2024 Baltimore Orioles: New Owner, New Hope

[Hersh]

6 hours ago, Ball Security said:

I dunno.  Cowser has a lot of swing and miss in his bat right now and looks lost.  Kjerstad hasn’t played a professional game.  Plenty of top 10 picks don’t make it.   The signs from them don’t look…great.

 

Half the O's best prospects won't be that good in the majors. Which isn't a knock on the team. It's like that for all baseball teams. The O's have had a bunch of pitchers put up great numbers in the minors and most have been bad at the big league level. The jump is underestimated by some. 

[fullnelson9999]

9 minutes ago, Hersh said:

 

 

Also, "But don't blame the Orioles for being wary of tying up money in players that have no long term future with the team so that your ego can be stroked with a few more wins." Who said tie up money in players that have no long term future with the team? Oh, that's right. No free agent would have a long term future here cause all the positions in questioned are covered in the minors. 

 

Now you've got it.  Pessimism in the face of obvious facts so you can play devil's advocate is really unimpressive.

[Hersh]

13 minutes ago, fullnelson9999 said:

 

Now you've got it.  Pessimism in the face of obvious facts so you can play devil's advocate is really unimpressive.

 

Yes, it's an obvious fact that not all top prospects for teams turn out to be any good. That's not pessimism, that's being realistic about major league baseball. 

2 out of 3 of the Astros overall number one picks never played for their major league team. It happens. 

[abdcskins]

Appreciate all the viewpoints in this thread, you all know more about the economics than me. I will say I have no confidence in the Orioles farm system to develop talent. Historically it just isn't good. I am of the opinion that eventually you gotta spend some money to field a competitive team. I don't think anyone in this thread is saying otherwise really.

 

I remember back when I was a child and Angelos was spending like crazy. Scott Erickson, Alomar, Palmeiro, Eric Davis, Jimmy Key. Those were some cool teams to watch. I will never condone steroids, but damn Palmeiro had one of the nicest swings I've ever seen.

[Spaceman Spiff]

Tough to keep losing 1 run, low scoring games.  Silver lining is that the pitching continues to impress.  

 

The defense, aside from the disaster this past weekend has also been pretty good.  IIRC, we're second in the majors in double plays turned.  

[Bang]

Yes, last night was tough. Runners get around, and then just wither on the bases in scoring position. It is tough to keep seeing it happen. 
It's SO close.

A hit here or there, and a lot of these games change to wins.

 

~Bang

[Spaceman Spiff]

2 minutes ago, Bang said:

Yes, last night was tough. Runners get around, and then just wither on the bases in scoring position. It is tough to keep seeing it happen. 
It's SO close.

A hit here or there, and a lot of these games change to wins.

 

~Bang

 

+4 runs at home, -27 runs on the road.  

[fullnelson9999]

12 hours ago, Hersh said:

 

Yes, it's an obvious fact that not all top prospects for teams turn out to be any good. That's not pessimism, that's being realistic about major league baseball. 

2 out of 3 of the Astros overall number one picks never played for their major league team. It happens. 

I'm not counting on Elias thinking he's going to fail, so why shouldn't he have confidence in all of his picks?

 

https://www.mlb.com/news/mlb-2021-22-free-agents-by-position

 

And seriously, look at this list.  It's not hard to see why the Orioles ended up not signing anyone, it wasn't a good cycle for them.  You can't just say "they need to sign people", when literally every available player had a better option, or they couldn't fill a position of need.  Correa is young, proven, and has experienced success, so he's the guy you might think would come to a rebuilding franchise, but everyone else?  No way.  Careers are short and they're not wasting them in Baltimore.  

[Hersh]

3 minutes ago, fullnelson9999 said:

I'm not counting on Elias thinking he's going to fail, so why shouldn't he have confidence in all of his picks?

 

https://www.mlb.com/news/mlb-2021-22-free-agents-by-position

 

And seriously, look at this list.  It's not hard to see why the Orioles ended up not signing anyone, it wasn't a good cycle for them.  You can't just say "they need to sign people", when literally every available player had a better option, or they couldn't fill a position of need.  Correa is young, proven, and has experienced success, so he's the guy you might think would come to a rebuilding franchise, but everyone else?  No way.  Careers are short and they're not wasting them in Baltimore.  

 

Elias knows the failure rate of picks. How do you know everyone else had better options? You don't. 

[fullnelson9999]

9 hours ago, Hersh said:

 

Elias knows the failure rate of picks. How do you know everyone else had better options? You don't. 

 

Because that list tells you which team each player signed with, and most of them are in a much better position that Baltimore. It's called reading. 

 

It's not like signing someone like Jed Lowrie was going to change anything anyway. And that's the point...spend the money building an international scouting department rather than a scrub who's gonna win you 5 more games and you're still in last place. 

 

The key is to not care what other people think of you for supporting a last place team. 

Edited May 4, 2022 by fullnelson9999

[Hersh]

2 minutes ago, fullnelson9999 said:

 

Because that list tells you which team each player signed with, and most of them are in a much better position that Baltimore. It's called reading. 

 

It's not like signing someone like Jed Lowrie was going to change anything anyway. And that's the point...spend the money building an international scouting department rather than a scrub who's gonna win you 5 more games and you're still in last place. 

 

The key is to not care what other people think of you for supporting a last place team. 

Good gracious you don’t understand sports. Not all players chase championships over money. A lot of players will go with the most money. 
 

