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2017 ES GM's Mock Draft is now in the books. FULL details in the OP.

Gibbs Hog Heaven

By Gibbs Hog Heaven
in The Stadium

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RemoveSnyder

RemoveSnyder

Posted
Posted

Fine, skip him. People, don't be coming in here playin' switch. One thumb in your mouth the other in your ...

 

Seriously, how could any person say with a straight face that the current format for drafting is any bit better than an open window format for undrafted?

 

Seriously. Right now we are waiting 6, 8, for me -- even 10 hours before we can pick. What's more, this is the 2nd or 3rd time in recent picks folks have picked someone already selected. 

 

In the open window format, the last 6 hours, folks could have come in and claimed a dude and been done for the day all while we waited for Z to come in and do a true clownshoes jig. 

 

Oh Lord. 

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Wildbunny

Wildbunny

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5 minutes ago, Monk4thaHALL said:

Fine, skip him. People, don't be coming in here playin' switch. One thumb in your mouth the other in your ...

For all I know, when you make your pick, the next team is on the clock.

If your pick has already been taken doesn't change the fact that you made your pick.

At least I remember us doing it this way the preceeding years...

 

So, it's up to the commissioner, but to me the Rams are now on the clock if I'm not mistaken...

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PokerPacker

PokerPacker

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Posted
1 minute ago, Monk4thaHALL said:

Fine, skip him. People, don't be coming in here playin' switch. One thumb in your mouth the other in your ...

 

Seriously, how could any person say with a straight face that the current format for drafting is any bit better than an open window format for undrafted?

 

Seriously. Right now we are waiting 6, 8, for me -- even 10 hours before we can pick. What's more, this is the 2nd or 3rd time in recent picks folks have picked someone already selected. 

 

In the open window format, the last 6 hours, folks could have come in and claimed a dude and been done for the day all while we waited for Z to come in and do a true clownshoes jig. 

 

Oh Lord. 

The difference is that the draft actually works this way for the most part (but on a much tighter time scale) while free agency deals with actually talking to players/agents and coming to an agreement.  UDFAs are a negotiation, so pigeonholing in some draft-like mechanic to it does nothing to actually simulate it.

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Gibbs Hog Heaven

Gibbs Hog Heaven

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3 minutes ago, Wildbunny said:

For all I know, when you make your pick, the next team is on the clock.

If your pick has already been taken doesn't change the fact that you made your pick.

At least I remember us doing it this way the preceeding years...

 

So, it's up to the commissioner, but to me the Rams are now on the clock if I'm not mistaken...

 

 

These French are TOUGH! Geez. 

 

You can't make a pick if there's no player to pick. Let's be fair. 

 

Hail. 

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RemoveSnyder

RemoveSnyder

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11 minutes ago, PokerPacker said:

The difference is that the draft actually works this way for the most part (but on a much tighter time scale) while free agency deals with actually talking to players/agents and coming to an agreement.  UDFAs are a negotiation, so pigeonholing in some draft-like mechanic to it does nothing to actually simulate it.

 

Then how could one accurately simulate it? Not at all is the answer. 

 

So far I haven't seen anyone suggest a format that would not only incentivize UDFA, but also make it a competition between the GMs. 

 

 

The open window format uses first come first served as the tool to 'simulate' negotiation tactics. In lieu of actually being able to negotiate with a player, the determining factor between two GMs going after the same guy is based upon who got there first. 

 

That's the most equitable notion I've come up with. You are free to make one up yourself and present it. 

 

 

The only alternative being presented is that any GM/poster so inclined can post their laundry list of guys they like in UDFA. That's nice, but I'm not going to waste my time responding to someone telling them that the player they'd like to look into is actually going to be working landscaping next fall. 

 

And if that laundry list format is an attempt to spark anything other than a handful of posts along the line of ... "hey yeah, I like that guy too," I'm not sure what else it adds, if anything. 

 

 

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tibbidoe

tibbidoe

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2 minutes ago, Monk4thaHALL said:

 

And if that laundry list format is an attempt to spark anything other than a handful of posts along the line of ... "hey yeah, I like that guy too," I'm not sure what else it adds, if anything. 

 

 

 

What if each GM did their own laundry list of top-10 UDFA available, and that was just tacked onto each draft haul and taken into consideration when looking back 3-4 drafts from now? Each guy would likely have made whatever impact they were going to make by then, same as any drafted player, for the most part.

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Wildbunny

Wildbunny

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Well we've been on this for quite some time and lots of us spend lots of hours studying guys trying to separate those that are worth draftable with those that aren't.

 

I'll find it tough to go on for a few hours/days to add guys that we'll have trouble to argue over with in any way...

 

This whole thread is just here for the fun of it. No matter how you do it, going with UDFA doesn't add much fun to it. In this format, at least, we can compare what we've done with the real one and brags ourselves that we could send our resume to Bruce Allen for the GM's position at Redskins Park.

