!!!!0mgz!!!! Trent Williams finally showed up

[Kurd Cudins]

6 minutes ago, jamellm78 said:

I still find it unbelievable that we still have pro-Bruce fans... No offense to anyone on here but it's mind boggling 

Don't you EVER apologize to those morons. EVER!!!!

[mrcaniac]

34 minutes ago, SoCalSkins said:

The commissioner has the ultimate arbitration power under the CBA. The Zeke and Brady cases solidified that. If the he refuses to play or fakes injury the Redskins need to treat this a a disciplinary case and not a medical grievance. They need to suspend him for conduct detrimental then have the commissioner intercede and suspend him for conduct detrimental to the NFL.  
 

The owners need to take power back and the nonsense Jalen Ramsey and now if the reports are accurate Trent want to pull is unacceptable. 

 

Commissioner has absolute power when it comes to player conduct, not for CBA or contract grievances. If there is union  grievance filed because of something in the CBA, then an independent arbiter will hear and decide the case.

 

Goodell may say Trent's contract will be rolled over to 2021, but Trent then will file a grievance and the case goes to an arbiter.

[goskins10]

1 minute ago, PartyPosse said:

If it was money then yes what he did was smart in terms of leverage. If it was a legitimate gripe against the team and it’s medical staff and he was determined to never play for the team again then no, he screwed himself.  The proof is in the pudding.

 

So? It's his business. Let me rephrase since you want to change the conversation - He did it when he felt he had best leverage. Did he? Who knows. I don't actually care one bit. My point is people need to stop whining about WHEN he did it. He did when he did it - up to him and the bottom line is the team had plenty of time to work things out. Their arrogance and ignorance is what kept them from doing that. 

[goskins10]

2 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

CBA doesnt allow this anymore then the law allows murder with the expectation of  jail sentence.  Good for you for being pissed, I am too, at both of them.

 

So now we are equating murder with football? Are you kidding me? Dude you need to get a grip. It's football! Nothing but football!!

 

I am not pissed - just astounded at the whining and ****ing about a guy doing what he thinks is right and not without risk. You guys act like this is all a bed of roses for him. He is leaving money on the table and accruing fines if the team so chooses to levy them. 

[megared]

 

11 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

If anything the front office has become cheap AF, they arent wheeling and dealing overpaying everyone that comes in here and stays.  Both the Reed and Kerrigan deals were more the reasonable, this has nothing to do with anything, you're jus looking for different ways to day what the redskins are doing is worse then what Teent is doing so it's all good. Do you, I'm not with you on this.

 

Not for FAs they identify and outbid themselves for.  No one was lined up to sign those guys to the same deals we gave them.  

 

The only reason Kerrigan is signed is because it's a below market deal from his perspective.  He's one of the most underpaid DL in the league based upon past production.  

 

There's a reason why Scherff isn't signed yet.  Or Dunbar, or anyone eligible for extensions.  And there's a reason why we're always seemingly a year behind on these transactions.  That isn't the player's fault.  It's the same reason why we tagged Kirk twice...why we inexplicably kept Gruden to fire him after 5 games...now the same reason we've been indecisive on Trent.  

 

There is no plan.  

[JSSkinz]

54 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

Is it really though?  Take a gander at where the majority of the cap is going.  Yikes.

I like the mentality over the last 4 or 5 years, don't sign old players and if you do make them team friendly deals. I do think Bruce is too stingy in free agency but I'm fine with the choices we have made so far, none of the big names that play for $12M on one year deals would have moved the needle here.

 

Our worst cap issues have been Culliver, A Smith, Norman, Moses (Last 2 years), and Reed.

 

3 of those 5 were deals done by GMSM, we were still holding $5M in dead cap during the 2017 season for Culliver, probably could have used that for Kirk. 

 

I don't see Smith as cap mismanagement, just bad luck even though personally I do not like him as a QB but he does have a history of success unlike some other QB's in the league who get paid big bucks. 

 

One thing Smith has done is to stay pretty healthy his entire career.  You always worry about a 34 year old getting injured but I don't think any team would have expected what happened to him last year.

[SoCalSkins]

7 minutes ago, mrcaniac said:

 

Commissioner has absolute power when it comes to player conduct, not for CBA or contract grievances. If there is union  grievance filed because of something in the CBA, then an independent arbiter will hear and decide the case.

 

Goodell may say Trent's contract will be rolled over to 2021, but Trent then will file a grievance and the case goes to an arbiter.

Not if it’s treated as a player conduct issue. That’s my point. You need to suspend him for his conduct and better yet get the NFL suspend him. Then it’s game over. I’m sure the NFL doesn’t want a nonsense precedent if Trent is able to fake injury and sit for 8 games.

[NickyJ]

13 minutes ago, PartyPosse said:

If it was money then yes what he did was smart in terms of leverage. If it was a legitimate gripe against the team and it’s medical staff and he was determined to never play for the team again then no, he screwed himself.  The proof is in the pudding.

