wit33 Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 The limitations of the playbook he is working with must be frustrating. He is forced to only use the middle of the field in the passing game. The Skins lack playmakers on the outside and a QB who can make those kind of throws. Opposing defenses are now up to speed and have been since the Giants game. This is why we have seen Grossman's play get worst from game to game. I am going to attempt to spin this into a positive. I believe two players who hopefully will receive significant playing time in next week's game will help to open the playbook up, thus making us a more explosive offense. Jon Beck- He has more physical ability than Rex Grossman (does not mean he is better, but hopefully he will be). This offense needs a guy who can extend some plays with his legs, throw the ball deep, make the outside throws, run the bootleg and avoid the costly mistakes. His talents can help to elevate the play of the mediocre supporting cast. --Not saying he is going to do these things but as a fan I hope he does. Anthony Armstrong- He is the one guy on the team who consistently take the top off of defenses. The offense the past few weeks has sorely missed his speed. His skill set helps Moss, Jabar, Davis and Cooley work the underneath stuff. Teams must account for Armstrong's speed and that right there is enough for me to say his return will make a big impact. --Not implying he's all pro but is a vital piece to the overall offense Lets all keep our fingers crossed these two guys can help the Skins' sputtering offense and infuse some life into it. Also, making Kyle Shannahan a much happier coordinator with more tools at his disposal. Go Skins! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbs Hog Heaven Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 Good coordinators, for me, tailor their scheme to the personnel at their disposal. He hasn't. Nor has he taken what's there on certain plays. But as your trying to put a positive slant on this I'll say no more on the OC as this isn't the thread. I wish you luck as I kinda' think others won't and will just pile in. Hail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khaozerker Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 I really hated the plays where Kyle Shanahan called for those interceptions, he needs to work on a better scheme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aghar Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 Kyle Shanahan was not impressive in his play calling ability yet again today. You attack a defense's weakeness. The Eagles have two glaring weaknesses and he attacked neither. Not good to consistantly call the same plays that don't work, no matter the personnel! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
9_to_42_td Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 Just don't bring back the Bingo caller. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinsrbeast Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 we hate running the ball Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kleese Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 I like Kyle and I think people are just reacting emotionally to losses. Not only do we have a black hole at QB, but our WR corps is one of the worst/least talented in the league. And I'm not sure what people want him to do when a team is completely stuffing the run against us like the Eagles did yesterday. On second and 12, he is probably doing whatever he can to avoid third an long with Rex, so he calls a pass play before it's an obvious passing situation. He has zero weapons to work with. Literally zero. Going into this game the Redskins were actually one of thenmote balanced run/pass teams in the league. "Tailor" his playcalling to his personell? Is there a playbook out there called "Really good plays to call when you have a really bad quarterback and no receivers"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grego Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 Is there a playbook out there called "Really good plays to call when you have a really bad quarterback and no receivers"? yes, its called run the ball more. seriously, yesterday we were hamstrung by our injuries on O line (at least i'm assuming thats part of why we couldnt run it), and people keep saying they stacked the box. i'll ask again, if philly is stacking the box, where are the open WR's? they still play with 11 on D, right? maybe rex is that bad (beck found some open guys), maybe our WR's cant get separation, as they rarely seem 'open', maybe, like fred davis on that first INT, our recievers need to learn to catch a goddam ball. but as far as our OC, i'll take GHH's lead and leave it from here and just say he needs to get better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 I like Kyle and I think people are just reacting emotionally to losses. Not only do we have a black hole at QB, but our WR corps is one of the worst/least talented in the league. Yeah, I think this is a bit unfair. There are few teams in the league that won't drop the running game when down by twenty. Heck, even down by 20 the Eagles were still crowding the box with eight or nine men. Plus, a bunch of those throws were open, but Rex didn't have the arm to get it there. The second interception was a touchdown except Rex threw it so short that the hopelessly beaten defender had an easy pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyDave Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 