Ron Rivera: Redskins First (non-interim) Head Coach of Color

[Conn]

48 minutes ago, onedrop said:

 

well it should be.

 

it makes me very happy that my children's generation has far fewer embedded societal prejudices than mine. i hope that trend continues until a time where no one is "judged" based on anything other than deeds alone.

 

It's not about judgement. You're right that that should be the goal. That wasn't what I addressed. You said "a person's ethnicity shouldn't be a concern"...and sorry, but that's purely a white person thing to think. It's uncomfortable, the history is uncomfortable to confront, so it's easier to pretend the goal is NOT to. But for many other people, race plays an integral role in their lives and concept of self-identity, family, and culture. That's why representation like this thread celebrates is important. It's okay, we are all different and celebrating that is the idea. Wiping it off the table is not" the exact final goal" as you asked. That's what I was referring to and addressing. And that's why there can be such a disconnect on this topic and why listening and reading can be better than loudly opining. 

[onedrop]

6 minutes ago, BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93 said:

Uh huh. 

 

good day sir. HTTR

 

(My DMs are open if you need any further assistance on the matter)

no, we can leave it right here......my kind arent allowed in here anyway...remember? 😜

[PlayAction]

Well this conversation degenerated pretty quickly

[Conn]

11 minutes ago, PlayAction said:

Well this conversation degenerated pretty quickly

 

Not really. Being able to constructively have this conversation is a pretty important part of moving forward on stuff like this imo. I'm grateful the mods have let it go and are trusting people to voice their point of view in a respectful manner. It's mostly gone that way even if there's some disingenuous posts as expected. 

[onedrop]

2 minutes ago, ConnSKINS26 said:

 

It's not about judgement. You're right that that should be the goal. That wasn't what I addressed. You said "a person's ethnicity shouldn't be a concern"...and sorry, but that's purely a white person thing to think. It's uncomfortable, the history is uncomfortable to confront, so it's easier to pretend the goal is NOT to. But for many other people, race plays an integral role in their lives and concept of self-identity, family, and culture. And that's okay, we are all different and celebrating that is the idea. Wiping it off the table is not" the exact final goal" as you asked. That's what I was referring to and addressing. And that's why there can be such a disconnect on this topic and why listening and reading can be better than loudly opining. 

i paraphrased "a persons ethnicity shouldnt be a concern" when describing anothers post. i know exactly where the world at large and the US specifically stand. both currently and historically. again, i only (mistakenly) contributed anything because i found it amusingly ironic in a thread about moving the needle so to speak someone was told to get out because they had a varied opinion. kind of like "you can only be in this thread if you discuss what is accepted and in the manner that is approved by thread management"

 

i never suggested "wiping" away anything.  i just hope to get to a place in time where peoples differences do not automatically trigger undeserved prejudices. 

[PlayAction]

3 minutes ago, ConnSKINS26 said:

 

Not really. Being able to constructively have this conversation is a pretty important part of moving forward on stuff like this imo. I'm grateful the mods have let it go and are trusting people to voice their point of view in a respectful manner. It's mostly gone that way even if there's some disingenuous posts as expected. 

 

IMO,  a "constructive conversation to move forward on stuff like this" too often means "here I'm going to explain why you are wrong" rather than about listening to different perspectives.

 

If you care that he's Hispanic then great.  It doesn't matter to me.  It's kind of neat that he's half Puerto Rican because I am too but that's the extent of my interest in his origins.  

 

btw pasteles suck.  How could anyone prefer pasteles to empanadas? 

[Destino]

5 hours ago, BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93 said:

Oh my ****ing god...

 

When I saw this thread, I was excited but I knew that there would be a few idiots that couldn’t wait to be dicks. 
 

you are truly insufferable ****s 

Honestly, I’d appreciate if we got some mods in here to get some of the trolls out of here. This is ****ing ridiculous. 
 

@Destino  @TK

I’m not seeing what you’re seeing.  If there’s a specific post that you think crosses the line report it or at least point it out.  I might have missed something.
 

