Heinicke Hive: The LEGEND of Taylor Heinicke Thread

[Captain Wiggles]

Sharpe likes Heinicke so much he didn't even bother to learn his name. 

 

Tyler Heinicke, Scott Brunells oldest n dearest friend. 🤭

[redskinss]

1 minute ago, PartyPosse said:

Have you ever seen a team act like they’re screwed when a new QB comes in? 
 

“Well, we just lost our leader, and (insert name) is a good dude and fun to party with, but man, we are in trouble.”

The cowboys were pretty close to that last year, they didn't say that but they did say they had to adjust expectations. 

They knew without dak they were done.

[Conn]

It gets frustrating reading people dismissing intellectually honest and realistic worries. Nobody is saying you need a Howitzer attached to your shoulder to succeed in the NFL. We all know about Brady and Brees (who famously had to compensate for his size—and later in his career, arm—by being a football genius and all-time anticipation thrower) and others. And his mobility (if he stays safe and doesn’t risk his health too much) can certainly help compensate. He’s exciting, he has good pocket presence, and he knows the offense extremely well and distributes the ball well. These are all strengths we can work with and have success with—to a point.
 

Because unless he ends up with all-timer ability in the brains department, it’s going to be hard for him to continually threaten defenses past a certain point, and that’s where people’s fears come in. If defenses can condense the field they’re worried about him attacking and learn to predict his floaters, it could be trouble. He’s still taking teams by surprise right now but that won’t last forever. 
 

That’s what keeps people’s expectations and future hopes in check. For the people saying he’s just a good fill-in that we can win some games with, agreed 100%. For people with hopes he can become the franchise with his moxy, mobility, and savvy…those are the people I disagree with, even if I wish I didn’t. And I know there aren’t that many of you. But there comes a point where an arm like Heinicke’s holds you back, no matter what other tools he has, unless he is truly special like the other exceptions people love to list. And again, I don’t need to be reminded of the Jamarcus Russells who could throw the ball out of the stadium but sucked out loud. I know. We all know. The point has always been that you need to hit a certain floor of arm strength to, at minimum, threaten the defense all over the field—and an even higher floor of arm strength to surprise defenses with those dynamic throws few others can complete (think Favre, Mahomes, Herbert, Stafford, Allen).

 

No one is expecting Heinicke to be a part of that latter group, and you don’t “need” that guy to be a good team. The concern is that he doesn’t seem to be a part of that former group either, as he flutters too many balls that he can’t get his whole body into. So he needs to be absolutely special in other ways to overcome that, long-term. 
 

Again, long-term. We aren’t necessarily disagreeing with the people who just say he’s a fine fill-in that can win some games. I agree, personally. This is aimed towards the true believers who think he can be the franchise guy. 

Edited September 15, 2021 by ConnSKINS26

[Koolblue13]

51 minutes ago, DJHJR86 said:

 

I hope he saves it for tomorrow.  I don't want him to go to jail.

Better than a water park.

[DJHJR86]

23 minutes ago, PartyPosse said:

Have you ever seen a team act like they’re screwed when a new QB comes in? 

 

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/dolphins-players-not-confident-in-tua-tagovailoas-quarterbacking-abilities-per-report/

 

Yes.

[Malapropismic Depository]

Rivera has used the word "gunslinger" to describe Heinicke.

Interesting choice of words.

I'm not saying the word directly translates into a QB with a rifle of an arm, however "gunslinger" usually isn't a word used to describe a QB with a weak arm.

 

It's also not a word usually used to describe a QB whose main threat is his running or scrambling ability.
He could easily be considered a dual-threat QB

 

Edited September 15, 2021 by Malapropismic Depository

[Conn]

3 minutes ago, Malapropismic Depository said:

Rivera has used the word "gunslinger" to describe Heinicke.

Interesting choice of words.

I'm not saying the word directly translates into a QB with a rifle of an arm, however "gunslinger" usually isn't a word used to describe a QB with a weak arm.

 

It's also not a word usually used to describe a QB whose main threat is his running or scrambling ability.
He could easily be considered a dual-threat QB

 

It’s a commentary on his mindset. Fitzpatrick also isn’t known for arm strength and is called a gunslinger. Meanwhile Carr has a strong arm but isn’t thought of as a gunslinger. In the end it’s just a buzzword saying he’ll try to make plays, even if they’re dangerous, and throw the ball up for his receivers to fight for. I think that’s a fair description.