Yeah kyle didn't have any plays to run towards the rookie replacement at end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paloosa Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 I like Kyle and I think people are just reacting emotionally to losses. Not only do we have a black hole at QB, but our WR corps is one of the worst/least talented in the league. And I'm not sure what people want him to do when a team is completely stuffing the run against us like the Eagles did yesterday. On second and 12, he is probably doing whatever he can to avoid third an long with Rex, so he calls a pass play before it's an obvious passing situation. He has zero weapons to work with. Literally zero. Going into this game the Redskins were actually one of thenmote balanced run/pass teams in the league. "Tailor" his playcalling to his personell? Is there a playbook out there called "Really good plays to call when you have a really bad quarterback and no receivers"? Buddy I think that you need to take those rose color glasses off and see the real issue at hand. They only ran the ball a total of 14 times. Let me say that again so it sinks in. 14 TIMES! How do you call that getting stuffed? Obviously you don't see what the real issue is. In the two losses we had we ran the ball less than 20 times. In order for this team to be successful we need to run the ball which sets up the play action pass. Our recievers can't get open when they have 5 DB's in the game so you run it. They were giving up 134 yards a game and we managed less than 50 yards. H-E-L-L-OOOOOOO!!!!! This team hasn't changed their ways at all. They win 3 games and then they start losing again. We have now officially replaced the Lions as the door mat of the NFL. I was behind this team because I saw something I hadn't seen in quite a few years but yesterday snapped me back to the present and gave me the clear view of the true Redskins team. We have a bad QB, OC, DC and players that aren't embarassed about getting whooped by a team that isn't that good. On paper they may have a lot of talent but this team does too. We just have no pride. Yes we are 3-2 but the two games we lost were to teams we can't beat. Whether it is the lack of calls by the referees, self inflicted penalties and mistakes or just bad coaching and player performance we just can't beat the NFC East teams. We beat the Giants because they played the game of their lives and the Giants had a lot of injuries. So I may be overreacting but until this team can get their heads out of their @$$e$ they don't deserved to be supported by any fans. I am going to watch but I am not expecting to win any more games. I am just too mad and disappointed again to think about it. NFC East bottom here we come. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJD2 Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 It just seemed like the Eagles basically said at the beginning of the game that they weren't going to allow a running game and forced Rex to beat them through the air, which he obvisouly couldn't do. Why is the question. I don't know if it was because the o-line was suspect even before losing the left side, but it also has to be playcalling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 Buddy I think that you need to take those rose color glasses off and see the real issue at hand. They only ran the ball a total of 14 times. Let me say that again so it sinks in. 14 TIMES! ...When your opponent controls the ball and jumps out to a 20-0 lead, you throw the ball and try to extend the game and catch up. You don't run the football to milk the clock. There's no choice.Let me say that again so that it sinks in. There's no choice! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USS Redskins Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 Snyder is keeping an eye on all Bingo parlors in the metro DC area. Help is out there! I agree with Paloosa... Shanny Jr. thinks he has Favre behind center, not Grossman the horrible, and calls games based on panic. Run the ball!!! But Pappa Shannahan wont pull the rug out from under wonder boy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bang Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 Good coordinators, for me, tailor their scheme to the personnel at their disposal. He hasn't. Nor has he taken what's there on certain plays. But as your trying to put a positive slant on this I'll say no more on the OC as this isn't the thread. I wish you luck as I kinda' think others won't and will just pile in. Hail. His QB is ****. You can tailor a nice suit and put a turd in it, and it is still a sharp dressed piece of crap. I'd hate to say this, but the fact is when you see the limited number of reads Rex has been allowed, that IS tailoring the offense to his talent... or more aptly, tailoring it to stay away from his deficiencies. ~Bang Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 Anthony Armstrong is the key to the offense. Without him they don't really have someone to stretch the field. That said, Gaffney was open deep and Grossman underthrew him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skins island connection Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 The Eagles knew Rex couldn't beat them so they flooded the line to stop the run. Screens, draws, and pitch-outs disappeared, but Kyle's inability to utilize the strengths hurt. The playcalling was vanilla, and Kyle was out-coached. He thought we could just walk on the field and Philly would just give up, but it didn't turn out that way. I've said it before, he's not OC material; he happened to be placed in a system with a very good qb and a beast wr, and that doesn't qualify for being a good OC, only qualifies for being in the right place at the right time. Daddy needs to open his eyes before this gets ugly... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
