A Realistic Look at the Roster in Terms of Rebuilding

[TimmySmith]

Rebuilding is a dirty word in DC. The owner has never wanted to do it. The coaches are too smart to do it. And the fans are too attached to do it.

If you take a good look at the roster there is actually very little value on it. Take into consideration the players who are worth keeping. Those who are young, talented and the nucleus of the future, I will rate at the top.

Lorenzo Alexander, Anthony Armstrong, Adam Carriker, Fred Davis, Brian Orakpo, Trent Williams, Ryan Torrain, Laron Landry, Deangelo Hall

Next are those who are talented and young, but not as indispensible as the previous group:

HB Blades, Jammal Brown, , Derrick Dockery, Reed Doughty, Stephon Heyer, Rocky McIntosh, Jeremy Jarmon, Kory Lichtensteiger, Kareem Moore, Kedric Golston

Projects. Guys who the Skins are not sure what they have :

Erik Cook, Terrance Austin, Kevin Barnes, Andre Brown, Anthony Bryant, James Davis, Macho Harris, Rob Jackson, Joe Joseph, Logan Paulsen, Sha’reff Rashad, Perry Riley, Nick Sundberg, Keiland Williams, Darrel Young, Robert Henson, Malcolm Kelly, Clint Oldenburg, Anderson Russell, Chad Simpson

Fatal Flaws, Too Old, Too many injuries, too expensive for their worth on the field:

London Fletcher, Clinton Portis, Donovan McNabb, Mike Sellers, Phillip Daniels, Chris Cooley, Santana Moss, Andre Carter, Rex Grossman,

Not worth much toward the future, no real league value:

Brandon Banks, Philip Buchanan, Vonnie Holliday, Artis Hicks, Will Montgomery, Darrion Scott, Roydell Williams, Chris Wilson, Chris Horton, Ma’ake Kenoeatu,

Quick and Dirty Analysis: The Skins have 19 players who are capable of being a part of a legitimate future, although only 9 could start on a quality NFL team. Roughly 65% of the roster has no real future in a true rebuilding process.

[SWFLSkins]

I think you have some names mixed up and missing, but I know it is just your opinion. And that opinion also includes that Albert Haynesworth is right, so I take it for what it is worth.

[Champskins]

Jammal Brown, Derrick Dockery, and Rocky Mcintosh are all around their 30's, I would hardly say that they are young. Dock does not fit our scheme of offense so he needs to go, plus he was never very good anyway. Mcintosh and Moore need to learn how to tackle but could still be serviceable backups. Brandon Banks definitely has some value if he can learn to take different routes on returns, and we havent really given him a chance at WR so id throw him in to the guys "are not sure what they have" group.

Also, Chris Wilson is a great backup for Orakpo, ive always liked what he brings to the table and hes 28, explosive pass rusher

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

Pretty good synopsis TS.

The only way I disagree is on Dockery, Heyer, McIntosh, Lichtensteiger and Morre being talented enough to maybe keep around in your second group; Golston I'd possibly keep around for depth and rotation purposes. Fletcher being in the group to go (he's the one vet. I would DEFO keep. Fletch is no mug, he won't play beyond what he's capable of. When he truly starts to wane, he'll hang it up for a younger guy); and Banks, Montgomerry and Wilson having no real worth for the future. Banks has finally given us a SERIOUS return threat for the first time in like forever, and Monty and Wilson have shown enough in spells to warrant at the least a serious look for depth.

So we come to around the same number, just by different means.

The next two or three years are gona' be LONG if we're to hopefully do this right.

Hail.

[Bang]

Reed Doughty and Kareem Moore are not what I'd consider talented.

Moore should be released outright, and Doughty should be kept for special teams value. He is pretty good there, but when he's on the field defensively he's a straight up liability. I am a believer in keeping a few players who offer nothing more than special teams ability, and Doughty fits this category. He's one of the few special teams bright spots this year.

If either are on the field as a starter at safety next season for any reason other than injuries, then there's a serious problem.

I'm not sure why you've got Grossman where you do. Regardless, we have to have a QB.

London Fletcher is old, and plays with more motor and heart than 75% of the players in the league. He has not lost any of his ability and has adjusted to his role in the 3-4 better than most. He works so hard I can see him getting better in it and not worse. He can stay until he decides to go.

~Bang

[TaylorPickSix]

Reed Doughty and Kareem Moore are not talented.

Moore should be released outright, and Doughty should be kept for special teams value.

If either are on the field as a starter at safety next season for any reason other than injuries, then there's a serious problem.

