The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[skinsfan66]

1 hour ago, FootballZombie said:

 

He's dirt cheap and you aint getting nothing in a trade.

 

He has a great attitude and work ethic, Its not like he's moping around or anything. We are gonna need like 3-4 QBs in camp anyway.

At worst he's a study buddy for the new guy to bounce questions they don't wanna go to the coach with as they both learn a new playbook. Plus he has proven to be unreasonably Kryptonian level durable. I've seen heavy bags take less damage. That's nice to have, especially if the lead guy has injury concerns.

 

He is not like Wentz where the contract is self defeating and he is not like TH where the ceiling is below the floor.

 

Unless there is some fear that he is a threat to the new guy's job, I don't see much of a reason to give him the boot.

We will have new brass, so its not like Sam will be their "guy". In fact the new guy will inherit that title.

 

The only way I can see Sam as a potential issue is if you draft some 2nd or 3rd round QB and he has to directly compete for play time... and I don't think that is gonna happen.

And he is still on his feet and playing, when is the last time a QB has made it through half a season here? New offense and coach 1st year starter.  K.Pickett  B.Young, Zach Wilson, Trey Lance, Mac Jones, Justin Fields, A.Richardson 1st rd. picks D.Ridder 3rd. He was a 5th rd. pick are any of these any better, every one of these have been benched except A.Richardson ,he only made it few games this season. Why are they still with their teams? 

[FootballZombie]

2 minutes ago, skinsfan66 said:

And he is still on his feet and playing, when is the last time a QB has made it through half a season here?

 

The fact that Howell is somehow still drawing breath on this Earth is almost making me consider giving up red meat...

 

almost...

[Skinsinparadise]

 

[skinsfan66]

2 hours ago, ThatNFLChick said:

I am quite confused as to why people want Howell on the team next year? He didn't outplay our backup QB. Someone who was benched 3 times in a season should not be trying to mentor anyone else, certainly not whatever QB we draft, and we're almost surely getting a new OC and HC so it would be a new offensive scheme anyway that Sam wouldn't know. 

 

What is the benefit in keeping him besides that he is cheap? Washington should not spend time or resources trying to develop two QBs simultaneously (especially one that they have already decided is not the guy)

And the 12 year Vet backup could never beat him out until 2 games to go? A little different to come in when the game is over. He went 0 for 2 also. Howell was Benched 2 times late in games, Vet became the starter till he couldn't go for 1 game, and back to the bench.

[mac8887]

56 minutes ago, ThatNFLChick said:

 

Is it worth it if someone wants to trade a 6th for him? I would at least explore our options. He is young, cheap and on a rookie deal. Someone might be willing to work with him. I don't see the point if he has no real future here

 

I think a vet works better as a backup to a learning and developing rookie. If Jacoby is willing to stay, great, but it seems unlikely. He'll see Flacco's success and look for a place he might be able to start. 

 

I'm not sure Sam would fetch a 6th, but it's possible. I could maybe see a draft day scenario where we could maybe trade sam+6th or 7th for a 5th. I don't think a new coach will want to keep him around if we draft a qb. To many fans are enamored with sam and if anything starts to go sideways the fans and the media, Especially the media will try to push a qb controversy, and it would just be headache for no reason. Any smart coach would avoid that.

 

If we forgo qb in the draft and bring in a veteran, like Russell Wilson, I could see the benefits of having him stay and learn. His and Russell's game are similar. And if you are bringing in a vet, you are in win now mode anyway, so as soon as you are out of a playoff race a qb controversy wouldn't mean much.

 

In that scenario sam would have one last chance to cement himself as a starter here, or if he plays decent, but not great, he could be a cheap back up for another year. But then you're back to drafting a qb the next year.

 

Best bet would be to draft qb with the 1st this year and try to get something of value for sam. Whether it be a late round pick, a late round package deal to move up a little in the draft, or maybe even a player for player even though that is pretty rare these days.

 

The dilemma is even though people say sam is basically a rookie, he is actually at the end of the 2nd year of a 4 year contract with no 5th year option due to him being a 5th rounder. In any scenario rather it be drafting a rookie or bringing in a stopgap vet, by the time sam would even get a shot here again to be starting qb, barring injury, you would have to give him a new contract. That's not going to happen if he is still unproven

 

If sam really wants a chance to start soon, he should ask for a trade to the rams, or jets or to any team that doesn't draft their guy this year. Go anywhere there is an aging qb, and if they get injured be ready to step in and never look back. If not, it could be years before he ever gets another opportunity, if at all.

