2023 NFL Draft Watch and Post Thread - The Hangover Special

[Koolblue13]

1 minute ago, samy316 said:

We could’ve moved up like the Steelers did for Broderick Jones, but we stood Pat

Prove this or drop it.

[Skinsinparadise]

29 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

I've been a defender of Ron and this FO for a while now. I've remained optimistic, but the shark is jumped. We're a respectable .500 team that players don't refuse to play with, but this draft felt like the car ran out of gas.

 

I think Ron is a really good dude.  And did a really nice job.  I can even live with him as the HC but prefer a change everything being equal. 

 

But as to running the FO -- he's solid. not great IMO.  That IMO needs to change. 

 

I used to talk to death in the old FO thread about Dan should hire a top GM and get out of their way for once.  He never did it.  But I gave up on that ever happening and I was good with Ron running thiings because otherwise Dan would be the defacto GM.

 

And i am not angry at all at Ron.  Great job handiling this crappy environment with total class and he's done a competent job.  But this draft, while overall i like the players, I don't love the aggregate job of what was done versus what they could have done better.  @KDawg articulated it well in one of his recent posts. 

[“Misdirection”]

Perhaps there’s a better place for this, but wanted to put the idea out even if I can’t do it til later.

 

would be fun to put two things down

 

Real-time mock: who you would’ve picked at our pick, knowing only what had happened leading up to our pick 

 

ultimate hindsight mock: who you would pick at each slot knowing where everyone ultimately went

 

could be fun to look back 

[DWinzit]

3 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

Prove this or drop it.

Yes, there was no one worth moving up for at 16.

[Koolblue13]

I really like Forbes and I think he'll be very good in the future, but Anton, Murphy, Nolan would have made more sense in a draft with a ton of depth at CB.

 

The second and third round picks were great and fairly predictable. Been saying DB and Stromberg for months.

 

Day three was old men ****ting their bed. Henry is a good pick. Daniels was an awful pick. Sure, I might be wrong, but we passed on a bunch of guys of need only to use two picks to make up for it.

[FootballZombie]

All I know is things would have gone down very differently if some of us were involved.

 

[Koolblue13]

5 minutes ago, DWinzit said:

Yes, there was no one worth moving up for at 16.

The Steelers, who had OT as their top need sitting there watching the other 3 1rst round OTs come off the board were not trading Jones for less than a kings ransom.

[KDawg]

Just now, Koolblue13 said:

I really like Forbes and I think he'll be very good in the future, but Anton, Murphy, Nolan would have made more sense in a draft with a ton of depth at CB.

 

The second and third round picks were great and fairly predictable. Been saying DB and Stromberg for months.

 

Day three was old men ****ting their bed. Henry is a good pick. Daniels was an awful pick. Sure, I might be wrong, but we passed on a bunch of guys of need only to use two picks to make up for it.

Anton Harrison vs. Forbes is a tough one. I think I actually think Forbes is a better player. So from a BPA perspective, I might actually still take Forbes there. I wasn’t down on Anton, but wasn’t as high as some here, either. So I think that may just be me. But, factoring in Forbes size I think it’s a bit closer. 
 

I had them both rated similarly. Forbes as a better player, Anton as more positional norm size wise. 
 

We took a swing for the better player in my opinion. 
 

If Skoronski or Johnson were there, they are the better player and it’s not close. Wright? Close, but I may give the slight edge to Wright. But Forbes vs. Harrison I think we did the right thing (in my opinion).

 

Ideally we would have traded back but my guess is we didn’t really have many people dying to swan dive up the board.

 

I think my biggest frustration with the Forbes pick was it leaked and teams like New England knew exactly what we were going to do and didn’t feel the need to trade up with us or leap frog us. And teams later knew what we were doing and probably where New England was going because they knew our pick.

 

It was telegraphed and predetermined. And that’s just another strategic blunder in our draft strategy.

[Warhead36]

I don't think Harrison was really in play for us since he projects as a LT only(or I guess he could play G). I believe the only OL we would have taken were Johnson(who is also LT only but is better and has more upside), Wright(because he can play RT), or Skoronski(because he'll be an elite G). 

[Koolblue13]

13 minutes ago, KDawg said:

Anton Harrison vs. Forbes is a tough one. I think I actually think Forbes is a better player. So from a BPA perspective, I might actually still take Forbes there. I wasn’t down on Anton, but wasn’t as high as some here, either. So I think that may just be me. But, factoring in Forbes size I think it’s a bit closer. 
 

I had them both rated similarly. Forbes as a better player, Anton as more positional norm size wise. 
 

We took a swing for the better player in my opinion. 
 