authentic Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 yes, its called run the ball more. seriously, yesterday we were hamstrung by our injuries on O line (at least i'm assuming thats part of why we couldnt run it), and people keep saying they stacked the box. i'll ask again, if philly is stacking the box, where are the open WR's? they still play with 11 on D, right? maybe rex is that bad (beck found some open guys), maybe our WR's cant get separation, as they rarely seem 'open', maybe, like fred davis on that first INT, our recievers need to learn to catch a goddam ball. but as far as our OC, i'll take GHH's lead and leave it from here and just say he needs to get better. Bro. Doc Walker was on the radio a few mins. ago and confirmed that the WR were visibly frustrated because they were getting OPEN but didnot get the ball. This isn't coming from us couch potatoes, its coming from someone who was on the side line near the player's bench. I'm not saying that we have great talent @ WR, because we don't. But you MUST be able to exploit a defense that stacks the box. They knew we wanted to run, (I've been saying this for 2 weeks!!), and that they will dare Rex to beat them. Obviously that stategy worked, because our QB is garbage... All of this Kyle doesn't like to run the ball crap is nonsense IMO. when you're down 20-0 and they're stacking the LOS, then you run just for the sake of clearing your football conscience?? OMG!!..... :doh: ---------- Post added October-17th-2011 at 07:58 AM ---------- Anthony Armstrong is the key to the offense. Without him they don't really have someone to stretch the field. That said, Gaffney was open deep and Grossman underthrew him. This is easy to say when you don't thave the right tools to execute the system. Lets wait until they get a legit QB before we write Kyle off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingdaddy Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 This was a tough loss to take but I think a lot of good is gonna come out of this one, and, we are still in good shape in the division. Rex Grossman deserved to be the starter after his play last season and this preseason. However, we all knew he wasn't the long term answer, especially after his play the past 3 weeks. He is not capable of winning games consistently and IS capable of losing them with bad decisions. The fact is, because he has no mobility, he has to put the ball up to avoid being sacked which leads to forced throws. Enter John Beck. At the very least, Beck is gonna buy more time for WR's to get open because of his mobility. He just looks more like a QB than Rex does. Now, if the Shanahan's are smart, which I believe they are, they will find more time for Terrence Austin and, obviously, Anthony Armstrong when he is healthy. These two will inject speed into the offense and will get open more with Beck buying more time. I have no doubt about this. We all knew that QB was our major hole and that our WR's were not the greatest. We are undersized at WR which is why we drafted Hankerson. When will he be ready to play? I don't know, but I think we are heading in the right direction with this team and am willing to have more growing pains as long as we are mixing in the young guys. I still expect 8-9 wins and to be playing meaningful games in December with a shot at winning the division. Next week we go to 4-2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hunterx Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 Kyle Shanahan was not impressive in his play calling ability yet again today. You attack a defense's weakeness. The Eagles have two glaring weaknesses and he attacked neither. Not good to consistantly call the same plays that don't work, no matter the personnel! You catch their play calling on a CB radio? Let me know, I would love to know how many of the same plays were called. How do we know a lot of these "bad plays" were because of audibles? What about if Grossman didn't take the shot down field on those interceptions, and hit the short-to-intermediate route instead? Would we be saying great plays? We don't hear the plays called, we don't watch the gametape, so it's a bit ignorant to blame the play calling, right? If Peyton Manning was our QB, would all of a sudden the play calling be awesome? I think the play calling worked well for Matt Schaub in Houston for a few years. Start blaming the QB, as default, for making bad decisions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grego Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 Bro. Doc Walker was on the radio a few mins. ago and confirmed that the WR were visibly frustrated because they were getting OPEN but didnot get the ball. This isn't coming from us couch potatoes, its coming from someone who was on the side line near the player's bench. I'm not saying that we have great talent @ WR, because we don't. But you MUST be able to exploit a defense that stacks the box. They knew we wanted to run, (I've been saying this for 2 weeks!!), and that they will dare Rex to beat them. Obviously that stategy