Marshall Faulk: Kyle Shanahan would be fired with a different last name

[DieHardSkinsfanNJ]

http://m.washingtonpost.com/blogs/dc-sports-bog/wp/2013/11/22/marshall-faulk-kyle-shanahan-would-be-fired-with-a-different-last-name/

Have to win monday

[MartinC]

I have never been in a huddle when ANYBODY but the QB speaks. A huddle is not a debating society - if the QB calls the wrong formation or protection that's on him and no one else.

On Kyle there is room to question some of the design and play calling for sure - however we are ranked 6th overall on offense for yardage and 13th for scoring. We need to finish drives better and covert yardage to points BUT if Kyle was fired he would not be out of work for long.

[darrelgreenie]

Lets assume Kyle is mistake free.

Lets assume we have a uber talented QB good enough to trade up for and won rookie of the year.

Lets agree that a major part of an OCs job is to develop their QB.

Lets assume that Kyle and Griff don't get along.

In what other team is the OC more important than the QB?

It happened here once, I hope it doesn't happen again.

And like before it began with 'leaks' and veiled attacks through the media.

[Skinsinparadise]

In Shanny's book he made it clear that when he was the offensive coordinator, he was a successful buffer between Elway and the head coach Reeves.  In RG3's case, he has no buffer -- he has Shanny as the head coach and another Shanny as O coordinator.

 

Actually this was brought up on ESPN that Aikman had Norv to go to even though he didn't get along with Jimmy Johnson.  While I think most of the focus should be on Shanny's long running failure on building a defense both here and Denver -- the issues with RG3 and coaching staff is clearly a problem, too 

[MartinC]

Lets assume Kyle is mistake free.

Lets assume we have a uber talented QB good enough to trade up for and won rookie of the year.

Lets agree that a major part of an OCs job is to develop their QB.

Lets assume that Kyle and Griff don't get along.

In what other team is the OC more important than the QB?

It happened here once, I hope it doesn't happen again.

And like before it began with 'leaks' and veiled attacks through the media.

If you have to choose between the QB and OC in our case you go with the QB. With what we invested in RGIII you need to find him someone who can develop him and put him in the best position to succeed. That does not necessarily mean someone he 'gets along with' though - respect and trust certainly.

I have no idea what the real relationship between Kyle and RGIII is but I do think a few wins would work wonders all round.

Personally I would give Mike and Kyle a full 'normal' offseason to work with RGIII and the judge them at the end of next year based on his and the offenses development. I don't think we are THAT far away on offense. Defense needs a lot more work IMO.

[Wyvern]

When I saw that clip, my immediate reaction was that Faulk was falling behind a cliche term, without much thought behind it, and delivering his rehearsed punch line for the show's last words. Frankly, I would have loved to asked him a few follow-up questions such as the following:

1. So, as an offensive coordinator ---how do you call plays for a "franchise quarterback" who is not being very accurate with his passes, and whose body is still healing from what happened last season?

2. What should you do when you have a REALY good running back and effective ground game, but your franchise QB just wants to throw long bomb passes to his inexperienced WRs instead of making the occasional short pass needed to keep the chains moving. Do you forego the running game to keep him happy?

3. The term "franchise quarterback" gets tossed around a lot, but there's not really something written out on what defines when you have one, nor once they've been 'anointed' what they should expect as special treatment.

--- So was Alex Smith the franchise QB for the 49'ers? (After all he was the #1 pick.). He toiled for years in a system not suited to his talent, before going to a better fit in Kansas City.

--- if the 49'ers should have accommodated Smith, should the Raiders have done more to accommodated Jamarcus Russell?

--- How about Jeff George? (Should the Skins have done everything they could to accommodate George, instead of letting him go?)

Bottom line: Perhaps Marshall Faulk's comments reveal his own bias that a franchise player deserves primary consideration over the rest of the team and coaches. He was a 'franchise' running back, drafted second overall by the Colts -- who despite great performances eventually had to be traded to the Rams, apparently due to "misunderstandings"with the Colts, (The Colts later inferred keeping Faulk would have been detrimental for team chemistry, and drafted Edgerrin James as a replacement.)

[knowledge316]

I don't agree that the QB shouldn't run the plays being called if he doesn't like the plays. Using Faulk's own facts (RG3 is a second year player, he didn't play in preseason, he's not a seasoned vet), there's no reason to believe he would know if a play will work or not. Also, those discussions need to happen during the week with the OC as far as saying something like, "hey, during the games if I see something different, I might call certain plays if I strongly believe it will net better results."