If Skoronski or Johnson were there, they are the better player and it’s not close. Wright? Close, but I may give the slight edge to Wright. But Forbes vs. Harrison I think we did the right thing (in my opinion).

 

Ideally we would have traded back but my guess is we didn’t really have many people dying to swan dive up the board.

 

I think my biggest frustration with the Forbes pick was it leaked and teams like New England knew exactly what we were going to do and didn’t feel the need to trade up with us or leap frog us. And teams later knew what we were doing and probably where New England was going because they knew our pick.

 

It was telegraphed and predetermined. And that’s just another strategic blunder in our draft strategy.

I think it's a push between them, too, but the drop off between the OTs after AH, weighted with positional need, compared to the depth of CB I would have drafted AH and I really like Forbes. 5 or 6 CBs were picked between 97 and our Daniels pick that we could have drafted and Stromberg might have still been there at 118.Olu Olu and Wypler were still around for OC and lots of OGs.

 

Just felt like poor resource management, because of how inflexable our board seems to be.

[MartinC]

Having slept on this my thought is it’s a ‘safe’ draft. Picked some good players with upside in positions of need. Improved the roster - but almost certainly passed over some players with higher ceilings who could have really (potentially) elevated the roster.

 

We should come out of this with at least 3 solid starters, but outside of Forbes hard to see anyone with Pro Bowl type potential. Then again no one in the first 3 picks is likely to be an out and out bust. 
 

This is how 8-9/9-8 teams are built.

 

Unless Howell plays to his ceiling (which I think is pretty high, but the history of the league says its odds against he hits that) we are stuck in mediocrity. 
 

Change is coming from the top down and it’s needed.

[Warhead36]

1 minute ago, MartinC said:

Having slept on this my thought is it’s a ‘safe’ draft. Picked some good players with upside in positions of need. Improved the roster - but almost certainly passed over some players with higher ceilings who could have really elevated the roster.

 

We should  one out of this with at least 3 solid starters, but outside of Forbes hard to see anyone with Pro Bowl type potential. Then again no one in the first 3 picks is likely to be an out and out bust. 
 

This is how 8-9/9-8 teams are built.

 

Unless Howell plays to his ceiling (which I think is pretty high, but the history of the league says its odds against he hits that) we are stuck in mediocrity. 
 

Change is coming from the top down and it’s needed.

I could see Forbes being a star and I look at that pick as a potential home run swing because of his ability to create takeaways. We are in desperate need of a dynamic playmaker on our defense(and overall team in general).

 

Rest are definitely safer picks. A home run swing would have been guys like Darnell Washington and Broderick Jones in those middle rounds.

[KDawg]

5 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

I think it's a push between them, too, but the drop off between the OTs after AH, weighted with positional need, compared to the depth of CB I would have drafted AH and I really like Forbes. 5 or 6 CBs were picked between 97 and our Daniels pick that we could have drafted and Stromberg might have still been there at 118.Olu Olu and Wypler were still around for OC and lots of OGs.

 

Just felt like poor resource management, because of how inflexable our board seems to be.

Even factoring that in, I think Forbes is a better player. But we definitely didn’t play the board correctly. 

[MartinC]

3 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

I could see Forbes being a star and I look at that pick as a potential home run swing because of his ability to create takeaways. We are in desperate need of a dynamic playmaker on our defense(and overall team in general).

 

Rest are definitely safer picks. A home run swing would have been guys like Darnell Washington and Broderick Jones in those middle rounds.

 I think we have some dynamic players on offense at receiver that D’s have to game plan for - Terry, Dotson even Samuels to some extent. And the D is good, I maybe even very good but I agree there is/was a need for more impact plays from the D.

 

It will come down to how Howell plays. And that to at least some extent will depend on the O’line - which is meh IMO.

[Koolblue13]

6 minutes ago, MartinC said:

Having slept on this my thought is it’s a ‘safe’ draft. Picked some good players with upside in positions of need. Improved the roster - but almost certainly passed over some players with higher ceilings who could have really (potentially) elevated the roster.

 

We should come out of this with at least 3 solid starters, but outside of Forbes hard to see anyone with Pro Bowl type potential. Then again no one in the first 3 picks is likely to be an out and out bust. 
 

This is how 8-9/9-8 teams are built.

 

Unless Howell plays to his ceiling (which I think is pretty high, but the history of the league says its odds against he hits that) we are stuck in mediocrity. 
 

Change is coming from the top down and it’s needed.

Ya know, that's exactly what I have always wanted and expected from RonMart. A respectable .500 team that's fun to watch and easy to route for. That's his ceiling and floor and we're right there. 

 

I'm glad that we're far away from a 3 win team, with a draft full of busts, which we've been too many times over the years.

