***2021-2022 NBA Season Thread***

[CrypticVillain]

If Oden could give them 15 to 20 effective minutes a night, it would make them a different team.

 

I just think that his knees are actually worse than we suspect they are (and we all suspect that they are a torture porn movie). I would love to see him become an effective NBA player, but I think there is a better chance that this experiment is over by Christmas.

No doubt. I am 6' 6" and I have some knee problems. Now granted I have some weight on me, and I know that is effecting me, but I still can't imagine Oden, who is 7'0" 250, lasting long on those messed up knees...

That is why i am amazed that Shaq was able to do what he did, for the time he did it.

Two coaches making bonehead decisions to keep premier big men out of the game in the last 30 seconds saved Miami this past postseason.  I don't think Miami's road to the Finals is as easy as some are making it out to be.  They shouldn't have won last year and they were bailed out.  The Pacers can beat them in a series, that we know.  The Bulls, don't know if they have the depth but if Rose is healthy, we'll see.

I am just at the point where I am like prove it. All these teams could have and should have beat the Heat, but for two straight years, nobody has beaten them in a playoff series, and in three years nobody in the East has been beaten . So again, I am just at the point where I want somebody to show me that they can do it. Until then, the Heat should be favorites.

[Mr. Sinister]

I doubt Greg Oden will last. Whenever he's in, his old-assness will slow the team down on offense, when typically we like to get up the court. We'll have to pay more half court with him in.His health/productivity is more than a big if. It's a colossal if. Even though there will be little asked of him, other than getting rebounds and providing a presence in the paint, even that will be a stretch. It's pretty much on the same level as expecting Tanard Jackson to come back for the Skins and play at even a serviceable level.

 

Now if he can do everything asked of him, he makes the Heat better in the interior, and (with his rebounding) will allow them to get more fast break opportunities/possessions against better defensive teams, when they can't beat them up in the paint on every possession (along with allowing Bosh to move to the 4), but even if he shows that in a game, I'll have little faith that he'll be able to keep it up for an entire month, let alone for the entire season/postseason.

 

It may just come down to one game/two games/3 games. If only for 3 games, or 3 plays, he can give us what we need (when we really need it), defensively, and on the boards, I'll take it as a win. At the end of the day, that's what championships come down to.

Edited October 24, 2013 by Mr. Sinister

[RonArtest15]

If Greg Oden wanted to get the most out of what's remaining of his career, he should have signed w. Phoenix.

[Destino]

Oden is needed more for defense than anything else and even then only in the post season.  Birdman was little more than an annoyance to Hibbert, and that weakness almost derailed the Heats championship run.  Chicago, Brooklyn, and Indiana all have active interior talent.  In the west Houston, Memphis, and maybe the Clippers have bigs that would give Battier/Birdman fits but I doubt those teams make the finals.  

 

The Heat are heavy favorites to win it all and I while I expect some really entertaining basketball in the playoffs I would absolutely pick them to take a third title.    

If Greg Oden wanted to get the most out of what's remaining of his career, he should have signed w. Phoenix.

 

Why don't more teams just copy their medical/training staff template?  I wish the Wizards would.  

[Going Commando]

I think Miami is still the favorite.  LeBron is still the best player and even if Bosh and Wade are just role players now, they're really really good role plyers.  And Chalmers/Haslem/Battier/Allen is still a good supporting cast.  Their only real weakness is the lack of an inside presence.  We'll see what happens with Oden I suppose.  Aside from that, LeBron gives them unique advantages for busting up opposing lineups because of his interchangeability at SF and PF, on both ends of the court.  This helps them minimize the damage of not having a great interior presence because teams can't use "Twin Towers" lineups on them as effectively.  Can't put a traditional big man PF on LeBron and you can't switch him onto a Battier or Allen playing SF.

 

We're at the point where LeBron pretty much has to be consistently great for them to win it all though.  Wade is not capable of carrying a top two seed when LeBron slumps like he was at times during the first three years.  Bosh goes through stretches of pretty striking unreliability too.  Sometimes it feels like Miami is set up to feature his deficiencies rather than his strengths.

 

I think there are definitely several teams that can win the championship this season.  San Antonio, Oklahoma City, and Chicago are all legit.  Chicago will probably lead the league in winning % again.  Houston and the Clippers are probably legit, though I don't think we know that yet.  Brooklyn might be too.