worked, because our QB is garbage... All of this Kyle doesn't like to run the ball crap is nonsense IMO. when you're down 20-0 and they're stacking the LOS, then you run just for the sake of clearing your football conscience?? OMG!!..... :doh: i heard doc say that too. so, the answer is that our QB sux. then i would ask, why the hell is he out there?? this is the guy they picked. now, i dont necessarily think that guys were open every play- i think doc even said that he hadnt seen tape, and he pointed to the one play where rex underthrew gaffney who was otherwise open. i certainly think our WR's not being open may be part of the problem, and rex not seeing them could be another part. i will disagree with you and old fan. the eagles had a 20 - 0 lead in the first half. that is plenty of time to do the one thing we are supposed to be able to do- run it. now, down 20-0 with 10 minutes left is another story. i dont get why people think we can pass like that when it hasnt worked or showed any signs that it can work. i heard someone mention the same thing im talking about on 980- if they are stacking the box, where are the open guys. doc seemed to think guys were open a times. i dont know. every time i saw rex pass- outside of a couple of times, guys were covered well, it seemed. i also want to know why- when philly and other teams have their o linemen go down, we cant exploit that, but when our guys go down, we are lost. i get that our depth isnt great, but other teams dont miss a bit. we play teams that cant stop the run, yet we cant run it? at all? that doesnt make sense to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 This is easy to say when you don't thave the right tools to execute the system. Lets wait until they get a legit QB before we write Kyle off. I am not advocating writing Kyle off. I believe Armstrong's absence limits his options, but Grossman should have hit Gaffney for a TD and he just threw the ball badly. There was nothing wrong with the play call. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goingforburgundy Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 I think is a perfect storm of fail for Kyle Shannahan. *It all begins and ends with the QB. In this league, you get only as far as your QB can take you. It has been since 2000 Trent Dilfler and the Ravens since a mediocre/game managing QB has won the super bowl. The 2000 ravens had one of the greatest defenses in the history of the NFL. *I firmly believe that we still have a mediocre AT BEST OLine. Kory Lich should be a weak link not a strength. We still need 3 starters with Monty being the primary backup for the Centers and guards. *The RBs I am not worried about. Once Helu picks up his blocking I think he will be a typical Shanny RB. ATV and THT are perfect fits for Short yardage and 3rd down back. *WRs we have right now are not up to snuff. Santana cant do it on his own. AA is no more than a deep threat and the rookies I see no better than being number 2 with the hopes of Hankerson being a league best number 2 or a low end number 1. Still need to find a top 10 WR in the league a la Fitz, AJ, Megatron. *TEs. Even without Cooley we are firmly set for the future pending we sign Sleepy. If we dont we are REALLY hurting here for the next 2-4 years at the position as I see Cooley being done. He is a fraction of what he once was. I really wish we traded him prior to last season. The main downfall I see for Kyle is that he thinks he has an upper echelon QB and a top 3 WR on this team. We have neither and no where near close in either. Kyle has yet to show that he has the ability to design the offense around the talent that best suits the players we have. We have seen very little in terms of Slants, WR and RB screens, Draws, and other similar plays that gets the ball into play makers we do have in Moss, Davis, and Helu out of the backfield. Instead Kyle has been throwing intermediate passes that requires percise passes in small windows, something that neither QB we have on the roster that is capable of making. I still dont see this team competing for championships until the 15-16 season. We still have far too many holes on offense on top of filling a couple holes in the near future we will have on defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 ...i will disagree with you and old fan. the eagles had a 20 - 0 lead in the first half. that is plenty of time to do the one thing we are supposed to be able to do- run it... You are the coach. Your task is to game plan for a 35 minute game where your team is handicapped by 20 points. So, you say your plan is the same as one for a 60-minute game with no handicap? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GaryGreenMonk Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 I like Kyle and I think people are just reacting emotionally to losses. Not only do we have a black hole at QB, but our WR corps is one of the worst/least talented in the league. That's why Kyle sucks. He's trying to force our crappy QB to throw to our not very good WR's. And.. you get 4 INT's out of it. You didn't see Andy Reid throwing plays that require time in the pocket and multiple reads against us with 2 of his starting OLmen out. And why we didn't see that coming on our defense in the first half was ridiculous... the defense at least recovered and played well in the 2nd half.. but the offense is just terrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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