SkinsHokieFan Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 In a 20 season stretch from 1972 to 1991, the Washington Redskins won 3 Superbowls, 5 NFC Titles, 6 NFC East championships and had 11 playoff appearances. The team also appeared in 6 NFC Championship games The franchise had 13 seasons with at least 10 wins, including 6 seasons with at least 11 wins. In that 20 season stretch, the Redskins had 1 season with 10 losses (1980) and only 2 losing seasons (1980 and 1988) and 0 last place finished The 20 season stretch under Dan Snyder has had 0 Superbowl wins, 0 NFC Titles, 3 NFC East titles, 5 playoff appearances and 2 playoff wins. The team has had 8 seasons with at least 10 losses, including 6 seasons with at least 11 losses The team has had 8 last place finishes in the NFC East It is very clear the franchise is totally dead under Dan Snyder. Forget Superbowl wins, or NFC Championships, 7-9 or 8-8 is the best this team will ever do so long as Dan Snyder is the owner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smooters Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 Thanks, Obama. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 1 hour ago, SkinsHokieFan said: ...7-9 or 8-8 is the best this team will ever do so long as Dan Snyder is the owner. I'm not sure what this sentence means lol... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bakedtater1 Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 Yep even the 20 year olds know the hell we've been through thanks.. can we squeeze in three more threads on this dumpster fire? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CjSuAvE22 Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 Damn my fandom has been all of the 20 years of hell literally my first real memory was mark rypien on his last legs basically about to get sacked and somehow getting pitchjng ball outta his hands vs the giants literally couldnt throw more than ten yards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreatBuzz Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 How do we rank total W/L over Snyders tenure compared to the league? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hail2skins Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 1 minute ago, TheGreatBuzz said: How do we rank total W/L over Snyders tenure compared to the league? I seem to recall checking that a few months ago, maybe before this season, and we were tied for like 6th worst record in the league over during his tenure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreatBuzz Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 3 minutes ago, hail2skins said: I seem to recall checking that a few months ago, maybe before this season, and we were tied for like 6th worst record in the league over during his tenure. I'm sure there is an easier way to figure it out than adding up each teams record during that period. I just dont know how. Some excel sheet or something could do it I bet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hail2skins Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 I should start by saying I'm thankful that my Redskins fandom started in the early 70s and was able to fully enjoy the glory years of the 80s and early 90s. That probably does wonders in keeping me as a somewhat devoted fan who will watch every game and can't fathom abandoning at least my interest in the Redskins and openly rooting for another team. That said, sometimes I wonder what my attitude would be like if the Skins "glory years" had happened in like the 50s/60s before I was born. Sort of like the Browns and Lions. Now, I'm sure that every team honors its past heroes to some extent. But I wonder if the Browns and Lions consantly show highlights of Jim Brown and Bobby Layne on their scoreboards. I don't know why, but the hanging on to the 1980s just rubs me the wrong way a bit. Yesterday, all the social media pictures of Joe Gibbs at the stadium. God........just stop!! I really wish this organization would move forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulSkin Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 This was from before this season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelvin Bryant Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 Interesting post. Did you happen to check on how many playoff wins the Skins had during those first 20 years? I'm pretty sure Gibbs I was 15-6. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Springfield Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 I was arguing this exact subject with a coworker earlier today. His argument was that the Redskins have traditionally been a mediocre team, it was simply Gibbs propping the up in between decades of mediocrity. Gibbs owns all the Super Bowl hardware and all of the Super Bowl appearances except one. He argued that Sonny Jurgenson, regraded as an all time great for the Redskins, led teams that were mainly mediocre. I argued that the only period of the NFL era that matters is the Super Bowl era and they were standouts in that regard until Cooke died. Sonny Jurgenson and Sammy Baugh are ****ing nobodies to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hail2skins Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 15 minutes ago, Kelvin Bryant said: Interesting post. Did you happen to check on how many playoff wins the Skins had during those first 20 years? I'm pretty sure Gibbs I was 15-6. I got 16-5 with Gibbs 1 and 2-5 with Allen. 5 minutes ago, Springfield said: I argued that the only period of the NFL era that matters is the Super Bowl era and they were standouts in that regard until Cooke died. Sonny Jurgenson and Sammy Baugh are ****ing nobodies to me. I tend to agree, I don't really care about an era I wasn't alive for. I think Sonny's capabilities made the Redskins at least an exciting team to watch in the late 60s, before injuries derailed him once Allen got here. And I don't mind Sonny's media presence all these years. On George Michael's Redskins Report, he would consistently pick the Redskins to win, no matter who they were playing, but in a less obnoxious way than Larry Michael. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