 

[Destino]

55 minutes ago, PlayAction said:

How could anyone prefer pasteles to empanadas? 

 

Short answer:  yes, empanadas > pasteles.  
 

that said, what kind of empanadas are we talking about?  It shouldn’t be a question being that the Chilean empanada is king.  Living in the US however has made me aware that evil people have corrupted the mighty empanada.  I’ve ordered them whenever I encounter them on a menu and 99% the time what is served to me can only be described as an insult.  
 

[ntotoro]

9 hours ago, Destino said:

 

Short answer:  yes, empanadas > pasteles.  
 

that said, what kind of empanadas are we talking about?  It shouldn’t be a question being that the Chilean empanada is king.  Living in the US however has made me aware that evil people have corrupted the mighty empanada.  I’ve ordered them whenever I encounter them on a menu and 99% the time what is served to me can only be described as an insult.  
 

Now you know how I feel about Olive Garden. Oddly enough, a lot of Middle Eastern restaurants tend to not suck.

[goskins10]

Interesting thread - surprised it's lived on but glad it has. 

 

For those who came in with the - color shouldn't matter, you just look at qualifications - that is a dog whistle statement for those that either choose to ignore there is a racism problem or are blind to it based on their own privilege. It's easy to say - let's all just be equal when in fact all the advantages point to you. By pushing this claim you are advocating for the status quo which is rife with inequality. Or your personal situation is not impacted so you choose to ignore the reality that the minority feel. I am sure your response will be something along the lines of - well shouldn't that be the goal? Yes, of course. But it very far from the reality. And continuing to ignore the reality will not make it go away. We need to understand the issue, confront it and work towards an equitable set of solutions. Just saying it is not enough. 

 

For those saying he has been a HC for a long time so what's the big deal - please read the OP more closely. This is about him coming to the Redskins and the Redskins making progress as an organization. Having said that, I think this would be more ground breaking strictly from a minority hiring standpoint had the job gone to someone not already in the coaching fraternity. In reality no one else was even considered. And there are a whole bunch of minority candidates that are qualified and deserve a chance. 

 

I watched a segment on First Take (yes it was a very slow day!). They lured me by the title saying they would discuss the Redskins hiring Ron R but it was really all about the Rooney Rule. The one thing they said that made sense is that until you have owners that are person's of color there is little chance the executive positions on teams will be filled by people of color. Until then it will be very small steps like this one. This hiring should not be that big a deal - don't get me wrong i agree it's a huge deal. But it really should not be. But as evidenced by the people claiming they don't see skin color, just qualifications, we are very far away from the maturity level needed to realize that type of equality. 

[RabidFan]

20 hours ago, Koolblue13 said:

I'm in the US virgin islands and it's Pate, not empanada and I'm not putting popcorn or crackers in ceviche. Sounds like you got too much cracker in the customer.

popcorn on the side is how they do it in South American my man.  Which is how I was intro’d to it.  Crackers and sashimi style (not in a soup bowl) is how i’ve seen it in other non traditional countries recently like US.  Just giving my side. 

[Koolblue13]

3 minutes ago, RabidFan said:

popcorn on the side is how they do it in South American my man.  Which is how I was intro’d to it.  Crackers and sashimi style (not in a soup bowl) is how i’ve seen it in other non traditional countries recently like US.  Just giving my side. 

I know people do it like that. I have a few customers that ask for that. There's dozens of ways to serve it. It basically just means cooked with acid.

[98ORAKPO98]

There is no such thing as white privilege. Racism also isn't exclusive to people with fair colored skin. 

 

I'm glad we hired Rivera though, because he is a hard nosed disciplinarian.

[dyst]

It is very hard for minorities to consistently break through the barriers put forth by management, the owners and the league. 
 

There are tons of qualified minority assistants coaches, head coaches and GM who do not get the opportunity because unqualified guys like Joe Barry, Jeff Fisher and Bruce Allen continue to “magically” qualify for these positions. 

[98ORAKPO98]

12 minutes ago, dyst said:

It is very hard for minorities to consistently break through the barriers put forth by management, the owners and the league. 
 

