***2021-2022 NBA Season Thread***

[CRobi21]

3 hours ago, TradeTheBeal! said:

Did he not predict the “Heatles” would win 5,6,7 titles in a row…and then got thrashed by Dirk Nowitski and Sean Marion?!?  I mean, that’s genuinely hilarious forever.

 

Edit:  AND DESEAN STEVENSON!!!

 

Must we not forget the greatest king slayer of them all....

 

[justice98]

1 hour ago, Spaceman Spiff said:

 

Sure it would.  Taking a team like Cleveland and making them a desirable destination would have been more impressive.  Instead of recruiting LeBron to Miami -which, let's be honest, going from Cleveland to Miami strictly based on lifestyle alone isn't hard- it would have been more impressive for LeBron to say to Wade and Bosh "No, **** you both, if you want to win you're giving up South Beach and you're coming here.  This is where I'm from, this is the team that drafted me, and I'm staying here.  You can come here or not come here, either way I'm figuring this **** out."

 

The Cavs had some very good teams in the late 80s and early 90s buy by and large it was NBA Siberia, along with places like Minnesota...and, well, Washington.  Taking that and turning it around to a place that would have been desirable to go to instead of caving and going to Miami would have been more impressive.  You can't tell me that if the Wizards drafted the next LeBron, the next generational talent and he couldn't break through and said "**** it, I'm going to the Lakers," you'd find that more impressive.

 

And, yes, to TTB's point, getting beat by Dirk, Marion and Stevenson in the finals was fantastic.  

 

It's a stylistic argument based on geography, rather than a substantive one, and I can't fathom why a player (or any one else) should care about that.  

 

But I'm not gonna penalize a guy cuz he plays with good teammates.  We didn't do that with Russell, or Magic, or Bird, etc.  The building a team agita folks have is just nonsense.

 

I dont know where this started where winning came with conditions.  Like, it's not as good if X, Y, Z.  Nah, it's plenty good.  The ring fits just as well.  I dont think players actually care about how they win a championship, nor should they.  They definitely shouldn't care what we think about it.

 

"Turning it around" is highly overblown and overrated.

[justice98]

39 minutes ago, Destino said:

Now that Durants time with the Nets is over, let’s take a moment to remember he left a dynasty for that mess.  We can criticize Lebron all we want but he won championships everywhere he went.  Miami, champions twice.  Returned to Cleveland, championship.  Moves to Lakers, championship.  
 

Durant built his own squad and that team became the laughingstock of the nba.  

 

I dont know why we're criticizing LeBron at all though. lol

[The Evil Genius]

KD would probably be on Ring 4 going for 5 had he stayed in Golden State.

 

$'s and stats over rings though. 

[justice98]

2 hours ago, Renegade7 said:

The superteam fad was getting ridiculous, so while LeBron does deserve credit for winning finals MVPs with three separate teams, It's during an era where it's become more common for players to want to move around to loaded teams versus making it work where they are. 

 

James did everything he could to help rip Davis out of a smaller franchise, and it took the basketball gods stepping in to help make New Orleans even stronger after that from that.

 

It's not right to single out LeBron for this when Durant broke the NBA going to the Warriors, now this bamma taking his supermax contract with him he jus signed to Phoenix.  Expect something new in the next CBA about that.

 

I see both sides of the "they should be able to" debate, Lillard is trapping himself, Gannis gutted it out, and Beal looks perfectly comfortable with the bed he's made in DC.  I don't agree with trying to shut down these conversations, DF else we gonna talk about?

 

Players rarely "made it work" where they were and won a bunch of championships.  It's a fallacious argument.  I mean, did Magic make it work going to a team with 2 future HoFers already there?  Did Bird when Tiny Archibald, Cedric Maxwell, and Dave Cowen were already there and Parish, McHale, DJ, etc all show up within a couple years?  Dont get me started on those Celtics teams from the 50s/60s where 3/4 of the roster went to the Hall of Fame. 

 

The best player on the Cavs team LeBron got drafted to was Carlos Boozer.  Drew Gooden might've been the 2nd best player when they got swept by the Spurs. GTFOH.  lol  I dont wanna hear about how superteams are new thing and how players of yesteryear didnt move around looking for championships.  The only difference is who's pulling the strings.  The power shifted from the front office on the players.  But nobody has ever been out here toiling and scuffling for a decade trying to win one for the hometown fans on principle.  And if they were doing that, they usually weren't successful.

2 minutes ago, The Evil Genius said:

KD would probably be on Ring 4 going for 5 had he stayed in Golden State.

 

$'s and stats over rings though. 

 

He had numbers and stats in GS though.  He just didn't like those MFers.  lol

[The Evil Genius]

KD averaged about 3 pts per game less in GS than anywhere else. 