[Malapropismic Depository]

3 minutes ago, ConnSKINS26 said:

It’s a commentary on his mindset. Fitzpatrick also isn’t known for arm strength and is called a gunslinger. Meanwhile Carr has a strong arm but isn’t thought of as a gunslinger. In the end it’s just a buzzword saying he’ll try to make plays, even if they’re dangerous, and throw the ball up for his receivers to fight for. I think that’s a fair description.

 

Does this mean he has some Rex Grossman in him ?

 

[Conn]

Here’s a weird comp that feels kind of right…

 

Johnny Manziel didnt have prototypical size, didn’t have a great arm but was a gunslinger, wasn’t an all-world sprinter but was thought of as a tough scrambler, and was considered to have toughness and moxie. Maybe a good comp for Heinicke is “Johnny Manziel with a work ethic and no addiction issues, and if he wasn’t an asshole”. 

[Stone Cold]

4 minutes ago, ConnSKINS26 said:

Here’s a weird comp that feels kind of right…

 

Johnny Manziel didnt have prototypical size, didn’t have a great arm but was a gunslinger, wasn’t an all-world sprinter but was thought of as a tough scrambler, and was considered to have toughness and moxie. Maybe a good comp for Heinicke is “Johnny Manziel with a work ethic and no addiction issues, and if he wasn’t an asshole”. 

weird… was just thinking the same.  Heinie Man is Johnny Football without the issues

[PartyPosse]

20 minutes ago, DJHJR86 said:

 

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/dolphins-players-not-confident-in-tua-tagovailoas-quarterbacking-abilities-per-report/

 

Yes.

That’s entirely different. That was end of year and unnamed players coming out and saying they’re unsure. Has it ever happened during a season where one guy gets taken out and another comes in for whatever reason and a player or players came out to say “we don’t think they can get the job done.”?

15 minutes ago, ConnSKINS26 said:

It’s a commentary on his mindset. Fitzpatrick also isn’t known for arm strength and is called a gunslinger. Meanwhile Carr has a strong arm but isn’t thought of as a gunslinger. In the end it’s just a buzzword saying he’ll try to make plays, even if they’re dangerous, and throw the ball up for his receivers to fight for. I think that’s a fair description.

You misheard. Fitzpatrick is a “fun-slinger”.

46 minutes ago, redskinss said:

The cowboys were pretty close to that last year, they didn't say that but they did say they had to adjust expectations. 

They knew without dak they were done.

Still a big difference between being realistic about expectations and saying someone isn’t capable of getting the job done or being a capable leader under center.

[CapsSkins]

Heinicke's X-factor is he's a scrambling QB who can also go through all his progressions and make the right decision with the ball.

 

That's why I think he can succeed even after defenses prep for him. It's not like once defenses figure out the RPO he's dead in the water (like RG3). It's also not like if defenses can pressure the QB and collapse the pocket then he's dead in the water (like Alex/Fitz).

 

Of course he'll face a tougher challenge when opponents can prep for him. But his skillset is just difficult to shut down, it's that potent combo of going thru your reads and making the right play while also being able to elude the rush and buying yourself more time, not to mention opening things up with the running threat.

[Malapropismic Depository]

21 minutes ago, CapsSkins said:

Heinicke's X-factor is he's a scrambling QB who can also go through all his progressions and make the right decision with the ball.

 

That's why I think he can succeed even after defenses prep for him. It's not like once defenses figure out the RPO he's dead in the water (like RG3). It's also not like if defenses can pressure the QB and collapse the pocket then he's dead in the water (like Alex/Fitz).

 

Of course he'll face a tougher challenge when opponents can prep for him. But his skillset is just difficult to shut down, it's that potent combo of going thru your reads and making the right play while also being able to elude the rush and buying yourself more time, not to mention opening things up with the running threat.

 

 

You put my thoughts into words nicely.

I've basically been saying similar things, without elaborating as much, by noting that Heinicke's unpredictability, as well as his versatility, makes him more diffficult for defenses to prepare for and "neutralize"

[Conn]

33 minutes ago, CapsSkins said:

Heinicke's X-factor is he's a scrambling QB who can also go through all his progressions and make the right decision with the ball.

 

That's why I think he can succeed even after defenses prep for him. It's not like once defenses figure out the RPO he's dead in the water (like RG3). It's also not like if defenses can pressure the QB and collapse the pocket then he's dead in the water (like Alex/Fitz).

 

Of course he'll face a tougher challenge when opponents can prep for him. But his skillset is just difficult to shut down, it's that potent combo of going thru your reads and making the right play while also being able to elude the rush and buying yourself more time, not to mention opening things up with the running threat.

