Why John Beck is Likely to Win the Job

[sportjunkie07]

so when beck faces the same first string defense grossman does, they suddenly become inferior?

that sounds like beck makes the team better.

the truth is with grossman's propensity to:

a) throw over the middle

make careless mistakes with the football

c) not leave the pocket

it looks like we're in for a lot more bad rex than good rex.

no.. if you are comparing the two based on preseason, rex has faced tougher competition. they both did well versus the ravens 1st stringers.

a.) rex's arm is strong enough to make all the throws.. he is not limited to over the middle throws

b.) yes, rex makes careless mistakes

c.) leaving the pocket has nothing to do with anything. many qb's are great in the pocket. can beck's mobility be a help in this system? it most probably will. but because rex likes to stay in the pocket is not a knock against him.

and why should we get prepared for more of bad rex than good rex.. preseason is not showing that.

[GWinSkins83]

no.. if you are comparing the two based on preseason, rex has faced tougher competition. they both did well versus the ravens 1st stringers.

a.) rex's arm is strong enough to make all the throws.. he is not limited to over the middle throws

b.) yes, rex makes careless mistakes

c.) leaving the pocket has nothing to do with anything. many qb's are great in the pocket. can beck's mobility be a help in this system? it most probably will. but because rex likes to stay in the pocket is not a knock against him.

and why should we get prepared for more of bad rex than good rex.. preseason is not showing that.

The thing is Rex has no pocket awareness. And that is a very big problem.

[HigSkin]

I don't know what if any plan Mike has for drafting a QB. But, the immediate advantage of John Beck is that he enables the coaches to evaluate other players. For example, the rollout deep pass to Stallworth that was intercepted showed the value of a Brandon Marshall type receiver in this scheme. Marshall in Denver's 2008 offense would probably have caught that pass or would have drawn an interference call on the corner.

I watched that replay a couple of times and believe Stallworth pulled up trying to shake the DB. Beck probably should have underthrown that one, Stallworth would have had a better shot at it.

It doesn't really matter because Turnoversaurus Rex has had his share of INT's too.

[Conn]

“His little swag, his little swag that he has,” Gaffney said, via 106.7 The Fan. “And a lot of quarterbacks don’t do that, they just like to sit back and be mellow, but he likes to get amped up and get it going, and I like that in a QB.”

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d81fc3681/article/quarterback-beck-takes-redskins-offseason-leadership-role (the whole article, i'll try to pick out other stuff from different articles)

“John has basically showing countless effort to be out here and do the work,” wide receiver Anthony Armstrong said. “He has flown in from [san Diego] to come in and throw. I almost have to ignore his phone calls and text messages because he always wants to throw. But I know he’s putting in the work and I’ve seen the improvement.”

Added center Casey Rabach: “Anytime you don’t have a set-in-stone starting quarterback, there are questions about who is going to be in that role. The quarterback is obviously the leader of the team and leader of the offense. I think John has stepped up in a leadership role and worked tirelessly to put himself in the best position to win that job.”

Through the offseason, Beck made sure that he worked closely with the rookies, including wide receivers Leonard Hankerson, Niles Pauland Aldrick Robinson, running backs Roy Helu, Jr., and Evan Royster and offensive lineman Maurice Hurt. Beck even made sure the rookies had a copy of the playbook.

there's a couple for you.

That's all well and good, and I know that those quotes are out there. But they aren't specifically comparing Beck's leadership to Grossman's, which is what you said in your post. That's the only reason I singled it out.

[sportjunkie07]

The thing is Rex has no pocket awareness. And that is a very big problem.

disagree.. from what i have seen this preseason, rex's pocket awareness is better than beck's. there have been one or two plays where beck has had the chance to throw it away, but didnt.. i for one think that its because he is still relatively inexperienced, but its a play that rex throws away.

[Oldfan]

Neither Davis nor Stallworth were ever open on those deep throws. Stallworth had nowhere to run, because defender had inside position one step deep.

It's not subjective. At least not those throws.

You are stating your opinions. Your opinions are subjective. Your opinion differs from mine and from others who saw the same play and reached different conclusions.

