BR: Jay Gruden Has Mishandled Washington Redskins' Quarterback Situation

[brandymac27]

Meanwhile I cant make my thread about how Pierre Garcon may actually be Jesus. I have stats to back me up and this jabroni has a dumb moron link to idiot crap.

Slow your roll. If you'd have read more than just others comments, you'd understand where i was coming from posting this and my questions about Jay's QB flip flopping decisions,

Btw, BR is not a news source imho. It’s all opinion based, just like all of what us geniuses here do on ES when we start new threads. It's for discussion purposes only. If you can discuss some if the topics in threads on ES, you can discuss this.

[Nuwanda]

OK... I think I get it... Kirk is so painfully bad that we disrespect him by calling him by the wrong name... like me and my painfully bad post.. and callin' me.. StephenSkins... or worse o_0... still I think calling him Curt would be apropos.. Curt - adj - marked by rude or peremptory shortness. Rudely brief.

 

Curt would be too over the top. Grown up folks like "bradboyd80" would catch on too quickly.

[grego]

Gruden messed up bigtime. .... he quickly tossed RG3 under the bus and wanted to move on with Kurt. ....and suddenly you have Gruden suck up to RG3 again.....The guy is just spineless, unloyal. ......but not for this coach who basically quit on him the first chance he got.

 

 

 

 

sorry, what? what did i miss?

[brandymac27]

Meanwhile I cant make my thread about how Pierre Garcon may actually be Jesus.  I have stats to back me up and this jabroni has a dumb moron link to idiot crap.

 

Jabroni lol? More than likely you can't start new threads because you're a Supreme Idiot.

 

Gruden messed up bigtime. I laugh at the people who think that the organization was looking for RG3 to become a pocket passer and that's why they went with Gruden. Then after RG3 went down and Kurt had his little miracle performance that made Gruden believe the hype he quickly tossed RG3 under the bus and wanted to move on with Kurt. Kurt then starts to be who he always was, a terrible QB and suddenly you have Gruden suck up to RG3 again and basically pray to god that he gets healthy ASAP so he can be the franchise QB again. The guy is just spineless, unloyal. Now his future/job is up to RG3. I think RG3 is going to dominate for himself and for this team/franchise but not for this coach who basically quit on him the first chance he got.

 

Unless he goes back to letting RG3 play the way he plays the game and doesn't try to force him to drop back on every down and sit in the pocket because QB's used to do that 50 years ago and the game doesn't evolve at all (such BS), if that's what he wants then Jay needs to go. Plain and simple. RG3 has proven he can dominate, we can win here without Jay. We can't without RG3.

I'm not buying that Jay wants to turn Robert into a pocket passer at all. I think that falls soley on Robert. I think Jay may see that Robert is gonna take a lot more time than expected to develop, and he's losing patience.

[wrecker]

This line of thought is seriously starting to get on my nerves. Look, I get it was not a super impressive game in terms of big plays but for the love of god he had 90 QB rating. I'd rate it as a mediocore day. People need to stop acting like he posted a sub 50 percent completion day with a low QB rating.

But we scored 6 points.....just sayin

[Old Bay]

But we scored 6 points.....just sayin

 

Fumbles in the red zone will do that to you.

[justice98]

This line of thought is seriously starting to get on my nerves. Look, I get it was not a super impressive game in terms of big plays but for the love of god he had 90 QB rating. I'd rate it as a mediocore day. People need to stop acting like he posted a sub 50 percent completion day with a low QB rating.

 

But his Total QBR was only 29.7 in that game, which is a much better measure than the regular QB rating, IMO.  

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

To think we could have hired Seattle or San Fran's o coordinators who have experience developing talent similar in skillset to rg3, but they weren't allen's friends.

We really don't want Seattle's O Coordinator. All the Seahawks fans I've talked to want him fired.

[justice98]

Gruden did in the first game what most of us wanted/hoped he would do - he gave Griffin a lot of high percentage throws to build his confidence back up.  Fumbles and lamentable special teams lost that game for us. By the second game, he had Griffin run the read option.

Playcalling has NOT been the issue on offense.  Ultimately our team is suffering because we tied up too much money in the franchise tag for Orakpo, and filled gaping holes in the OL with draft projects and cheap and available free agents.

 

Wasn't one of those fumbles on the QB though, at least he and Morris had a hand in it. I'd need to see it again though.  Either way, 6 points is 6 points.  Maybe they score on the drive Paul fumbled on, maybe they don't, can't really assume they would've.  

[skinsnut1823]

I think there is a fine line between wins vs reps. What decisions would we make? (Some rhetoricals)

Is it right to bench cousins with a 1-5 start even though we are not halfway through the season?