I'm not sure why you've got Grossman where you do. Regardless, we have to have a QB.

London Fletcher is old, and plays with more motor and heart than 75% of the players in the league. He has not lost any of his ability and has adjusted to his role in the 3-4 better than most. He works so hard I can see him getting better in it and not worse. He can stay until he decides to go.

~Bang

Everything Bang said, plus:

* Rocky is not that talented. He's a decent OLB in a 4-3, but a horrible fit as an ILB for a 3-4. Perry Riley made about three plays in the Dallas game and that was enough for people to be clamoring for him to start over Rocky. That's saying something.

* Banks is a legit return threat. He stays absolutely.

[NewCliche21]

While I agree with some of this, there are glaring holes.

Banks is the most exciting part of this team and will be one of the top returners in the league very shortly. He is also our only wildcat threat. I have no idea how you can think that he has no value.

McIntosh is bad. Riley and Jackson are not.

Heyer is the second-worst player on this team. Rabach is the worst, not only on this team, but in the league.

I'm kind of dumbfounded here.

[SWFLSkins]

Reed Doughty and Kareem Moore are not what I'd consider talented.

Moore should be released outright, and Doughty should be kept for special teams value. He is pretty good there, but when he's on the field defensively he's a straight up liability. I am a believer in keeping a few players who offer nothing more than special teams ability, and Doughty fits this category. He's one of the few special teams bright spots this year.

If either are on the field as a starter at safety next season for any reason other than injuries, then there's a serious problem.

I'm not sure why you've got Grossman where you do. Regardless, we have to have a QB.

London Fletcher is old, and plays with more motor and heart than 75% of the players in the league. He has not lost any of his ability and has adjusted to his role in the 3-4 better than most. He works so hard I can see him getting better in it and not worse. He can stay until he decides to go.

~Bang

Everything Bang said, plus:

* Rocky is not that talented. He's a decent OLB in a 4-3, but a horrible fit as an ILB for a 3-4. Perry Riley made about three plays in the Dallas game and that was enough for people to be clamoring for him to start over Rocky. That's saying something.

* Banks is a legit return threat. He stays absolutely.

Yeah, what they said. Safety and LBer needs to be upgraded this offseason, and that would not be as easy without Fletcher, who is the only LBer worthy of starting at this point. YEah I know, Orapko but that is it. I would like to see what the team could do with a bonifide F/S. And I also believe that Phillip Buchannon is a fine nickel corner with Barnes coming on I think corner is set for now. I did notice in yesterdays game on many plays it appeared that wonder boy D. Hall was lost in space. He did do a good job of trying to cover for players playing out of position, but I swear it looked as though he pulled up a few times.

[wilco_holland]

Lol Brandon Banks, Philip Buchanan and Chris Wilson have no real league value.

Brandon Banks is a good return man when he is healty.

PB is still a solid CB.

Chris Wilson can be a backup, he shows some flashes.

So I don´t agree at all with you.....maby you can explain it.

[TimmySmith]

Banks is a tough call. I like him, but he really does not fit into any other category. You obviously cannot build around a return man, if the Skins run him in the wildcat more often it would increase value.

Moore, Doughty and McIntosh are guys that you cannot exactly build around, but the are solid stopgap measures for a while until somebody better comes along.

Heyer is always needed, hate him or not, he's needed. I missed Rabach somehow. He is 100% expendable.

I had a tough time with Grossman, he is not the QB of the future. At least I hope he is not. That said he is QB of 2011 (with a draftee backing him up I hope). Another FA QB is another disaster waiting to happen.

Buchanan only has value as a desperation nickel back, give Barnes a shot in that role.

Wilson is in his 4th year and his production is lower level flatline. This list is trying be realistic without projecting.

[authentic]

How can you say B. Banks is not worth much towards the future? Huh? The dude is one of the most explosive players on the team and has constantly given us decent field position all year.

[TheLongshot]

Fatal Flaws, Too Old, Too many injuries, too expensive for their worth on the field:

London Fletcher, Clinton Portis, Donovan McNabb, Mike Sellers, Phillip Daniels, Chris Cooley, Santana Moss, Andre Carter, Rex Grossman,

I disagree with most of it, tho some of those players (McNabb, Carter come to mind) are probably mismatches with the direction of this team. Fletcher is the heart and soul of this defense. Moss is by far the best WR on this team.

