All things defense

[skins4eva]

13 minutes ago, FLSkinz83 said:

That blitz on 3rd and 15 brought back memories of Jim Haslett on Monday Night against the Cowboys in 2011.  3rd and 21.

 

 

JDL and Haslett are very similar. Both were incredibly mediocre head coaches and awful coordinators. I mean we’ve had some really bad defensive coordinators over the last 30 years. I used to think Greg Blache was the worst, but Del Rio is on a whole different level of suck. He’s like 5 standard deviations away from the next most awful coordinator we’ve ever had. 

Edited September 19, 2022 by skins4eva

[CjSuAvE22]

38 minutes ago, skins4eva said:

JDL and Haslett are very similar. Both were incredibly mediocre head coaches and awful coordinators. I mean we’ve had some really bad defensive coordinators over the last 30 years. I used to think Greg Blache was the worst, but Del Rio is on a whole different level of suck. He’s like 5 standard deviations away from the next most awful coordinator we’ve ever had. 

Lol we are talking about the same jack del rio that coached a top 5 defense on 2020? Tell me since then what players have we added to build on that defense? Im not saying jdr isnt to blame for how we have started but i dont think its just him, hes clearly capable of coaching a decent defense with the right players.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

5 hours ago, CjSuAvE22 said:

 

6 hours ago, skins4eva said:

JDL and Haslett are very similar. Both were incredibly mediocre head coaches and awful coordinators. I mean we’ve had some really bad defensive coordinators over the last 30 years. I used to think Greg Blache was the worst, but Del Rio is on a whole different level of suck. He’s like 5 standard deviations away from the next most awful coordinator we’ve ever had. 

Expand  

Lol we are talking about the same jack del rio that coached a top 5 defense on 2020?

 

Do you recall the QBs this team faced in 2020?

 

The 2020 defense was a mirage.

 

The defense could use an injection of talent.  But JDR has done himself no favors with what he does have.

[NoVaSkins21]

The only hope is they do what Dal@ss idd in 2020 and draft exclusively on defense, but they would need to find an innovative DC like Dan Quinn which I doubt is out there and would want to come here

[redskinss]

On that play where swift fell down then scored a touchdown 91 (I think that's potoae but thought he was inactive) looked about as athletic as a hippopotamus. 

I know big guys aren't going to be nimble but he looked about as goofy and awkward as I've ever seen.

Definitely a reason he didn't make a roster this year until the worst defense in the league came calling.

[KDawg]

I think this next draft is a year that has been set up for a defensive heavy draft already. 
 

As of this moment I’d try to add a OT in FA and then turn my focus to defense.

 

This defense needs the following, badly: A high football IQ thumper of a linebacker who can play a little pass coverage, a corner who consistently plays his responsibility and a free safety who can play downhill on run but also range and stay over the top. 
 

There are going to be several first round options at all three of those spots in this upcoming draft.

 

Jordan Battle and Sewell among them. 
 

It comes down to where we finish, how we finish and contract negotiations with guys whose deals are up. But this D needs talent at key spots.

 

We have talented edge guys (productive is another conversation, but there is talent), we need a high IQ backer and a rangey free. Those are the hallmarks of good defenses.

[redskinss]

I'm thoroughly confused as to how much of our problems are coaching and how much is just the stink of this franchise that's impossible to wash off while your still here.

Look at the parade of offensive gurus that are excelling elsewhere and now look at joe Barry, he was absolutely worthless here and now he's considered a top defensive coordinator. 

 

[CjSuAvE22]

The good news is, if we do have a legit coach in Ron Rivera than team defense is much easier to improve midseason vs having a terrible offense, but they are gonna have to find the players and be aggressive on switching up the schemes.

[AlwaysBeRedskins2Me]

12 hours ago, CommanderCarson said:

Yeah this was trash. That’s inexcusable tbh

I think this is getting overblown. He went down but somehow he was back up in like 0.3 seconds. So it's not like Haynesworth's belly flop while Vick was running around. I'm just saying, is it really that much of an advantage for a defense if the player goes to the ground, if they're literally back on their feet in a blink of an eye?

[Leonard Washington]

16 minutes ago, CjSuAvE22 said:

The good news is, if we do have a legit coach in Ron Rivera than team defense is much easier to improve midseason vs having a terrible offense, but they are gonna have to find the players and be aggressive on switching up the schemes.