[sportjunkie07]

You are stating your opinions. Your opinions are subjective. Your opinion differs from mine and from others who say the same play and reached different conclusions.

in the postgame interviews, beck said that he talked to stallworth before the drive, and they were set on that play. from what i gathered, they were just going to go for it in one on one coverage and see what happened.. is that a play he forces in season, i dont think so.

[Oldfan]

I watched that replay a couple of times and believe Stallworth pulled up trying to shake the DB. Beck probably should have underthrown that one, Stallworth would have had a better shot at it..

Beck should probably have thrown it shorter and to the outside shoulder, but the ball was in the air when Stallworth appeared to pull up. There's no excuse for that.

[Skinsinparadise]

in the postgame interviews, beck said that he talked to stallworth before the drive, and they were set on that play. from what i gathered, they were just going to go for it in one on one coverage and see what happened.. is that a play he forces in season, i dont think so.

yeah in addition Beck said he and Kyle talked about it and decided to go for it

[Oldfan]

in the postgame interviews, beck said that he talked to stallworth before the drive, and they were set on that play. from what i gathered, they were just going to go for it in one on one coverage and see what happened.. is that a play he forces in season, i dont think so.

That's a play you force if you have a stud receiver.

[tiger187126]

no.. if you are comparing the two based on preseason, rex has faced tougher competition. they both did well versus the ravens 1st stringers.

a.) rex's arm is strong enough to make all the throws.. he is not limited to over the middle throws

b.) yes, rex makes careless mistakes

c.) leaving the pocket has nothing to do with anything. many qb's are great in the pocket. can beck's mobility be a help in this system? it most probably will. but because rex likes to stay in the pocket is not a knock against him.

and why should we get prepared for more of bad rex than good rex.. preseason is not showing that.

i'm talking ravens 1s vs. redskins 1s because that's our apples to apples. i read how beck was "saved by the running game" and other nonsense like it. as if somehow he just lucks into better running plays than grossman, or even better it's some secretive play calling that's used to pull the wool over everyones eyes.

sorry for not believing that the team running the ball better with beck is somehow an indictment on him not being as good of quarterback. we're going to run the ball a lot this year, and if one guy gets more out of it for whatever reason then that's the guy i want playing.

and that throw that got picked off by indy's 2nd or 3rd lineback was a perfect example of just a horrendous decision. beck's INT was a 50/50 ball where one guy didn't go for it and gave up on his route. he saw man, he threw deep (not to mention only 1 receiver was running a pattern on that play).

the rex staying in the pocket point was more about the turnovers when he's had relatively low (especially compared to what the redskins give up) sack numbers and yet has 48 turnover to 40 touchdowns with only 67 career sacks.

to put that in perspective, jason campbell in three years as a starter here was sacked 102 times (45 games) with 45 touchdowns to 41 turnovers.

[sportjunkie07]

That's a play you force if you have a stud receiver.

exactly.. and other than malcomb, we dont have one. so hopefully beck doesnt do that in season.

[dballer]

Obviously.. stretching a team horizontally is going to come of Beck's boot-legs I've conceded that point all along.

It can be argued that stretching the team horizontally is actually more important in this ZBS than stretching it vertically.

Either way you make it seem like Rex is just out throwing bombs and Beck is just dinking and dunking. Doesn't really matter because we haven't seen enough of either to see which will consistently throw the ball down the field more often. But I have seen enough to tell that Beck has the stronger arm. At the same time it doesn't mean he has a better deep ball.

To the point you made earlier about YAC being added into yards per completion...THIS offense is actually designed for YAC. That is what the offense is all about. So if Beck is making passes that gives the receivers better chances at YAC then he would be outperforming Rex, atleast in Kyle and Mike's minds...

[GWinSkins83]

disagree.. from what i have seen this preseason, rex's pocket awareness is better than beck's. there have been one or two plays where beck has had the chance to throw it away, but didnt.. i for one think that its because he is still relatively inexperienced, but its a play that rex throws away.

