TheGreatBuzz Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 23 minutes ago, The Sisko said: Just wishful thinking on my part. I stand by what I said before all this kicked off, when this was on the horizon we should have put troops in Ukraine, at their request of course. Call it joint training or whatever. Then say very sternly that those forces will defend themselves if fired upon as well the full force of the nation will back them up. Then dare them. 3 minutes ago, CousinsCowgirl84 said: Biden doesnt have to do any of that because his current strategy is working perfectly. I think the people of Ukraine would disagree. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CousinsCowgirl84 Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 14 minutes ago, The Almighty Buzz said: I think the people of Ukraine would disagree. I don’t. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildbunny Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 3 hours ago, CousinsCowgirl84 said: I don’t. Really depends on what the overall strategy is here. Fact is Russia control the Donbas now, and even if they are progressing slowly, they are making progress. And they don't give a **** of how many people they lose over there or how long it takes. Those soldiers are mostly people from far east of Russia that don't even know what they are doing there and are there so their family over their are given money for these. Another fact is that Russia already has stolen grain from Ukraine, I don't see why they would stop now. They are working on creating the starvation so they can blame the West within Africa/Asia where they think they have some partners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildbunny Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 (edited) 5 hours ago, CousinsCowgirl84 said: Won’t China be forced to support Russia. If Russia gets turned into a third world country, or a country like Japan post WW2 who is allied with China? If America gets involved directly in conflict against Russia, doesn’t China have a national security interest in keeping Russia as an ally? China wouldn't be forced at anything regarding Russia. They already have an alliance with Ukraine regarding Nuclear defense. Do you think they would go with it if Russia nuke Ukraine? I don't. They aren't either allied with Japan, it's kinda the opposite, those two countries are often on the verge regarding the sea of China that Chinese thinks belong to them while international laws says otherwise. That's part of the thing of China "expanding" themselves by creating artificial island all over them so they can finally call the sea of China being theirs. The new prime minister of Japan made it perfectly clear by saying that "all options are on the table" while reviewing troops. Also, China wouldn't mind conquering those russians land north of their country. So they will as always play their own card in this ****. 5 hours ago, CousinsCowgirl84 said: out of curiosity do you think avoiding world war 3 is soft 🤨 For some reason I think in 50 years 2022 will be teached as the year where WW3 found its roots. Edited July 23, 2022 by Wildbunny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sisko Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 6 hours ago, CousinsCowgirl84 said: Biden doesnt have to do any of that because his current strategy is working perfectly. Sorta. The only problem is that it’ll only continue working for another two years or so. When Tя☭mp or DeathSantis takes over, all the aid stops. HIMARS, three hatchets and all the rest will be useless without ammo, not to mention all the cash they need to keep their economy afloat. At some point, I could see Pootin deciding to just dig in and wait for that to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Die Hard Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 42 minutes ago, The Sisko said: Sorta. The only problem is that it’ll only continue working for another two years or so. When Tя☭mp or DeathSantis takes over, all the aid stops. HIMARS, three hatchets and all the rest will be useless without ammo, not to mention all the cash they need to keep their economy afloat. At some point, I could see Pootin deciding to just dig in and wait for that to happen. A lot of the talking heads have been repeating the same mantra…. things are going to start turning in Ukraine very shortly (in August) as Ukraine goes on counter-offensive. Apparently, things are pretty bleak for Russia at the moment. Perhaps this won’t be a drawn out war. We’ll have a better idea soon enough 🙂 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CousinsCowgirl84 Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 (edited) 4 hours ago, Wildbunny said: Another fact is that Russia already has stolen grain from Ukraine, I don't see why they would stop now. But they have agreed to allow Ukrainian ships to pass. This is a concession that doesn’t seem to have a lot of strategic benefit to them. 4 hours ago, Wildbunny said: China wouldn't be forced at anything regarding Russia. I think having a strong ally in Russia is valuable to China. If you don’t you are entitled to your opinion. 4 hours ago, Wildbunny said: They aren't either allied with Japan, it's kinda the opposite, those two countries are often on the verge regarding the sea of China that Chinese thinks belong to them while international laws says otherwise. that isn’t what I was saying. I was saying if Russia got turned into a demilitarized state like Japan after WW2 that would be bad for China. 4 hours ago, Wildbunny said: For some reason I think in 50 years 2022 will be teached as the year where WW3 found its roots. maybe, but ww3 is inevitable and it makes since to draw the start of it out as long as possible, as Biden is doing. Edited July 23, 2022 by CousinsCowgirl84 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RansomthePasserby Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 Just now, CousinsCowgirl84 said: But they have agreed to allow Ukrainian ships to pass. This is a concession that doesn’t seem to have a lot of strategic benefit to them. Ukraine has pushed the Russian fleet back with anti ship missiles and denied access to Snake Island, so Russia may not to be able to enforce a full blockade. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CousinsCowgirl84 Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 Just now, RansomthePasserby said: Ukraine has pushed the Russian fleet back with anti ship missiles and denied access to Snake Island, so Russia may not to be able to enforce a full blockade. Yes, that is my point. The concession is a concrete sign that it isn’t going well for them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 17 minutes ago, CousinsCowgirl84 said: Yes, that is my point. The concession is a concrete sign that it isn’t going well for them. Only if they live up to it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CousinsCowgirl84 Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 8 minutes ago, Larry said: Only if they live up to it. There is no reason to give the concession at all in the first place though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 2 minutes ago, CousinsCowgirl84 said: There is no reason to give the concession at all in the first place though. I could easily see them "give up the concession", and then just steal the boat and the cargo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 LULLZZZZ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CousinsCowgirl84 Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 12 minutes ago, TradeTheBeal! said: LULLZZZZ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RansomthePasserby Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 3 hours ago, TradeTheBeal! said: LULLZZZZ Russia doesn’t respect agreements. This is what the people calling for a ceasefire don’t understand. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
China Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 Russia claims it destroyed four HIMARS launchers in Ukraine Russia’s defence ministry says its forces destroyed four US-supplied high mobility artillery rocket systems (HIMARS) in Ukraine earlier this month. Between July 5 and 20, “four launchers and one reloading vehicle for the US-made multiple launch rocket systems (HIMARS) were destroyed,” it said in a daily briefing on Friday. Kyiv rejected Moscow’s claims, calling them “fakes” designed to undermine the West’s support for Ukraine. Ukraine has accused the Russians of intensifying missile and rocket attacks on cities in recent weeks in a deliberate attempt to terrorise its population. Thousands of people have been killed and cities and towns devastated by Russian bombardment, with even some towns far from front lines hit by missiles. Moscow denies deliberately firing on civilians and says all its targets are military. Click on the link for the full article Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 9 hours ago, CousinsCowgirl84 said: 13 hours ago, Wildbunny said: I think having a strong ally in Russia is valuable to China. If you don’t you are entitled to your opinion. I think you’re the only one in the world that thinks Russia is a strong ally to have 😂 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
88Comrade2000 Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 If Russia didn’t have nukes; I would invade them. It would be bloody but they could be defeated. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 Lol invading them is dumb. History is pretty clear on that. destroying their military presence in Ukraine is different. And I’m guessing wouldn’t be hard at all. although I’m guessing you have to accept losing some people but the numbers would likely be low relative to conflict. I still get a chuckle out of the fact that so many people have watched this completely corrupt and inept **** show called the Russian military, but don’t bat an eye at the idea that they have maintained and can operate a fully functional nuclear infrastructure im a betting man. My bet is their **** don’t work. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildbunny Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 3 minutes ago, 88Comrade2000 said: If Russia didn’t have nukes; I would invade them. It would be bloody but they could be defeated. Considering how their army is doing, you have to wonder how effective those nukes are... 9 hours ago, CousinsCowgirl84 said: But they have agreed to allow Ukrainian ships to pass. This is a concession that doesn’t seem to have a lot of strategic benefit to them. I think having a strong ally in Russia is valuable to China. If you don’t you are entitled to your opinion. that isn’t what I was saying. I was saying if Russia got turned into a demilitarized state like Japan after WW2 that would be bad for China. maybe, but ww3 is inevitable and it makes since to draw the start of it out as long as possible, as Biden is doing. Ok to answer your 3 points all in order: 1 - They bombed Odessa less than 24H after signing the agreement, then denied it. So, I guess that makes me a winner considering my earlier guess? 2 - I misunderstood you then, but your wording was poor really. Maybe use commas next time. Still, China has more to gain from a weakened Russia than a strong one. Hell I could see China jumping on the occasion to conquer all the lands up to the other side of Bering's detroit. Then North America have a huge problem. 3 - I'm not so sure we have anything to gain by delaying it. I could see the gain if we were turning our economies into war economies and starting to buff up our army. But that's not the impression I get from us in Europe. Once again our dear leaders are lacking in the geopolitical department and believe it will sort itself out. Waiting for too long will only enfeeble everyone of us while China will be stronger. Then, that'll be a huge problem. Striking Russia now while they are beaten would makes it easier for everyone for the next round while we gear up.as nobody wants to have to fight China and Russia at the same time. If we did strike now, I'm not sure China would move at all. But we're really playing it scared with lack of vision and anything. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CousinsCowgirl84 Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 1 hour ago, tshile said: I think you’re the only one in the world that thinks Russia is a strong ally to have I hear you, but they are Chinas only first world ally…. 1 hour ago, Wildbunny said: Considering how their army is doing, you have to wonder how effective those nukes are... Ok to answer your 3 points all in order: 1 - They bombed Odessa less than 24H after signing the agreement, then denied it. So, I guess that makes me a winner considering my earlier guess? ****. 1 hour ago, Wildbunny said: 2 - I misunderstood you then, but your wording was poor really. Maybe use commas next time. i know. I was still in bed… 1 hour ago, Wildbunny said: . 3 - I'm not so sure we have anything to gain by delaying it. Russia is getting steadily weaker… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CousinsCowgirl84 Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 (edited) Nvm Edited July 23, 2022 by CousinsCowgirl84 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbear Posted July 24, 2022 Share Posted July 24, 2022 As I read David and Goliath, there is a part in it where the author describes Britain prior to getting bombed by the Germans. Everyone, including the British, thought it would be a disaster leading population to panic. They built mental hospitals and prepared for psychological devastation about their inability to stop the Germans from bombing them. Night one went pretty much as expected w roughly 40k dead and lots more injured, but very little panic. You see, there were roughly 8 million people in London. Most werent amongst the injured. The dead dont panic. Night after night, most of London wasnt directly impacted. It bread a sense of societal invincibility. The panic never happened because there was no singular incident which impacted enough of the population. I wonder if Russia isnt making the same mistake in Ukraine. Yes, the combined impact is ruining cities, much like London was in WW II. However the survival breeds a sense on invinsibility which is much harder to overcome. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted July 24, 2022 Share Posted July 24, 2022 (edited) 20 hours ago, tshile said: I still get a chuckle out of the fact that so many people have watched this completely corrupt and inept **** show called the Russian military, but don’t bat an eye at the idea that they have maintained and can operate a fully functional nuclear infrastructure im a betting man. My bet is their **** don’t work. I can easily believe that some of them don't work. How many cities are you willing to bet, that zero of them do? Edited July 24, 2022 by Larry 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinsmarydu Posted July 24, 2022 Share Posted July 24, 2022 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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