2023 Comprehensive Draft Thread

[Sacks 'n' Stuff]

Notre Dame tight end please.

[Skinsinparadise]

15 hours ago, KDawg said:

I’m lukewarm on picking Meyer. Love the player. Don’t like the pick for us. But of course, that changes based on what’s on the board so the draft may come and I may love a Meyer pick up. 

 

I don't want Meyer either.  But I do want Mayer.  😀.   But i am not really locked into any player or for that matter position. I am a go with the flow BPA dude especially in the 20s in the first round, I hate locking into a position.  Not saying you are saying otherwise. 

 

I do disagree with some who don't see Y-TE as a major need.

 

I was listening to jay Gruden the other day on Standig, and he echoes my point, he thinks this team needs a TE big time and believes among other things they would help this teams red zone woes. 

 

 

 

9 hours ago, Forehead said:

For me as Penn State guy, the guy I'd love, and it is a position of need, is Joey Porter Jr.  I'm not sure if he'll drop quite to wherever we wind up in the draft but he's a likely 1st round pick, probably between 10-20.  Arguably the top corner in the draft.  He's big, something like 6'1" and around 200 pounds.  He is not afraid of contact and hits like a truck for his size and position.  He has a mean streak, which considering he's the son of former Steeler stud Joey Porter, isn't a surprise.  He's also battle tested, he's held up against the string of receivers Ohio State trots out.  

 

 

I haven't watched him yet.  I did notice that all the ESPN draft guys if I recall are picking him now as their top corner.

Edited December 24, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[KDawg]

1 minute ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I don't want Meyer either.  But I do want Mayer.  😀.   But i am not really locked into any player or for that matter position. I am a go with the flow BPA dude especially in the 20s in the first round, I hate locking into a position.  Not saying you are saying otherwise. 

 

I do disagree with some who don't see Y-TE as a major need.

 

I was listening to jay Gruden the other day on Standig, and he echoes my point, he thinks this team need a TE big time and believes among other things they would help this teams red zone woes. 

 

 

 

I agree that a real tight end is a big time get for us. I’d never be mad at Mayer (I have a friend with the name Meyer and my phone corrects it… it’s like the Heinous thing I guess).

 

But I’m hoping an OT is the BPA there for us. 
 

But I still think we’re going to do something perhaps semi foolish as it pertains to getting a QB.

[Skinsinparadise]

9 minutes ago, KDawg said:

I agree that a real tight end is a big time get for us. I’d never be mad at Mayer (I have a friend with the name Meyer and my phone corrects it… it’s like the Heinous thing I guess).

 

But I’m hoping an OT is the BPA there for us. 
 

But I still think we’re going to do something perhaps semi foolish as it pertains to getting a QB.

 

The Heinous is a classic.  If he performs like I suspect he might today I might use it on the game thread again. 😀

 

I am hoping for OT, too.  Guard.  Center. 

 

I see TE as somewhat of an appendage of the O line and Mayer is a rare old school Y-TE that would add to the smash mouth play and also serve as a weapon.  But I do like some other TEs in this draft, some I've talked about. 

 

I want a buffet of additions on the O line and i see a Y TE and sort of on that same menu.  I am more on that track than CB everything being equal.  

 

If we are going fully going on just position talk -- O line and Y-TE.   On defense:  CB, LB.  

 

 

 

I posted this If I recall back in September.  But the other benefit of Michael Mayer is how close his name is to Michael Myers, the Halloween spoofs with be endless.  Getting his draft day call from Rivera.. 

 

 

Edited December 24, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[philibusters]

Maryland--I will do offense now, defense later.
 

1.  Rakim Jarrett (WR):

Projected Draft position: 3rd or 4th round

Take at projected draft position:  Maybe

 

Rakim Jarrett is a smooth athlete, but he struggled with production in college.  He had 40 receptions on 64 targets for 471 yards, but had a whooping 8 drops (16.4% of catchable balls).   He was just a true junior and is only 21 years old (though he will have his 22nd birthday before the draft).  He was productive as a true freshman, then had 900 yards receiving as a sophomore so his drop in production was a bit of a surprise.   He was a five star recruit out of high school and a consensus top 5 receiver in his class.   Of the four WR's from Maryland who had NFL success in the last 15 years (Darrius Heyward-Bey, Torrey Smith, Stefon Diggs, and DJ Moore) his athletic profile is most like Diggs--the first word I would use for both of them is smooth and body control.  And Diggs followed the same career arch--productive as a true freshman, but never turned a corner and became elite at the college level before leaving after his true junior year.   Diggs ended up going in the 5th round to Minnesota and was a great value, so there is possible value in Jarrett.   That said, Diggs made more wow plays at the college level that Jarrett.   I wouldn't hate Jarrett in the fourth round, but I am much rather take a flier late in the draft on him if he slips into the 5th or 6th rounds.  I could see him as a potential NFL starter, but he wasn't that amazing in college.