How did Trent screw himself? He wants to get off the team, and he has done everything he needs to make that happen as soon as possible. He held out for half the season waiting for a trade, and when the team was stupid enough to not do that, he still made sure this year counts to his contract. What could he have done better?

[Renegade7]

5 minutes ago, goskins10 said:

 

So now we are equating murder with football? Are you kidding me? Dude you need to get a grip. It's football! Nothing but football!!

 

I am not pissed - just astounded at the whining and ****ing about a guy doing what he thinks is right and not without risk. You guys act like this is all a bed of roses for him. He is leaving money on the table and accruing fines if the team so chooses to levy them. 

 

Your overthinking my point, the CBA doesnt allows this at all. And dude is already a multi-millionaire, this isnt like you or me giving up two months worth of pay because we hate our boss and coming back to still get paid millions more.

[PartyPosse]

11 minutes ago, goskins10 said:

 

So? It's his business. Let me rephrase since you want to change the conversation - He did it when he felt he had best leverage. Did he? Who knows. I don't actually care one bit. My point is people need to stop whining about WHEN he did it. He did when he did it - up to him and the bottom line is the team had plenty of time to work things out. Their arrogance and ignorance is what kept them from doing that. 

Of course it’s his business, but in terms of leverage, if he wanted off this team he should have aired his grievances at the beginning of the offseason. He lost a ton of his leverage waiting so long and, from what I gather, being very vague about what he wants/why he’s upset. He had a better chance of getting his wish fulfilled earlier than later. Before the draft would have been optimal for him because the team could have recouped picks, reassessed the draft etc. instead he made it personal and thus so did Bruce.

[Renegade7]

7 minutes ago, megared said:

 

There is no plan.  

 

And what makes you think Trent has a plan?  Again, what the redskins have or havent done doesnt give Trent the go ahead to meet them halfway.  This is indefensible, you jus okay with it because you think the front office is worse they both suck here.

[PartyPosse]

2 minutes ago, NickyJ said:

How did Trent screw himself? He wants to get off the team, and he has done everything he needs to make that happen as soon as possible. He held out for half the season waiting for a trade, and when the team was stupid enough to not do that, he still made sure this year counts to his contract. What could he have done better?

because there’s a better chance he would have had his demand of being traded met earlier in the offseason before free agency and the draft. Nothing about it come out until much much later. What did the team know? No one knows but I still imagine they would have address tackle at the draft had they known.

[goskins10]

2 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

Your overthinking my point, the CBA doesnt allows this at all. And dude is already a multi-millionaire, this isnt like you or me giving up two months worth of pay because we hate our boss and coming back to still get paid millions more.

 

Not overthink it at all. Just totally disagree with your take . I think you are flat out wrong to be complaining about him and what he has done. What he did has consequences and he is willing to pay them. That's on him. More importantly, you keep ignoring that the team could have gotten themselves out of this and arrogantly choose not to. This is on them. 

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

@Renegade7 It’s a bit odd, coming from a guy that feels so terribly about the guys in charge in Ashburn, that you don’t enjoy seeing Trent put their ****show on blast.  You fully recognize how downright terrible and embarrassing these guys are and Trents making them look even worse, on a national stage.  This is basically more free pub for what you want to accomplish.

 

 

[goskins10]

4 minutes ago, PartyPosse said:

Of course it’s his business, but in terms of leverage, if he wanted off this team he should have aired his grievances at the beginning of the offseason. He lost a ton of his leverage waiting so long and, from what I gather, being very vague about what he wants/why he’s upset. He had a better chance of getting his wish fulfilled earlier than later. Before the draft would have been optimal for him because the team could have recouped picks, reassessed the draft etc. instead he made it personal and thus so did Bruce.

 

No, you and the fans are making it personal. And again, I could care less if it gave him more or less leverage. That is the whole point. I don't care, though I think you are incredibly wrong. The Tunsil deal is proof of that. The team is inept and keeps proving it. They could have turned this into at least some sort of positive. But instead they have taken the worst path possible - again. 

[megared]

2 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

And what makes you think Trent has a plan?  Again, what the redskins have or havent done doesnt give Trent the go ahead to meet them halfway.  This is indefensible, you jus okay with it because you think the front office is worse they both suck here.

 

Trent has done everything, by the book, to a tee.  He hasn't uttered one negative word about the team, or even appeared in the press during his holdout.  He's done exactly what he should, to exert the maximum leverage available to him to get off the team.  (I'd even argue he should've gone public earlier)

[Renegade7]

6 minutes ago, goskins10 said:

 

Not overthink it at all. Just totally disagree with your take . I think you are flat out wrong to be complaining about him and what he has done. What he did has consequences and he is willing to pay them. That's on him. More importantly, you keep ignoring that the team could have gotten themselves out of this and arrogantly choose not to. This is on them. 