There are tons of qualified minority assistants coaches, head coaches and GM who do not get the opportunity because unqualified guys like Joe Barry, Jeff Fisher and Bruce Allen continue to “magically” qualify for these positions. 

Isn't the Rooney rule in place? What barriers are in place? Didn't Jeff Fisher take the Titans to the super bowl?

 

What is the percentage of coaches, owners that need to be non white?

 

Isn't America like 60 something percent white?

 

Aren't the NFL players like 70 percent black? 

 

Is that diverse enough, or should the owners start looking for talent around Europe to make the leagues players more racially diverse?

 

 

[98ORAKPO98]

 

[dyst]

8 minutes ago, 98ORAKPO98 said:

Isn't the Rooney rule in place? What barriers are in place? Didn't Jeff Fisher take the Titans to the super bowl?

 

What is the percentage of coaches, owners that need to be non white?

 

Isn't America like 60 something percent white?

 

Aren't the NFL players like 70 percent black? 

 

Is that diverse enough, or should the owners start looking for talent around Europe to make the leagues players more racially diverse?

 

 

To answer your questions...

 

1. Yes the Rooney Rule is in place. It’s a nice rule to have, but it still places hope on ownership to be genuine about it. Are they? Don’t know but doesn’t feel like it.

 

2. There is certainly a feeling of a “wink wink” barrier otherwise there would be more minorities in as GM or even head coach unless one is to think minorities are not qualified enough.
 

3. I have no idea what the racial makeup of America or football is. Usually in these sort of discussions someone always mentions the players, as if that eases the concerns as to why minorities are not in more positions of leadership (i.e. coaching, management, ownership).

 

This is similar to many businesses, where several of workers are minorities but the managers, project managers, and executives tend to be non-minorites who use the “but look how many minorities we have working for us” talking point. Very much like the “I have a black friend” response given countless times in these viral videos.

 

3. There is no percentage amount that needs to be attained. Just hire qualified people. If you think that is what is happening then so be it. I just find it hard to believe that there are so few qualified minorities to fill these positions.

 

No one is saying hire minorities to fill a quota. Not one minority would say that or want that. All they want is equal standing and a fair shake. NFL rules can’t fix this. Its engrained in peoples mind and that is what needs to change.

 

With this said, overall, America is still a great country.

[TK]

18 hours ago, Destino said:

I’m not seeing what you’re seeing.  If there’s a specific post that you think crosses the line report it or at least point it out.  I might have missed something.

This.

 

I've been keeping an eye on this thread since it started. There's been some tip toeing up to the line but no Rules violations. The closest I've come to doing anything here is moving to the Tailgate as on occasion it's started to lean that way.

[98ORAKPO98]

On 1/4/2020 at 6:04 AM, FrFan said:

It's good to see POC showing their skills and getting rewarded as a matter of facts.

There is discrimination (racism), and positive discrimination (trying to get a mirror image of our society) to counter the previous one.  Both of them are a breach of the right to equality, one use racism in job selection, the other one skin color, ethnicity. Both of them usually ignore merit and skills.

Wouldn't our societies be better by clearly renouncing quotas and the word discrimination ?

I believe in an "ideal" society there would be no discrimination whatsoever, and that our references should be the concepts of positive equality and additional merit with equal skills.

Well said.

[COWBOY-KILLA-]

Just remember guys this isn’t about hiring a coach that is of Hispanic/POC descent.
 

This is about Hiring a Hispanic/POC to be the top decision maker in the organization. Something that we have NEVER done as an organization (88yrs) and something that has not been happening enough in the NFL. 
 

That is what makes this a big deal. Some people are missing that point. At its essence it’s about power and who wields it. So our organizational chart flows 1. Snyder 2. Rivera w/ Snyder explicitly saying it starts and ends w/ Rivera. 

Ideally I think we’d love to not have quotas or the Rooney Rule or things like Title ix. But when the market shows it is unable or unwilling to make equitable choices then I have no problem w/ the NFL or govt helping it along through regulation/rules.