 

2.  Jacob Copeland (WR)

Projected Draft position:   Undrafted

Take at projected draft position:  Yes

 

Copeland is not the best draft prospect on the team at WR, but he probably was the best WR in the 22 season on the team.  He had 26 catches on 40 targets for 376 yards and 1 drop on 27 catchable balls (3.7%) drop rate.  He is small (6'0 200 pounds) and quick.   In 2021 he played for the Florida Gators and lead the team with about 600 receiving yards so his transfer to Maryland probably wasn't the success he hoped for.  I don't think there is a lot of NFL interest in him though he is choosing not to take a covid season.  He is 23 years old and will be 23 years old at draft time but 24 before the 2023 season (his birthday is in July).   He is definitely worth a look as an undrafted free agent.

 

3.  Dontay Demus (WR)

Projected Draft position: Undrafted
Take at projected draft position:  Yes

 

Demus had the best career of the three WR's being mentioned.  He is about 6'3, has good straight ahead speed, and the ability to find open spots against zone defense.  But he wasn't very good this past season and that is because he had a severe knee injury against Iowa in October 2021 and wasn't his former self physically this past season.  He wanted to come back for this season and did--and he deserved cred it for that, but physically he wasn't the Demus we knew from 2019, 2020, and 2021.  He had 22 receptions on 42 targets and 233 yards and two drops.    As a freshman he was an immediate contributor was about 300 receiving yards, then had over 600 yards as a sophomore.   He broke out early in his junior year would have been a 1000 yard receiver in 2021 but for injuries.  He was on fire to start the 2021 season with 507 receiving yards in 4.25 games.  Then on the 1st play of the second quarter he was return a kickoff against Iowa he suffered a gruesome ACL injury.  Not just tearing his ACL but doing other damage in the knee.  Unlike Chase Young Maryland allowed him to rush back for the 2022 season, but he simply wasn't the same player.  If you take him as an undrafted free agent you are hoping his knee has improved since the end of the season and he is the player he was in in 2021.

 

4.  Jaelyn Duncan (OT)
Projected Draft Position:  4th or 5th round

Take at the projected draft position: No                         

Duncan was a guy who had first round hype early in this season, but faded.  GoingCommando is not a fan of him, but I think he has valid points.  The biggest complaint about Duncan is that he is soft.  He doesn't finish plays and doesn't look to make contact.  His technique could use refinement but if that was his only issue he would still be a 2nd or 3rd round guy.  What he does do well is he moves well.  He 6'5 320 pounds and he moves like a smaller guy.  The athleticism is there to be a starting LT in the NFL.   But the toughness and technique are lacking.

 

In other words, I am not super high on any of the Maryland offensive prospects.   Demus and Copeland could be worth a look as an undrafted free agent and Jarrett is a high ceiling prospect who didn't prove much at the college level.

[Skinsinparadise]

Dalton Kincard.  2nd round, more of an F TE, reminds me some of a more explosive Chris Cooley -- Cooley going to Utah State, Kincaid to Utah.

 

I watched his game against USC which is referenced here.   I had a hard time zoning in on his blocking in that game.  As a pass catcher, he finds the seam, good hands (hands catcher), and is a good YAC guy, fun to watch when he has the ball in his hands.  Good target on the 2nd level in between the numbers -- Jordan Reed style.

 

I got to find a good game to see his blocking.  Reports on him are mixed on that front.  I admit i am a little biased against 240 pound types or lower right now if I am looking for a Y.   It's not that we can't use an F. I'd take a dynamic F.  But with this offense, I'd love a Y.   

 

 

 

Edited December 24, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[philibusters]

17 minutes ago, KDawg said:

I agree that a real tight end is a big time get for us. I’d never be mad at Mayer (I have a friend with the name Meyer and my phone corrects it… it’s like the Heinous thing I guess).

 

But I’m hoping an OT is the BPA there for us. 
 

But I still think we’re going to do something perhaps semi foolish as it pertains to getting a QB.

 

Its going to be rare that a OT is truly the BPA in a draft just because its a coveted position.   QB's go to high based on positional value, whereas OT's tend to go off quickly simply due to scarcity.   Often times if a OT is in the top tier of players (say 6 players left in that tier--they will be the first to go and that makes it hard to find situations where they are a true BPA, the best you will do is in get them within tier).

[Skinsinparadise]

1 minute ago, philibusters said:

 

Its going to be rare that a OT is truly the BPA in a draft just because its a coveted position.   QB's go to high based on positional value, whereas OT's tend to go off quickly simply due to scarcity.   Often times if a OT is in the top tier of players (say 6 players left in that tier--they will be the first to go and that makes it hard to find situations where they are a true BPA, the best you will do is in get them within tier).