Not worth much toward the future, no real league value:

Brandon Banks, Philip Buchanan, Vonnie Holliday, Artis Hicks, Will Montgomery, Darrion Scott, Roydell Williams, Chris Wilson, Chris Horton, Ma’ake Kenoeatu,

Really? You are going to list Banks here? He should be on your first list of the 'nucleus of the future'.

Most of these guys are roleplayers who you fill out your roster with.

Reed Doughty and Kareem Moore are not what I'd consider talented.

Moore should be released outright, and Doughty should be kept for special teams value. He is pretty good there, but when he's on the field defensively he's a straight up liability. I am a believer in keeping a few players who offer nothing more than special teams ability, and Doughty fits this category. He's one of the few special teams bright spots this year.

If either are on the field as a starter at safety next season for any reason other than injuries, then there's a serious problem.

Man, people like to beat up on Doughty, but I think he's a solid SS who is not the liability that you make him out to be. If it weren't for the fact that Landry is amazing that that position, we'd be fine there even with him.

The problem is with FS right now. The thing is, both options there right now (Moore and Harris) are pretty young, with Moore only just getting some playing time there this year and Harris last year. I would think that we'd draft there and have those two compete with a draft pick to see who can play.

[BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93]

As soon as I saw talented and Kareem moore nearby, you lost me

Also, I'm pretty sure Dockery is not young

[authentic]

Heyer is always needed, hate him or not, he's needed.

...yeah he's needed when you want to see your drives stalled with a sack or a run for a loss (see yesterday). Yeah, he's versatile enough to play 3 position, too bad he sucks at all 3.

[Chump Bailey]

Brandon Banks, Philip Buchanan, Vonnie Holliday, Artis Hicks, Will Montgomery, Darrion Scott, Roydell Williams, Chris Wilson, Chris Horton, Ma’ake Kenoeatu,

Banks and Wilson are players and should be kept without question IMO.

Chris Wilson should be starting IMO. These IMO could be a devastatingly good group to go with next season.

OLB Orakpo * ILB David Harris * ILB Chris Wilson * OLB Rob Jackson

[authentic]

Man, people like to beat up on Doughty, but I think he's a solid SS who is not the liability that you make him out to be. If it weren't for the fact that Landry is amazing that that position, we'd be fine there even with him.

The problem is with FS right now. The thing is, both options there right now (Moore and Harris) are pretty young, with Moore only just getting some playing time there this year and Harris last year. I would think that we'd draft there and have those two compete with a draft pick to see who can play.

This was a concern of mine sine early in the offseason. I like K. Moore, but it troubled me that we didn't have anyone on the roster that could challenge him since all of the other safetys were strong. Which made me believe that he was the starter by default. I agree with Reed, he's good on STs and is a solid back up SS (as a blitzer and in run support). But what drove alot of people crazy was seeing him in coverage, he's not a liability on coverage, he is down right crippling. When he's out in space, its like playing 11 on 10.

[Chump Bailey]

Heyer is always needed, hate him or not, he's needed. I missed Rabach somehow. He is 100% expendable.

Heyer's gone and is not needed at all IMO. He's garbage. Capers will hopefully earn a spot next season and if not they're plenty of 2nd and 3rd tier OT's that will be available to backup Brown - if he's healthy.

[justice98]

I think I read Jammal Brown's a free agent at the end of the year, so I assume they resign him? Otherwise, that's 3 good picks they'd have flushed down the toilet in a year's time.

[TD_washingtonredskins]

How can you say B. Banks is not worth much towards the future? Huh? The dude is one of the most explosive players on the team and has constantly given us decent field position all year.

I agree that there is no reason to get rid of Banks. However, I understand the reservations that some have about him. No doubt, he's been explosive at times returning kicks. However, a kick returner isn't necessarily someone you can build around and/or rely on to continue producing. It's very possible that Banks will be this era's Brian Mitchell for us. It's also very possible that he'll be a bright star for a couple years and then disappear. Let's not forget another undersized guy who was probably more explosive than Banks...Dante Hall. That guy was unbelievable for a couple years and then he was out of the league. So, of course you ride Banks as long as you can...but I wouldn't necessarily count him as a building block during a rebuild.

[authentic]

Banks and Wilson are players and should be kept without question IMO.

Chris Wilson should be starting IMO. These IMO could be a devastatingly good group to go with next season.

OLB Orakpo * ILB David Harris * ILB Chris Wilson * OLB Rob Jackson

I would still like to get a true OLB out side of Orakpo, not sold on Rob Jackson as a starter just because of one game. If we can get a OLB and another MLB via FA or in the draft, we should be set.