[RandyHolt]

I agree with Faulk, in stressing that we are discussing a franchise QB. Someone Mike pushed all in on. RG3 succeeding instantly became the top organizational objective, as it is the key to a super bowl. 

 

Only, how is he to compete with the coaches son. Mike's primary goals are to make sure his son succeeds and to win a super bowl. Since he has only won 1 in 15 years, the realistic main goal remains to help Kyle's career.  In fact, Mike will not fire Kyle, no matter the situation. That is pushing all in on an OC. 

 

It's not a healthy situation.

 

RG3 is not sand bagging it. He cannot be the one to compromise. It has to be Kyle.  But Kyle calls plays that he likes, far more often than he calls the plays that RG3 likes, and it is crushing our offense. Since we are built to win games on offense, it is crushing our team.

 

Sure RG3 has had some struggles this year, but then it should be all the more imperative for Kyle to compromise. It seems more the opposite. Kyle remains foot on the gas petal, largely confining RG3 to the pocket, and teaching him to play the game not using his legs.

 

Mike needs to tell Kyle to use Robert to his strengths, or he runs risk of all 3 failing.  It is that simple. It requires Kyle relinquishing some control of the offense to RG3 and I do not see it happening. Kyle will just call a read option every now and then. Rah. A play that has largely been solved league wide.

[HapHaszard]

Quoting the entire article violates the rules, read rule #10

 

When posting anything concerning news articles from outside sources or using any website as part of the topic please include a direct link (i.e., URL) to the original page/site. Paste the URL directly atop the post, above a small portion of the article's text (for example, the lead paragraph or a particular sentence or two). Such a practice provides credibility and attribution to the source of the information, and allows visitors the option to visit the respective websites. You are responsible for the content you post.

[Section106]

What has Kyle done to get fired? The offense is not the problem in DC. It is the DC that is the problem.

[MustangSteve]

I have never been in a huddle when ANYBODY but the QB speaks. A huddle is not a debating society - if the QB calls the wrong formation or protection that's on him and no one else.

On Kyle there is room to question some of the design and play calling for sure - however we are ranked 6th overall on offense for yardage and 13th for scoring. We need to finish drives better and covert yardage to points BUT if Kyle was fired he would not be out of work for long.

Russ Grimm in the 1982 championship game would not except the play called in running the ball wide. Lets keep pounding strait ahead he said, and the Redskins offense did just that 9 times in a row to run the clock out.

[MartinC]

Russ Grimm in the 1982 championship game would not except the play called in running the ball wide. Lets keep pounding strait ahead he said, and the Redskins offense did just that 9 times in a row to run the clock out.

That might be the exception that proves the rule. One of the fundemntal rules on every team I played on and every team I have heard about is the QB is the only person who speaks in the huddle. I know that one of the things is says in Shanny playbook from his Denver days is the QB does all the talking in the huddle.

[thebluefood]

That might be the exception that proves the rule. One of the fundemntal rules on every team I played on and every team I have heard about is the QB is the only person who speaks in the huddle. I know that one of the things is says in Shanny playbook from his Denver days is the QB does all the talking in the huddle.

Also, from what I understand, conversation was lively and frequent in the Raiders huddle when Ken Stabler was QB.

 

Then again, those teams were very unusual.

[Voice_of_Reason]

Everybody has to get their shot in about something RGIII related.

I actually take a completely opposite view from Daulk: if Kyle's name wasn't Shanahan, RGIII would be under even more heat. Because there wouldn't be anything to hide behind, agendas, nepotism, none if these excuses would be there.

Many more questions would be asked about why Robert isn't playing well. Less about his relationship with the OC.

[RandyHolt]

With every QB that ever tanks, there is an OC that drove that Ferrari right off the road. Yet, it always seems the car was always the problem, and never the driver, the OC, who always seems absolved of any blame.

 

I don't want to wait until the smoke settles, before looking a little deeper into what Kyle is doing to help RG3 become a successful QB.

 

While no one wants Robert to fail, the fail rate of top rated QB's coming out of college is mind boggling.

 

And I think its high time OCs are in the discussion of exactly why that is. If you wait until the jury comes back, it seems too late to scrutinize what went wrong.

[1198skinsfuture]

Everybody has to get their shot in about something RGIII related.

I actually take a completely opposite view from Daulk: if Kyle's name wasn't Shanahan, RGIII would be under even more heat. Because there wouldn't be anything to hide behind, agendas, nepotism, none if these excuses would be there.