Edited October 24, 2013 by stevemcqueen1

[Going Commando]

I also don't think the NBA is the same as it was in 2010.  A lot of people though that 2010 was going to permanently reshape the nature of the league, Miami giving us a super team format.  But I think the lockout in 2011 was far more impactful.  The new CBA made it practically impossible to build a three AS team in free agency ever again anyway.  Teams are going to have to build up assets to make trades and use their draft pickjs well to build good teams.  And All Stars are going to have to walk away from tons of money to change teams because the league gave teams a lot of tools to keep their own players.  You're going to see more parity resulting from this.  You're going to see the draft become more important and more teams investing in the development of their picks.  Might even get a third round to the draft eventually.

[Ozymandias]

For the 3 minutes Oden was in yesterday, he looked good. hopefully he can keep it up and play more without getting hurt

[RonArtest15]

A FA to keep your eye on is Carmelo Anthony....going to be real interesting to see what he does.  I have a feeling he's going to bolt from the Knicks and end up somwhere back in the WC. 

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

Who knows what Melo's agenda is at this point?. It's possible he figured out that as long as Durant and Lebron are in the league, he's not going to win titles or MVPs (or, frankly, make ALL NBA first team)....so he wants to score points, make millions, and - I dunno - make reality tv shows or something. It's possible that New York just suits his needs - whatever they are.

[Ozymandias]

Who knows what Melo's agenda is at this point?. It's possible he figured out that as long as Durant and Lebron are in the league, he's not going to win titles or MVPs (or, frankly, make ALL NBA first team)....so he wants to score points, make millions, and - I dunno - make reality tv shows or something. It's possible that New York just suits his needs - whatever they are.

 

Exactly. I never saw him as a competitive player like LeBron, Durant, Wade and Kobe. I feel like he just wants to get his at this point. Go after some scoring records.

[RonArtest15]

Who knows what Melo's agenda is at this point?. It's possible he figured out that as long as Durant and Lebron are in the league, he's not going to win titles or MVPs (or, frankly, make ALL NBA first team)....so he wants to score points, make millions, and - I dunno - make reality tv shows or something. It's possible that New York just suits his needs - whatever they are.

 

That's a good question. 

 

With the Knicks getting back to relevancy, there is going to be even more pressure on him and the team to make some noise in the playoffs.  Funny thing about his impending FA, is that Mike Woodson basically told him to shut up about it. 

 

Yes, the Knicks can offer him the most money but it's interesting that he's pretty much been quiet about his plans going forward.  The Knicks are a mess and have no draft picks for a while...IF they finish in 4th/5th in the East and have yet another 1st round exit, I think Melo's decision will be set in stone.  He'll bounce.  On top of it all, LA probably suits his wife's needs as well.  She's done NY...next step is to conquer Cali. 

[DM72]

A FA to keep your eye on is Carmelo Anthony....going to be real interesting to see what he does.  I have a feeling he's going to bolt from the Knicks and end up somwhere back in the WC.

You think so? I can't see him going back out west unless it's to the Lakers.

[CrypticVillain]

I think there are definitely several teams that can win the championship this season.  San Antonio, Oklahoma City, and Chicago are all legit.  Chicago will probably lead the league in winning % again.  Houston and the Clippers are probably legit, though I don't think we know that yet.  Brooklyn might be too.

As long as Scott Brooks is coaching OKC, they will never have my trust. KD is my man, Westbrook can ball, but after seeing how severely lame OKC looked in the playoffs this year without Westbrook, I am starting to think Brooks isn't the coach to lead them to a ring.

[Sticksboi05]

No doubt. I am 6' 6" and I have some knee problems. Now granted I have some weight on me, and I know that is effecting me, but I still can't imagine Oden, who is 7'0" 250, lasting long on those messed up knees...

That is why i am amazed that Shaq was able to do what he did, for the time he did it.

I am just at the point where I am like prove it. All these teams could have and should have beat the Heat, but for two straight years, nobody has beaten them in a playoff series, and in three years nobody in the East has been beaten . So again, I am just at the point where I want somebody to show me that they can do it. Until then, the Heat should be favorites.

 

My point isn't that they didn't "earn" their title or that they didn't "deserve it".  They earned and deserved it.  If you read in context, my point was, people are coming into the season as if Miami is going to cakewalk to a threepeat and given that they barely won last year against a team that has improved and a Spurs team that simply collapsed by themselves, that's not the case.  Are they the favorite, yes.  Not denying that, they have to be.  If Wade is healthy, it's going to be VERY tough for anyone to compete. 

 

People don't need to be so defensive, if I went into the Nats Thread and said that the Nationals let the Cardinals off the hook last year with a 6-0 lead in Game 5 of the NLDS, would anyone disagree?  Because that's exactly what happened.  Credit the Cards for battling back and winning but the Nationals pulled off an enormous choke job even for a team with zero playoff experience.