We don't seem to be aggressive with the players we have.  Davis and Holcomb aren't good read and react LBs but they do have speed and good tacklers. Doesn't Hudson fall in that category?  Can't we try to capitalize on that? 

 

Forrest can thump, can't we have him play buffalo nickle?  Is Butler even playing? 

 

What the hell is Sweat doing?  He HAS to dominate tight ends and running backs.

 

Just f'ing attack!

Edited September 19, 2022 by Leonard Washington

[KDawg]

3 minutes ago, AlwaysBeRedskins2Me said:

I think this is getting overblown. He went down but somehow he was back up in like 0.3 seconds. So it's not like Haynesworth's belly flop while Vick was running around. I'm just saying, is it really that much of an advantage for a defense if the player goes to the ground, if they're literally back on their feet in a blink of an eye?

 

The problem is no one is around him at all. Is that scheme? Maybe. Could be play call. Or it could be someone didn't do their job. 

[AlwaysBeRedskins2Me]

4 minutes ago, KDawg said:

 

The problem is no one is around him at all. Is that scheme? Maybe. Could be play call. Or it could be someone didn't do their job. 

That's true. The other problem was the hideous attempts at tackling him, after he got back up.

[KDawg]

Just now, AlwaysBeRedskins2Me said:

That's true. The other problem was the hideous attempts at tackling him, after he got back up.

Oh, sure. But if someone was near him when he fell he's touched and downed. The rest doesn't have a chance of happening.

[HigSkin]

DETROIT — Dear Washington Commanders defense: Feel free to be good. Not great. Just good.

Yes, you have a first-round draft pick — the second overall choice two years ago — wearing sweatpants, not pads, and Chase Young as a cheerleader doesn’t have the potential of Chase Young as a pass rusher. But you also have a first-round pick at one tackle and a first-round pick at another tackle. You have a first-round pick at the end opposite your injured first-round pick, and you have a first-round pick at linebacker. You have a guy who is paid like a top-10 cornerback in the league. And you felt good enough about the group that you essentially made no moves via free agency or trade to improve it.

Some of those players do their jobs with regularity and distinction — hello, Jonathan Allen and Daron Payne. Some, well, don’t.

 

But this isn’t completely about — ahem — Jamin Davis or William Jackson III. This is a group that, collectively, can’t funnel its talent into anything that resembles consistency. Which makes you wonder about the coaching. Which makes you wonder about Jack Del Rio.

 

And that assessment isn’t just from one Sunday afternoon at Ford Field, though the 36-27 loss to the Detroit Lions provides plenty of examples. Here, Washington’s offense somehow brainwashed itself into forgetting an absolutely horrific first half and twice clawed its way within a score of the Lions. The defense responded thusly: 75 yards in four plays to allow the Lions to go up 14 again, then 70 yards in six plays for Detroit’s final points.

Why does a unit that believes it can be so good so infrequently play that way?

“We definitely have a lot of talent,” said defensive back Bobby McCain, in his eighth NFL season. “We have great continuity. We communicate very well. There’s nothing that changed in that aspect.

“We’ve just got to be better on the little things, be more detailed in practice and understand, man, everybody’s got to do their job.”

 

This was said Sunday, when the Lions gained 425 yards and averaged 7.0 yards per play — and 8.0 yards per rush. But it could have been said after so many games over the past year and change.

“You want to blame anybody?” Coach Ron Rivera said. “Blame us all.”

In this case, “all” includes Del Rio, in his third year on the job. The No. 1 Commanders character who faced something of a referendum on his career coming into this season had to be quarterback Carson Wentz because he was on his third team in three years, with questions about his leadership and decision-making following him into town. But there’s a solid argument — and it’s the belief here — that the figure facing the next most scrutiny in Washington is Del Rio.

Take away the offseason fiasco in which he was fined for calling the insurrection at the U.S. Capitol “a little dust-up.” Just concentrate on the football.

The football would tell you that what used to be the strength of this team no longer is. That can be on everybody, as Rivera would prefer. But some of it has to be on his coordinator. Fifty-four weeks ago, heading into the 2021 season opener, this defense — playing under a different name but with much of the same personnel — wasn’t hyped as a top-five defense in the NFL. It was a top-five defense in the NFL.

That unit had Young coming off a season in which he was the defensive rookie of the year. It had committed more capital by taking Davis, a linebacker, in the first round of the draft and adding Jackson as a high-priced corner in free agency. And it had ranked second in the NFL in both yards allowed per game (304.6) and yards allowed per play (4.9) in 2020.