Again, the point of bringing in better players is to begin to get incrementally better since that’s how teams get to the playoffs. They don’t need to be players that are here when the team is actually competing for the playoffs but the Os would be better if they had a couple of better infielders at 2nd and 3rd. 
 

so to recap, I showed you the Astros built and spent more incrementally, no team wins with all homegrown players and Elias knows all these prospects won’t succeed. 
 

any other lessons you need?

[fullnelson9999]

7 hours ago, Hersh said:

Good gracious you don’t understand sports. Not all players chase championships over money. A lot of players will go with the most money. 
 

Again, the point of bringing in better players is to begin to get incrementally better since that’s how teams get to the playoffs. They don’t need to be players that are here when the team is actually competing for the playoffs but the Os would be better if they had a couple of better infielders at 2nd and 3rd. 
 

so to recap, I showed you the Astros built and spent more incrementally, no team wins with all homegrown players and Elias knows all these prospects won’t succeed. 
 

any other lessons you need?

Are you normally this disrespectful when you're struggling to get people to agree with you? Don't condescend me, please. It's not necessary. 

 

Not once have you actually mentioned any players that you think they should have signed. You're complaining from a distance because it's easy, but it requires no real thought. 

Edited May 4, 2022 by fullnelson9999

[Hersh]

6 hours ago, fullnelson9999 said:

Are you normally this disrespectful when you're struggling to get people to agree with you? Don't condescend me, please. It's not necessary. 

 

Not once have you actually mentioned any players that you think they should have signed. You're complaining from a distance because it's easy, but it requires no real thought. 

This you?

 

10 hours ago, fullnelson9999 said:

 

Because that list tells you which team each player signed with, and most of them are in a much better position that Baltimore. It's called reading. 

 

[fullnelson9999]

22 minutes ago, Hersh said:

This you?

 

 

 

Apples and oranges my man. I truly mean that you gotta read it if you want to participate. 

 

Still waiting on hearing which players you thought Baltimore should have persued, and why those players were wrong to sign with other teams. 

 

 

[Ball Security]

1 hour ago, fullnelson9999 said:

 

Apples and oranges my man. I truly mean that you gotta read it if you want to participate. 

 

Still waiting on hearing which players you thought Baltimore should have persued, and why those players were wrong to sign with other teams. 

 

 

There are no core guys in the middle infield on the roster.  Spending there on Simmons and Hernandez would have provided much better defense to help the developing pitchers.  They both signed for non-playoff teams for a combined $8M.  Pay the Orioles tax of 25% and you have a much better MI and extra $10M in payroll maintains the Angelos’ goal of being at the bottom of the league.  
 

If they wanted to get crazy, they could have targeted Greinke instead of Lyles with a difference of about 8M.  That’s three definitive upgrades for an extra 16-20M that doesn’t block anyone and helps the development of the pitching.

[Hersh]

3 hours ago, fullnelson9999 said:

 

Apples and oranges my man. I truly mean that you gotta read it if you want to participate. 

 

Still waiting on hearing which players you thought Baltimore should have persued, and why those players were wrong to sign with other teams. 

 

 

 

Anyone that projected to be better than what the O's currently have would've been great. If the O's offered more money to players that joined non-contenders would be reason enough for any of those players to sign with the O's instead. 

[Skinsfan1311]

On 5/3/2022 at 9:08 AM, Bang said:

Yes, last night was tough. Runners get around, and then just wither on the bases in scoring position. It is tough to keep seeing it happen. 
It's SO close.

A hit here or there, and a lot of these games change to wins.

 

~Bang

Kinda like the Skins, right?

[fullnelson9999]

2 hours ago, Hersh said:

 

Anyone that projected to be better than what the O's currently have would've been great. If the O's offered more money to players that joined non-contenders would be reason enough for any of those players to sign with the O's instead. 

Is that a direct quote from those players? Which players? 

[TheDoyler23]

It's looking like the first overall pick next spring is off the table. Our birds may not be so hot, but look at the Reds... woof. 

[abdcskins]

Bradish vs. Bundy tonight should be fun.  Two guys traded for one another.  I think we are gonna rough up Bundy.

[fullnelson9999]

40 minutes ago, TheDoyler23 said:

It's looking like the first overall pick next spring is off the table. Our birds may not be so hot, but look at the Reds... woof. 

 

There's a draft lottery and Baltimore will definitely have a shot.

Edited May 4, 2022 by fullnelson9999

[TheDoyler23]

29 minutes ago, fullnelson9999 said:

 

There's a draft lottery and Baltimore will definitely have a shot.

That’s right. Forgot about that. 
 

Bottom 3 teams have a 16.5% chance each.  

[Hersh]

4 hours ago, fullnelson9999 said:

Is that a direct quote from those players? Which players? 

 

Are you really that clueless about how free agency works? Good gracious. 

[fullnelson9999]

1 hour ago, Hersh said:

 

Are you really that clueless about how free agency works? Good gracious. 

 

Again, pretty disrespectful. You're literally coming from a place where you're complaining, but aren't offering any specific solutions. There's nothing profound about that.

 

Which. Players. Do. You. Think. They. Should. Have. Signed? Be specific.

[Hersh]

16 minutes ago, fullnelson9999 said:

 

Again, pretty disrespectful. You're literally coming from a place where you're complaining, but aren't offering any specific solutions. There's nothing profound about that.

 

Which. Players. Do. You. Think. They. Should. Have. Signed? Be specific.

 

@Ball Security is my agent. He speaks for me.