profusion Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 12 minutes ago, Springfield said: I argued that the only period of the NFL era that matters is the Super Bowl era... Why would that be? I've always found this notion to be rubbish. Nothing magically changed just because the NFL agreed to start playing a season-ending game against the AFL in 1967. If anything, the emergence of the AFL in 1960 watered down the rosters by adding more teams competing for pro talent and by coaxing the NFL to expand even before the merger. NFL teams in 1959 were probably better top to bottom than they were in 1969. Football has changed a lot over the decades, but it has arguably changed more since 2000 than in the five decades before that. It's just as valid to argue that "the only period that matters" in pro football for comparison purposes is the 21st Century due to the rules tipping the game in favor of the offense. The constant changes have made the game a better TV viewing experience, but they make it difficult to compare players across eras. Nevertheless, tackling is tackling, blocking is blocking, and much of the basics of the game are just as they were 60-70 years ago. I recommend learning about the history of the game, and you might gain new respect for "nobodies" like Jurgensen and Baugh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hail2skins Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 9 minutes ago, profusion said: I recommend learning about the history of the game, and you might gain new respect for "nobodies" like Jurgensen and Baugh. Profusion, I agree that Baugh and Jurgy were great players for the Skins and historically should be recognized as such. I think what Springfield was trying to say was more along the lines of when people argue that "well, so what that the past 25 years have been bad for the Redskins? The 25 years prior to the arrival of George Allen were bad too." As to historically excuse our most recent quarter-century of woe. Well, true........but I personally wasn't alive for those years. The period prior to the early 1970s is pretty much irrelevant to me in so far as how the team did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbs Hog Heaven Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 I’m just fortunate that I, like the OP, grew up through the glory days when a 10 win season was disected in panic to see what went wrong! I have my memories that nobody cam ever take away from me from being a World Champion. Something I’m completely at peace with to never seeing again in my lifetime. Hail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morneblade Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 2 minutes ago, Gibbs Hog Heaven said: I’m just fortunate that I, like the OP, grew up through the glory days when a 10 win season was disected in panic to see what went wrong! I have my memories that nobody cam ever take away from me from being a World Champion. Something I’m completely at peace with to never seeing again in my lifetime. Hail. Sad, but true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
profusion Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 5 minutes ago, hail2skins said: Profusion, I agree that Baugh and Jurgy were great players for the Skins and historically should be recognized as such. I think what Springfield was trying to say was more along the lines of when people argue that "well, so what that the past 25 years have been bad for the Redskins? The 25 years prior to the arrival of George Allen were bad too." As to historically excuse our most recent quarter-century of woe. Well, true........but I personally wasn't alive for those years. The period prior to the early 1970s is pretty much irrelevant to me in so far as how the team did. Those are good points, and I get that's where Springfield was coming from. However, I think it's always valuable to see the big picture. I'm lucky to have had parents who remembered the pre-George Allen Redskins (they even knew a couple players, like Scooter Scudero). The team was a big deal then and very popular, despite the losing and and that George Preston Marshall was arguably as bad an owner as Snyder or even worse. It's entirely valid to compare Snyder's reign of error across the broad sweep of the team's history, and all it takes is a little basic Googling to do so. Those of us who grew up in the '70s and '80s (one of my earliest memories is watching Super Bowl VII on TV) have a certain perspective on the team, but it's not the entire picture. Understanding that picture helps explain why it's far from "inevitable" that the Skins should be a premier franchise. Perhaps Snyder (about my age) might have acted a little differently if he understood that JKC's era of excellence wasn't just by accident. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 For me, knowing about more than just the last 20 or so years helps put what we're experiencing now in better perspective. And not just from the perspective of "Look how far we've fallen"... Fans here on ES get up in arms about RG3 versus Cousins? Hell, this franchise had "I like Sonny" and "I like Billy" bumper stickers all over the damn place back when I first started watching the Skins (I preferred Billy Kilmer and his wounded duck throws for the record lol). Think guys like Desean Jackson skipping the first several days of voluntary OTAs is a big deal and shows how little control the coach has over the team? Back in the 70s and 80s writers didn't even want to cover OTAs because like 30% of the players didn't show up lol...and nobody wrote negative articles about players because of it. Think Snyder is personally an asshole and a bad person? Jack Kent Cooke was arguably a worse person, we just didn't have twitter filling us in on every single aspect of his life back then, whether factual or speculation masquerading as "fact." Upset Gruden cut Swearinger? Gibbs almost cut Bostic. Think FedEx sucks? RFK Stadium was an absolute dump, but the location and the constant winning made up for it. If the Skins during the 80s had been averaging 6 or 7 wins a season, trust me, that stadium would have been considered an absolute embarrassment. Think Scot M's early-round draft picks have been mediocre? Go back and check Beathard's cringe-worthy run of pathetic 1st and 2nd rounders in the mid to late 80s. When you live through 5 decades of Redskins football--or just NFL football, period--you realize how little most of the things fans obsess over now actually matter in terms of winning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
profusion Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 23 minutes ago, Califan007 said: When you live through 5 decades of Redskins football--or just NFL football, period--you realize how little most of the things fans obsess over now actually matter in terms of winning. True, and social and mass media put the team under a much more powerful microscope than in the past. The Redskins had all kinds of crazy history before George Allen arrived. --The team's first star and Hall of Famer, Cliff Battles, retired after the 1937 championship because George Marshall wouldn't give him a raise despite paying newcomer Sammy Baugh a lot more money. --The Redskins' famous 73-0 loss in the 1940 championship game occurred after Marshall publicly called the Bears "crybabies and quitters." Sammy Baugh thought some of his teammates might have been trying to throw the game to spite Marshall, but no one ever backed up Baugh's theory. Can you imagine if things like that happened now? Also, the private lives of athletes were just that, private. Football players were expected to be a bunch of crazy goobers and no one batted an eye when they behaved badly. The Oakland Raiders dynasty in the '70s was built on an entire of roster of guys who'd probably be on the commissioner's exempt list now. The Steel Curtain was built on steroids. I'm not saying that was a better time, just that things were different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 2 minutes ago, profusion said: Also, the private lives of athletes were just that, private. Football players were expected to be a bunch of crazy goobers and no one batted an eye when they behaved badly. The Oakland Raiders dynasty in the '70s was built on an entire of roster of guys who'd probably be on the commissioner's exempt list now. The Steel Curtain was built on steroids. I'm not saying that was a better time, just that things were different. 1 Amen to all of that lol... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dancing Bear Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 1972-1991 vs 1999-2018 (20 years of glory vs 20 years of hell); In other words the late Edward Bennett Williams and Jack Kent Cooke vs Daniel Snyder. No doubt old school all the way!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corcaigh Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 It's not all Snyder's fault. When I moved to this country in November 1996 the Redskins had a 7-1 record. They finished the season 9-7 and missed the playoffs. In 1997 they missed the playoffs again with a 8-7-1 record. In 1998 they missed the playoffs with a 6-10 record. In 1999 Snyder acquired the team and they actually won the division with a 10-6 record. So I like to think I have some fault in the fall of the Redskins. But Danny deserves most of the credit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carex Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 what irriates me about this is it just dismisses 92 through 98 so you can focus on Snyder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hail2skins Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 6 minutes ago, carex said: what irriates me about this is it just dismisses 92 through 98 so you can focus on Snyder I think its fair enough to recognize that the Redskins were bad record-wise in the six seasons between Gibbs 1 and Snyder. However, that six seasons is less than a third of Snyder's tenure of owner. The Redskins record over that 20-year span has basically equalled out to exactly 7-9 per season. Which doesn't seem so bad. But then you look at the overall win totals of every team, and the Redskins are still in the bottom quarter of the league in terms of wins. Maybe they can make up some of ground (they crept closer to the totals of the 49ers, Bucs, and Cardinals this season), but it highlights that, in a salary-cap league which pretty much is designed for teams to average 8-8 over time, the Skins have fallen well short of that......by 20 overall games, at least, under his tenure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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