The immigration thread: American Melting Pot or Get off my Lawn

[Event_Horizon]

Wait I thought you were "out"????

 

I am.  I apologize to the liberal civics party going on in here.  I just do not see the world in rainbows and unicorn utopia as many of you obviously do.

 

Plus, I was defending myself a bit.  I should have known better.

[The 12th Commandment]

You are a good person Zguy.

Looks like my "point" wasn't as poorly stated as you thought KAOskins?

touche

[Zguy28]

Sorry, I do not believe you for a second and think you are just trying to make new liberal friends after the some of the things you post.

 

I wouldn't take any darn nonsense into my home. EVER. Period.  Guess that makes me a bad Catholic, but I will live to see next Christmas and keep my family safe.

Believe what you want. You're entitled to it. But know this, I do what I do because my Savior died for me and took my sin and wrath upon Himself. So when I have a chance to show mercy and love, like He showed me (the worst of sinners), I do it. My safety doesn't factor in. Peace.

Edited November 19, 2015 by Zguy28

[Event_Horizon]

Believe what you want. You're entitled to it. But know this, I do what I do because my Savior died for me and took my sin and wrath upon Himself. So when I have a chance to show mercy and love, like He showed me (the worst of sinners), I do it. My safety doesn't factor in. Peace.

 

I respect that but I still think you are full of ****.

[No Excuses]

I just do not see the world in rainbows and unicorn utopia as many of you obviously do.

 

There is plenty of evidence that the US refugee vetting process is robust and excellent. It's not "rainbows and unicorns". It's called stats and facts.

 

Always amusing to see the super patriots who apparently don't give a **** about the things that actually do make this country as great as it is. Systems that are in place that work really really well.

Edited November 19, 2015 by No Excuses

[Predicto]

When the dust settles from this debacle, I don't think you're going to be able to overstate just how damaging the last few days have been to the Republican brand.

 

 

Sadly, I disagree.   Appealing to populist fear, ignorance and xenophobia historically has been a rather successful electoral strategy.   

[rictus58]

Sorry, I do not believe you for a second and think you are just trying to make new liberal friends after the some of the things you post.

 

I wouldn't take any darn nonsense into my home. EVER. Period.  Guess that makes me a bad Catholic, but I will live to see next Christmas and keep my family safe.

It does. No doubt. You're turning your back on one of the key tennants of the faith.

 

 

If the left had any balls, they'd use this as an opportunity to hold the Rights feet to the fire and put forth bills to help the poor, the homeless, and the veterans. Make the right put their money where there mouth it.

Edited November 19, 2015 by rictus58

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

Sadly, I disagree.   Appealing to populist fear, ignorance and xenophobia historically has been a rather successful electoral strategy.   

 

I have to say the fascinating thing about Trump is how openly and willingly he has been exploiting these fears. I mean, not even Pat Buchanan would really have the balls to call for shutting down mosques. There has largely been a certain level of restraint in these tactics since the 60s. Code words and such. Trump doesn't play that game. It's somewhat refreshing - even if it is completely terrifying.

[Event_Horizon]

It does. No doubt. You're turning your back on one of the key tennants of the faith.

 

 

And many others Sir

[MattFancy]

I have to say the fascinating thing about Trump is how openly and willingly he has been exploiting these fears. I mean, not even Pat Buchanan would really have the balls to call for shutting down mosques. There has largely been a certain level of restraint in these tactics since the 60s. Code words and such. Trump doesn't play that game. It's somewhat refreshing - even if it is completely terrifying.

 

Um, now he wants to put all Muslim Americans in database so they can be tracked. Any other person would be getting crushed in polls for what he says. For some reason, the dumber **** he says, the better his numbers look. It's really scary.

[Predicto]

I have to say the fascinating thing about Trump is how openly and willingly he has been exploiting these fears. I mean, not even Pat Buchanan would really have the balls to call for shutting down mosques. There has largely been a certain level of restraint in these tactics since the 60s. Code words and such. Trump doesn't play that game. It's somewhat refreshing - even if it is completely terrifying.

 

Well why do you think he is so popular?   

 

He is a expression of the dark and selfish Id of the American psyche.  