Edited January 4 by mac8887

[kingdaddy]

11 minutes ago, skinsfan66 said:

And he is still on his feet and playing, when is the last time a QB has made it through half a season here? New offense and coach 1st year starter.  K.Pickett  B.Young, Zach Wilson, Trey Lance, Mac Jones, Justin Fields, A.Richardson 1st rd. picks D.Ridder 3rd. He was a 5th rd. pick are any of these any better, every one of these have been benched except A.Richardson ,he only made it few games this season. Why are they still with their teams? 

Howell making it through this season without missing a game is nothing short of amazing....his toughness might be his greatest asset.

[skinsfan66]

4 minutes ago, mac8887 said:

I'm not sure Sam would fetch a 6th, but it's possible. I could maybe see a draft day scenario where we could maybe trade sam+6th or 7th for a 5th. I don't think a new coach will want to keep him around if we draft a qb. To many fans are enamored with sam and if anything starts to go sideways the fans and the media, Especially the media will try to push a qb controversy, and it would just be headache for no reason. Any smart coach would avoid that.

 

If we forgo qb in the draft and bring in a veteran, like Russell Wilson, I could see the benefits of having him stay and learn. His and Russell's game are similar. And if you are bringing in a vet, you are in win now mode anyway, so as soon as you are out of a playoff race a qb controversy wouldn't mean much.

 

In that scenario sam would have one last chance to cement himself as a starter here, or if he plays decent, but not great, he could be a cheap back up for another year. But then you're back to drafting a qb the next year.

 

Best bet would be to draft qb with the 1st this year and try to get something of value for sam. Whether it be a late round pick, a late round package deal to move up a little in the draft, or maybe even a player for player even though that is pretty rare these days.

Some people need to look around at the more highly rated 1st year players and what they have done too. Russell sucks now why would you want him here another castoff like the others in the past never  can make it through the season. Brissett will be gone and we will be lucky to get a 7th rd. comp pick. He will take another 8 mil check and hit the road. If we draft one of the top 3 I hope Howell is not here, but if you take a second tier QB in the draft he should stay. 

[mac8887]

40 minutes ago, skinsfan66 said:

Some people need to look around at the more highly rated 1st year players and what they have done too. Russell sucks now why would you want him here another castoff like the others in the past never  can make it through the season. Brissett will be gone and we will be lucky to get a 7th rd. comp pick. He will take another 8 mil check and hit the road. If we draft one of the top 3 I hope Howell is not here, but if you take a second tier QB in the draft he should stay. 

I don't want russ here, I was just mentioning possible scenarios. If you mean second tier qbs I hope you mean anybody after rattler. No way do you draft penix or McCarthy and keep Sam here. Why in the world would any coach want that headache. I imagine it's beside the point because I'm fairly certain if they are drafting top 2, they are going qb with that pick.

 

It's sounds to me like you are worried more about Sam succeeding or getting another shot at succeeding than you are the team succeeding. Would you want one of the lesser qbs so their leash is a little shorter? Even if it's penix or McCarthy, Sam would be qb 2 and it would take a catastrophic failure or injury by one of them for sam to get any meaningful playing time. That's if they don't bring in a veteran like jacoby to be qb2, sam could easily be qb3 in that scenario.

 

If they draft rattler or nix or even jordan travis in rounds 3-5, mabye nix goes in the 2nd, (though it wouldn't be us taking him there) to sit for a year or 2, they would be bringing a stopgap veteran as qb1 and sam would be qb3 on that depth chart and would have to beat out 2 qbs to get a chance to start. Are you hoping that if it's one of them there will be a qb competition in camp with sam? That will not happen. No coach is coming here year 1 uncertain who his day 1 starter is. That will be 100% figured our by the end of the draft.

 

There just really isn't any reason to keep Sam here if they can get anything of value in return, unless they bring in someone like kirk or russ to start and let sam back them up. In that scenario they probaly take a flyer on a 7th round project qb or go the udfa for qb3.

Edited January 4 by mac8887

[88Comrade2000]

Sam at best would net a 4th rounder.

 

 

Justin will not have a long career. Whether he stays in Chicago or is traded, give him 3-4 more years.