 

Those numbers ballooned a year ago to 359.3 yards per game (22nd in the league) and 5.7 yards per play (27th). Through two weeks this year, Washington is giving up 404 per game and 6.6 per play. Yeah, small sample size, and those might not be the best metrics. But the trend isn’t upward.

So now it’s the offense that has to bail out the defense? It feels like there’s acceptance that this has become a mediocre unit. Not by the coaches and players, who expect better. But if you’re sitting at home on the couch thinking, “Well, maybe Wentz and his group of dangerous receivers can pull this one out,” you’re not alone.

Sure, the offense — which gained just 56 yards and gave up four sacks — was more responsible for Sunday’s 22-0 halftime deficit. But the Lions’ lead was also built on a blown coverage that left wide receiver Amon-Ra St. Brown with what amounted to a cow pasture around him. It was also built on a 50-yard romp by running back D’Andre Swift.

“I saw that we gave them big plays, explosive plays,” Rivera said. “You can’t give up those plays. You allow an explosive play, and it throws you off.”

 

Here’s the difference right now for Washington: The offense, with Wentz and coordinator Scott Turner unlocking a more creative version of the playbook, seems to have the ability to get thrown off, correct mistakes and adjust.

Del Rio’s defense just doesn’t pivot in the same way. It’s telling that, after Wentz’s touchdown pass to tight end Logan Thomas pulled the Commanders within 22-15 late in the third quarter, the defense seemed to react to the Lions’ first play with a combination of admiration and awe rather than just going and tackling the guy. It was a jet sweep to the dynamic St. Brown, and it went for 58 yards.

“Just being probably out of position, maybe not as gap-sound as we should be,” Payne said. “It’s just all things we’ll look at when we look at film tomorrow.”

 

It would be nice to be able to more frequently recognize them in real time. Three plays later, quarterback Jared Goff — under pressure from Davis, who Rivera said played with “a little inconsistency,” which has become a defining characteristic — found Swift in the flat. The back made the catch, fell down and had time to get up, dust himself off and wander through what remained of Washington’s secondary for a touchdown.

That, unfortunately, is the identity of this defense. Not just Sunday. But over the course of the past year and change.

Antonio Gibson’s one-yard touchdown run with just under 11 minutes remaining pulled the Commanders within 29-21. The defense forced the Lions into a third and two.

 

“Everybody [is] out there with the mind-set: ‘We got to get the ball back for the offense. We got the ball back for the offense,’ ” second-year safety Darrick Forrest said. “That was the mind-set.”

 

It was not the result. Instead, Goff emptied the backfield — a bold move, given the Lions’ obvious strength. It seemed to surprise the Commanders because why wouldn’t it? And it led to a 25-yard completion down the seam to backup tight end Brock Wright. Goff hit St. Brown in the flat on the next play, and that was that.

 

Look, this isn’t a result that means the season is lost. That’s not possible in Week 2. Plus, as Rivera said both to the media and to his team, “There’s a lot of football ahead of us still to play,” which is both a cliche and the truth.

But it’s worth wondering: Are Del Rio’s players going to get better? Is his unit going to improve to become the team’s strength again? The players can talk about their talent. Someone has to get it out of them not just occasionally but every week.

[kingdaddy]

The fact that we picked up #91 off the streets and he saw time this week is pretty bad. Losing Settle, Ion and Landon Collins in the same offseason is coming back to haunt this defense right now. That's a lot of experience and guys who played roles well. Settle and Ion were home grown draft picks that we let go for nothing. Now we're picking up guys who can't make other teams and playing them? How is Blake Martinez (28 years old) still sitting out there when he's probably better than both of our starting LB's? 

 

[@DCGoldPants]

8 minutes ago, HigSkin said:

“You want to blame anybody?” Coach Ron Rivera said. “Blame us all.”

 

Come on. Ron, you boy just isn't getting it done anymore. Maybe his defense has gone the way of the Wildcat. Everyone knows how to beat it now and the game has passed your Coordinator by. 

[ntotoro]

2 minutes ago, @DCGoldPants said:

 

Come on. Ron, you boy just isn't getting it done anymore. Maybe his defense has gone the way of the Wildcat. Everyone knows how to beat it now and the game has passed your Coordinator by. 

 

Ron does share a lot of the blame here. He has the final say-so on personnel and completely eviscerated the DT position in the offseason. He hasn't handled the lack of talent at LB at all and there are still communication issues in the Secondary, the latter being coaching issues directly on the DC and the Secondaries Coach. Ron picks the coaches, too.