[RVAbrendan]

I wouldn't take any darn nonsense into my home. EVER. Period. 

 

People fleeing war are darn nonsense? That's pretty deplorable.

 

I just can't understand folks who assume that if you're of the Islamic faith, you are an immediate threat. There are 1.6 billion followers in the world. ISIS is such a minuscule percentage of that number.

 

Your reaction to this is exactly what ISIS wants. They want a clear drawn war between the West and Islam. Good job buying in.

[Zguy28]

Um, now he wants to put all Muslim Americans in database so they can be tracked. Any other person would be getting crushed in polls for what he says. For some reason, the dumber **** he says, the better his numbers look. It's really scary.

Actually from what I read he was asked if he would like that and his response was not that.

 

 

Washington (CNN)Donald Trump isn't ruling out requiring all Muslims living in the U.S. to register in a national database to protect the country against terrorism.

 

Trump, who also said this week that he would consider shutting down mosques, said in an interview with Yahoo News published Thursday that "we're going to have to look at a lot of things very closely" when asked about a national database for Muslims.

 

http://edition.cnn.com/2015/11/19/politics/donald-trump-barack-obama-threat-to-country/index.html

 

One needs to be careful that one doesn't perpetuate the fear mongering they rail against by exaggerating.

Edited November 19, 2015 by Zguy28

[rictus58]

People fleeing war are darn nonsense? That's pretty deplorable.

 

I just can't understand folks who assume that if you're of the Islamic faith, you are an immediate threat. There are 1.6 billion followers in the world. ISIS is such a minuscule percentage of that number.

 

Your reaction to this is exactly what ISIS wants. They want a clear drawn war between the West and Islam. Good job buying in.

did you not get the memo?

It's perfectly ok to believe all Muslims are terrorists based upon a small sample size. .

It's not ok to think all Cops are bad based on a small sample size.

 

i've never seen a group of people so willingly embrace their hypocrisy.

[Predicto]

Actually from what I read he was asked if he would like that and his response was not that.

 

 

http://edition.cnn.com/2015/11/19/politics/donald-trump-barack-obama-threat-to-country/index.html

 

One needs to be careful that one doesn't perpetuate the fear mongering they rail against by exaggerating.

 

 

Point taken.

 

But to be honest, there is so much reprehensible **** flying around these days that it's hard to keep up.  I think I broke Google.

[MattFancy]

Actually from what I read he was asked if he would like that and his response was not that.

 

 

http://edition.cnn.com/2015/11/19/politics/donald-trump-barack-obama-threat-to-country/index.html

 

One needs to be careful that one doesn't perpetuate the fear mongering they rail against by exaggerating.

 

So maybe he doesn't "want" to, but he sure as hell didn't say he didn't want to.

[Going Commando]

Sadly, I disagree.   Appealing to populist fear, ignorance and xenophobia historically has been a rather successful electoral strategy.   

I don't now, so many GoP elected officials in so many different places are making statements of overt bigotry that can not be walked back or spun. Eventually people are going to calm down. And you've got generations of the electorate that were already suspicious of the GoP getting to witness the GoP show its racist ass in the shrillest of ways. This is going to be remembered as the GoP's insane moment where they wanted to bring back the days of Japanese internment camps and McCarthyism. Ugly, craven nativism is not acceptable to a majority of the electorate any more. The country is soooo much more diverse now.

The GoP is becoming an aging white identity movement that will only win elections in heavily white districts. If it isn't already. You'll see the effect of this over the course of the next generation. But you're also going to see it this election too. They're headed for a 10 point loss in the presidential election and they're going to lose the Senate.

Well why do you think he is so popular?   

 

He is a expression of the dark and selfish Id of the American psyche.

He's popular with about 23 % of Republican primary voters? That doesn't mean he's actually all that popular on a national political scale. But it does mean we get to see where the dumbest ****ing part of our electorate resides.

[Going Commando]

Guys, Event_Horizon is a troll. He said he wanted to see a genocide of Muslims in the Middle East in the Paris thread. Put him on ignore and move on.

[Event_Horizon]

Guys, Event_Horizon is a troll. He said he wanted to see a genocide of Muslims in the Middle East in the Paris thread. Put him on ignore and move on.

