minded younger head coach though.

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

 

[clskinsfan]

3 minutes ago, mhd24 said:

Kalil was a bust

He wasnt a bust at all? He had injury issues. But earned a second huge deal in free agency. He was a good player. But a bad knee eventually did him in after 7 seasons. 

[skinsfan66]

5 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Long article about Atlanta today in the Athletic

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

What QB should have they taken in the draft the last 3 years instead, that would have been a better player or made the team better. 

[ThatNFLChick]

21 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Every Vikings Draft Pick Under Rick Spielman, by Round

Vikings Draft Picks by Round, 2012-2020

1st Round

**2020 — Justin Jefferson (WR) 22
2020 — Jeff Gladney (CB) 31
2019 — Garrett Bradbury (C) 18
2018 — Mike Hughes (CB)  30
2016 — Laquon Treadwell (WR)  23
2015 — Trae Waynes (CB) 11
**2014 — Anthony Barr (LB)  9
**2014 — Teddy Bridgewater (QB) 32
2013 — Sharrif Floyd (DT) 23
**2013 — Xavier Rhodes (CB) 25
**2013 — Cordarrelle Patterson (WR) 29
**2012 — Matt Kalil (OT) 4
**2012 — Harrison Smith (S) 29

 

https://vikingsterritory.com/2021/general-news/every-vikings-draft-pick-under-rick-spielman-by-round

 

He worked in the FO previously but didn't become GM until 2012.   

 

His first round picks aren't as much of interest to me than his evaluation of QBs. He traded away a 1st and 4th for Sam Bradford then drafted Kellen Mond to be the future of the Vikings franchise which is part of what got him fired (on top of Ponder and Bridgewater). To his credit, he did take full responsibility for pushing them to draft Ponder and admitted her was wrong. 

 

Getting Kirk was seen as a good thing at the time but considering what they got...maybe not so much since the Vikings haven't gone anywhere in the postseason since Kirk got there, he was paid a TON and Kirk is likely to be moving on now. 

[actorguy1]

Nevermind 

Edited January 9 by actorguy1

[skinsfan66]

2 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

 

Good move

[ThatNFLChick]

Slowik!!!