 

I'm not ignoring what they should've done I've repeatedly said I'm not defending them.  I'm making clear I wont defend either of them, I dont care, I dont support holdouts to get what you want because I dont want other players doing it.  This is bigger then them

[Coopskin44]

2 minutes ago, goskins10 said:

 

No, you and the fans are making it personal. And again, I could care less if it gave him more or less leverage. That is the whole point. I don't care, though I think you are incredibly wrong. The Tunsil deal is proof of that. The team is inept and keeps proving it. They could have turned this into at least some sort of positive. But instead they have taken the worst path possible - again. 

         What are you talking about?Were close and the culture is good !

[PartyPosse]

1 minute ago, goskins10 said:

 

No, you and the fans are making it personal. And again, I could care less if it gave him more or less leverage. That is the whole point. I don't care, though I think you are incredibly wrong. The Tunsil deal is proof of that. The team is inept and keeps proving it. They could have turned this into at least some sort of positive. But instead they have taken the worst path possible - again. 

Dude, I was only responding to your “leverage” comment about doing it when he felt he had the best leverage. Chill. All im stating is if he truly wanted out as soon as possible he should have said something at the beginning of the offseason. Instead it toiled and when it finally came out, because it was so vague the team did due diligence in trying to convince him to reconsider. If he said something earlier, then by the time the Tunsil trade came along the team may have been exhausted in their attempt to keep him and may have been more open to moving on.

 

And If you don’t think it’s personal between Trent and Bruce now then I don’t know what to tell you. Trent obviously had an issue with how he was treated by the medical staff and Bruce obviously took it personally that Trent just decided to wave a middle finger to the team after free agency and the draft. It’s pretty clear.

[Renegade7]

5 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

@Renegade7 It’s a bit odd, coming from a guy that feels so terribly about the guys in charge in Ashburn, that you don’t enjoy seeing Trent put their ****show on blast.  You fully recognize how downright terrible and embarrassing these guys are and Trents making them look even worse, on a national stage.  This is basically more free pub for what you want to accomplish.

 

Because it hurts people that have nothing to do with this, like Haskins.  Does it help my cause, yes, but at a cost and in the sphere of a bigger picture.

7 minutes ago, megared said:

 

Trent has done everything, by the book, to a tee.  He hasn't uttered one negative word about the team, or even appeared in the press during his holdout.  He's done exactly what he should, to exert the maximum leverage available to him to get off the team.  (I'd even argue he should've gone public earlier)

 

If he had come out and said this is what I want, this is why I'm doing this, himself, this would be a different conversation.  This is not by the book, he has not said what he wants other then he doesnt want to be here and even that is through other people.  This is not by the book, what book are you going from?

[PartyPosse]

At the end of the day, neither Trent nor Bruce did what they did for the sake of the team. They can both go **** themselves. They might both still be a part of the organization but I consider neither to be a redskin.

[goskins10]

8 minutes ago, PartyPosse said:

Dude, I was only responding to your “leverage” comment about doing it when he felt he had the best leverage. Chill. All im stating is if he truly wanted out as soon as possible he should have said something at the beginning of the offseason. Instead it toiled and when it finally came out, because it was so vague the team did due diligence in trying to convince him to reconsider. If he said something earlier, then by the time the Tunsil trade came along the team may have been exhausted in their attempt to keep him and may have been more open to moving on.

 

And If you don’t think it’s personal between Trent and Bruce now then I don’t know what to tell you. Trent obviously had an issue with how he was treated by the medical staff and Bruce obviously took it personally that Trent just decided to wave a middle finger to the team after free agency and the draft. It’s pretty clear.

 

Yes, I made it clear that was NOT the point. I even rephrased it. But you wanted to continue talking about it. It may be personal between them and likely is so I should not have said no - but instead that additionally some of you fans are taking personal - way too personal. 

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

1 hour ago, sempre_victrix said:

 

I don't believe a word that DHall says.  He hasn't gotten a single thing right tin this debacle.

 

TW would not play a down the rest of the season.  His greedy butt can sit there in sweats and watch the game as he grows older.

It was Hall who said that Trent would come back eventually to get vested.  Some said he wouldn’t.  Hall actually was the dude who broke the story that Trent came back.

 

Don’t care though what people think of Hall so if people want to aim some anger his way all the same to me.

[PartyPosse]

1 minute ago, goskins10 said:

 

Yes, I made it clear that was NOT the point. I even rephrased it. But you wanted to continue talking about it. It may be personal between them and likely is so I should not have said no - but instead that additionally some of you fans are taking personal - way too personal. 

 

 

Maybe. I couldn’t care less about either of em. Sounds like you’re angrier than most.

[mrcaniac]

13 minutes ago, SoCalSkins said:

Not if it’s treated as a player conduct issue. That’s my point. You need to suspend him for his conduct and better yet get the NFL suspend him. Then it’s game over. I’m sure the NFL doesn’t want a nonsense precedent if Trent is able to fake injury and sit for 8 games.

 

Except this is a contract/money issue. Those always go to arbitration.

 

Much like if Trent felt that he was treated poorly by the medical staff, or that they denied him treatment, then he should have filed a grievance with the union.