[MartinC]

1 minute ago, Koolblue13 said:

Ya know, that's exactly what I have always wanted and expected from RonMart. A respectable .500 team that's fun to watch and easy to route for. That's his ceiling and floor and we're right there. 

 

I'm glad that we're far away from a 3 win team, with a draft full of busts, which we've been too many times over the years.

 Agree with a but. The but is the objective is to win a Championship and ‘safe’ and ‘respectable’ doesn’t normally get you to that level. 
 

Look it really comes down to the QB. Put Mahomes on this roster and we are in the mix for a Super Bowl. Not enough Pat Mahomes to go around though.

[Koolblue13]

1 minute ago, MartinC said:

 Agree with a but. The but is the objective is to win a Championship and ‘safe’ and ‘respectable’ doesn’t normally get you to that level. 
 

Look it really comes down to the QB. Put Mahomes on this roster and we are in the mix for a Super Bowl. Not enough Pat Mahomes to go around though.

Gotta drag the old truck outta the swamp and clean all the crap out of it, before it can become the race car. The truck is cleaned out and ready to build.

 

Yeah, QB definitely matters and if we had the leagues best, we'd definitely be better. 

[MartinC]

Just now, Koolblue13 said:

 

Yeah, QB definitely matters and if we had the leagues best, we'd definitely be better. 

 I realize I really went out on a limb with that take 😂

[skinny21]

1 hour ago, FootballZombie said:

My biggest warm-fuzzys outta this draft are:

 

1.) Emphasis on playmakers, something we lack

2.) I love that we managed to get a good C given our problems there

3.) No injury stash guys

 

 

I think my biggest regrets outta this draft are:

 

1.) No TEs

2.) 1st rounder was not an O player

3.) RB is a power type rather than a C.O.P.

 

I like that they took advantage, to some extent, of the positional depth - 2 corners, 2 edges, and a back.  Of course, you could argue we only took 2 edge rushers because of how we positioned ourselves with Sweat/Young…  The flip side is that if they took those two with an eye towards succession planning (on top of depth), or to give them the option to trade one of Sweat/Young, that’s a forward thinking move I wouldn’t have expected from an FO with one foot out the door.

 

I think it was probably smart of them to go for more seasoned players.  Conversely, I don’t like that we’re in a position that makes this a (IMO) smart modus operandi… but we’re in a unique situation with an ownership change and the FO (likely) on it’s last year.

 

 

Interestingly, aside from those on here that feel we needed to land a starting OT (ie in rd 1 or 2), feels like most would be much higher on this draft if we’d taken Gonzalez over Forbes.  I could be wrong about that though.

 

The Rodriguez pick surprised me - fully expected a change of pace back.  The only reason it’s not a regret for me is that he was EB’s “guy”.

[Conn]

I would really love to know what Mayhew means when he says he’s frustrated with himself over missing some opportunities to be aggressive on Day 3 with trades. Because that’s the day where I thought we were noticeably behind the curve on tier drops at positions we clearly were targeting, so I’d love to know who we could have had and what later picks it would have cost us. 

[MartinC]

5 minutes ago, skinny21 said:

 

 

The Rodriguez pick surprised me - fully expected a change of pace back.  The only reason it’s not a regret for me is that he was EB’s “guy”.

I think the thing with Rodriguez is that he’s excellent in pass pro picking up blitzes. He could see 3rd down snaps as well as providing some 1/2 down carries to keep Robinson fresh. He looks like he could be a heck of a short yardage and goal line back as well. 

[FootballZombie]

4 minutes ago, skinny21 said:

The Rodriguez pick surprised me - fully expected a change of pace back.  The only reason it’s not a regret for me is that he was EB’s “guy”.

 

Roddy the player is good at what he does, but I don't expect him, or any other late round power back, to come in an steal meaningful reps from B-Rob.

 

A change back at least has a succession plan if Gibby leaves via FA next year even if they are walled of from meaningful reps this year. Roddy feels more like insurance in case B-Rob gets injured rather than a potential improvement or replacement since B has plenty of time on his rookie deal.

[Koolblue13]

[Koolblue13]

Arizona Cardinals’ current 2024 draft picks:

1st-round pick

1st-round pick (Texans)

2nd-round pick

3rd-round pick

3rd-round pick (Texans)

3rd-round pick (Titans)

4th-round pick

4th-round pick (projected compensatory pick)

5th-round pick

5th-round pick (Eagles)

7th-round pick

 

I guess next year they get to make a decision about Kyler Murray. That's another top draft pick for them. I'm so jealous.

[Est.1974]

Yep I think AZ have a plan in place to be picking the #1 QB next year.