First people say you cant give Beck the nod cause its little sample(preseason) but you're going to give the benfit of the doubt to Grossman when you know dang well Grossman has been horrible in his career. And don't use the sacks as indication cause two was not his fault. One Williams wiffed on and another he took a sack instead of forcing a pass. Other than that Beck seems to feel pressure better then Grossman. And if Grossman does feel pressure he panicks he doesnt know how to escape that. I think your wrong saying Grossman has better pocket awareness not from what I seen.

[tiger187126]

That's all well and good, and I know that those quotes are out there. But they aren't specifically comparing Beck's leadership to Grossman's, which is what you said in your post. That's the only reason I singled it out.

i said better and more active, basically i kind of infer that the two are one in the same. and i'll point you to the cult of colt vs. campbell on those points.

[s0crates]

That's a play you force if you have a stud receiver.

That is a play you force every time. If you have single coverage with no safety help, and all your other options are well covered, then you throw it up there and give the WR a chance.

[Atlanta Skins Fan]

Beck should probably have thrown it shorter and to the outside shoulder, but the ball was in the air when Stallworth appeared to pull up. There's no excuse for that.

Yes, there is. The only path to the ball was through the defender. Do that and it's offensive pass interference.

I saw a similar miss that Grossman threw against the Steelers. Q2, 4:03. It's marked "Over" in the Air column. Moss was covered and slowed down.

I think the receivers are trained to slow down when covered, to avoid offensive pass interference. That's the appearance.

[MartinC]

Yes, there is. The only path to the ball was through the defender. Do that and it's offensive pass interference.

I saw a similar miss that Grossman threw against the Steelers. Q2, 4:03. It's marked "Over" in the Air column. Moss was covered and slowed down.

I think the receivers are trained to slow down when covered, to avoid offensive pass interference. That's the appearance.

They are trained to expect the ball to be thrown back shoulder if the DB has position over the top. Beck should have thrown it inside and short where only Stallworth would have been able to make a catch.

As it was though Stallworth should have taken a PI call and gone through the DB to prevent the pick.

[dballer]

Yes, there is. The only path to the ball was through the defender. Do that and it's offensive pass interference.

I saw a similar miss that Grossman threw against the Steelers. Q2, 4:03. It's marked "Over" in the Air column. Moss was covered and slowed down.

I think the receivers are trained to slow down when covered, to avoid offensive pass interference. That's the appearance.

Because pass interference is a less desired outcome than a pick?

[Oldfan]

Yes, there is. The only path to the ball was through the defender. Do that and it's offensive pass interference.

A stud receiver with outside position always has a path to the ball. In this case Stallworth could have let the corner get past him, cut behind and gone up high for the reception. The outside man always has the advantage because he can see the defender and the ball at the same time.

Besides, offensive interference is better than an interception. Stallworth wasn't even close enough to interfere.

[Atlanta Skins Fan]

They are trained to expect the ball to be thrown back shoulder if the DB has position over the top. Beck should have thrown it inside and short where only Stallworth would have been able to make a catch.

As it was though Stallworth should have taken a PI call and gone through the DB to prevent the pick.

Maybe so, but the discussion was whether it should be graded a catchable pass. On the prior week, I graded Grossman's similar pass to Moss at 2Q 4:03 as uncatchable. ("Over.") I graded Beck the same way for that pass, for the Air column. Both were graded consistently, and I marked down Grossman first.

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

OF and ASF,

Have either of you ever stopped to ponder how much time you are spending discussing Rex Grossman and John Beck? There's a chance that one of these cats will not be in football in three years.

[Duckus]

OF and ASF' date='

Have either of you ever stopped to ponder how much time you are spending discussing Rex Grossman and John Beck? There's a chance that one of these cats will not be in football in three years.[/quote']

And maybe both.

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

And maybe both.

I actually originally wrote "both" but I think that seems unlikely. One of them will hang around for a while due to our severe national QB shortage.

[Oldfan]

OF and ASF' date='

Have either of you ever stopped to ponder how much time you are spending discussing Rex Grossman and John Beck? There's a chance that one of these cats will not be in football in three years.[/quote']What could possibly be more fascinating in Washington DC than a QB controversy?