 

I actually happen to think that the Heat's 2013 title was extremely impressive and more so than 2012 given that they had to face the biggest two-team wall they could've faced in the Pacers and Spurs.  Two teams equipped to challenge Miami unlike any other teams in the NBA including OKC.  I think LeBron, though he had a tough first half of the series, proved why he is the best in the business in the second half, especially in that Game 6 OT when they needed him the most.

Edited October 24, 2013 by Sticksboi05

[RonArtest15]

You think so? I can't see him going back out west unless it's to the Lakers.

 

Yeah...I think he's 50/50 at this point.  He's been noncommittal to this point and has mentioned that this is a big year for himself, teammates, and management.  I think there is immense pressure to get this team over the hump.  However, with teams like Miami, Chicago, and Indy rapidly improving or being the class of the East, the writing MAY be on the wall for Melo and his career w/ the Knicks. 

[Sticksboi05]

Exactly. I never saw him as a competitive player like LeBron, Durant, Wade and Kobe. I feel like he just wants to get his at this point. Go after some scoring records.

 

I think he wants a ring and he will leave NY this offseason depending on what LeBron does.  He will hit 30 which is when you start thinking about the back half of your career as a star player.

[SuperBash]

I just finished a 10 team, 80 million salary cap, fantasy basketball league. It's pretty tough to gauge the value of players in terms of what round to take them in compared to their salary. I finished about 5 mil under the cap with a team of:

 

PG: Lillard (3.2M)

SG: Wade (18.7M)

G: Goran Dragic (7.5M)

SF: Ilyasova (7.9M)

F: Harden (13.7M)

PF: Markieff Morris (2.1M)

C: Larry Sanders (3.1M)

C: Valanciunas (3.5M)

Flex: Reggie Jackson (1.3M)

 

BENCH:
Giannis Antetokounmpo (1.8M)

Al Harrington (1.4M)

JJ Hickson (5.2M)

Kelly Olynyk (2M)

Cody Zeller (3.9M)

 

Players like Kobe, Deron, Bosh, Pierce, Howard Dirk will never be on a roster in this league. I took some high upside rookies since it's a dynasty and they are cheap. If we want to keep any players, we have to add 2.5 M to their salary next year. It should be an interesting league.

[CrypticVillain]

My point isn't that they didn't "earn" their title or that they didn't "deserve it".  They earned and deserved it.  If you read in context, my point was, people are coming into the season as if Miami is going to cakewalk to a threepeat and given that they barely won last year against a team that has improved and a Spurs team that simply collapsed by themselves, that's not the case.  Are they the favorite, yes.  Not denying that, they have to be.  If Wade is healthy, it's going to be VERY tough for anyone to compete. 

 

Back to last year, so Mr. Sinister doesn't come back in to defend Miami again, it's okay to call a spade a spade, the Spurs choked.  Big time.  No team with that kind of coaching and championship resume should blow a 5 point lead with under 30 seconds to go. You can argue that all you want, but it is what it is.  Now, are they the only team, no.  Have other teams been "let off the hook" by teams that had it in the bag, yes.  Does it happen multiple times a year in sports?  Yes.  Does that stop us from pointing it out when it happens?  No. 

 

People don't need to be so defensive, if I went into the Nats Thread and said that the Nationals let the Cardinals off the hook last year with a 6-0 lead in Game 5 of the NLDS, would anyone disagree?  Because that's exactly what happened.  Credit the Cards for battling back and winning but the Nationals pulled off an enormous choke job even for a team with zero playoff experience.

 

 

I actually happen to think that the Heat's 2013 title was extremely impressive and more so than 2012 given that they had to face the biggest two-team wall they could've faced in the Pacers and Spurs.  Two teams equipped to challenge Miami unlike any other teams in the NBA including OKC.  I think LeBron, though he had a tough first half of the series, proved why he is the best in the business in the second half, especially in that Game 6 OT when they needed him the most.

My point still remains. I don't want teams to get close to beating them, I want them beaten.

 

And leave the Nats out of this. I am trying to forget that even happened...

[Sticksboi05]

My point still remains. I don't want teams to get close to beating them, I want them beaten.

 

And leave the Nats out of this. I am trying to forget that even happened...

 

Me too, but I watched Werth's walk-off yesterday and the joy was gone knowing what happened two days later.

 

I'm not saying they aren't the favorites.  They are and deservedly so.  They have to be.  I'm simply saying it won't be a cakewalk like some think.

[CrypticVillain]

Me too, but I watched Werth's walk-off yesterday and the joy was gone knowing what happened two days later.

 

I'm not saying they aren't the favorites.  They are and deservedly so.  They have to be.  I'm simply saying it won't be a cakewalk like some think.