Is it right to change RG3 in just one season to a proto typical pocket passer?

If you know your backups psyche is screwed up do you make a change to your third?

How important is confidence in a rookie QB?

How important is it to maintain some semblance of morale/optimism for a rookie head coach?

Does it matter that Gruden to date has never really had anything like the losing season that is in front of us?

Again folks just some rhetoricals?

This team has a quandary of issues where we stand right now. I don't think gruden has done a horrible job as a rookie coach. Compare to Zorn or the spurrier years. Given that how much is him and how much is it the team he was handed? The drama is thick!

[wrecker]

Fumbles in the red zone will do that to you.

So will throwing short, high percentage passes while receivers are running free downfield.

[DC9]

I've read some dumb blogs/articles in my day... but that has to be top three

[bradboyd80]

So will throwing short, high percentage passes while receivers are running free downfield.

How does that contribute to us only scoring 6 points (like fumbles in the red zone that were referenced)? If anything, it keeps the drive alive; increasing our chances of scoring more points.  Am I reading this wrong or something? Seriously just wondering.

[Old Bay]

So will throwing short, high percentage passes while receivers are running free downfield.

 

With these receivers there's still a chance for a big play on a short pass.

[MustangSteve]

Gruden messed up bigtime. I laugh at the people who think that the organization was looking for RG3 to become a pocket passer and that's why they went with Gruden. Then after RG3 went down and Kurt had his little miracle performance that made Gruden believe the hype he quickly tossed RG3 under the bus and wanted to move on with Kurt. 

How the hail did you come up with this crap? He was ask the simple question of what if Kirk has the hot hand when RG3 is ready to go. The correct answer is never pull the hot hand and he stood on that, that doesn't throw anyone under the bus. SMH at some of these post.

[Riggo-toni]

Wasn't one of those fumbles on the QB though, at least he and Morris had a hand in it.

Yes, but it wasn't the result of a bad playcall. The gist of this article is that from 5 quarters of play the author can extrapolate myriad projections of catastrophic failure from Gruden's play calling.

Also, Gruden stated publically on a number of occasions prior to the season that he wasn't going to force RG3 into pocket passer mode - and that he wasn't going to make RG3 runs plays Robert wasn't comfortable with.

[Taco Bell]

The only positive from this artycol is that I now fully believe if I want to become a "paid professional writer" I need to look no further than bleacher report for where to start. 

 

There have only been a few positives on the field thus far this season.  One of them has been Jay and his ability to make adjustments in a variety of forms without "sticking to his guns" just for the sake of doing so, whether it was the draft, or players based on performance, in contextually allowable circumstances that don't seem like "flip flopping," more like right on time.  Others include Desean, Pierre and Andre all showing they are worthy in their own way, Keenan Robinson showing he was worth the wait even if he's not a patrick willis, and then our "best" players Williams and Kerrigan both holding their ends of the bargain yet again even if they aren't Anthony Munoz and Lawrence Taylor.

 

I'm sorry but, this James Dudko seems to get alot of bad reviews on his artycols so this one seems to fall in line with the rest, based on what I just looked at.  

 

No one on the redskins roster looked at these particular QB decisions and said "wow, gruden is a flip flopper" given that Cousins has thrown an absurd amount of picks in his games and seemed dejected about it.  If he was practicing poorly, that's an even further reason to have "flip flopped" given the state of the season at this juncture, where it's on life support.  Sure, if we were 3-4 or better than the change would look on the outside to make less sense, since we'd still seem to be in it and that would mean that Cousins would have at least shown he could win a single start, and likewise we aren't playing for a draft pick just yet, so we are in a very particular circumstance that the QB change made sense.  A last ditch effort to keep our season alive.  I think it was a great choice, and there was no sooner time for it to happen, and it happening later, *might* have been too late if Kirk lost against the Titans.  Right on time I think. 

 

How does that contribute to us only scoring 6 points (like fumbles in the red zone that were referenced)? If anything, it keeps the drive alive; increasing our chances of scoring more points.  Am I reading this wrong or something? Seriously just wondering.

 

I was just in a thread, the "is RG3 our franchise QB?" thread, where Jay Gruden has a quote stating that RG3 did not play well against the Texans.  Meaning, we were most likely calling those quick passes for the same reasons why people on this MB were saying he didn't play well, because they were the only types of throws he was able to make to get into some sort of rhythm.  It didn't work obviously.

