The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[The Consigliere]

41 minutes ago, ThatNFLChick said:

This is again why I do not buy into the "Caleb is generational" talk at all. He is not a better prospect than Burrow or Stroud (better than Lawrence though). His ceiling is high IF he can put it all together but if he can't? The floor is low. He had several plays just like this in the same game:

 

 

He is a better prospect than Stroud, Stroud's a better pro QB than him, for now (and perhaps always), but we can only judge prospects by where they were in their draft years. Stroud was not the consenus #1 in a weaker draft class than this one by a good stretch. 

[DogofWar1]

2 minutes ago, DiscoBob said:

 

If Peters and team don't view this as easily correctable, this is a fatal flaw that should overrule every other trait.

 

Before people jump on me, there is an IF in that statement.  My point being, that nothing else matters in the evaluation unless this one thing cannot be fixed.

 

Yeah I mean he's gotta show that he can get up to about 220 imo.  He indeed needs to take the checkdowns too. Looking at some of his plays (still going thru them) he definitely runs after things break down, where you might expect most players to hit a checkdown.  I do wonder how much that was schemed.  At the same time, boy howdy there are some big holes he got to run through.  Watching from the back angle it's like "lol no duh he ran it there's a bus sized hole in the line and 10 yards of open field."

 

So I don't know whether to dock him or not.  But he needs to be able to hit the checkdown in the NFL more than sprinting off.

 

 

[ThatNFLChick]

15 minutes ago, The Consigliere said:

He is a better prospect than Stroud, Stroud's a better pro QB than him, for now (and perhaps always), but we can only judge prospects by where they were in their draft years. Stroud was not the consenus #1 in a weaker draft class than this one by a good stretch. 

 

This is my opinion. I've said it before, Williams is #1 for me in this class but I liked Stroud and Burrow more as prospects. A lot of people are dazzled by the wow throws and arm strength but that is far less important to me. More than any other group we have seen big strong armed QBs taken super high and flame out (Paxton Lynch, Mitch Trubisky, Zach Wilson, Blake Bortles). As for Williams I have him slightly above Lawrence but I never liked Lawrence as much as everyone else 

Edited February 22 by ThatNFLChick

[NOLA2DC]

1 hour ago, ThatNFLChick said:

This is again why I do not buy into the "Caleb is generational" talk at all. He is not a better prospect than Burrow or Stroud (better than Lawrence though). His ceiling is high IF he can put it all together but if he can't? The floor is low. He had several plays just like this in the same game:

 

 

Many analysts have unintentionally adapted their ideal to Mahomes since he's the young goat. I agree you cannot make those decisions in the NFL, but I'm sure he got used to playing hero ball sometimes.  Mahomes has improved since his first year as a starter, and teams anticipate coaching him out of those habits. In terms of rankings, I don't think he's better than Burrow, but that's more about competition and accomplishments (Joe is cool in a class of his own). 

[ThatNFLChick]

Just now, NOLA2DC said:

Many analysts have unintentionally adapted their ideal to Mahomes since he's the young goat. I agree you cannot make those decisions in the NFL, but I'm sure he got used to playing hero ball sometimes.  Mahomes has improved since his first year as a starter, and teams anticipate coaching him out of those habits. In terms of rankings, I don't think he's better than Burrow, but that's more about competition and accomplishments (Joe is cool in a class of his own). 

 

For me with Burrow he was just a good decision maker that could methodically march a team down the field. He didn't have a ton of wow throws, but I don't care, he rarely went 3 and out. He took care of the ball, rarely put it in harms way, was excellent at leading his receivers (never throwing it behind them or making them do acrobatics to catch a ball), he was clutch in the 4th quarter, he played his best games against his toughest competition, he had good mechanics, a quick release and fluid throwing motion. 

 

CJ Stroud was the same way for me. 

[clskinsfan]

5 hours ago, ThatNFLChick said:

Did not notice this yesterday and this seems weird. The Seahawks now have two former coaches of Jayden Daniels on their staff?

 

 

Thank Christ, Let them have his skinny ass. 

[clskinsfan]

3 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

PFF guy who is a fan of this team

 

 

 

 

1a) Caleb Williams 1b) Drake Maye 3) Jayden Daniels

And its not really close for me after Caleb and Maye. If we were picking 3 fine. I would take the bean pole. But we arent.

[DiscoBob]

1 hour ago, DogofWar1 said:

 

Yeah I mean he's gotta show that he can get up to about 220 imo.  He indeed needs to take the checkdowns too. Looking at some of his plays (still going thru them) he definitely runs after things break down, where you might expect most players to hit a checkdown.  

 

All valid points, but I mostly mean the ability to avoid direct hits.  Players like Mahomes, Kyler, Wilson, and Lamar are all good at avoiding the catastrophic hit.  I don't know if every player can be taught this skill set across all situations 🤷

[Warhead36]

3 hours ago, 88Comrade2000 said:

Yep. The only way we are similar to last years Bears is this:

 

We decide that Howell is the qb we want to run with this year . So, we trade down and use the extra picks to build around him.  That extra 2025 #1 and any other 25,26 picks we pick up would be used to further build the roster of put us in position to get the top qb on 25 draft, if Sam bombed in 24. 
 