 

Now, this being said. I'm off for today, and most of tomorrow as well. I'm in charge of my local voting office, so this will take lots of my time (and will be super boring btw). I'll be able to check in at times, but not as much as I'd like too.

Considering we're 6 picks away from my last pick, I'll sent my guy to both @goskins10 and @Gibbs Hog Heaven in case my pick come this night, or tomorrow. I have little doubt @ZRagone will change his pick rather quickly.

I'd love to make my last pick myself, and hopefully my guy won't be taken before 240, but that's the best if we want to have a shot at closing this by tomorrow.

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RemoveSnyder

RemoveSnyder

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Nah, attributing anything via laundry list is lazy, imo. 

 

The only way to give a GM credit is if he/she actually stands up and posts before someone else, "this is my #1 guy." 

 

And if said guy does something in the NFL of note, the GM who saw the talent and made it here before someone else would get the credit. Laundry list does nothing but say I like that guy over there. 

 

In real life, the GM who convinces the UDFA to come to his team, not someone else's, reaps the benefits of his ability. The other 31 GMs who also wanted that player and tried unsuccessfully, they don't get credit points for saying "I liked him."

 

If the UDFA goes on to have a HOF career, the one GM who got him gets the reflected glory while standing on the podium hoisting the Lombardi trophy. The other 31 GMs who liked the UDFA, they get to tell their story while standing in queue at McDonalds. 

 

There can be only one. 

 

 

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PokerPacker

PokerPacker

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1 minute ago, Monk4thaHALL said:

 

Then how could one accurately simulate it? Not at all is the answer. 

 

So far I haven't seen anyone suggest a format that would not only incentivize UDFA, but also make it a competition between the GMs. 

 

The only alternative being presented is that any GM/poster so inclined can post their laundry list of guys they like in UDFA. That's nice, but I'm not going to waste my time responding to someone telling them that the player they'd like to look into is actually going to be working landscaping next fall. 

 

And if that laundry list format is an attempt to spark anything other than a handful of posts along the line of ... "hey yeah, I like that guy too," I'm not sure what else it adds, if anything. 

 

 

It can't be simulated, which is why I have zero interest in participating in any kind of UDFA player selection.  If you wanna show your scouting prowess, put up a list of names of some guys who went undrafted and what you like about them and why they'll make someone's roster.

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RemoveSnyder

RemoveSnyder

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Just now, PokerPacker said:

It can't be simulated, which is why I have zero interest in participating in any kind of UDFA player selection.  If you wanna show your scouting prowess, put up a list of names of some guys who went undrafted and what you like about them and why they'll make someone's roster.

 

No. :)

 

*



The open window format uses first come first served as the tool to 'simulate' negotiation tactics. In lieu of actually being able to negotiate with a player, the determining factor between two GMs going after the same guy is based upon who got there first. 

 

That's the most equitable notion I've come up with. You are free to make one up yourself and present it.

 

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RemoveSnyder

RemoveSnyder

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2 minutes ago, skinfan2k said:

You could give everyone a fake amount of money and then bid on free agents.  Like pick 10-15 really good UDFAs and have a 12 hour auction and then the team with the highest offer takes him.

 

Yeah sure. That's at least an idea. 

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ZRagone

ZRagone

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1 hour ago, Monk4thaHALL said:

Already selected.

 

 

 

Crap, really? I even searched through and didn't think he was taken. Damnit, my bad! I was trying to make the pick quick before I had to pull things out of the oven for dinner

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Gibbs Hog Heaven

Gibbs Hog Heaven

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3 minutes ago, Monk4thaHALL said:

 

Ok, time to move on from Z, I think. 

 

Let's get onto the next. 

@styx491

 

You're up. 

 
 

 

Play nice Mr Monk. 

 

1 minute ago, ZRagone said:

 

Crap, really? I even searched through and didn't think he was taken. Damnit, my bad! I was trying to make the pick quick before I had to pull things out of the oven for dinner

 
 

 

Philly made the brilliantly inspired take his last pick for great value 3 picks back. 

 

Hail. 

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Reaper Skins

Reaper Skins

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If it was up to me, I'd make UFA a one and done thing for the "best of the rest"  Basically just give every team one slot to say "I can't believe this guy didn't get drafted, I bet someone will pick him up on draft day".  Make it separate from your team specific needs and just go on straight talent

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ZRagone

ZRagone

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My apologies on the screw up folks. Was rushing and clearly looked at things wrong. My fault! Thanks to those being patient about the whole thing. If it wasn't for those that are understanding of the realities of peoples lives in this thing, I wouldn't have bothered to even tried to jump in here in the middle of cooking dinner for family to make a pick and would've just took advantage of the time limit.  Also, haven't been a fan of the UDFA notion anyways, and given the attitude regarding it right now, count me as a GM that's got zero interest in dealing with it regardless of what the format is.

 

Kansas City will go with Josh Malone, Wide Receiver, Tennessee. 

 

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