Edited February 9, 2023 by The Evil Genius

[Cooked Crack]

 

 

 

 

Edited February 9, 2023 by Cooked Crack

[Spaceman Spiff]

18 minutes ago, justice98 said:

 

It's a stylistic argument based on geography, rather than a substantive one, and I can't fathom why a player (or any one else) should care about that.  

 

But I'm not gonna penalize a guy cuz he plays with good teammates.  We didn't do that with Russell, or Magic, or Bird, etc.  The building a team agita folks have is just nonsense.

 

I dont know where this started where winning came with conditions.  Like, it's not as good if X, Y, Z.  Nah, it's plenty good.  The ring fits just as well.  I dont think players actually care about how they win a championship, nor should they.  They definitely shouldn't care what we think about it.

 

"Turning it around" is highly overblown and overrated.

 

Well the NBA is based a lot on geography and major media markets.  The only way a place like Cleveland gets a chance to win a ring is if they draft a guy like LeBron and then make some smart moves around him.  Milwaukee doesn't get a ring if they're don't draft Giannis. They're not going to be able to attract a great player to come play there.  But the Lakers are never going to have a problem in that department.

 

Like, the Minnesota Timberwolves are never going to win a championship.  Unless they draft someone generational and then hit on a few more picks, and even then they're most likely going to bolt to a nicer more metropolitan area with better weather like Miami or LA.  Or a major media market like NYC.

 

The NBA is now mostly set up for superstars to collude together to go to places to win titles, I don't even know why these guys have agents anymore.  And that's fine, it makes for good drama and it makes for good storylines.  No one has a better off-season than the NBA.  The power dynamic of the entire league can hinge on what a few players decide to do, but there are almost always certain franchises left out in the cold.

 

In regards to penalizing a guy for doing that, specifically LeBron, I don't think anyone is penalizing him and saying it's not as good.  I just think they're using it as an example of why they don't like him.  I mean, I don't like LeBron, flat out.  People confuse that with being a hater, or assuming that I think he's overrated or dissing him or whatever.  None of that is true, I think he's a great player.  Depending on what you're looking for, he's probably in the all-time starting 5.  If I have to have a small forward, I'm probably taking him over Bird.  

 

But I just don't like him.  I think he's soft, I think he's a bit of a phony, I think he's absolutely starved for attention and adoration.  When he won his ring with the Lakers, he's been a champion again for maybe 15 minutes, he gives that MVP award acceptance speech and he's like "...and I want my damn respect."  Like, okay dude, who doesn't respect you?  Who doesn't think you're an all time great and the defining player of your generation?

 

In that moment, I think what he really meant is that he wants to be loved and adored.  Jordan didn't give a ****, he even said it in the Last Dance documentary.  "I wasn't a politician when I was playing my sport. I was focused on my craft. Was that selfish? Probably. But that was my energy. That's where my energy was. It's never going to be enough for everybody, and I know that. Because everybody has a preconceived idea for what I should do and what I shouldn't do. The way I go about my life is I set examples. If it inspires you? Great, I will continue to do that. If it doesn't? Then maybe I'm not the person you should be following."

 

I don't think LeBron thinks that way.  I think he wants to be loved and treasured in the way that Jordan was.  Jordan, the ultimate pitch-man who had commercials and print ads everywhere and practically took the NBA global just didn't give a **** if people liked him or not and was completely comfortable if people didn't.  And I think it bugs LeBron that he's not adored the way Jordan was...why else demand his "damn respect"?  

 

So, yeah, I don't like LeBron for those reasons and some others.  Doesn't mean I don't think he's a great player, he absolutely is.

[Destino]

Warriors dumped Wiseman for second round picks?  

[CRobi21]

Always forget how chaotic NBA trade deadline is... This **** is crazy. Entire league is getting reshuffled.

[abdcskins]

I think it's crazy how teams treat second round picks like apples. Bucks giving up 5 second rounders, Nwora, Hill, and Ibaka for Crowder is a little silly imo.

 

I realize many second rounders end up riding the bench or out of the league, but you gotta at least try to build a good young core eventually. 

[Dr. Do Itch Big]

37 minutes ago, justice98 said:

 

Players rarely "made it work" where they were and won a bunch of championships.  It's a fallacious argument.  I mean, did Magic make it work going to a team with 2 future HoFers already there?  Did Bird when Tiny Archibald, Cedric Maxwell, and Dave Cowen were already there and Parish, McHale, DJ, etc all show up within a couple years?  Dont get me started on those Celtics teams from the 50s/60s where 3/4 of the roster went to the Hall of Fame. 