 

No, I did not.  

[visionary]

I don't now, so many GoP elected officials in so many different places are making statements of overt bigotry that can not be walked back or spun. Eventually people are going to calm down. And you've got generations of the electorate that were already suspicious of the GoP getting to witness the GoP show its racist ass in the shrillest of ways. This is going to be remembered as the GoP's insane moment where they wanted to bring back the days of Japanese internment camps and McCarthyism. Ugly, craven nativism is not acceptable to a majority of the electorate any more. The country is soooo much more diverse now.

To be fair, a Democrat brought up the Japanese internment camps as supposedly being a good example of what should be done.  Also polls seem to indicate that unfortunately quite a lot of the country is in agreement with the GOP on the refugee issue right now.  I assume that will change as (if) things calm down a bit though.  

 

 

https://twitter.com/markknoller

House votes 289-137 to pass Syrian refugee screening bill. 47 dems joined with nearly all GOPs to pass the bill. Now goes to Senate.

1:57 PM

Edited November 19, 2015 by visionary

[Going Commando]

So this happened: (it's much worse than the headline.)

http://www.politico.com/story/2015/11/syrian-refugees-banned-216037

How does someone that stupid manage to win an election?

Also Mayor Bowers proves the GoP doesn't have a total monopoly on ignorance. My God, how can anyone not know Japanese internment was one of the ugliest and most unjustified moments in our national history? He needs to resign. Someone that ignorant of one of the most serious political lessons in our history is not fit to hold office.

[The Evil Genius]

Something that hasn't been discussed much is how the same GOPers who defended Kim Davis a few months back on the idea of religious freedom are now the same people who want to deny entry to the US for refugees primarily based on their religion.

 

I guess, currently the idea of freedom of religion for the powers that be in the GOP only apply for Christians and some Jews?

Edited November 19, 2015 by The Evil Genius

[HogNose]

[visionary]

http://www.bloombergview.com/articles/2015-11-19/republican-campaign-against-refugees-is-just-beginning

Republican Campaign Against Refugees Is Just Beginning

 

The House passed a bill Thursday to severely restrict the admission of refugees from Syria and Iraq. President Barack Obama has promised to veto it. Behind the scenes, Republicans are preparing several bills that are more drastic, aiming to close American borders to asylum seekers. These measures set up a much longer political battle.

 

The most severe of the Republican proposals would suspend all U.S. government support for resettling refugees in the U.S. and would aim to guard against certain refugees entering the U.S. through the southern border who are suspected of ties to terrorism, designating them “special interest aliens.”

 

The four sponsors said in a press release that all services in the Office of Refugee Resettlement should be suspended, including the health services, legal services and social services “that help refugees become self-sufficient as quickly as possible after their arrival in the United States.”

 

One senior Republican House aide told me that if lawmakers are concerned about radicalization in the U.S., then cutting off refugee resettlement is the most counterproductive step they could take.

Ted Poe, Republican of Texas, has introduced a separate piece of legislation that would change the law to allow governors to refuse admission to refugees the federal government wants to resettle in their states. Twenty-seven governors have come out publicly to say they would refuse new refugees from Syria, but in a conference call this week, top White House officials told governors they did not currently have that right.

 

“Given that more than half of the US states have already indicated their desire to opt out, it is imperative that Congress ensure that our states have this choice,” Poe’s office said in a letter to his colleagues.

The administration has found some unlikely allies. Retired Gen. Jack Keane, a harsh critic of the Obama administration’s Middle East policy, implored Republicans to resist the rhetoric against Muslims and refugees.

 

“Come on, this is America. We can do this right,” he testified. “We are smart enough to bring thousands of people into this country and make sure they are not going to hurt is.”

Edited November 19, 2015 by visionary

[MattFancy]

Something that hasn't been discussed much is how the same GOPers who defended Kim Davis a few months back on the idea of religious freedom are now the same people who want to deny entry to the US for refugees primarily based on their religion.

 

I guess, currently the idea of freedom of religion for the powers that be in the GOP only apply for Christians and some Jews?

 

Religious Freedom to them means they can practice their religion freely, wherever and whenever they want. It doesn't mean people from other religions can do the same.