[Skinsinparadise]

So Ron's leaving this job whining about the QB.  Basically gone from shouting from the roof tops that Sam is the guy and Ron is the hero for finding him -- to now throwing him under the bus and implying he's not the guy.

 

I guess their #32 ranked defense has nothing to do with why this team sucks.  It's all about Howell.

 

 

 

Edited January 4 by Skinsinparadise

[BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93]

Really want to make a thread and get everyone’s opinion on where Ron falls in the Snyder’s HC group. 
 

To me, he’s in Zorn and Spurrier territory easily. 

[Thinking Skins]

What if.... And this is all just a theory so bear with me.

 

But what if Harris knew he couldn't do anything as far as hiring, so the max reps came from Harris when he was he was hired. What is Harris called Ron a week before camp and Ron called EB to do it. Then we see it play out through the season. We saw how it impacts our draft picks and Sam's body and our running game and stuff. But EB has kinda said or had sped up his development, and maybe he's talked with Harris about it. 

 

So now we've got EB and Sam that have advanced forward in this pass first system. I fully believe that a lot of these pics are not on Sam. Like the last one against NY2, the last one against Dallas, the last one against SF, heck I can't remember the ones in the nugget Buffalo game but that was his only bad int game for a long time. 

 

Anyway, just a thought

[Skinsinparadise]

6 minutes ago, BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93 said:

Really want to make a thread and get everyone’s opinion on where Ron falls in the Snyder’s HC group. 
 

To me, he’s in Zorn and Spurrier territory easily. 

 

Agree, easily.  I respect his personal journey dealing with cancer and all the Dan garbage.  But as a coach-GM he's been atrocious.  And his comments have been equally off putting.

 

He's fit to a tee the "losing culture" of the Dan era.  It was fitting how much he praised Dan this year and didn't get why people had a beef with Dan. 

 

This season he's been a combinaton of delusional-arrogant-lazy-incompetent.  A Zorn like ending to his tenure. 

Edited January 4 by Skinsinparadise

[RWJ]

3 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Agree, easily.  I respect his personal journey dealing with cancer and all the Dan garbage.  But as a coach-GM he's been atrocious.  And his comments have been equally off putting.

 

He's fit to a tee the "losing culture" of the Dan era.  It was fitting how much he praised Dan this year and didn't get why people had a beef with Dan. 

 

This season he's been a combinaton of delusional-arrogant-lazy-incompetent.  A Zorn like ending to his tenure. 

It got worse when he tried to be a GM too.  

[Skinsinparadise]

2 minutes ago, Thinking Skins said:

What if.... And this is all just a theory so bear with me.

 

But what if Harris knew he couldn't do anything as far as hiring, so the max reps came from Harris when he was he was hired. What is Harris called Ron a week before camp and Ron called EB to do it. Then we see it play out through the season. We saw how it impacts our draft picks and Sam's body and our running game and stuff. But EB has kinda said or had sped up his development, and maybe he's talked with Harris about it. 

 

So now we've got EB and Sam that have advanced forward in this pass first system. I fully believe that a lot of these pics are not on Sam. Like the last one against NY2, the last one against Dallas, the last one against SF, heck I can't remember the ones in the nugget Buffalo game but that was his only bad int game for a long time. 

 

Anyway, just a thought

 

Even Harris' critics say the dude doesn't interfere sometimes to a fault with the coaches-GM.  

 

So here you are referencing what if Harris interferred in a big way.  I'd say zero chance.  Keim who seems plugged into that ownership groups has said they've been very hands off.

 

You still want EB to be the HC?

[Ball Security]

13 minutes ago, BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93 said:

Really want to make a thread and get everyone’s opinion on where Ron falls in the Snyder’s HC group. 
 

To me, he’s in Zorn and Spurrier territory easily. 

Marty

Gibbs II 

Jay

Shanahan

Rivera

Spurier

Zorn

(not counting the interims or Norv whom he inherited)

[Conn]

10 minutes ago, Thinking Skins said:

What if.... And this is all just a theory so bear with me.

 

But what if Harris knew he couldn't do anything as far as hiring, so the max reps came from Harris when he was he was hired. What is Harris called Ron a week before camp and Ron called EB to do it. Then we see it play out through the season. We saw how it impacts our draft picks and Sam's body and our running game and stuff. But EB has kinda said or had sped up his development, and maybe he's talked with Harris about it. 