[kingdaddy]

7 minutes ago, ntotoro said:

 

Ron does share a lot of the blame here. He has the final say-so on personnel and completely eviscerated the DT position in the offseason. He hasn't handled the lack of talent at LB at all and there are still communication issues in the Secondary, the latter being coaching issues directly on the DC and the Secondaries Coach. Ron picks the coaches, too.

I agree...it's mind boggling to me that we'll pick up a guy who can't make an NFL roster to replace our 2nd round pick when there are several NFL free agent vets who could be signed? Good teams like Tampa Bay, Rams and others sign the best players they can get while we go for cheap, unproven no-name guys. How do you expect to get your fans back when you sign players like that? George Allen built a defense with vets who knew how to play; RR is filling in holes with guys who can't play. 

[method man]

5 minutes ago, kingdaddy said:

I agree...it's mind boggling to me that we'll pick up a guy who can't make an NFL roster to replace our 2nd round pick when there are several NFL free agent vets who could be signed? Good teams like Tampa Bay, Rams and others sign the best players they can get while we go for cheap, unproven no-name guys. How do you expect to get your fans back when you sign players like that? George Allen built a defense with vets who knew how to play; RR is filling in holes with guys who can't play. 

As @FootballZombie has pointed out, the team has less then $4M of cap space left so a cavalry probably isn’t coming

[ntotoro]

The team had a couple really good backups at DT who could play, but were let go. That's on Ron and the team got gashed in the middle all-day yesteday.

[justice98]

They trot out the exact same defense as last year, and are not coincidentally, getting the exact same results. 

 

I guess Sam Mills Jr wasn't really the problem. 

 

Montez Sweat may be seeing more double teams with Chase Young out, but he's not off to an impactful start.  It's two games, but it's two games that look like most of the other games.  He's kind of around the QB, but at the end of the game, you ultimately didn't notice him too much.  Reminds me of Preston Smith, in that, he's ok, but not the stud you were hoping he was gonna be.  And in Sweat's case, not the stud he's been hyped up to be. 

[Warhead36]

7 minutes ago, justice98 said:

They trot out the exact same defense as last year, and are not coincidentally, getting the exact same results. 

 

I guess Sam Mills Jr wasn't really the problem. 

 

Montez Sweat may be seeing more double teams with Chase Young out, but he's not off to an impactful start.  It's two games, but it's two games that look like most of the other games.  He's kind of around the QB, but at the end of the game, you ultimately didn't notice him too much.  Reminds me of Preston Smith, in that, he's ok, but not the stud you were hoping he was gonna be.  And in Sweat's case, not the stud he's been hyped up to be. 

Sweat had a real good Week 1. This was a tough matchup as the Lion OTs are outstanding. 

 

I don't think Sweat will ever be a 15+ sack stud, but he'll be a solid 10 sack guy. Need him to be better at setting the edge and playing the run as well though. And he should be deflecting more passes.

[Cooleyfan1993]

This whole defense is GARBAGE. Each and every player. Pure trash. I’m done hearing about “we have the talent” or “we know what we’re capable of”. Stop talking about it. Just. STOP. Stop telling me, and start SHOWING me. Until then, I’ll choose to think of everybody on defense as garbage. 

[justice98]

13 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

Sweat had a real good Week 1. This was a tough matchup as the Lion OTs are outstanding. 

 

I don't think Sweat will ever be a 15+ sack stud, but he'll be a solid 10 sack guy. Need him to be better at setting the edge and playing the run as well though. And he should be deflecting more passes.

 

In your mind, is it a slam dunk that Sweat should be re-signed?  Out of all these first rd DL, the only one I felt was a slam dunk was Allen.  They took care of him, but these other three are iffy.  And I don't wanna fall for the contract year production bump, which i kinda feel Payne is trying to hoodwink people on.  If he played like this all the time, he'd have a deal and wouldn't have one foot in free agency.

[Warhead36]

14 minutes ago, justice98 said:

 

In your mind, is it a slam dunk that Sweat should be re-signed?  Out of all these first rd DL, the only one I felt was a slam dunk was Allen.  They took care of him, but these other three are iffy.  And I don't wanna fall for the contract year production bump, which i kinda feel Payne is trying to hoodwink people on.  If he played like this all the time, he'd have a deal and wouldn't have one foot in free agency.

Not a slam dunk, but we exercised his 5th year option already so I'll re-evaluate at the end of 2023.