 

The best player on the Cavs team LeBron got drafted to was Carlos Boozer.  Drew Gooden might've been the 2nd best player when they got swept by the Spurs. GTFOH.  lol  I dont wanna hear about how superteams are new thing and how players of yesteryear didnt move around looking for championships.  The only difference is who's pulling the strings.  The power shifted from the front office on the players.  But nobody has ever been out here toiling and scuffling for a decade trying to win one for the hometown fans on principle.  And if they were doing that, they usually weren't successful.

 

He had numbers and stats in GS though.  He just didn't like those MFers.  lol

He didn’t like being in Curry’s shadow. Too insecure. 

[Cooked Crack]

 

[justice98]

8 minutes ago, Spaceman Spiff said:

 

Well the NBA is based a lot on geography and major media markets.  The only way a place like Cleveland gets a chance to win a ring is if they draft a guy like LeBron and then make some smart moves around him.  Milwaukee doesn't get a ring if they're don't draft Giannis. They're not going to be able to attract a great player to come play there.  But the Lakers are never going to have a problem in that department.

 

Like, the Minnesota Timberwolves are never going to win a championship.  Unless they draft someone generational and then hit on a few more picks, and even then they're most likely going to bolt to a nicer more metropolitan area with better weather like Miami or LA.  Or a major media market like NYC.

 

The NBA is now mostly set up for superstars to collude together to go to places to win titles, I don't even know why these guys have agents anymore.  And that's fine, it makes for good drama and it makes for good storylines.  No one has a better off-season than the NBA.  The power dynamic of the entire league can hinge on what a few players decide to do, but there are almost always certain franchises left out in the cold.

 

In regards to penalizing a guy for doing that, specifically LeBron, I don't think anyone is penalizing him and saying it's not as good.  I just think they're using it as an example of why they don't like him.  I mean, I don't like LeBron, flat out.  People confuse that with being a hater, or assuming that I think he's overrated or dissing him or whatever.  None of that is true, I think he's a great player.  Depending on what you're looking for, he's probably in the all-time starting 5.  If I have to have a small forward, I'm probably taking him over Bird.  

 

But I just don't like him.  I think he's soft, I think he's a bit of a phony, I think he's absolutely starved for attention and adoration.  When he won his ring with the Lakers, he's been a champion again for maybe 15 minutes, he gives that MVP award acceptance speech and he's like "...and I want my damn respect."  Like, okay dude, who doesn't respect you?  Who doesn't think you're an all time great and the defining player of your generation?

 

In that moment, I think what he really meant is that he wants to be loved and adored.  Jordan didn't give a ****, he even said it in the Last Dance documentary.  "I wasn't a politician when I was playing my sport. I was focused on my craft. Was that selfish? Probably. But that was my energy. That's where my energy was. It's never going to be enough for everybody, and I know that. Because everybody has a preconceived idea for what I should do and what I shouldn't do. The way I go about my life is I set examples. If it inspires you? Great, I will continue to do that. If it doesn't? Then maybe I'm not the person you should be following."

 

I don't think LeBron thinks that way.  I think he wants to be loved and treasured in the way that Jordan was.  Jordan, the ultimate pitch-man who had commercials and print ads everywhere and practically took the NBA global just didn't give a **** if people liked him or not and was completely comfortable if people didn't.  And I think it bugs LeBron that he's not adored the way Jordan was...why else demand his "damn respect"?  

 

So, yeah, I don't like LeBron for those reasons and some others.  Doesn't mean I don't think he's a great player, he absolutely is.

 

You have the same feeling about LeBron that I had about Kobe.  lol  

[Dr. Do Itch Big]

11 minutes ago, Destino said:

Warriors dumped Wiseman for second round picks?  

Bust, he may still be able to turn around his career but he was going to cost 115 million in luxury tax if he wasn’t traded. Can’t blame the owners. He wasn’t providing anything. 
 

trade Poole of bridges and picks tho. Do it 

Wiz fans salty cuz LeBron went in that ass every year and never gave a ****.Y’all was just a fly in the front of the freight train that was LeGOAT. 

Edited February 9, 2023 by Dr. Do Itch Big

[Spaceman Spiff]

6 minutes ago, justice98 said:

 

You have the same feeling about LeBron that I had about Kobe.  lol  

 

That's fair.  I liked Kobe but I can see why others wouldn't.  

6 minutes ago, Dr. Do Itch Big said:

 

Wiz fans salty cuz LeBron went in that ass every year and never gave a ****.Y’all was just a fly in the front of the freight train that was LeGOAT. 

 

The Wiz have been a fly in front of many a freight-train over the years.  This ain't unique to LeBron.

[abdcskins]

I doubt Wall is happy going back to Houston.

[justice98]

The Warriors got the 2nd overall pick after a Finals appearance and nothing to show for it.  They wee supposed to reload with that.  But they got 2nd overall in a draft where the best players were guards, where you already have Curry, Klay, and Poole from the year before.  