 

So now we've got EB and Sam that have advanced forward in this pass first system. I fully believe that a lot of these pics are not on Sam. Like the last one against NY2, the last one against Dallas, the last one against SF, heck I can't remember the ones in the nugget Buffalo game but that was his only bad int game for a long time. 

 

Anyway, just a thought

why do you think it’s hard for you to accept that these guys are just bad coaches 

[BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93]

7 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Agree, easily.  I respect his personal journey dealing with cancer and all the Dan garbage.  But as a coach-GM he's been atrocious.  And his comments have been equally off putting.

 

He's fit to a tee the "losing culture" of the Dan era.  It was fitting how much he praised Dan this year and didn't get why people had a beef with Dan. 

 

This season he's been a combinaton of delusional-arrogant-lazy-incompetent.  A Zorn like ending to his tenure. 

I was so onboard with him the first year and a half. I really was. I blindly defended him at times even though I pretty much disagreed with him completely at a philosophical level. Defended the Jamin Davis pick even though it went against what I believed a modern team should do. I went to war with folks in favor of Wentz bc I was a fan of his and I still wanted to believe in Ron. 
 

But the arrogance and superiority complex drove me away slowly. I get it. He’s a 1 of 1 alpha male that’s accomplished greatness at basically every level of football. He should be arrogant but the final straw for me was going into that first Philly game in 2022 and being like a 7-8 point dog AT HOME to a rival that started a rebuild after you did. I had ST that year and I remember walking into that stadium resigned to the fact that we were gonna be wrecked and no one associated with Philly was even worried about the result.
 

Inexcusable. His record at drafting and FA is unbelievably bad. I know there were forces beyond his control at times but it’s hard to be this bad. 

[CapsSkins]

11 minutes ago, Thinking Skins said:

What if.... And this is all just a theory so bear with me.

 

But what if Harris knew he couldn't do anything as far as hiring, so the max reps came from Harris when he was he was hired. What is Harris called Ron a week before camp and Ron called EB to do it. Then we see it play out through the season. We saw how it impacts our draft picks and Sam's body and our running game and stuff. But EB has kinda said or had sped up his development, and maybe he's talked with Harris about it. 

 

So now we've got EB and Sam that have advanced forward in this pass first system. I fully believe that a lot of these pics are not on Sam. Like the last one against NY2, the last one against Dallas, the last one against SF, heck I can't remember the ones in the nugget Buffalo game but that was his only bad int game for a long time. 

 

Anyway, just a thought

 

I appreciated open-minded speculation but, with all due respect, I have no idea what you're talking about lol

[Skinsinparadise]

 

[BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93]

6 minutes ago, Ball Security said:

Marty

Gibbs II 

Jay

Shanahan

Rivera

Spurier

Zorn

(not counting the interims or Norv whom he inherited)

I’m 30 so while I’ve pretty much never missed a game since I was like 5, I didn’t really understand/pay much attention to coaches until like the Gibbs 2 era. I remember the results before then but I don’t really have much of a memory/concept about the others’ coaching styles except that Marty was a hard ass and Spurrier was um…quirky? Lol 

1 minute ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I know everyone thinks I hate Sam but legitimately never understood how Ridder and Corrall got picked before him. It sounds good in hindsight but I got instant bust vibes as soon as I started researching them leading up to the draft. Especially Corrall. 

[clskinsfan]

21 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

When Atlanta cuts him they can throw in a Super Bowl ticket as his severance.

[illone]

5 hours ago, ThatNFLChick said:

I am quite confused as to why people want Howell on the team next year?

 

What's the alternative, cut him?

 

He is under contract for another two seasons...

[ThatNFLChick]

2 minutes ago, illone said:

 

What's the alternative, cut him?

 

He is under contract for another two seasons...

 

Trade him? At least see if there is any interest. The Broncos need someone, the Saints might be looking for a successor to Carr but won't have a high draft pick, the Raiders, etc. 

 

I just don't see the value of keeping him around to be a 3rd QB that may not even be active most games or stashed on the PS. 

[illone]

11 minutes ago, ThatNFLChick said:

 

Trade him? At least see if there is any interest. The Broncos need someone, the Saints might be looking for a successor to Carr but won't have a high draft pick, the Raiders, etc. 

 

I just don't see the value of keeping him around to be a 3rd QB that may not even be active most games or stashed on the PS. 

 

 

Who is the backup for next season?