 

I haven't studied the tackles yet but I know the bigger names Johnson, Skoronski seem projected higher than our pick.  At our likely range right now I see mocks have B. Jones, Mauch, Harrison.  Combine is often big for that spot.

 

Judging by mocks seems like they all agree that Torrence is the best guard.  I watched him and I like him a lot.  he seems to be in the range of our picks in current mocks. 

 

2 years ago we should have taken Darrisaw.   I liked JOK and then Darrisaw.  And Darrisaw had love from others on this thread.  He's been really good.  

[method man]

4 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I haven't studied the tackles yet but I know the bigger names Johnson, Skoronski seem projected higher than our pick.  At our likely range right now I see mocks have B. Jones, Mauch, Harrison.  Combine is often big for that spot.

 

Judging by mocks seems like they all agree that Torrence is the best guard.  I watched him and I like him a lot.  he seems to be in the range of our picks in current mocks. 

 

2 years ago we should have taken Darrisaw.   I liked JOK and then Darrisaw.  And Darrisaw had love from others on this thread.  He's been really good.  

Consensus board pick was Darrisaw. He has been a total stud in MIN but he has had injury/concussion issues stemming from college that have followed him to the pros. I still would take part time elite LT play vs above average full time off ball LB play. I also think they could’ve still gotten the above average off ball LB from Werner

Edited December 24, 2022 by method man

[Skinsinparadise]

6 minutes ago, method man said:

Consensus board pick was Darrisaw. He has been a total stud in MIN but he has had injury/concussion issues stemming from college that have followed him to the pros. I still would take part time elite LT play vs above average full time off ball LB play. I also think they could’ve still gotten the above average off ball LB from Werner

 

For me it was JOK, or Darrisaw.    Davis though is looking good.  I liked him in that draft.  He wasn't my first choice by a long shot but I didn't hate the pick.

 

So many draft picks in the 2nd half of the first are outright busts or end up being just a guy.  If i recall miss rate is about 50% in the 2nd half of the first.  So I'll take Jamin Davis over a Haskins or Doctson and the slew of other busts from teams in that part of the draft.   But still I feel it was a squandered oppportunity.  But just in general I don't lament any pick if the player ends up good and Jamin is headed on that track IMO.  Jamin is a freak athlete so I think the good can end up great -- LB is typically a slow developing spot especially for inexperienced players like him.  Will see. 

Edited December 24, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[illone]

Mayer would be a great addition…

 

that said, it does seem like a luxury pick for this version of Washington. 
 

don’t we need oline and linebackers more than TE?  Oh, and QB. No idea how this team resolves the QB position unless we somehow get Aaron Rodgers…

[philibusters]

For Maryland, a player who I was high on was CJ Dippre, but he entered the transfer portal and is likely headed to Alabama.   He is a TE taht can block and be a receiver.  As a true freshman in 2021, he played a lot but mainly as a blocker.   The top two receiving threats at TE for the Terps were Chig Okonkwo who was a fourth round pick of the Titans and has been moderately productive as a rookie TE (374 receiving yards)  and Corey Dyches who is a decent receiving TE, but lacks the blocking ability.   Okonkwo was drafted and that opened up receiving opportunities and he had over 300 yards receiving while being a solid blocker at TE.  He entered the portal and is going to get some NIL money and Alabama and zeroed in on him as their top TE portal prospect where they are likely only taking 1 TE in the portal.  He is a guy to watch for next year.   Not a super athlete, but a guy who can both block and be a receiver.

[Warhead36]

What we do in FA will determine how we play the draft. I see one of two scenarios:

 

1. We acquire a veteran QB. Maybe Carr or something like that. Draft focus is on OL and TE.

 

2. We rebuild the OL through the draft and trade up for a QB. Will require future 1s. 

[Zim489]

16 hours ago, KDawg said:

I’m lukewarm on picking Meyer. Love the player. Don’t like the pick for us. But of course, that changes based on what’s on the board so the draft may come and I may love a Meyer pick up. 

I dont see many options for improving the offense available to us. I am hard against IOL round 1. No QBs. LTs are thin currently. I highly doubt a WR. So that leaves TE really or Bijan which I would be furious about 

[illone]

3 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

What we do in FA will determine how we play the draft. I see one of two scenarios:

 

1. We acquire a veteran QB. Maybe Carr or something like that. Draft focus is on OL and TE.

 

2. We rebuild the OL through the draft and trade up for a QB. Will require future 1s. 

 

there are other options available, I think…

 

you could restructure Wentz and bring him back another year.  
 

the choices are very limited, which makes wentz a viable option. 

[Warhead36]

First round TEs just don't have a great track record. Pitts hasn't done much and he was supposed to be revolutionary. Hockenson was underwhelming and got traded. Engram has been disappointing. List goes on and on.