[skins island connection]

Looking at some of the posts here does crack me up a little.

But it just goes to show that emphasis on ethnicity is more important than emphasizing equality for everyone; and there IS a difference.

I could care less what Rivera's nationality or heritage is; all I care about is, is he a good enough HC to get this team going in the right direction.

 

There is a saying; the more one holds onto the past, the less they can embrace the future.

 Doug Williams was the first black QB to win a Super Bowl, and he did it with the Redskins. Am I glad? Hell yes; did I care what his ethnicity was? Hell no. I'm glad he won it with the Redskins. But just as head-scratching as the question asked to him by a reporter, " how long have you been a black QB " is matched by the thread title.

[98ORAKPO98]

On 1/3/2020 at 8:51 AM, bakedtater1 said:

Yawn....wake me when women start becoming head coaches(no disrespect to you cowboykilla...i frickin love you here)..

I prefer to not see a female coach myself, or players. I'm all for women creating their own league though if they want.

[COWBOY-KILLA-]

1 hour ago, skins island connection said:

 

But it just goes to show that emphasis on ethnicity is more important than emphasizing equality for everyone; and there IS a difference.

 

But SIC, this IS about emphasizing EQUALITY, you see, it has not been equal in anyway in the NFL historically. So a step towards equality would be for more representation by People of Color in Power.  Hence why its a big deal that we did it for the first time as an organization, (eventhough from the looks of it, it played absolutely no part in DS's decision which is great ). This thread champions that move

 

1 hour ago, skins island connection said:

I could care less what Rivera's nationality or heritage is; all I care about is, is he a good enough HC to get this team going in the right direction.

There is a saying; the more one holds onto the past, the less they can embrace the future.

 Doug Williams was the first black QB to win a Super Bowl, and he did it with the Redskins. Am I glad? Hell yes; did I care what his ethnicity was? Hell no. I'm glad he won it with the Redskins. But just as head-scratching as the question asked to him by a reporter, " how long have you been a black QB " is matched by the thread title.

 

Yeah no one is disputing anything you are saying. I don't think anyone cares what his nationality is or isn't as long he is the best guy right fit.  But the FACT that he was the one chosen and IS (a POC is the top position of power) should be recognized and acknowledged imo, because there are so few POC's in positions of power in the NFL. This is nothing but a thread to  the celebrate the skins for the choice they made, and pat Ron on the back for making it this far.  So not sure what your issue with it is. 

[THE HAMMER'IN HOG]

On 1/3/2020 at 10:36 PM, ConnSKINS26 said:

 

Slow down. Read the thread slowly instead of giving in to your basest impulsive overreations and discomfort. See if you find a glimmer of truth or perspective in what someone thinks who isn't you or like you. You're doing yourself a disservice. This could be an illuminating thread without posts like this. Derisively calling a Puerto Rican person "a shade darker than albino" to dismiss others' experiences is irrational behavior and a destructive attitude, man. 

What color is his skin??? White!!! To refer to him as a person of "color" .. deciding what his skin color is or should be based upon your assumption of Puerto Ricans sounds about as racist as you get!!! 

The NFL is full of what you would call "minorities!" So this guy who has been treated like gold in the NFL his entire life is breaking some sort of racist boundary??? 

Sad that once again race takes precedence over accomplishment, instead of looking at his merits that he himself has "WORKED" for, seeing the man for who he is,,, rather than his skin color, has to be cheapened by interjecting race into his hiring...why? Because that's all some people see!!!! 

Tell me; what makes the hiring of a Puerto Rican individual any better or worse than the hiring of anyone else???  

[tibbidoe]

Sad that some people can't allow others to take pride in an event that isn't typical to the norm. African American coaches went thru (and still go thru) the same thing. It's the society many here have grown up in and one that many are still trying desperately to cling to.

 

Coach Rivera is an excellent hire and we're going to be better with him aboard. He also gets to be a role model for Puerto Rican and Mexican people, and other non-white people, who don't have nearly the representation that we, the EXTREMELY privileged White people in America, do.