It’s definitely possible that this is true, his mobility makes shutting down all his passing lanes tougher, even if you don’t have to be worried he’s going to throw some sick across the field boundary ball from the opposite hash. That’s not his game, and it doesn’t have to be if he uses his mobility smartly and finds a workable balance between risky playmaking and taking care of the ball. 

 

But we won’t know if he’s got exploitable tendencies until we (and opposing defenses) see him for more than the 2.75 games he’s played here, or whatever it’s been. 

[HigSkin]

https://www.washingtonfootball.com/news/washington-players-ready-to-rally-around-taylor-heinicke

 

WFT Daily: Taylor Heinicke's Teammates Are Ready To Rally Around Him

Ron Rivera has a different player break down the pre-practice huddle every day. On Wednesday, it was time for Taylor Heinicke, who was named the starting quarterback earlier in the week, to take on the mantle. He didn't disappoint.

 

"I felt like I needed to get in front of the team a little bit," Heinicke said after practice. "So I went in there and said a couple of words that I probably shouldn't say right now about these Giants. Hopefully it got the guys fired up and ready to play for Thursday."

The media couldn't hear what was said, but Heinicke had clearly achieved his goal. It's what they've come to expect from the quarterback, and in case anyone still needs convincing, they're ready to rally around him.

 

"He just gives us all confidence because he knows what he's doing," said wideout Terry McLaurin. "He's gonna give you a chance to make plays."

 

There are some players who have an innate ability to create enthusiasm and excitement, Rivera said Monday. Heinicke has that ability because of the way he plays. He directs the offense "like his hair's on fire," according to Rivera, and his gunslinger mentality creates opportunities.

 

Those qualities are what Heinicke put on display in his first postseason start last season against the Tampa Bay Buccaneers, when he nearly helped upset Tom Brady and the eventual Super Bowl champions. That performance, which included 352 total yards and a pair of touchdowns, earned McLaurin's respect.

 

Nearly eight months later, the same traits shined again, as Heinicke completed 11-of-15 passes for 122 yards and a touchdown to go with three carries for 17 yards against the Los Angeles Chargers.

 

"The way he came in and handled his business on a moment's notice when we found out that Alex [Smith] wasn't going to be able to go, he was just prepared for his moment," McLaurin said after the 31-23 loss to the Buccaneers. "That's what this league is about, being prepared for your moment.

 

 

The way he plays, along with his preparation in the offseason and training camp, gives his teammates assurance that he can handle a starter's responsibilities in 2021. From the perspective of Chase Young, one of Heinicke's biggest supporters, there's no doubt in what "Big Tay" can do.

 

"At that position...I don't think anybody's really too worried," Young said. "Taylor can come in and sling it."

 

Young remembers when Washington signed Heinicke as its emergency quarterback in December. He also remembers being impressed with how Heinicke started to "sling it" against the Carolina Panthers, ending the day 12-of-19 for 137 yards and a touchdown.

 

The biggest reason Young trusts Heinicke under center: "he's just a winner."

"He's just gonna go hard," Young said. "That's all you can really ask.

 

"Heinicke doesn't plan on changing his personality after having his dream of being a starting NFL quarterback come to reality. It was Ryan Fitzpatrick's team to start the year, so he didn't feel like it was his place to speak up. Now, however, if he feels the need to speak up, he's going to do it. And he knows his teammates are going to follow him.

 

"When we get out there on Thursday," Heinicke said, "everyone's pretty juiced up and everyone's ready to go."

[bowhunter]

2 hours ago, PartyPosse said:

 

You misheard. Fitzpatrick is a “fun-slinger”.

 

I think the preferred term now is "HIPster"

[Stone Cold]

can not wait for the game tomorrow.  Stay healthy young fella…would love to see you ball out

[wit33]

As I grow in learning about Turner and his offense, I’ve become convinced the offense requires a QB with above average mobility to reach its ceiling/flirt with being dynamic. 
 

The run/pass game don’t seem to be married together in Turner’s scheme with a slower/pocket QB. This seems to come alive with a 4.6 type QB, felt this way when Kyle Allen came in last year. Allen opened up an area of the playbook other guys couldn’t and the offense had moments of being dynamic with him. I’m not an Allen promoter, as I believe he lacks football instincts when running the football and inside the pocket, but see his value to a play caller because you can scheme him up to roll/run places quickly. 
 

Taylor provides everything Allen does but at a much higher level in terms of football instincts at the QB spot: pocket/spatial awareness inside and outside the pocket, above average to good agility, comfortable scrambling and creating in all directions (Allen, Haskins, and Smith predictably scramble right). I’m hoping his running ability will open up some RPOs, Ros, and bootlegs helping to merry the run and pass game— big piece missing in many Turner led games. 
 