 

The best TEs are guys drafted in the middle rounds who develop over time. 

[Skinsinparadise]

It's a big time need.   I am not stuck on inflexible rules.  Mayer isn't an ordinary TE.  I am typically ok with the notion of taking a TE later in the draft but Mayer IMO is special. 

 

 

 

 

[Going Commando]

Mayer is a transcendent prospect and would be a good get.  So is Jaxon Smith-Njigba.  We just need talent, no matter the position. Go BPA at every pick.

[88Comrade2000]

I think the number #1 goal for the 2023 draft is to get assets for 2024.

 

2024 is when we are likely going to make a move to draft a qb; so we need picks.

 

Trade Down our #1 pick for 23, to pick up an additional #1 pick for 2024.

 

Also, trade some players to pick up picks for 23 and 24.

[philibusters]

12 hours ago, Going Commando said:

Mayer is a transcendent prospect and would be a good get.  So is Jaxon Smith-Njigba.  We just need talent, no matter the position. Go BPA at every pick.

This board loves Mayer, but on the college football podcasts I listen to like Cover3, a lot of college football analysts think Brock Bowers is clearly better  than Mayer (though he was a true sophomore and is not draft eligible this year).   I have not studied either of them, but its just interesting to get the diverging opinions.

Edited December 25, 2022 by philibusters

[Warhead36]

Kyle Pitts was supposed to be transcendent as well. What has he done in Atlanta? Honestly kinda tired of hearing that term thrown around. 

 

Like I said, the best TEs tend to be mid round guys who develop over time. I'd like to see what we have in Cole Turner in year 2. That kid Armani Rogers looked pretty good in limited time as well. 

 

I'm not saying it isn't a need, it absolutely is. But burning a 1st rounder on one is not the answer I don't think. 

[Conn]

Pitts absolutely is incredible. That Falcons offense with Mariota was not the way to showcase it lol. I wouldn’t be using him as an example of a failed or even questionable 1st round pick—I would be using it to question wtf their GM is doing investing in pieces that should be building blocks, on a roster that ignores them. The real answer of course is that he’s trying to create a situation that a young QB can step into and have weapons and a running game—they just won some games they shouldn’t have by shortening games and wildly increasing variance, so some people were fooled into thinking they were ahead of schedule the first half of the season when in reality this was basically set up to be a tanking season for them. 

[Warhead36]

1 minute ago, Conn said:

Pitts absolutely is incredible. That Falcons offense with Mariota was not the way to showcase it lol. I wouldn’t be using him as an example of a failed or even questionable 1st round pick—I would be using it to question wtf their GM is doing investing in pieces that should be building blocks, on a roster that ignores them. The real answer of course is that he’s trying to create a situation that a young QB can step into and have weapons and a running game—they just won some games they shouldn’t have by shortening games and wildly increasing variance, so some people were fooled into thinking they were ahead of schedule the first half of the season when in reality this was basically set up to be a tanking season for them. 

I'm not saying Pitts has been bad, but if you're TRANSCENDENT than it shouldn't matter who your QB is. They passed on guys like Sewell, Waddle, Parsons, Surtain jr. etc. etc. for a TE. That's the mistake I don't want us to make(granted we're not gonna have a top 5 pick but you get the point).

[KDawg]

2 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

I'm not saying Pitts has been bad, but if you're TRANSCENDENT then it shouldn't matter who your QB is. They passed on guys like Sewell, Waddle, Parsons, Surtain jr. etc. etc. for a TE. That's the mistake I don't want us to make(granted we're not gonna have a top 5 pick but you get the point).

Pitts and Mayer are different style tight ends though. Pitts couldn’t block for **** but was a dynamic pass catching tight end that could at least pretend like he could block someone. 
 

Mayer is less of a dynamic receiver (more possession tilted but not a possession guy) but a much better blocker. 
 

The two shouldn’t even be considered as the same position.

[Conn]

6 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

I'm not saying Pitts has been bad, but if you're TRANSCENDENT than it shouldn't matter who your QB is. They passed on guys like Sewell, Waddle, Parsons, Surtain jr. etc. etc. for a TE. That's the mistake I don't want us to make(granted we're not gonna have a top 5 pick but you get the point).

 

Pitts is a jumbo WR playing TE, that’s all. It’s a position dependent on targets, not really one that can excel on its own. That should maybe be factored into expectations of what you’re getting with a high draft pick (if you don’t have a QB), but if you’re drafting for the overall roster you’ll have a couple years down the road, I’m not sure how heavily you should weigh it. If they draft or sign a QB this year and then Pitts and London each put up 1200+ yards, do they retroactively become better value picks? I don’t think so, great talent is great talent even if things don’t come together right away.