Of course, we have no idea where that 25 #1 pick would be.  Chicago had no idea Carolina’s pick would be #1 pick.

 

 

If you want to compare us to Chicago, you compare our situations now.  We both have a qb that we feel can improve on. We both are in a position to draft a replacement qb that we feel will be better. 

Yep. Also, this year's QB class was known to be a fantastic one with Williams and Maye, and it got even better with Daniels rise. It was a smart move by Chicago to make that trade with a team that'll probably suck, so at worst they have ammunition to move up in a strong QB draft. Of course they got lucky and ended up getting the best pick possible.

 

Next year's draft class is garbage for QBs. Extra picks next year aren't gonna help. This is not the year to punt on a QB if you're picking top 2-3.

[clskinsfan]

3 hours ago, 88Comrade2000 said:

We decide that Howell is the qb we want to run with this year

 

[ThatNFLChick]

56 minutes ago, clskinsfan said:

1a) Caleb Williams 1b) Drake Maye 3) Jayden Daniels

And its not really close for me after Caleb and Maye. If we were picking 3 fine. I would take the bean pole. But we arent.

 

Is this necessary? Can we actually discuss these QBs without childish comments like this? Like whomever you like but nobody here has resorted to this kind of stuff when talking about Maye nor Williams. 

Edited February 23 by ThatNFLChick

[HTTRDynasty]

Seahawks are unlikely to draft Daniels if this move is anything to go by (which it is):

 

 

[mistertim]

Just now, ThatNFLChick said:

 

Is this necessary? Can we actually discuss these QBs without childish comments like this? 

 

This is coming from the poster who's most often used response when discussing negative takes on Jayden Daniels seems to be "LOL"

[ThatNFLChick]

Just now, mistertim said:

 

This is coming from the poster who's most often used response when discussing negative takes on Jayden Daniels seems to be "LOL"

 

And you think the two are equivalent huh? K. 

[clskinsfan]

5 minutes ago, ThatNFLChick said:

Is this necessary?

Yes it is. I am drunk and didnt join the site 2 months ago. Seethe all you want. 

[DogofWar1]

I like Daniels a lot, I haven't given up on him being #2 (I'm undecided) but at 210 he is kinda a bean pole.

 

Kids' gotta put on 10 pounds in the right places.

 

Now you wanna talk about skinny little dudes, let's talk about stickman JJ McCarthy at 200 pounds.  Dude is 6'3".

[clskinsfan]

Just now, DogofWar1 said:

but at 210

Bro. He isnt 210. He will weigh that next week at the combine and wont run. Then at his pro day he wont weigh and will run. It is a clown show. 

[ThatNFLChick]

Just now, clskinsfan said:

Yes it is. I am drunk and didnt join the site 2 months ago. Seethe all you want. 

 

That tracks. 

 

Daniel Jeremiah and Lance Zierlin talking about Drake Maye

 

 

[DogofWar1]

Just now, clskinsfan said:

Bro. He isnt 210. He will weigh that next week at the combine and wont run. Then at his pro day he wont weigh and will run. It is a clown show. 

If he does that, it'll really knock him down in my eyes.  Those kinda games are bad form and a red flag, so I hope he doesn't pull that stuff.

[clskinsfan]

Just now, ThatNFLChick said:

 

That tracks. 

 

Daniel Jeremiah and Lance Zierlin talking about Drake Maye

 

 

[mistertim]

1 minute ago, DogofWar1 said:

I like Daniels a lot, I haven't given up on him being #2 (I'm undecided) but at 210 he is kinda a bean pole.

 

Kids' gotta put on 10 pounds in the right places.

 

Now you wanna talk about skinny little dudes, let's talk about stickman JJ McCarthy at 200 pounds.  Dude is 6'3".

 

I'd be shocked if Daniels was actually 210 on game days this season. He's looked more like a buck 90 or so. College sites tend to exaggerate height and weight somewhat, especially for QBs so I definitely don't take the 210 as fact.

 

I'm guessing he'll put on weight for the combine, but who knows how that will impact his 40 time (though he probably won't run depending on how much weight he tries to add).

[HTTRDynasty]

Interesting comparison...

 

 

[zCommander]

10 hours ago, Going Commando said:

 

Yep.  Throwing to a first read who is a dominant receiver running wide open up the seam with no safety help, on time, from a clean pocket doesn't really show off any particular special NFL trait.

 

Like this one?

 

 

 

[DogofWar1]

Yeah college sites exaggerate and that might actually help a tinge for him if they gave him some extra height but not weight (probably unlikely they only did that one way tho).

 

If he's only 6'3" then I could feel more comfortable at like 215/218 versus wanting him to get up to at least 220/223 range.  But if he IS only 6'3" then yeah, that makes me question the 210.

[Skinsinparadise]