Many more questions would be asked about why Robert isn't playing well. Less about his relationship with the OC.

I agree 100% with this

[Shiv]

So what's the excuse for Haslett and the special teams coach (I refuse to learn his name)?

[ddub52]

Haslett doesn't share the same last name as Mike. 

[darrelgreenie]

For whatever reason explaining some of the issues with the playcalling and gameplan through X's and O's isn't working.

And I've tried my best. But, putting aside the X's and O's for a second.

If Harbaugh and Andy Reid receive credit for developing Alex Smith then conversely shouldn't the previous coaches that failed deserve blame?

Or a more direct situation.  Let's remove all the off the field inneundo and rumor for a second and look at McNabb. The season before we traded for McNabb he went to one of his many pro-bowls yet the very next season after 13 games he's benched had pne of his worst seasons personally (while on pace to set the franchise yardage record). Think about that and divorce yourself from all the rumors and leaks. We traded for a QB coming off a pro-bowl QB coming off a pro-bowl season and benched him after 13 games for Rex Grossman.

 

Meanwhile, Cutler and the Bears offense struggle under 2 OCs that they replace then bring in Trestman and Cutler is having a resurgence.

 

Point being is that the OC is responsible for the production of the offense and the developement of the QB.

The OC is the teacher/instuctor/conductor. If his students fail. He fails. Especially when we know his prized pupil is one of the most talented QBs in the NFL.

 

I am not saying Kyle should be fired because that simply isn't tenable here. But Kyle's performance certainly deserves to be under the microscope based on lack of first half production if not for X's and O's, development or lack of the QB and leaking information (which has been a pet peeve of mine about this regime for awhile).

[veteranskinsfan]

I recall reading last year how Ben Roethlisberger on the Steelers did not agree with his offensive coordinator who had come from the Kansas City Chiefs.  Winning has to become the priority at Redskins Park and everyone's hidden agendas need to go away asap.

[darrelgreenie]

If you have to choose between the QB and OC in our case you go with the QB. With what we invested in RGIII you need to find him someone who can develop him and put him in the best position to succeed. That does not necessarily mean someone he 'gets along with' though - respect and trust certainly.

I have no idea what the real relationship between Kyle and RGIII is but I do think a few wins would work wonders all round.

Personally I would give Mike and Kyle a full 'normal' offseason to work with RGIII and the judge them at the end of next year based on his and the offenses development. I don't think we are THAT far away on offense. Defense needs a lot more work IMO.

I think you choose the QB in most situations. (maybe barring those where the HC is the OC) I only mention 'getting along' because those are the rumors, and those types of rumors seemed to follow Kyle.

I am not saying the you hire an OC based soley on their ability to 'get along' with the QB. But, I think on most teams the OC understands that it is HIS responsibility to make the relationship between he and the QB work.

 

I don't think we are far away on offense either and that for me is the most troubling part. The ability for the offense to function at a more productive level is there, we have the talent. And I may be the minority but I see it clearly as gameplan/playcalling issue.

 

But, if I were the Snyder I would have seen enough. Bad special teams starting from the top. Bad defenses starting from the top Shanny/Haslett/Raheem a lot of chefs there imho. Under acheiving offense. And a relationship with your franchise QB that seems to be falling apart (to include media leaks which as an owner I would HATE). Questionable front office decisions. Heading towards another 4th place finish.

 

I would be making phone calls to Tony Dungy, Bill Cowher, Jimmy Johnson and asking them about General Managers.

[DieHardSkinsfanNJ]

Quoting the entire article violates the rules, read rule #10

When posting anything concerning news articles from outside sources or using any website as part of the topic please include a direct link (i.e., URL) to the original page/site. Paste the URL directly atop the post, above a small portion of the article's text (for example, the lead paragraph or a particular sentence or two). Such a practice provides credibility and attribution to the source of the information, and allows visitors the option to visit the respective websites. You are responsible for the content you post.

sorry about that

[HapHaszard]

sorry about that

No problem, the rule is there to prevent you from being in violation of copyright laws.  Some entities are very serious about protecting their copy.

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

Marshall Faulk for once is bang on the money. 

 

Hail. 

[PlayAction]

Wow, there's nothing to this article.  RG3 is not a franchise QB so suggesting that the coaches defer to him is ridiculous.  I'm guessing but I don't think Marshall Faulk has any coaching or personnel management experience.  He's as qualified to opine on K.Shanahan as I am.