 

So, for better or worse, the HC said himself RG3 "didn't play very well", so theres a 99% chance that Gruden was calling those throws because RG3 wasn't able to do something better.  I think the book is closed on the debate whether he played well or not in that game because Gruden said it himself that he didn't.  Also, Gruden has proved to be pretty up front and consistent in his coach speak with the media relative to how said player/team actually fared in a given circumstance, so I actually believe what he is saying, whereas if someone like Shanny, just for example, said that, I wouldn't trust his word quite as much, so I'll even give you that.  Therefore, Gruden said he played poorly and I believe him to be telling the truth.  So he looked at the "misleading" Quarterback rating of 90+ and completion percentage and takes into account the easy passes he called and knows RG3 didn't play well. 

[wrecker]

How does that contribute to us only scoring 6 points (like fumbles in the red zone that were referenced)? If anything, it keeps the drive alive; increasing our chances of scoring more points.  Am I reading this wrong or something? Seriously just wondering.

 

I believe you are not getting it. The primary purpose of offense is to score points....as many and as often as possible.

Keeping the drive alive has more potential for increasing our chances for turn-overs and penalties more than points.

The bigger the chuncks of yardage the offense can produce does three things.

 

 

1. It gets you closer to the goaline/scoring situations faster. 

2. Moving the ball with less plays minimizes the chances of a drive stopping penalty or turn-over.

3. Keeps the field position in your favor.

 

The short high percentage stuff is more for when you are protecting a lead and eating up clock time, which we rarely have that luxury.

[Dan T.]

Gruden messed up bigtime. I laugh at the people who think that the organization was looking for RG3 to become a pocket passer and that's why they went with Gruden. Then after RG3 went down and Kurt had his little miracle performance that made Gruden believe the hype he quickly tossed RG3 under the bus and wanted to move on with Kurt. Kurt then starts to be who he always was, a terrible QB and suddenly you have Gruden suck up to RG3 again and basically pray to god that he gets healthy ASAP so he can be the franchise QB again. The guy is just spineless, unloyal. Now his future/job is up to RG3. I think RG3 is going to dominate for himself and for this team/franchise but not for this coach who basically quit on him the first chance he got.

 

Unless he goes back to letting RG3 play the way he plays the game and doesn't try to force him to drop back on every down and sit in the pocket because QB's used to do that 50 years ago and the game doesn't evolve at all (such BS), if that's what he wants then Jay needs to go. Plain and simple. RG3 has proven he can dominate, we can win here without Jay. We can't without RG3.

Are you writing a novel? Because this is largely fiction not based on any reality.

[gortiz]

what does this mean??? 

 

It was Gruden's flip-flop from trying to consign the read-option to memory to reintroducing elements of the run-first scheme, that precipitated Griffin's injury. It wasn't simply fate that played a part in Griffin's latest ailment and misfortune.

 

[planter]

Article contains some truth...some craziness.

[JG2004]

I believe you are not getting it. The primary purpose of offense is to score points....as many and as often as possible.

Keeping the drive alive has more potential for increasing our chances for turn-overs and penalties more than points.

The bigger the chuncks of yardage the offense can produce does three things.

 

 

1. It gets you closer to the goaline/scoring situations faster. 

2. Moving the ball with less plays minimizes the chances of a drive stopping penalty or turn-over.

3. Keeps the field position in your favor.

 

The short high percentage stuff is more for when you are protecting a lead and eating up clock time, which we rarely have that luxury.

Uh......not completely.  The NFL has been doing this since it started to have long drives that wear down a defense and open up more options. They were trying the fast short plays to move the sticks, get the defense tired and it could have opened up some holes for 46.  BUT the redzone turnovers squelched getting points.  Niles Paul holds on to his 30+ yard pass that could have been a TD.....and  NOT SHORT.  How is it something RG3 "couldn't do"???????  He threw the pass - did you expect him to catch it too?

[brandymac27]

Taco, i agree with the majority of your post. I feel like Jay made the right decision by benching Kirk. It not only gave Colt a chance, but it shows that Jay isn't afraid to make important decisions based off of performance (instead of either popularity or what the general concensus may be in a given situation).

It shows, to me, that these guys have to earn their keep around here. Same thing with him benching TyPo imo. That's a breath of fresh air.

But i do get what the author is saying about possibly lowering the confidence in Robert. I'm afraid he may already be fighting some demons because of his injuries, and if he happens to take all of this the wrong way, i can see Robert taking another step backwards. It's already gonna take time for him to develop as a pocket passer, and the last thing he needs is to be afraid he's gonna get benched.

Honestly, i think that could become a reality if Robert doesn't progress fast enough. Jay doesn't strike me as one with a lot of patience.

[grego]

what does this mean??? 

 

(glad i wasnt the only one who didnt get it).

[brandymac27]

(glad i wasnt the only one who didnt get it).

I'm still trying to figure that one out too.