[ODU AGGIE]

To quote my favorite QB regarding the Giants -- "**** 'em!"

Edited September 15, 2021 by ODU AGGIE

[Malapropismic Depository]

I posted earlier about the Heinicke to McLaurin connection that got off to a fast start in their last 2 games together.

But Cam Sims also had a huge game, catching from Heinicke, vs Tampa.

Eager to see if they can duplicate that success together.

So imagine if Heinicke connects well, to BOTH Sims and McLaurin in the same game, as he's shown already that he can do. Our offense should become refreshingly more productive.

Thursday could also become Hump Day.

Because, word is, that Heinicke loves Humphries too

Edited September 15, 2021 by Malapropismic Depository

[mistertim]

3 hours ago, ConnSKINS26 said:

Here’s a weird comp that feels kind of right…

 

Johnny Manziel didnt have prototypical size, didn’t have a great arm but was a gunslinger, wasn’t an all-world sprinter but was thought of as a tough scrambler, and was considered to have toughness and moxie. Maybe a good comp for Heinicke is “Johnny Manziel with a work ethic and no addiction issues, and if he wasn’t an asshole”. 

 

I think this is actually a pretty accurate comparison. (from a purely football perspective)

Edited September 15, 2021 by mistertim

[ThomasRoane]

6 hours ago, ODU AGGIE said:

In the fifth game of Heinicke's freshman year, he came into the game to replace starting QB, Thomas DeMarco, a senior with 27 starts under his belt, who went out with a high ankle sprain. DeMarco never started another game and TH went on to throw for just under 15,000 yards in his four-year career. To show the parallel to our current position, I searched for a news article from back in the day. The following article is what I found, and it does have a small reference to that moment. But more than that, it provides insight into Heinicke's character and the way he has played this game since his high school days at Collins Hill High School just outside of Atlanta. I invite you to read it, enjoy it, and gain a better understanding of what kind of person and QB he has always been. For those who might be tempted to say, "yeah, but that was not the NFL" -- that is not my point. I hope you enjoy the read. Certainly anything can happen in the next six to eight weeks, but I for one am excited and optimistic about how things will turn out with Heinicke under center. Cheers, all.

 

https://www.dailypress.com/sports/college/dp-xpm-20140823-2014-08-23-dp-spt-odu-heinicke-20140823-story.html

 

Really good article.  As JJG would say "he's super smart!"  That can make up for deficiencies elsewhere.  Really pulling for him!  

[Malapropismic Depository]

 

3 hours ago, CapsSkins said:

it's that potent combo of going thru your reads

 

Heinicke and all his Higher Math Degrees, reads defenses, like...

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 15, 2021 by Malapropismic Depository

[CapsSkins]

2 hours ago, wit33 said:

As I grow in learning about Turner and his offense, I’ve become convinced the offense requires a QB with above average mobility to reach its ceiling/flirt with being dynamic. 
 

The run/pass game don’t seem to be married together in Turner’s scheme with a slower/pocket QB. This seems to come alive with a 4.6 type QB, felt this way when Kyle Allen came in last year. Allen opened up an area of the playbook other guys couldn’t and the offense had moments of being dynamic with him. I’m not an Allen promoter, as I believe he lacks football instincts when running the football and inside the pocket, but see his value to a play caller because you can scheme him up to roll/run places quickly. 
 

Taylor provides everything Allen does but at a much higher level in terms of football instincts at the QB spot: pocket/spatial awareness inside and outside the pocket, above average to good agility, comfortable scrambling and creating in all directions (Allen, Haskins, and Smith predictably scramble right). I’m hoping his running ability will open up some RPOs, Ros, and bootlegs helping to merry the run and pass game— big piece missing in many Turner led games. 
 

 

It's not just the scheme of the offense. Our Offensive Line is not that good at pass pro and both almost-40 year old statues we've stuck back there have gotten killed. With the OL where it is, we need someone who can slip the rush. Point blank period. 

[CapsSkins]

@Skinsinparadise, you've talked about watching Heinicke vs. Fitz in practice. Here's a quote from TH that might explain why Fitz outperformed Taylor in practice but Taylor may be the better QB on Sundays:

  

Quote

"In practice, you really want to stay in the pocket, go through your reads and kind of see things from the pocket in a perfect world," [Heinicke] said. "But, everyone knows during a game, things break down, holes open up and I know sometimes I can use my legs."

 

Seems like Taylor isn't using his legs to the fullest in practices, and if he keeps himself relatively stationary then I'm not surprised a pure pocket passer like Fitz would outshine him. But as we all know, game situations are very different.