[Renegade7]

58 minutes ago, justice98 said:

 

Players rarely "made it work" where they were and won a bunch of championships.  It's a fallacious argument.  I mean, did Magic make it work going to a team with 2 future HoFers already there?  Did Bird when Tiny Archibald, Cedric Maxwell, and Dave Cowen were already there and Parish, McHale, DJ, etc all show up within a couple years?  Dont get me started on those Celtics teams from the 50s/60s where 3/4 of the roster went to the Hall of Fame. 

 

That's not the same thing, Magic and Bird were drafted onto those teams.  Winning multiple rings anyway isn't common, let's bring this back to multiple stars colluding in season or offseason leaving to go form superteams for a second, that's different.

 

58 minutes ago, justice98 said:

The best player on the Cavs team LeBron got drafted to was Carlos Boozer.  Drew Gooden might've been the 2nd best player when they got swept by the Spurs. GTFOH.  lol  I dont wanna hear about how superteams are new thing and how players of yesteryear didnt move around looking for championships.  The only difference is who's pulling the strings.  The power shifted from the front office on the players.  But nobody has ever been out here toiling and scuffling for a decade trying to win one for the hometown fans on principle.  And if they were doing that, they usually weren't successful.

 

Again, no one is blaming for LeBron for leaving Cleveland, I knew he would because that was a trash organization and I didn't believe he could win one there (he went back to prove everyone wrong, credit to him).  But how he left, stuff like The Decision, even he regretted that. So don't defend him for that if even he won't. 

 

Again, superteams aren't new, maybe we should call it the superfriends era instead, because the way players were making team changing plans was and is outright banned by front offices to be involved with, the ultimate loophole to that conversation and lead to the changing of supermax contracts that paid more for staying then leaving to encourage players not to do that.  So it's clearly different and that matters.

9 minutes ago, abdcskins said:

I doubt Wall is happy going back to Houston.

 

I wonder if they even have to do a physical before waiving him, which case, he could jus stay in LA and not even go back in that building.

Edited February 9, 2023 by Renegade7

[Dr. Do Itch Big]

Come on bob myers do something. We ain’t winning **** currently constructed 

[Renegade7]

16 minutes ago, Dr. Do Itch Big said:

 

Wiz fans salty cuz LeBron went in that ass every year and never gave a ****.Y’all was just a fly in the front of the freight train that was LeGOAT. 

 

LeBron been around so long I'm sure there are Wizards fans who didn't even see or even know about "The Whisper"...

[Momma There Goes That Man]

4 minutes ago, Dr. Do Itch Big said:

Come on bob myers do something. We ain’t winning **** currently constructed 

GP2 coming back for 5 second rounders lol

[justice98]

15 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

That's not the same thing, Magic and Bird were drafted onto those teams.  Winning multiple rings anyway isn't common, let's bring this back to multiple stars colluding in season or offseason leaving to go form superteams for a second, that's different.

 

Again, no one is blaming for LeBron for leaving Cleveland, I knew he would because that was a trash organization and I didn't believe he could win one there (he went back to prove everyone wrong, credit to him).  But how he left, stuff like The Decision, even he regretted that. So don't defend him for that if even he won't. 

 

Again, superteams aren't new, maybe we should call it the superfriends era instead, because the way players were making team changing plans was and is outright banned by front offices to be involved with, the ultimate loophole to that conversation and lead to the changing of supermax contracts that paid more for staying then leaving to encourage players not to do that.  So it's clearly different and that matters.

 

Literally the only difference is who's getting the players together.  Which is really insignificant.  It's a different, but no less legitimate, way of achieving the same goal.  Getting the best players on one team.  Either they're doing it themselves, or someone else is doing it for them.  But it's not happening by magic.  If the front office pulls you all together, cool.  But if you coordinate to do it yourself, it's a heinous act.  lol

 

I personally couldn't care less about the Decision.  Sure, it was clunky, but other than that, wholly meaningless and dumb.  And the hand wringing over it years after the fact was even dumber.  

 

On that last point, the difference there is the owners wanted some control back.  Doesn't make the previous system any better though.  Look at the trade deadline.  Players moving all over the place, but it's cool cuz the teams are doing it.  But when players take control of their own destiny, it's foul.

I think we see why Tommy wanted all those 2nd rounders.  That's how deals get done now.  You have 3-4 excess 2nds laying around, you can do some things.

[Spaceman Spiff]

31 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

Again, no one is blaming for LeBron for leaving Cleveland, I knew he would because that was a trash organization and I didn't believe he could win one there (he went back to prove everyone wrong, credit to him). 

 

I don't think he goes back if the Cavs didn't land Kyrie after he left the first time.

[Dr. Do Itch Big]

34 minutes ago, Momma There Goes That Man said:

GP2 coming back for 5 second rounders lol

Tragic. Never should have left.