Okay. That was my bad then. We all know it won't be a cakewalk. Never is.

[Going Commando]

Carmelo could win a ring if he played with another player of his caliber.  That's never going to happen in New York.

 

If I were him, I would leave, but it would mean walking away from a TON of money.  Especially if he opts out of his final year this summer.  I don't know if I'd opt out a year early if I were him and I wanted to leave.

 

Carmelo is probably the one guy who might leave and alter the balance of power.

 

I see four places he could win a ring:

 

Chicago - I think he'd make them the favorite by a good margin.  It's an ideal situation for him for basketball reasons, and I wish he'd end up here.  Chicago can make a ton of room by letting Luol Deng expire and finding a way to dump Boozer.  Rose, Butler, Gibson, Melo, Noah would be pretty awesome.

 

Houston - this should be choice #2.  He should be able to win a title with Harden and Dwight.  Parsons is a nice fourth option.  Houston can easily get the room to sign Melo by dealing Asik and Lin for expirings.

 

Clippers - The original plan was to team up with CP3, might be able to make it happen here.  They'll certainly have to get rid of Jordan to clear space and Crawford would be the low hanging fruit to create more space since most of his contract isn't guaranteed after this season.  They'd still need more room though.  It was probably a mistake to sign JJ Redick for as much as they did.  I don't see this being the best fit, especially with CP3 eyeing early retirement...

 

Miami - Wade will be done soon and Bosh looks massively overpaid frankly.  Young contenders are springing up.  Miami could make room for Melo by dumping Bosh and getting Wade to take a deserved pay cut.  LeBron and Melo have a good relationship.  They could easily milk this partnership for a couple rings, no one would even come close to having the players to deal with that forward tandem.  

 

Feels like Melo wouldn't to accept being LeBron's sidekick, and would want to get his rings through LeBron rather than with him.  But they might be desperate when they're both on the other side of 30 and know they've basically got one more window to win championships as the star players of a construction.

[Mr. Sinister]

People don't need to be so defensive

 

I'm not sure if you intend to be consistently passive aggressive or not, but exactly who is being defensive in here? I don't see anyone.

 

My issue with your post is that it wreaks of a bunch of "What if". Sure the Pacers might be able to beat the Heat in a series, but no one knows that... Because it hasn't happened. Twice now they've had their shot, and twice they failed to answer the bell. We can all play this little game of how maybe this could've happened or maybe that could've happened (Not that I'd expect you to do it if the situation was reversed. You'd probably just mention something along the lines of "Lebron's not Jordan" and cite some random nugget from one of his Finals appearances).

 

People love to play the "Cheat/What if" card when it comes to the Heats championships. So yeah, many different things could've happened last year, but to sit back and say that they "Shouldn't have won" (which is what you posted before you made the edit), or that some other team saved them (as if they had nothing to do with it) is a little ridiculous (hence my post) on it's face... Objectively speaking of course. It just smells a little like sour grapes. Just being honest  .

 

I hate the Giants. I think they got lucky in SB 42, but luck is needed to win championships. I give them credit for their SB runs, but because I don't pretend to be unbiased, I'll play the what if card all day, without hesitation. Doesn't mean that what I said has any merit, because they went out and got the job done.

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

Melo just doesn't strike me as the kind of guy to leave THAT much money on the table to go to Houston of all places. Dwight Howard is wired differently. I think he legitimately wanted to go someplace "safe" because he could no longer handle the criticism that comes with playing in LA. He was willing to forego millions of dollars to go to an easier market where he wouldn't have to be the face of the franchise. He's a very odd dude.

 

I think Melo wants titles, but I also don't think he feels the need to justify his career to anyone. He won an NCAA title. He has two Olympic golds. He's won a scoring title. He made the Knicks relevant again. I also don't see how LA is any more desirable in 12 months than New York. Would he want to play with a 40-something Kobe Bryant who is trying to break scoring records? Is Jimmy Buss an improvement over James Dolan?

 

New York will have Amare Stoudmire's expiring contract in two years. They will have some flexibility.

[Destino]

If Melo goes to LA it would be to play with Paul and Griffin, not Kobe. The Knicks are the team everyone pretends is relevant because the media desperately wants the biggest market to matter. They don't. If a New York team is to be a contender, Brooklyn is that team, not the a Knicks.

[G.A.C.O.L.B.]

For the 3 minutes Oden was in yesterday, he looked good. hopefully he can keep it up and play more without getting hurt

Guess how much Greg Oden has earned per second of playing time over the last four seasons? Anyone. Hint: LeBron has earned $110 per second over that span.