---------- Post added December-27th-2010 at 11:54 AM ----------

I agree that there is no reason to get rid of Banks. However, I understand the reservations that some have about him. No doubt, he's been explosive at times returning kicks. However, a kick returner isn't necessarily someone you can build around and/or rely on to continue producing. It's very possible that Banks will be this era's Brian Mitchell for us. It's also very possible that he'll be a bright star for a couple years and then disappear. Let's not forget another undersized guy who was probably more explosive than Banks...Dante Hall. That guy was unbelievable for a couple years and then he was out of the league. So, of course you ride Banks as long as you can...but I wouldn't necessarily count him as a building block during a rebuild.

Well also remember that D. Hall's production as a PR/KR decreased as he was being used more on offense, similar to what happened to Hester. I think we could get maximum use out of Banks if we could continue to use him in his current role.

[S.T.real,lights,out]

While I agree with some of this, there are glaring holes.

Banks is the most exciting part of this team and will be one of the top returners in the league very shortly. He is also our only wildcat threat. I have no idea how you can think that he has no value.

McIntosh is bad. Riley and Jackson are not.

Heyer is the second-worst player on this team. Rabach is the worst, not only on this team, but in the league.

I'm kind of dumbfounded here.

Totally agree with u!

[Chump Bailey]

I would still like to get a true OLB out side of Orakpo, not sold on Rob Jackson as a starter just because of one game. If we can get a OLB and another MLB via FA or in the draft, we should be set.

I've seen enough of him personally. The guy has a very good motor, plays disciplined and until the whistle blows. IMO, David Harris is the only LB we should be looking at. Respect your opinion regardless however.

[tml6157]

Banks is a tough call. I like him, but he really does not fit into any other category. You obviously cannot build around a return man, if the Skins run him in the wildcat more often it would increase value.

Just ask the Bears about that one.

[TimmySmith]

Heyer's gone and is not needed at all IMO. He's garbage. Capers will hopefully earn a spot next season and if not they're plenty of 2nd and 3rd tier OT's that will be available to backup Brown - if he's healthy.

Being realistic means accepting Heyer's plusses. He is huge and can fill in everywhere. If the Skins let him go, 25 teams in the NFL would snap him up in a heartbeat.

---------- Post added December-27th-2010 at 03:58 PM ----------

Just ask the Bears about that one.

Banks is good, but he is NOT Hester by 50 miles. Plus they did not build around him. They did put him on the field more, but Banks size appears to be preventing this.

[WhoRUSupposed2Be]

Rebuilding is a dirty word in DC. The owner has never wanted to do it. The coaches are too smart to do it. And the fans are too attached to do it.

If you take a good look at the roster there is actually very little value on it. Take into consideration the players who are worth keeping. Those who are young, talented and the nucleus of the future, I will rate at the top.

Lorenzo Alexander, Anthony Armstrong, Adam Carriker, Fred Davis, Brian Orakpo, Trent Williams, Ryan Torrain, Laron Landry, Deangelo Hall

Next are those who are talented and young, but not as indispensible as the previous group:

HB Blades, Jammal Brown, , Derrick Dockery, Reed Doughty, Stephon Heyer, Rocky McIntosh, Jeremy Jarmon, Kory Lichtensteiger, Kareem Moore, Kedric Golston

Projects. Guys who the Skins are not sure what they have :

Erik Cook, Terrance Austin, Kevin Barnes, Andre Brown, Anthony Bryant, James Davis, Macho Harris, Rob Jackson, Joe Joseph, Logan Paulsen, Sha’reff Rashad, Perry Riley, Nick Sundberg, Keiland Williams, Darrel Young, Robert Henson, Malcolm Kelly, Clint Oldenburg, Anderson Russell, Chad Simpson

Fatal Flaws, Too Old, Too many injuries, too expensive for their worth on the field:

London Fletcher, Clinton Portis, Donovan McNabb, Mike Sellers, Phillip Daniels, Chris Cooley, Santana Moss, Andre Carter, Rex Grossman,

Not worth much toward the future, no real league value:

Brandon Banks, Philip Buchanan, Vonnie Holliday, Artis Hicks, Will Montgomery, Darrion Scott, Roydell Williams, Chris Wilson, Chris Horton, Ma’ake Kenoeatu,

Quick and Dirty Analysis: The Skins have 19 players who are capable of being a part of a legitimate future, although only 9 could start on a quality NFL team. Roughly 65% of the roster has no real future in a true rebuilding process.

You lost me here champ.